Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Log In

A valid email is required.
Password is required.
Site Notices
6/21/2017 8:25:40 PM
Posted: 11/27/2001 8:47:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/27/2001 8:42:41 PM EDT by cc48510]
I Posted A While Back Regarding Where To Move After I Graduate. I Have Now Narrowed My List Down To A Number Of Cities. I Have Lived In Some Of These Cities, Visited Some Others, and Some I Have Not Been To At All. If Anybody Lives In Or Around Them, Please Let Me Know: A) How The Gun Situation Is (Ranges, Dealers, Gun Shows, Laws) B) How The Job Market Is (Computer Networking) C) How The Traffic Is (Roads, Etc.) D) Cost Of Living (Rent) E) Any Other Important Information Here Is My List: [list] [*]Florida[/*] [list] [*]Panama City[/*] [*]Jacksonville[/*] [*]Saint Augustine[/*] [*][s]Orlando[/s]: I Lived There For 2 Years[/*] [/list] [*]Georgia[/*] [list] [*][s]Atlanta[/s]: I Quasi-Lived There[/*] [*]Brunswick[/*] [*]Savannah[/*] [/list] [*]Mississippi[/*] [list] [*]Biloxi[/*] [/list] [*]Tennessee[/*] [list] [*]Knoxville[/*] [*]Gatlinburg[/*] [*]Nashville[/*] [/list] [*]Kentucky[/*] [list] [*]Louisville[/*] [/list] [*]Indiana[/*] [list] [*]Jeffersonville[/*] [*]Indianapolis[/*] [/list] [*]Pennsylvania[/*] [list] [*]Philadelphia[/*] [*]Poconos Region[/*] [/list] [*]Vermont[/*] [list] [*]Burlington[/*] [*]Saint Albans[/*] [*]Montpilier[/*] [*]Rutland[/*] [/list] [*]New Hampshire[/*] [list] [*]Concord[/*] [*]Manchester[/*] [*]Beach Area[/*] [/list] [*]Texas[/*] [list] [*]San Antonio[/*] [*]Waco[/*] [*]Coprus Christi[/*] [*]Austin[/*] [*]Houston[/*] [*]Dallas-Fort Worth[/*] [*]Amarillo[/*] [/list] [/list]
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 4:07:11 AM EDT
This is "narrowed down"? Whoa. You left off Waterloo, Iowa, but that's about all......
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 4:23:51 AM EDT
Out of your list, I think Texas is the best. I visited there and did some work there too....I like it.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:25:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 9:18:24 AM EDT by cc48510]
OK, here is my short list: [list] [*]Florida[/*] [list] [*]Panama City[/*] [*]Jacksonville[/*] [*][s]Orlando[/s]: I Lived There For 2 Years[/*] [/list] [*]Georgia[/*] [list] [*][s]Atlanta[/s]: I Lived There For A Little While.[/*] [*]Brunswick[/*] [*]Savannah[/*] [/list] [*]Tennessee[/*] [list] [*]Knoxville[/*] [*]Gatlinburg[/*] [/list] [/list]
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:36:24 AM EDT
Panama City A lot smaller than Jax, less traffic, less crime. Rent and house cost will be less, fuel a little higher. I chose Florida first, less taxes, and the state dowes not hassel you as much as others. CCW relative easy to obtain. Tx would have been my next choice.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:42:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Celt: This is "narrowed down"? Whoa. You left off Waterloo, Iowa, but that's about all......
View Quote
Actually, I left off everything west of the Mississippi River, except Texas. The Carolinas and Virginia are great states, but I have a problem with being limited to 1 Handgun per Month or Not Being Able To Go Class 3. I left off MD, DE, DC, NJ, NY, MA, CT, and RI for obvious reasons. OH was left off becuase it lacks CCW. MI is too cold from what I have heard. AL supposedly bans SBRs and SBSs
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:46:56 AM EDT
BTW, I am planning to head to the Jacksonville Gun Show this weekend. I will use the extra time to check out the city. Just checking but, I went to the Ft. Lauderdale Gun Show only find out Broward has an Illegal (Per FS 790.33) Waiting Period. Duval is pretty Pro-Gun right (No waiting period on Longguns ?)
