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2/23/2017 5:55:53 PM
Posted: 11/30/2001 10:55:07 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2001 2:56:09 PM EST by jvic]
A friend offerend to sell me his older Century Arms L1A1 with 6 magazines for $450. Any advice on the price? Any advice on the gun? Many thanks! Jeff
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 10:56:27 AM EST
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 11:20:48 AM EST
LOL...Thanks...
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 11:21:20 AM EST
As long as it works ok (some do some need work) and is on the IMBEL rcvr that is about what you would pay maybe a little more at a dealer I think SOG had them for 459 dealer price for a while. The CAI gas piston WILL need to be replace if it hasnt already as it WILL bend sooner or later you can get one from DSA or TAPCO. My first FAL was a cent L1A1 on an Imbel rcvr and it runs great I even put almost 500 rounds through it at one sitting and burnt the front of the handguards pretty good and Century sent me a new pair for free. The Hesse rcvrs suck big time.and the original CAI furniture leaves something to be desired but for now its all there is as the original butstock and grip would drop the parts count below legal levels. They are not as accurate as M1a's at longer ranges but for $450 its a pretty decent deal.I have a 9 power scope on mine and a 5 round mag have used it hunting many times.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 11:35:54 AM EST
Can you add a US made pistol grip and buttstock and stay legal? I am ignorant to these laws... It has a thumbhole stock now...
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:19:27 PM EST
A buddy of mine bought the Imbel L1A1 from AIM surplus. It's a magazine fed .308 battle rifle with adequate combat accuracy and seems to be reliable based on few hundred rounds. Yeah, it was worth the money, not much more though.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:34:38 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:47:49 PM EST
Originally Posted By jvic: Can you add a US made pistol grip and buttstock and stay legal? I am ignorant to these laws... It has a thumbhole stock now...
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Yes you can! You will have to replace the required number of parts with american made parts.... FSE (First Son Enterprises) makes Hammer, trigger, and sear, replace gas piston with one made in the USA, add a Inch pistol grip made by VOW, etc,etc.... Check out the Fnfal files, lots of knowledgable folks over there to steer you in the right direction!
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:52:40 PM EST
Originally Posted By jvic: Can you add a US made pistol grip and buttstock and stay legal? I am ignorant to these laws... It has a thumbhole stock now...
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Think I have the same CAI L1A1 you do...thumbhole stock and everything. $450 is a good price. I would do it.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:53:24 PM EST
How do I tell if it's an IMBEL receiver?
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:55:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2001 12:48:19 PM EST by SteyrAUG]
CAI makes the best unproven firearm/pipe bombs in the world. It "probably" won't blow up and kill you right away. CAI not only are their receivers dangerous, they use 20 year old retired parts. How can you go wrong? Check out that cool spray paint finish. Ever notice they are always for sale by previous owner pretty cheap?
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:57:32 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:58:47 PM EST
Originally Posted By WILSON:
How do I tell if it's an IMBEL receiver?
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It'll say so, or at least have the "gear" logo.
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Thanks!
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 12:59:24 PM EST
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG: CAI makes the best unproven firearm/pipe bombs in the world. It "probably" won't blow up and kill you right away. CAI not only are their receivers dangerous, they use 20 year old retired parts. How can you go wrong? Check out that cool spray paint finish. Ever notice they are always for sale by previous owner pretty cheap?
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That doesn't sound like a vote of confidence...
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 1:09:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By jvic: That doesn't sound like a vote of confidence...
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It doesn't matter that they are built by immigrant monkeys in bicycle shops with hand tools. The important thing is IT IS CHEAP. When you save money how can you go wrong? I mean a Yugo is still a car right?
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 1:18:38 PM EST
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
Originally Posted By jvic: That doesn't sound like a vote of confidence...
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It doesn't matter that they are built by immigrant monkeys in bicycle shops with hand tools. The important thing is IT IS CHEAP. When you save money how can you go wrong? I mean a Yugo is still a car right?
