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Posted: 11/5/2001 7:31:35 PM EST
I had just gone and talked to the Army today and a few guy's from the border patrol and they told me the best MOS for what I wanted to do would be "eleven bravo". I want to get on the Border patrol S.W.A.T team and what better way to get on it then to have eleven bravo maybe even Ranger school on it. All I have to do right now is fill out the paper work go to MAVES to get my height and weight done and in Jan I'm off to boot camp for a fun 9 weeks.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 7:36:12 PM EST
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 7:38:52 PM EST
you know the Air force Security Forces can go to ranger school, jump school and air assult school, and attend local SWAT schools. it might be worth looking into MP or Sp john
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 7:50:30 PM EST
I'd think 95B, Military Police, would better prepare you for the Border Patrol than being a grunt. When I was getting close to ETSing I had quite a few offers from different LE agencies. Tell your Recruiter you want locked into 95B with a guaranteed placement in either Airborne or Air Assualt school after AIT. After you arrive at your first duty station put in for MPI School. At some MP Companys you can also apply for Sniper School. Dog Handler School is also available to MP's. CID school is another option. I think 95B would be your best choice. Just my .02 worth. Good luck with what ever you decide.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 7:50:47 PM EST
Can the recruiter "guarantee" that you'll actually get to play cowboys and indians? Or is there a good possibility you'll be doing the karate kid (wax on, wax off) for a good portion of your enlistment since you may be needed there? You seem to be pre-occupied with that. Upon completion of your enlistment, you'll be given the opportunity to put in a job application just like everyone else. Hope you have fun. That's what's most important.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 7:52:19 PM EST
I agree with penrod get the job you want guaranteed nothing like being stuck in a job you hate for 3 years
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 8:02:14 PM EST
11 Bang-bang ?!?!?! Oh god say it isn't so . If you like living in the great outdoors 9 months out of the year I guess its the right MOS for you . Personally try to find some thing a little more technically challenging unless you plan on being a school teacher later . ;-) Mad Moe 93D20 USA PFC (Yep thats right E3 holdin down an E5 slot)
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 8:02:58 PM EST
I don't know if you have done thins but talk to Border Patrol,try to get your hands on an app. and see what they ask you for. Then you would have better idea what mos will work best for you. The thing is they are right that mos could get you in but what if you could do even better/ See if you can get even more skills,it's something you should think about. You could be Border Patrol or over time you could run Border Patrol,it all starts now dude.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 8:26:56 PM EST
Border Patrol? Lowest paid G-Agency there is? Hell, they can't keep people in. Tons of them lateral to civilian agencies everyday. Longevity is unheard of in the BP. Try the Coast Guard if you want to hunt down traffickers in drugs and bodies. Just my 2cents worth. And dude, trust these guys on here, 11Bravo bites. Use the Army for some good technical training...although, if 11B really excites you (now)...go for it. But just realize, the glamor and the Hollywood image you see on the Army Of One commercials is just that, Hollywood. There is no glamor in it. Hell, you might just be a great grunt. This is just an old hands opinion.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 9:10:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By hondajohn: you know the Air force Security Forces can go to ranger school, jump school and air assult school, and attend local SWAT schools. it might be worth looking into MP or Sp john
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You forgot standing at the main gate for 15 hours checking ID`s for 8,000 people aday SCHOOL Please do not be an SP or MP unless you have an IQ of a ROCK
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 9:16:51 PM EST
you dont know what a suck ass job is till you been a 0311 for a while(marine for infantry) any 11 mos means you are just going to hump a pack and say yes sir till you make e4. after that it gets just a little better. GET SMART! swing with the wing!!