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:49:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:49:55 AM EDT
I grew up and live in Knoxville. What do you want to know about it?
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 9:51:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By cc48510: The Carolinas and Virginia are great states, but I have a problem with being limited to 1 Handgun per Month or Not Being Able To Go Class 3.
View Quote
Yes, VA has only one handgun a month but it is very difficult to afford one a month. [;)] I think our new Attorney General wasts to get rid of the 1 Handgun a month.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 10:10:07 AM EDT
If VA gets rid of that rule, I will add: [list] [*]Richmond[/*] [*]Virginia Beach[/*] [*]Manassass[/*] [*]Danville[/*] [/list]
Originally Posted By 7:
Originally Posted By cc48510: The Carolinas and Virginia are great states, but I have a problem with being limited to 1 Handgun per Month or Not Being Able To Go Class 3.
View Quote
Yes, VA has only one handgun a month but it is very difficult to afford one a month. [;)] I think our new Attorney General wasts to get rid of the 1 Handgun a month.
View Quote
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 10:45:40 AM EDT
No. Virginia ie fairfax and Manasses are very anal about a lot of things.. Do have the NRA range there which is pretty cool. St Augustine, FL shuts down early.. Kind of a old person town. I'm on my way to houston in the fall... Good Luck..
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 11:05:13 AM EDT
Keep Panama City active and add back Nashville. I know taxes would "NEVER" influence your decision but neither Florida nor Tennessee have a state income tax. (Nor Texas)
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 11:40:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 11:34:44 AM EDT by cc48510]
My short list includes only cities I have actually visited. I haven't been to Nashville, so it wasn't on the list. I know from living in Pensacola that visiting a city doesn't tell me about the gun situation. For example, Pensacola is real cool about owning guns, but they have only 1 public Gun Range and almost no "exotic" guns. And when they say "exotic" that means AR-15s, etc... Panama City seems from what I know to better pretty good. They have a state range. Does anybody from there know how the Appalachicola Range compares to the Ocala National Forest Range. I bought a Carbine from a Panam City Dealer at the Santa Rosa Gun Show, he also had lots of AR-15 Parts. Are these relatively easy to find there ? My really short list is: [list] [*]Panama City, FL[/*] [*]Jacksonville, FL[/*] [*]Orlando, FL[/*] [*]Atlanta, GA[/*] [*]Knoxville, TN[/*] And If VA Drops The 1 Handgun/Month Rule... [*]Richmond, VA[/*] [/list]
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 11:45:33 AM EDT
I'll answer what I know for Texas (even though it's off the list) A) How The Gun Situation Is (Ranges, Dealers, Gun Shows, Laws) We love our guns. Houston and Dallas have pretty big gun shows. B) How The Job Market Is (Computer Networking) Computer high tech is split between Dallas (Silicon Corridor) and Austin (Silicon Hills). They're in the dump right now (who isn't?) but they beat Caliban any day of the week. C) How The Traffic Is (Roads, Etc.) Traffic is generally what you'd expect - sucks during rush hour. Dallas and Houston aren't too bad because you have a few choices in highways. Austin sucks the worst because of treehuggers and liberals that think light rail and bike trails are the answer to everything. D) Cost Of Living (Rent) Forget Austin. Everything is expensive. Most expensive city in Texas. And traffic sucks (see C) E) Any Other Important Information Houston will get a NFL team again in 2002.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 11:46:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 11:41:55 AM EDT by Gun-fan]