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He is a coworker who bought it from a former coworker who was the original owner...
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 1:24:40 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 1:35:16 PM EST
The reciever will say "reciever made by Imbel Injubata Brasila" the Cai guns didnt have the gear logo on them and of course the usual CAI st albans Vt lettering looks like a dot matrix printer did it. If you know what to expect from a century gun and that you may have to change some parts its a good deal --ask your buddy if he will let you shoot it if it gets through a mag ok go for it --hell 5 mags from DSA would cost ya 25 plus shipping (one probably came with the gun).I have never heard of a century L1A1 grenading. Like I said I have one and 4 home built FALs all on Imbel recievers and with no problems with any of em. There is some controversy over the williams Aluminium and DSA recievers right now but century never built on those recievers. Check that the gun fires and cycles good that the gas piston is in good shape check HS if possible.Break it in half- pullout the bolt carrier and bolt by the rattail - and check the bore. if all that looks good --Buy it.Its almost like buying a used car make sure you are not buying someone elses headache and then go ahead --every body is gonna have a different opinion of any particular model based on thier own prefrence . If you feel good about it go ahead If you have reservations or the deal doesnt feel right in your gut save your money for something that you know you want and will be happy with ---We dont have to live with the results of your actions so dont take our word for it do what makes YOU happy. Best of luck! If you need pics of what to look at let me know and I will post some.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 1:39:07 PM EST
Originally Posted By offctr: --ask your buddy if he will let you shoot it if it gets through a mag ok go for it --
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You don't expect a lot from firearms huh? Don't worry, it will probably go "Bang."
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 2:04:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2001 2:17:26 PM EST by offctr]
Nope I expect just as much as anyone else, Its just that the Cai's that have problems are pretty ovbious and probably wont get through a 20 round mag without FTF FTE's etc etc If it runs a mag no problem then the gas is set right and aside from CAI's stellar finishing skills will be ok. I have seen people have problems with DSA guns despite thier good reputation and HKs adn Colts rugers Most of the time these are quality manufacturers that let a bad one slip out and granted Century seems to be the other way around but as long as the parts are good there is nothing CAI did that cant be corrected. Since the dont even provide a manual I have seen em with the gas plug in grenade mode essentially turning it into a single shot rifle thatthe owner was ready to get rid of for 200 bucks until he forund out what was wrong with it .. so all I am saying is dont discount it just becuase CAI built it there are plenty of em out there that run just fine.As long as it works ok then 450 with 6 mags is a good deal. [img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1727175&a=13563493&p=56942040[/img] Here is My L1A1 CAI "sporter"
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 2:43:06 PM EST
I have shot it and been around it when it was being used and it never had a single malfunction. Seemed like a pretty decent gun, but I hate that butthole stock [;)]... $450 didn't sound too bad...
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 2:51:46 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2001 2:45:38 PM EST by jvic]
Originally Posted By offctr: The reciever will say "reciever made by Imbel Injubata Brasila" the Cai guns didnt have the gear logo on them and of course the usual CAI st albans Vt lettering looks like a dot matrix printer did it. If you know what to expect from a century gun and that you may have to change some parts its a good deal --ask your buddy if he will let you shoot it if it gets through a mag ok go for it --hell 5 mags from DSA would cost ya 25 plus shipping (one probably came with the gun).I have never heard of a century L1A1 grenading. Like I said I have one and 4 home built FALs all on Imbel recievers and with no problems with any of em. There is some controversy over the williams Aluminium and DSA recievers right now but century never built on those recievers. Check that the gun fires and cycles good that the gas piston is in good shape check HS if possible.Break it in half- pullout the bolt carrier and bolt by the rattail - and check the bore. if all that looks good --Buy it.Its almost like buying a used car make sure you are not buying someone elses headache and then go ahead --every body is gonna have a different opinion of any particular model based on thier own prefrence . If you feel good about it go ahead If you have reservations or the deal doesnt feel right in your gut save your money for something that you know you want and will be happy with ---We dont have to live with the results of your actions so dont take our word for it do what makes YOU happy. Best of luck! If you need pics of what to look at let me know and I will post some.