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 9:20:26 PM EST
Ripmeyer I guess I didn't have the same experience as you. I was a certified Patrolman within 3 months of arriving on my first duty station, only had to work the gate about once every three weeks. john
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 9:46:48 PM EST
Tayous, I caution joining the service for an ulterior motive. The border patrol will seem a long ways away when you're getting shot at in some shit hole. Infantry is the pure essence of the Army. That being said, be prepared for what's coming. Remember that about 15-20% of the 11Bs are there because they want to be. The other 85% are there because that's all they could qualify for. 3 years can be along time if you're stuck in a motor pool PMCSing your Bradley. If 11B is what you want then I recommend only signing if you can get the ABN option. Not that jumping is so great but being ABN will at least get you to Bragg and into the 82nd. Division also has it's unique problems but it's a step up in the world of infantry (training dollars, equip, etc). If you are career oriented then I'd look hard at getting to a Ranger Bn as soon as possible to master the basics. Spend no more than 3-4 years there and move to SF. In that world there are numerous opportunities. You'll never regret a minute of it. I'm retiring in the next few months and it's been a blast. No regrets. Good luck and train as if your life depended on it. It could.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 10:02:11 PM EST
Please do not be an SP or MP unless you have an IQ of a ROCK
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By "SP" I assume you're referring to shore patrol in the Navy. There is no "SP" rating. Shore patrol is a duty item, assigned in addition to your other duties.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 1:44:43 AM EST
Tayous1: Take this how you will, but "pdm" is the only person who has responded thus far that you should be listening too. We've got a lot of straight up pogues on this board who probably would ask their recruiter "what's the easiest job I can do that will let me tell cool stories to my buddies from high school." Anybody who has been there will tell you that you can tell an infantry soldier from any other soldier from a ways away. As an infantrymen, no doors will be closed to you in the army. You will be able to train a shard as you want to train. Stay light (stay away from Bradleys and you will stay out of motor pools) and stay focused. You may even be able to enlist with an option to go straight to Ranger School, or maybe guaranteed a shot at an assigment to a Ranger Battalion (wher the real Rnagers are), should that be your cup of tea. I am a support guy myself, but while an Infantry soldier's life surely does suck sometimes, he will get better training on the basics than anyone else. When our light guys come up on rotation to pull gate security - you can tell. The light guys more so then the mech guys. Everything from the way they handle their weapons to the way they search vehicles seems to convey an extra degree of professionalism. Our Provost Marshall only wishes he had Soldiers like that for MPs. Best of all, when you get out and every other fat fucker - who spent his career in division staff preparing and flipping slides to brief the Commanding General - want to talk about "what gear the Rangers use" or "What tactices the LRS guys in XXX unit use" you don't have to try to play their game. You will have been there and done that. You can sit back like most of us on this board do and laugh at them to yourself, feeling no real desire even to correct them - no more than you would try to correct a young child arguing with some other youjng kid how "holodeck" technology works on Star Trek. To them, it is no more real and every bit as much fantasy. An earlier thread about the Marine Corps had a similar main idea. The fact is, if you want to truly be "all you can be" in a brief Army stint - go infantry. If you want the soft life and thing Infantrymen are just "dumb grunts" then join the Air Force. You will find yourself hoping the infantry - not the Air Force "Security Force" guys - are around when shit hits the fan. BTW, the US Army Dress Blues look a hell of a lot nicer than the USMC Dress Blues - we just don't feel the need to wear them all the time. Adam "Go Ordnance"
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 3:49:56 AM EST
tayous1 I was an 11B, and yes there are things about it that sucks, but then again there is something about everything that sucks every now and then. Here is what you do, go down to MEPPS tell them you are going 11B (this will help you get into schools), tell them before you sign anything you want ABN school [b]AND[/b] Ranger school. Then maybe you can get into one of the Ranger Batts upon completion. That way you won't end up being a pogue.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 4:00:22 AM EST
CIB and PDM are correct. I qualified for any MOS in the Army and chose the Airborne Infantry. I am going back in to finish my career- you guessed it, 11H again (though now it has reclassed to 11B). Stay in long enough to make NCO. You will get your share of border patrol and checkpoint duty. It is a hard life, but a good one. I am one of the 15% that [i]REALLY[/i] wanted to do what I do. My only regret has been that I got out- I have not been happy doing anything else since then. If you really want Border Patrol, go to college, learn Spanish and French, and join the BP. [b][size=1]Don Out[/size=1][/b] [b][size=4][red]AIRBORNE! 2/505 PIR H-MINUS[/red][/size=4][/b]