I'd go with Jacksonville. It has everything you have asked for & is lose enough for you to really explore prior to making the commitment.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 12:35:14 PM EDT
Houston, TX A) Texas is a Class III accepting state, so you can go full auto. There are several places around Houston and the burbs that allow you to fire full auto as well, provided you bring your tax stamp. We have big 2,000 tables gun shows 4 times a year, and smaller shows at least once a month. In December there's one every weekend except the first. It's Texas, so the attitude is generally pro-gun unless you're in a really liberal part of town (Montrose/Westheimer area is the only one I can really think of). There are gun shops all over the places. Plenty of ranges too, both indoor and outdoor. B) I'm in computer networking, and right now the field is mostly open to contractors with some offering contract to hire. C) Traffic is generally acceptable as long as you're heading anywhere but the West side of I-10. Other than that, the Galleria area (I-10W and Loop 610) is the only other trouble spot. I stick to the toll roads as much as possible, and it's generally very easy to get around town. D) Cost of living in Houston is cheap! E) URBAN SPRAWL! [:D] Houston is literally a BIG city. But, it's got a lot to offer. We get lots of concerts and have a decent selection of music venues. We'll have all the major sports teams as of 2002 except for NHL. The people are friendly for the most part, and there's lots of good food, as more people eat out in Houston than any other city. You're not far from fresh or saltwater fishing if you're into that, and there are places to hunt if you are so inclined. It doesn't snow here often (last time was 1990), and the weather is generally warm with a lot of humidity. There are a decent amount of ar15.com folks here, and they have shoots every so often. It's been home to me most of my life. God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 12:56:04 PM EDT
I live in Panama City. Not a bad place to live at all. Let me see here... [b]A) How The Gun Situation Is (Ranges, Dealers, Gun Shows, Laws)[/b] Not bad...better than Pensacola. We have 2 class III dealers. One of the shops is huge with a 15 lane indoor range. The only other two ranges (if you're not a LEO) are the one you mentioned (25$ a year if an NRA member) that's about an hours drive or the "Panhandle Gun Club" $300 membership (they no longer allow class III weapons. [b]B) How The Job Market Is (Computer Networking)[/b] No Idea...sorry [b]C) How The Traffic Is (Roads, Etc.)[/b] No problem at all except from mid february until april (spring break season), at which time if you're on the beach you can expect very long delays. [b]D) Cost Of Living (Rent)[/b] Very good. [b]E) Any Other Important Information[/b] come visit, I'll show ya' around.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 12:57:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 1:49:59 PM EDT
SgtKiwi, If I end up going to the Tallahassee Gun Show, then I will probably head by Panama City. I will be heading to Jacksonville this weekend for their Gun Show and to take a look around. When is the next Panama City Gun Show ? Garand_Shooter, I checked out the actual NC Statutes and you are correct about C3. Just goes to show, I shouldn't believe what I read on the internet. Also, what is with the 31 Round rule ? Is that just another false rumor ? I understand NC has Gun Permits and GUn Registration, Is that true ?
