now these people are somewhat "argumentative" so patron beware.
[url]http://www.hardcoretalk.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=38&t=000561[/url]

the storie is at this addy.  [url]http://www.stanley2002.org/[/url]

i don't know but this looks promosing (in a way)

This is what I've always advocated. If enough of us stood up and said NO!! Maybe we wouldn't be in so much crap. But their are a lot of people who are too scared to actually do anything except try to be alone. They aren't willing to put their butt on the line.

Interesting idea.  Civil disobediance is the order of the day in Red California.

------
"Please stay away if you are a psycho, a coward or a liberal whiner."

I have an old Iver Johnson .22 revolver that don't work.

I wouldn't mind loosing it.  (I was waiting for a gun buy back so I could get maybe $50.00 to put towards something useful like a Vaquero.)

Would there be extradition laws with MI if it's legal for open carry here?

i belive this would be "the" last ditch effort to avoid revolution.

well, we gotta do something. and nothing weve done yet has worked.

the letters arent working... (especially uder the eleged threat of anthrax)

the phone calls arent working... all you get on the other end is a moron who gets payed minimum wage ..

voteing obviousely isn't working.. every polatition has proved that they all arent worth there salt..

how can we ever hope for a restoration if we continue blindly on this path weve followed for the last two centuries...

weve got to do something, and soon. or we will have lost. if this last effort at peacably resolving the situation pans out, maby theres a chance,, if it doesn't, well you know what the last resort is.

RAF ---

Do you in fact KNOW?  Will you only stand if there is a precedent or a crowd to stand with  you?  Will you stand alone? When and if the spirit resists, you alone or as a collective have won. What are YOU waiting for? Do you NEED consent in order to withdaw yours? Fortunately, or unfortunately, depending on your perpsective, the battle moves on without your understanding. The battle may infact be won on an individual basis.

We all individually decide what our personal level of tolerance is. When we decide the line we will personally not allow to be crossed, do we then need a group concensus to know that we have made the right decision?

Rhetorical questions, evidently, at least to me. But, RAF, Do you see the personal truth in the questions?

"The protection of our rights is tested, however, not when what we do or say is popular but when it is unpopular. Stated most starkly, a free society is tested by the way it protects the rights of its least popular members." --Roger Pilon

unfortuneatly, past perfornance provides that they don't. especially whare firearms owners are conserned.

I can't say I disagree, but what do we do?  If you start going out by yourself and waxing govt. bureaucrats a la Unintended Consequences, how long would it be before you got caught?  The media would convict you of being a "domestic terrorist" even if a kangaroo court could not.  No matter what your true intentions, you will be cast down as a traitor and evil.  Your story will never be heard over the din of "gunmen kills state official" or whatever it is.  All crimes are senseless in the eyes of the media.  There are never underlying factors like the guy just couldn't take it in the ass from society anymore.

It's too late don't you get it?  Checkmate.  Anyways, why the hell do you want to fight for the freedom of a bunch of sheeplike Americans who don't want freedom and would resent you for stirring things up and causing them inconvenience?  A popular resistance movement has to have some element of the population behind it and Americans are too fat, too dumb and too lazy to ever care about freedom.  

You and I understand that the taxes are unjust and that power is being wielded very arbitrarily and that American freedom is an oxymoron.  But until some overt and truly  vile incident takes place, there is no basis for armed resistance.  And guess what?  There will never be such a galvanizing incident.  We're all doomed to be Winston Smiths (from 1984).  Freedom lovers will be identified and knocked off one by one until there are none or so few that they don't matter (like now).

You can get revenge on bureaucrats, but you can't get revenge on a faceless bureaucracy.  

Well standing up for our rights is a good thing, and it is also good to have an armed demonstration at the right time and place, but getting arrested is NOT a good idea at any time and is in fact a totally stupid idea. What will happen to anyone who is stupid enough to actually do this is that first they will be arrested, and they will loose what ever firearm they have with them. This is of course understood and planned for by everyone who will take part in this demonstration. But everyone also has to understand that they stand to lose much more. For one thing if you are charged with a felony and are convicted you will lose the ability to purchase and own any firearms, plus the police will use the fact that you openly violated the law and will consider you a threat to society and will get a search warrant and search your home for any firearms. And unless you have removed them to a safe location you will not only have a criminal record but also not have any guns left.

Armed civil disobedience will only work if you have enough people who are willing to risk it all for freedom and will not surrender and let themselves be arrested. The idea behind this type of demonstration is to show to the government that we the people will not give up our rights and we still have the “Spirit of Resistance", and we are in fact saying to them that we are no longer going to automatically and slavishly obey a law just because it exists and we are willing to fight to defend our rights. And to the enemies of freedom and all those who will try to take our rights from us we need to state. We are willing to fight and die in defense of our God given rights and are you willing to fight and die trying to take our rights from us.

And another thing, this is not the right time to do this and seems to me to be more of a political show. At this time there are still a lot of things that we can do to save our rights among them is to let the people know that we the Home Guard aka Militia are willing and able to help protect the people from these terrorists. I believe that once the sheeple figure out that we are not the enemy and are in fact their protectors they will no longer support the agenda of the radical anti gun movement.

Now if Gore had stolen the Presidency it would be a whole different thing and it just might be the right time for this type of action. But not now.

btt