[i]You might be Airborne if... you Stand up and Yell "Sound off for equipment check" after the stewardess finishes giving seat belt operating instructions on a commercial flight. - Michael A. Andrascik III[/i]
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Link Posted: 11/6/2001 4:02:32 AM EST
HAHAHAHA...sorry...anyway. Let me tell you a little story.. I went 11B in 1988 at age 17, even though I was qualified for anything the Army had to offer at that point. Everyone was utterly in awe of my ignorance, even the recruiter. Him: [soapbox] "Let me get this straight. I'm offering you Defense Language training in f**king Monterey, CA for a year, going to class during the day and humping California women at night, and you want to go Georgia, get bug-bit, powder-burnt and PTd with some of the dumbest M.F.s you'll ever meet, then spend four years humping the bush with them?[thinking] Me: "Yup."[bounce][kill] Him: "What's wrong with you? You'll never get to [sleep], you'll always be [frag] or [heavy] all the time, and [pissed]at how hard they're working you, except when you're [beer]. Are you sure? Me: "Yup." [smoke] Dad: "I was in the 82nd! Go do something that will be useful when you get out!" Me: "This is useful. I'll be able to tell good stories and get [sex] whenever I want!" Dad, Mom, Recruiter: [rolleyes] "Have fun, shithead!" Me: [bounce] Anyhow...I'm not sorry I did it...I do have cool stories to tell now. Make sure to get all the college $ you can though, cause that's where your stories will come in most handy! QS 4/502 PIR Strike!
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 4:05:42 AM EST
Couldnt have said it better than 11H1P. I came in as 11B with 82d in contract. I have reclassed since but really miss the Infantry. I hope they didn't tell you that basic was 9 weeks for this MOS. It's not now it is 14 weeks OUST. I hope and wish you the best. SSG KP "Jumpmasters, Rotate one jumper to the RIGHT!!!"
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 4:35:35 AM EST
If you're choosing the Army over the Marines, because you think the Marines, and Marine boot camp are too hard.... Then you chose right.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 4:43:05 AM EST
Originally Posted By acftgrunt: Couldnt have said it better than 11H1P. I came in as 11B with 82d in contract. I have reclassed since but really miss the Infantry. I hope they didn't tell you that basic was 9 weeks for this MOS. It's not now it is 14 weeks OUST. I hope and wish you the best. SSG KP "Jumpmasters, Rotate one jumper to the RIGHT!!!"
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Yep, 9 weeks for BT, the another 4-6 for AIT, all rolled into 1. Add another 4 for BAT, then off to Division you go!! Airborne, All the Way, Every Day!!! Major, The Airborne could ALSO be called the Few, the Proud... [:D] the idiots that jump out of perfectly good, badly-flown airplanes... I don't dis the Jarheads- I just always wanted to be an Airborne Infantryman! [b][size=1]Don Out[/size=1][/b] [b][size=4][red]AIRBORNE! 2/505 PIR H-MINUS[/red][/size=4][/b]
[i]You might be Airborne if... you have ever demonstrated a PLF in front of the company coffee pot. - John "Doc" Horton[/i]
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Link Posted: 11/6/2001 4:54:41 AM EST
11H1P, I don't dis' the Army (maybe a little). The best soldiers join with the following in mind: 1. Maintaining an Army-family tradition. 2. Desire to jump (Marines jump, too. We just don't train the cooks and clerks to jump, or give it away as a reward) 3. Desire to be SF. The Army and the AF seems to get more of the "just joining for the sake of joining" crowd.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 5:00:53 AM EST
Like all the other guys have said, understand what you are getting into. I joined the National Guard (11B) when I was 17 and then I got a 4 year Army ROTC scholarship. After doing the infantry stuff for two years, I realized that as much as I like it now, I couldn't see myself doing it for another 18+ years, so I took the ROTC scholarship and now I'll be a 2LT in two more years and hopefully flying helos soon after that. Tell your recruiter you want an 11 X-ray contract. That's what the Airborne/Ranger option was called about 2 years ago, but now I've heard that they put all the 11 series MOS's together. Not sure if it's true. Whatever you do, good luck and have fun at Fort Benning.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 5:12:44 AM EST
Originally Posted By infantry556: Like all the other guys have said, understand what you are getting into. I joined the National Guard (11B) when I was 17 and then I got a 4 year Army ROTC scholarship. After doing the infantry stuff for two years, I realized that as much as I like it now, I couldn't see myself doing it for another 18+ years, so I took the ROTC scholarship and now I'll be a 2LT in two more years and hopefully flying helos soon after that. Tell your recruiter you want an 11 X-ray contract. That's what the Airborne/Ranger option was called about 2 years ago, but now I've heard that they put all the 11 series MOS's together. Not sure if it's true. Whatever you do, good luck and have fun at Fort Benning.