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 1:57:01 PM EDT
Knoxville - Basically a huge college town. And UT was ranked high as a "party school" for those so inclined. Its really a small city, not overwhelming like some cities. Job market is good Gatlinburg - Gets overrun by tourists every summer / fall. Dollywood is nearby, and well as the Smoky Mountains. Can be VERY rural. Reasonable cost of living. Job market less good compared to knoxville, due to its more rural nature, and the retail and service industry jobs that dominate a touristr trap town.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 1:57:12 PM EDT
Cool to see some folks on here from the Florida panhandle! I was born in Ft. Walton Beach and lived in Shalimar - we had waterfront property. Unfortunately, we moved back to Aberdeen, Md. when I was a kid. IMHO, however, the best choice you listed was on your long list - Austin, Texas. Got family there, and every time I've been I swore I'd move there some day.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 2:23:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 5:47:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 5:56:11 PM EDT by cc48510]
I went back and found the information I had read about NC and Class 3:
NORTH CAROLINA LAW ON NFA WEAPONS North Carolina regulates machine guns in two areas of their law, both as machine guns, and lumped in to a category of all NFA weapons (and some other, non-NFA weapons as well), which they call "weapons of mass death and destruction". The respective statutory sections are 14-409, and 14-288.8. In order to be exempted from the general ban on possessing "weapons of mass death and destruction", found at section 14-288.8, you need to be either an FFL holder (including a collector's FFL, type 03), OR be one of apparently many "inventors, designers, ordnance consultants and researchers, chemists, physicists, and other persons lawfully engaged in pursuits designed to enlarge knowledge or to facilitate the creation, development, or manufacture of weapons of mass death and destruction intended for use in a manner consistant with the laws of United States and the State of North Carolina." While there are a few other exceptions, they do not apply to most people. In addition to machine guns being regulated as weapons of mass death and destruction, section 14-409 of the North Carolina statutes regulates machine guns in particular. It says that it is illegal to have one, unless you fall one of into several categories: 1. Banks, merchants and recognized businesses that have obtained a permit for the gun from their counties sheriff; 2. persons in the U.S. military, while engaged in their duties; 3. persons in the state militia, while engaged in their duties; 4. peace officers, while engaged in their duties; 5. "the manufacture, use or possession of such weapons for scientific or experimental purposes when such manufacture, use or possession is lawful under federal laws and the weapon is registered with a federal agency, and when a permit to manufacture, use or possess the weapon is issued by the sheriff of the county in which the weapon is located"; 6. persons who possessed such guns as a war souvenir before the law was passed may also keep them legally if they register them with their sheriff.
View Quote
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 5:48:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 5:52:30 PM EDT by cc48510]
Since the laws suggests you need the "permit" after you acquire the machine gun, not before, ATF should not require proof of a state permit that only applies after you take delivery to approve a form 4. However, as of January, 2000, I understand that, after the N.C. A.G. got interested in this law and discussed it with NFA Branch, ATF is requiring proof of a permit before they will approve a machine gun transfer form, including a transfer to a dealer. A permit from the sheriff of the county where the machine gun is lcoated, in addition to the Form 4, is required to possess a machine gun legally, under the law. Arguably, possession of a machine gun under the permit is exception requires a permit from any county where the machine gun is located, at any time, including moving the gun with your personal property from one residene to another, or even transporting it. See the email from the A.G.'s office, below, indicating in an informal opinion that no permit is needed to move it through counties from place of purchase to its place of storage, although a permit is needed for where it will be stored, and if it is to ever be stored in a new county, a permit from the sheriff of that county will be needed. The permit would be for "scientific or experimental" purposes, unless you fall into one of the other categories. However, your sheriff may consider the approved Form 4 to be your "permit". Whether the D.A. would agree that a form 4 signed by the sheriff is a "permit" is another issue, and whether collecting and fun shooting is possessing for scientific or experimental purposes is yet another issue. In addition, to comply with the "weapon of mass death and destruction" statute you need to either have an FFL, or have the gun for purposes listed as lawful in that statute. Until the late 1980's North Carolina law defined any firearm which was set up to fire 31 or more rounds without reloading as a machine gun, regardless of whether it fired more than one shot with a single pull of the trigger. See State v. Lee, 877 N.C. 242 (1970), for a discussion of the prior statute. Lee possessed an apparently semi-automatic Universal M-1 carbine with a 30 round magazine, and was prosecuted, the prosecutor apparently counting 30 rounds in the magazine and one in the chamber to reach 31. This prior definition excluded some machine guns, since it was dependent soely on magazine capacity, and as shown by the Lee case, included some guns which are not usually considered machine guns. As a result, many persons have machine guns in N.C., for which they do not have a permit, and arguably do not qualify for a permit either - they don't have the gun for the extremely limited reasons in the law. A push has started (1/2000) to get section 14-409 repealed, or amended to permit any Federally registered machine gun.