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thanks! Good advice...I don't know anything about these weapons, so I will have to do some reading to understand assy, etc... [Edited because I don't know how to spell reading...lord...]
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 2:59:09 PM EST
The problem with the thumbhole stock is that century ground off the pistol grip screw bushing from the lower You can replace it or get a lower with the bushing in it and swap the parts over --actually I think I have an stripped inch lower in my pile'o parts Let me know if you buy it and you can have it otherwise stripped inch lowers are <29$ with the bushing in place and you will need the grip and stock set as well. A stock tool is handy but you can get by without it as long as you are cautious when removing the stock retaining screw or buy one or use a cleanig rod section to hold the spring during re-install. Theres alot of good info on them out there and they are just as addictive as AR's and M14's etc.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 3:01:19 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 3:02:00 PM EST
Originally Posted By offctr: I have seen people have problems with DSA guns despite thier good reputation and HKs adn Colts rugers
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Let's see... Typos, HK bash, hmmm...are you sure you're not Todd? Here's the word on CAI guns. When they are bought by those who never owned the real thing they seem OK. That is until compared to a quality FAL, Garand or HK. Just last week I had some guy who was completely amazed at how easily he could charge my HK91. All the ones he had tried were a bear to open. Well as it turns out this was the first REAL HK he tried. There is simply no comparing a CAI FAL to a DSA FAL. One uses a spec receiver the other does NOT, unless it happens to be Imbel. One uses 20 year old retired part kits and poor semi auot fire control parts the other uses NEW Steyr parts and US parts made to standards suprpassing Beligain FN. One is expertly assembled the other is not. One is professionally finished the other is spray painted. One also has a lifetime warranty, guess which one? So please spare me your one is as good as the other notion. It is absurd. I'm glad you are happy with your CAI guns. I personally would never invest in such a complete POS, let alone try and fix one. You could easily save yourself the time and trouble by buying a Imbel receiver, a NEW Steyr kit and DSA fire control parts. Then have it correctly assembled and finished. Then you would have a nice FAL. Why send the extra money on the crap gun from CAI when you will simple strip it to the receiver and start over? It would be easier and cheaper to get a finished DSA and that would come with a warranty. CAI guns are mostly for those who cannot afford or appreciate the real counterparts. These same people usually own a SKS and think it also is a fine rifle.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 3:08:29 PM EST
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG: These same people usually own a SKS and think it also is a fine rifle.
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Hey!!! I like my Romanian SKS! Not bad for $130 or whatever it was! It's what it is, nothing more, nothing less. Maybe I am the type of guy you are talking about! Hahaha I understand what you are saying, but it is also about budget. Not everyone can afford top of the line everything. I would rather put more money into another AR or save up towards a .50BMG. But this gun is fairly inexpensive, so maybe it's worth having. Maybe not. That's all I was asking.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 3:24:45 PM EST
No -- I am not bashing HK or DSA I am saying they have let bad pieces go out the door too (ocasionally) but in an inverse proportion to CAI and at an appropriate price diffrence a DSA starts at around 800 an IMI starts at 600 and SOME of those are crap The OLY fals are at around 600-700+ and arent even compliant(legal)--No I wont compare century to DSA or hold them up as comparable but alot of the cai guns that came out were perfectly functional examples and for 450 bucks all done you cant beat it. Sure if you got the 700-1000 to drop on every gun you buy so be it if the guy can pick up a fal to play with for 450 as long as the gun works as it should hey -- do it. There is nothing wrong with an Imbel rcvr or the parts used to build it just that CAIs concern was quantity and DSA's is quality Just as a Bushmanster and an OLY and a Colt and an RRA AR's would all have thier fans and detractors. BTW I bought an actual HK for a couple of hundred as the original owner had messed up the finish (scratched up) real bad and broken the cocking handle off Just cause the rifle looked bad when I bought it didnt disuade me cause I knew I could repark it and fix what he had done . Agian granted Its an HK and I wouldnt compare it to a CAI in terms of value but with markings covered I have seen HK's and CAIs and smith builds you could not tell apart by feel or shooting them, So if you want a shooter the CAI is a good way to go If you want a collectors item there are 50.63's out there you can find one and have the money.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 4:07:00 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2001 4:03:49 PM EST by jimmyjoebob]
