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Posted: 11/14/2001 3:45:38 PM EDT
now that i got someone's attention... will the fact that ive used LSD in the past hinder my becoming a LEO? on the applications it says... 1.) have to pass urinalysis 2.) no drug use in past year 3.) drug use in past limited to type and situation (whether they will "forgive" it or not) now, it was only a couple times...and about 4 or 5 years ago... any help?
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 3:49:52 PM EDT
If you weren't busted for it, don't mention it.
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 3:50:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 3:52:40 PM EDT
There's no way they'll know if you haven't used it in 4 years. Traces may remain in the body, but they're not coming out from your urine or in your blood. I hate to say this, but if you're a straight arrow now then you shouldn't tell them about your past, provided there is no record of it. So if you've never been arrested for it or been detained for being under the influence then you should be ok. Good luck! God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 3:52:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raf: If they ask you on the exam, or in oral interview, don't lie. Lying will only expose you to the truth. ALWAYS tell the truth, even if it hurts.
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... Mom? Is that you?
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 3:57:27 PM EDT
Since LSD cannot be detected except through a spinal tap, they'll never test for it. That said, only YOU will ever know the truth... The flip side of this is if you are ever administered a polygraph test, then it will probably be asked! Years ago when I was facing a drug test for employment, I figured that I really had nothing to lose by being honest with the employer before hand, when I was informed that a test was mandatory... I was told that he understood and apreciated my honesty, but that I still had to take the drug test. I failed it miserably, but was immediately hired anyway, due to my honesty. I can tell you that not everyone would obviously be that lucky, and I also learned a very valuable lesson... Quit getting high!
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:02:41 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:03:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rainman: If you weren't busted for it, don't mention it.
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When I applied for the CA Highway patrol, they asked the drug use question during the polygraph phase. Unless you know how to beat a polygraph, I would tell em. I used cocaine in H.S. and I put that down. I still passed the whole interview process. But there was such a long wait for the academy that I did not bother to pursue cause I needed a job right then and there. I just got out of the military and was broke. Not sure on this, but I have heard that some departments are using hair samples for drug testing instead of urinalysis. Hair test can detect drug use and far back as 10yrs.
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:03:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/14/2001 3:57:43 PM EDT by PBR12]
i wouldnt mention it if it werent for the damn polygraph... so, would it really cause me to not get hired? thanks again (BTW...i havent had any of the same hair for ten years...)
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:05:43 PM EDT
Originally Posted By PBR12: i wouldnt mention it if it werent for the damn polygraph... so, would it really cause me to not get hired? thanks again (BTW...i havent had any of the same hair for ten years...)
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Convince yourself that it was just a sugar cube.
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:06:19 PM EDT
LSD is not only mind altering but also alters both brain physiology and chemistry engrams...synaptic pathways..and neuro transmitters permanently altered...LSD is basically an artificial/synthetic creation of psychosis...that can cause irreversible damage....in professions that demand great concentration..cognitive abiltiy...and rely on both long term and short term memory ...LSD is just about the last thing on earth you might want to experiment with...
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:09:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:11:13 PM EDT
right right right...i know... drugs bad (especially that one, i know) BUT regardless cant change that so, once again...will it cause hiring problems?
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:16:29 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:18:56 PM EDT
Polygraph shmolygraph. If those were so great we could do away with entire judicial system. Hook some rube up to a computer and tell him that you'll [i]know[/i] when he's lying - puhlease. Pabst Blue Ribbon, if you're pretty sure that your past actions aren't traceable, I'd lie my ass off. Unless of course they use a DSVA (Digital Voice Stress Analyzer)! There's just no way to beat those! [:P]
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:41:04 PM EDT
I wouldnt mention it if it werent for the damn polygraph... So, would it really cause me to not get hired?
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An old friend that I used to party my ass off with is now a DEA Agent, and this guy did more acid than anyone I know! We laughed when we found out that he was an agent, and then started referring to him as the [b]D[/b]rug [b]E[/b]nhanced [b]A[/b]gent!
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:51:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raf: If they ask you on the exam, or in oral interview, don't lie. Lying will only expose you to the truth. ALWAYS tell the truth, even if it hurts.