View Quote
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 5:49:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 5:47:04 PM EDT by cc48510]
James H. Jeffries III, a attorney who practices firearms law in North Carolina and in various federal courts, offers these additional thoughts: You may wish to point out that (1) where two statutes inconsistently address the same subject matter (e.g., the collector's exception for weapons of mass death and destruction), the specific statute (the MG statute) will be deemed to prevail over the general; (2) the great bulk of MGs legally registered in NC occurred before 1989 when the statute defined a MG as anything with a 31-round capacity or greater, regardless of type of fire (it has now been amended to use the federal definition); (3) many of the 100 NC sheriffs have no knowledge of the law and are conditioned by our pistol permit scheme to sign gun permits; (4) the NC AG's office for a long time was equally ignorant; (5) BATF continued to believe that NC is a MG state because many sheriff's continue to (erroneously) sign Forms 4 and 5; (6) some of the urban sheriffs and the state AG are beginning to wake up; (7) we have a general firearms forfeiture statute which makes seizable any firearm used (possessed) in violation of the law. I refrained for years from disseminating this info because of the potentially devastating effect on MG owners, but the word is now out. I have advised NC clients for several years that purchasing a MG in NC is a risky proposition and that only legislation can change the situation. In addition, a correspondent sent me this email he received from the N.C. Attorney General's office on the permit requirement. While not formal guidance from that office, it ay help pooint N.C. residents in the right direction: Subject: Fw: Response to Machine Gun Questions Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 21:18:02 -0500 From: "Victor Au" To: Mr. Bardwell, I have responses from the NC AGs office regarding the transportation of MGs in NC, as well as the need for a permit where the MG (the machine gun owner) is "located". It would appear that to transport the gun from one point to another across county lines does not require permits from each County Sheriff. However, when you move, you need a permit from the Sheriff where you move to, as you have pointed out in previous posts. Thanks for your efforts on behalf of NFA firearms owners. Victor Au.
View Quote
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 5:50:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 5:44:45 PM EDT by cc48510]
----- Original Message ----- From: Criminal Div. NC Dept of Justice To: Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Response to Machine Gun Questions > Dear Mr. Au: > > The Attorney General has received your inquiry via e-mail, and I am happy to respond. As I understand your questions, you are trying to resolve two (2) issues. First, you want to know if a person lawfully entitled to possess a machine gun has to obtain a permit from the sheriff of each county through which the machine gun must pass in order to be transported from the place of purchase to the ultimate destination. Second, you have asked whether or not a lawful machine gun owner has to obtain a permit from the sheriff of a county to which the machine gun owner has moved. > > The relevant statute for purposes of evaluating the lawfulness of the possession of a machine gun is N.C. Gen. Stat. section 14-409. If you are going to attempt to possess a machine gun, I commend this statute to you for your review. This statute also provides answers to your two (2) questions. > > N.C. Gen. Stat. section 14-409 specifies that the statute's prohibitions on the possession of a machine gun do not apply to citizens who have properly acquired a permit to possess such a weapon. This statutory language speaks of the term "permit" in a singular manner. Thus, if a person properly possesses a permit for the possession of a machine gun pursuant to the provisions of N.C. Gen. Stat. section 14-409, that person can lawfully transport the machine gun from the place of purchase to the weapon's ultimate destination. > > An analysis of the language found in N.C. Gen. Stat. section 14-409 is also instructive for purposes of answering your second question. This statute requires a permit for the possession of a machine gun to be obtained from the sheriff of the county where the machine gun (machine gun owner) is located. Thus, if the lawful owner of a machine gun takes the weapon to a different county, a new permit will have to be obtained from the sheriff of the county where the weapon is currently located. > > I hope this information is helpful to you. If this response to your inquiry is not satisfactory, please feel free to contact me by telephone at (919) 716-6725. > > Sincerely, > Jeffrey C. Sugg > Associate Attorney General > Law Enforcement Liaison Section >