Gee AUG- do you by chance work for DSA? It seems that you have such glowing reports over their guns. You make them sound as infallible as the Pope! :) Actually, DSA uses the same parts that CAI does, they are just a bit chosier in what they consider rejects. There are DSA guns that are crap too, go over to the FIles and read about the guy with the DSA Argentine import that they refuse to fix( supposedly a bad ejector block) CAI makes thousands of more guns than DSA. FYI, DSA does not even make their own receivers, they farm out the work to a machine shop. I do like DSA Products, I own plenty of them, but lets be honest their prices are sky high, and their business practices are pretty shady. I will say this not all CAI guns are sub MOA out of the box, and yes some are down right garbage. But if you invest a little money in one, they can shoot and perform just as well as a DSA. I say go get one, learn how to fix it up, then go buy a kit and receiver and send it to one of the custom gunsmiths, it will come back probably still cheaper than a DSA, and it will definitely shoot better.
Link Posted: 11/30/2001 5:46:05 PM EST
Originally Posted By jimmyjoebob: Gee AUG- do you by chance work for DSA? It seems that you have such glowing reports over their guns. You make them sound as infallible as the Pope! :)
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The Pope is fallible, DSA is not.
Actually, DSA uses the same parts that CAI does, they are just a bit chosier in what they consider rejects.
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Not true. In the SA 58 they manufacture every part for it. In the Austrian kit they use NEW Steyr parts. CAI uses complete crap. You cannot fix a 20 year old fried barrel no matter what color you paint it.
There are DSA guns that are crap too, go over to the FIles and read about the guy with the DSA Argentine import that they refuse to fix( supposedly a bad ejector block) CAI makes thousands of more guns than DSA.
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DSA does not currently offer a Argentine receiver gun. This lead me to belive it is a receiver and part kit sent in by a customer for assembly. The gun can only be as good as the kit provided. And I'm sure McDonalds sells more beef than a Steakhouse, guess which one is better. You would think after 1000s of tries CAI would be able to get it right.
FYI, DSA does not even make their own receivers, they farm out the work to a machine shop.
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But they were made with original Steyr blueprints weren't they?
I do like DSA Products, I own plenty of them, but lets be honest their prices are sky high, and their business practices are pretty shady.
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Compared to a preban FN for $3,000.00 I consider them downright affordable. And I'm not familar with their "shady" practices. But I have seen CAI outright lie, the phrase "like new" comes to mind.
I will say this not all CAI guns are sub MOA out of the box, and yes some are down right garbage. But if you invest a little money in one, they can shoot and perform just as well as a DSA.
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Again, for the slow people. Once you get rid of all the junk parts on a CAI gun, you will have to buy a NEW kit to put on the remaining bare receiver. After installing and finishing correctly you could have just bought a DSA gun and had a fully warrantied gun.
I say go get one, learn how to fix it up, then go buy a kit and receiver and send it to one of the custom gunsmiths, it will come back probably still cheaper than a DSA, and it will definitely shoot better.
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No, it won't. And no I don't work for DSA but I have shot alot of FALs. The only ones to consider are the IAI Imbel on Imbel gun, the Entreprise and the DSA. The DSA is the best and given the small price difference I would not recommend saving a couple bucks for the IAI or Entreprise gun. But some of you probably would.
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