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NO WAY!!! ALWAYS tell them what they want to hear during a job interview.
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:54:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 9divdoc: LSD is not only mind altering but also alters both brain physiology and chemistry engrams...synaptic pathways..and neuro transmitters permanently altered...LSD is basically an artificial/synthetic creation of psychosis...that can cause irreversible damage....in professions that demand great concentration..cognitive abiltiy...and rely on both long term and short term memory ...LSD is just about the last thing on earth you might want to experiment with...
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Scare Tactics
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 5:06:30 PM EDT
PBR12 in his younger days... [img]http://www.gypsyrose.com/images/gds-john.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 5:19:41 PM EDT
Tell the truth. The hireing process is much more forgiving then even 10 years ago. My agency will hire [b]women[/b] who have admitted hard drug use as recently as three years ago. I think LAPD will hire you even if you use drugs with your background investigator .
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 5:53:35 PM EDT
Denver Police Department is so hard up for recruits they will overlook it as long as it isn't current.
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 7:25:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/14/2001 7:19:39 PM EDT by raven]
Originally Posted By Paul: The spinal tap thing is an urban myth as far as I know as I've had the Naval Investigative Service draw urine of a young student sailor that I susspected of LSD use. The gas spectrum chonograph (sp) can detect very very tiny amounts of drugs.
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I guess so. LSD dosages are meted out in micrograms; millionths of a gram. To detect that minute a dose by uninealysis....... Anyway, I would just lie about the past LSD use. Unless you were busted for possessing it or you told your employers and teachers you loved doing acid, the background check won't reveal your use either. I know a guy who's a pilot, a Navy SEAL, and one CIA agent who have used it in the past, and got their jobs in spite of it.
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:14:02 AM EDT
antiUSSA, did yer buddy admit to it? how bout the other people? i heard that if you fail the damn polygraph they wont hire you... so once again...ive done it, long time ago wont do it anymore dont plan on admitting it good idea or not?
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:24:23 AM EDT
antiUSSA, did yer buddy admit to it? how bout the other people? i heard that if you fail the damn polygraph they wont hire you...
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I honestly don't know, but the fact that his skin glowed and looked like a trip screen, I'm sure it was rather obvious! This guy did so much of EVERYTHING, that a urinalysis 20 years later would still light up like a Christmas tree! [:D]
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:27:29 AM EDT
LSD only elevates specific chemicals that are already presnet in the nervous system to produce the "high". The chemical that adjusts these levels (LSD) is not retained in the body perminetly nor are it's residuals.
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:28:26 AM EDT
Just be truthful. Put it to you this way: You tell the truth, and they ask you on the polygraph, and you pass, that's one in your favor. Your truthfulness can work for you. "Did you ever use LSD?" "Yes." Truth. "Recently?" "No." Truth. As I said. A point in your favor. Or, you can lie. And if they ask, you can lie there, too. Or just come out with it, and admit that you lied on the application. Either way, you're now a liar as far as they are concerned, and likely just shit away [b]any[/b] chance of being hired.
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:34:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2001 5:29:15 AM EDT by SouthernShark]
Originally Posted By PBR12: now that i got someone's attention... will the fact that ive used LSD in the past hinder my becoming a LEO? on the applications it says...
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I had a friend who applied to the FBI and she admitted to smoking pot more than 15 times. They told her that it disqualified her. Sorry, but I think most LEO's will disqualify you for prior drug use. My advice is to say F'em and find another career. Who wants to be in an organization where it is ok to beat your wife, but not ok if you smoked a fatty 5 years ago? [@:D] If you want to do it anyway, then just lie your ass off. If you fail the polygraph, then just keep lying. Tell them it is full of shit!! Get indignant about it. If they don't hire you, then who cares??? They weren't going to hire you anyway. No loss..... -SS
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:34:58 AM EDT
As long as were talking about the past, and you're through with that crap, now... ...deny it. Period. Your goal is to become a cop. Do what it takes, to make that happen, and then be a good cop.