View Quote
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 6:42:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/28/2001 6:37:36 PM EDT by dbrowne1]
Philadelphia- Went to undergrad there. Great city, some of it's a $hithole but PA has VERY relaxed gun laws, second only to VT (shall-issue without any strings, Class III is fine, no waiting periods or one gun a month crap). A lot of fun if you make some bucks. Cost of living is moderately high. Rent maybe 20% less than Boston/NY/DC. I'm basing this on law firm salary comparisons. Traffic in the city is city traffic, highways (76, 476) are good but busy during rushhour. VA- Currently at law school in VA. One gun a month doesn't bother me because I'm broke. CCW is shall-issue but can't carry in any place that serves alcohol unless you're LE or on-duty employee, very annoying. Machineguns are legal if you do the ATF crap and register it with VASP. No permit needed. Don't know about SBRs, suppressors, etc. Northern VA has a LOT of tech/telecomm companies, higher cost of living. Anywhere outside the DC area is cheap in VA though. Some localities have gun laws enacted before preemption in the 1980's. NH- Similar gun laws to PA. Concord is nice, reasonable cost of living, still far enough away from MA to still be "live free or die". Headquarters of LFI (Mas Ayoob). Manchester is legally the same and has a great airport (Southwest air flies there). 45 minutes from Boston if you want a city. Unfortunately it's full of strip malls and Massholes now due to its proximity to MA. More tech companies there, might find a computer job there and you can live in Concord. Anywhere in VT will be smalltownish and obviously there are no gun laws. No traffic, but no jobs for computer people.
Link Posted: 11/28/2001 7:16:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GodBlessTexas: Houston, TX A) Texas is a Class III accepting state, so you can go full auto. There are several places around Houston and the burbs that allow you to fire full auto as well, provided you bring your tax stamp. We have big 2,000 tables gun shows 4 times a year, and smaller shows at least once a month. In December there's one every weekend except the first. It's Texas, so the attitude is generally pro-gun unless you're in a really liberal part of town (Montrose/Westheimer area is the only one I can really think of). There are gun shops all over the places. Plenty of ranges too, both indoor and outdoor. B) I'm in computer networking, and right now the field is mostly open to contractors with some offering contract to hire. C) Traffic is generally acceptable as long as you're heading anywhere but the West side of I-10. Other than that, the Galleria area (I-10W and Loop 610) is the only other trouble spot. I stick to the toll roads as much as possible, and it's generally very easy to get around town. D) Cost of living in Houston is cheap! E) URBAN SPRAWL! [:D] Houston is literally a BIG city. But, it's got a lot to offer. We get lots of concerts and have a decent selection of music venues. We'll have all the major sports teams as of 2002 except for NHL. The people are friendly for the most part, and there's lots of good food, as more people eat out in Houston than any other city. You're not far from fresh or saltwater fishing if you're into that, and there are places to hunt if you are so inclined. It doesn't snow here often (last time was 1990), and the weather is generally warm with a lot of humidity. There are a decent amount of ar15.com folks here, and they have shoots every so often. It's been home to me most of my life. God Bless Texas
View Quote
I agree with GBT. I would add that to live outside houston city limits and Harris county limits is better (this would not be hard or harmful), we may have some interesting property tax issues in the next 1 or 2 years. SSD
Link Posted: 11/29/2001 3:57:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By cc48510: SgtKiwi, If I end up going to the Tallahassee Gun Show, then I will probably head by Panama City. I will be heading to Jacksonville this weekend for their Gun Show and to take a look around. When is the next Panama City Gun Show ?
View Quote
Sounds good, I e-mailed you my info if you want me to show you any of the area, give me a call. As far as gun shows, all we get is the "Southern GunMasters" here. It sux bad. They are the ones who put on the show at the Municipal Auditorium in Pensacola (Not to be confused with the one at the Pensacola Fairgrounds). If I want to see a decent show, I travel to Atlanta (4 1/2 hrs.), Jax (5 hrs.), or Orlando (5 1/2 hrs.).
Top Top