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 5:54:33 AM EDT
What they dont know doesnt hurt them. A buddy of mine admitted to smoking pot on his initial paperwork to get into the Army When he tried to reclassify his MOS from infantry to MP,it came back to bite him in the ass.He didnt qualify. As long as your straight now,who cares about the past?
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 6:13:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2001 6:06:37 AM EDT by Dolomite]
But what if you're telling the truth and the dipshit "running" the polygraph still says your lying? Hmmm... I wonder if maybe they tell everyone they're lying?[8P][<]:)][:)>]
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 7:33:05 AM EDT
As a police background investigator myself, I'm telling you to be totally honest. You're not applying for Wal Mart. Background questions are extensive and detailed. Our inital background form runs 32 pages, and goes through a detailed history back to age 16. (note this is not the same form used for the polygraph) Typically takes about 6 months. Add to this that lying on the forms is an automatic firing offense, NO MATTER HOW LONG AGO. We terminated an officer just last month for claiming college he didn't really have. He'd been with us 7 years, and was forced to surrender his certification so he'll never work in the field again. The investigator assigned to your case is going to talk to your friends, your enemies, co-workers, landlords, and all the jurisdictions you've ever lived in. He's also going to see the applications you've given to other departments. If your name pops up in just ONE intel report not already listed, you're toast. Does not have to be an arrest, Druggies habitually give up the names of their friends. How well did you ever trust the guys you did dope around? People trying to pull stunts in the background investigation is the reason we go thru so many applicants. Of the 44 I had to do during the last hiring phase, I canned 36 for inconsistencies, outright lies, and lying thru omission. I even canned several for not returning phone calls in a timely manner. Other posters give examples of depts where someone got away with it. Without exception, those agencies are inferior, poorly run, or incompetent. Want to work for them or someone decent? BTW: Just for your info, drug testing here is mandatory upon demand, usually 3-4 times a year. A hot test (Includes LSD, Ecstasy and steroids) is a firing offense, as is domestic abuse. Your assigned investigator is going to add up two things. Negatives, such as admitted prior drug use, and positives, such as education, military service, etc. As long as positives outweigh the negatives, you're doing fine. A lie is not a negative, but a trip to the dumpster.
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 7:45:54 AM EDT
well, heres my deal GOOD 1.)3yrs in Army 2.)college grad 3.) EMT trained BAD 1.) some drugs a long time ago (little LSD little meth, very little marijuana) 4yrs ago all of it... 2.) "fined" for drunk in public once (spent night in drunk tank) thats about it do i rack up on the pos or neg at this point?
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 8:26:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2001 8:19:08 AM EDT by Norm_G]
Originally Posted By Johninaustin: As a police background investigator myself, I'm telling you to be totally honest. ... A lie is not a negative, but a trip to the dumpster.
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So, who investigates [i]your[/i] ass?
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 11:29:56 AM EDT
Standard RadioImmunoAssay (RIA, aka Abuscreen) and Enzyme Multiplied Immunoassay Technique (EMIT) testing methods are very rarely used to test for stuff like acid or X. Not because they're too expensive. Not because of the inherent (but completely accepted) inaccuracy factor (>5%) that labels scores of innocent people "druggies". Not due to lack of very profitable government/corporate substance abuse counseling farms that owe there very existance to the random drug testing industry - but due to the fact the window of detection is approximately 30-48 hours for those drugs using the above common methods. PBR, four years ago was four years ago.
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 11:42:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/15/2001 11:38:29 AM EDT by AcidGambit]
I know people who are cops and have done every drug in the book, save "X" and Heroin. They were hired. However, I would say it seriously depends on the department your are trying to get a job with. I have read about departments that are seriously anal about any "bad" in your past. I have also read of departments that don't ask or care what drugs you have done, as long as you have been clean for x-# of years and were never arrested for it. It was explained to me by a local LEO that they shunned LSD because of the problems it could present, either on the job or in court. Say a LEO becomes involved in somethong (a shooting or whatever) and it goes to court. A lawyer could trash the LEO's creditability by bringing up the fact that he had used LSD in the past and was having a flashback. I persoanlly believe Extacy to be the most damaging of all drugs, just from what I have read. I have know people who have used LSD, and I don't mean once or twice. They behave the same as they did before they used it and with no flashbacks ever. I don't condone illegal drug use, but neith do I look poorly upon those who have done illegal drugs in their past, grew up, and stopped a number of years go. People do stupid things in their younger years. I think that aside from some serious mental problem, it shouldn't be held against you. Now, if you sold drugs or stole to get money, that's different. I would strongly encourage you to tell the truth. Barring something really evil in your past or something you have done that is totally against the hiring policy, they just want to know that you are a truthful kind of guy. I never took the chance to become a LEO because where I lived at the time, you had to pay your own money to attend a 6mo class, this is before you were even considered for the hiring process. I didn't like the odds on that. Like anything, you will hear stories about people who got hired, there is always someone who beats the system or gets lucky. Good luck (and no, my screen name has nothing to do with LSD.)
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 12:04:15 PM EDT
trippin.......good. :D
Link Posted: 11/15/2001 3:45:30 PM EDT
Norm, I passed my original background in 1983, and 4 periodic updates since then. I'm due for another in 2003. A background investigation is never final. PBR, does not sound like anything major, a lot will depend on age at the time. (that youthful experimentation thing) My point is, tell the truth and it'll probably work itself out. Lie, and you are history. Police depts keep records of applicants, and trade info. Lie to one, you lie to them all. What will REALLY get a good going over is "current state" items, such as known associates/activities, alcohol habits,your financial affairs, job stability, That sort of thing. Keep in mind there is no such thing as the perfect applicant, everyone has a rough edge somewhere. These days the drug use question comes up a lot, it's more a question of have you gotten smarter.
Link Posted: 11/16/2001 8:10:05 PM EDT
My roommate in college had been through rehab twice for alcohol and drugs. LSD was his drug of choice and to this day he thinks on your 18th bday you should have to take a trip just to see what its like. After his second rehab he was totally clean, no booze or drugs. He left college after the second year, applied to and was hired as an officer in one of the KC, MO suburbs. He was straight with them about it and they were convinced that he wasn't going to go back to it. good luck.
Link Posted: 11/16/2001 9:08:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Johninaustin: As a police background investigator myself, I'm telling you to be totally honest. You're not applying for Wal Mart. Background questions are extensive and detailed. Our inital background form runs 32 pages, and goes through a detailed history back to age 16. (note this is not the same form used for the polygraph) Typically takes about 6 months. Add to this that lying on the forms is an automatic firing offense, NO MATTER HOW LONG AGO. We terminated an officer just last month for claiming college he didn't really have. He'd been with us 7 years, and was forced to surrender his certification so he'll never work in the field again. The investigator assigned to your case is going to talk to your friends, your enemies, co-workers, landlords, and all the jurisdictions you've ever lived in. He's also going to see the applications you've given to other departments. If your name pops up in just ONE intel report not already listed, you're toast. Does not have to be an arrest, Druggies habitually give up the names of their friends. How well did you ever trust the guys you did dope around? People trying to pull stunts in the background investigation is the reason we go thru so many applicants. Of the 44 I had to do during the last hiring phase, I canned 36 for inconsistencies, outright lies, and lying thru omission. I even canned several for not returning phone calls in a timely manner. Other posters give examples of depts where someone got away with it. Without exception, those agencies are inferior, poorly run, or incompetent. Want to work for them or someone decent? BTW: Just for your info, drug testing here is mandatory upon demand, usually 3-4 times a year. A hot test (Includes LSD, Ecstasy and steroids) is a firing offense, as is domestic abuse. Your assigned investigator is going to add up two things. Negatives, such as admitted prior drug use, and positives, such as education, military service, etc. As long as positives outweigh the negatives, you're doing fine. A lie is not a negative, but a trip to the dumpster.
View Quote
Sounds like a real bunch of dickheads to work with!
Link Posted: 11/17/2001 6:19:06 AM EDT
Dickheads? Possibly. I'd like to point out though, this policy was voted on by the officers themselves as part of contract negoiations. It's no big secret. You screw up, you're gone. Nobody wants to work for LAPD.
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