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Has been 11X for a lot longer, just means Infantry, non-MOS qualified (I was 11X when I first joined in 1986). Major- no beef here. I hate to have to agree with the "giving it away" part as being partly true, as well as "joining just to join" crowd, but there are those of us who have the same esprit-de-corps, motivation, and loyalty as the Marines. Semper Fi, Sir!
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 5:15:50 AM EST
Don't believe everything the recruiters say. The chances of actually getting to do the type of work they are saying is possible, however it is also pretty slim. Don't let them trick you into a MOS that you will turn out hating. There is a saying in the army, although it does not directly relate to this, the same theories will apply. "The only good duty stations in the army are the one that you just left, and the one you are going to next, never the one you are at." With that in mind, take the time to make an informed decision. I was a combat medic, then went on to nursing school. I started out in a combat arms unit, and we all bitched about it, going to the field, being deployed, etc.. Not just me, everyone. It was fun at first, but it gets old. Then I went to work at a hospital, and couldn't believe how much I missed the field and the comradery of the field unit. If you are hell bent to be a grunt, then go for it, make the most of it. I went in not sure what I wanted out of the military, so all the doors were open. At one point I wanted to make it career, then later decided against it for my own reasons. All in all, 8 years, and I wouldn't trade them now for anything. Just make sure that you get some type of training. If you are hell bent on 11Bush, then make sure you get locked into some type of specialty training, airborne, ranger, something. Just being a regular Joe can sometimes suck.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 5:57:36 AM EST
tayous: A lot of good advise here. Read it all & follow what fits you. A lot of us have been down the road before. p.s. Don't believe everything a recruiter tells you. I did & got screwed by Army. Luckily flunked the physical due to wearing contacts & could not complete the vision test. Corrected the mistake by enlisting in the Corps. Get all guarantees in writing.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 6:28:07 AM EST
tayous1, If you are hell bent on Infantry - as all of these guys have already stated, don't settle for anything less than an Airborne assignement and RIP (ranger induction program) guarantee. I went in and asked for an Airborne Assignment and got what I wanted. It wasn't a great life but learned lots and let me tell you, having the 82nd patch on my right shoulder has opened a lot of doors and still does. If you want to be heads above our Leg brothers here on this board, don't settle and don't accept anything if it's not exactly what you want. PERIOD!! Nothing is set in stone until you raise your right hand and say I do. You can tell them to f*** off and walk away, if they try to fill you full of BS. It's a hard life but rewarding. My attention to detail and demand for my absolute best came from my time in Division. Go for it but only sign if it's what you want - 100%. Good Luck! Let us know how you come out. Pakrat 1/505 PIR 82nd ABD "H-Minus"
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 6:43:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/6/2001 7:27:47 AM EST by Major-Murphy]
A Marine Infantryman. As you can see from the testimonies of my Army brethren, here on the board, being a plain-old Army grunt sucks. They all say it, "go airbourne", "be a ranger", etc.. Being a Marine Infantryman does not suck. You will be part of the best Infantry on Earth. You will be Elite. Army "leg" Infantry is not Elite. Not at all. You will become part of the Fleet Marine Force. You will start the glorious FMF cycle of training and deploying. You will see the world. As part of a Marine Expeditionary Unit, you will train in Amphibious Assualt. You will travel from Ship to shoe via AMTRACs, Hovercraft, and Helos. You will fast-rope. You will be a Scout-Swimmer. You will be a member of a TRAP-team, rescuing downed pilots. In your first four years of service, you could deploy 3 times, not including rapid deployments. Women will go weak at the knees when you walk down the street. Old men will swell with pride. People will constantly tell you how they "almost joined", "wish they joined", "should've joined", but didn't. You did. Or you could join the army.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 7:22:07 AM EST
I love reading this Army/Marine rivalry stuff! Being an enlisted man is somewhat an advantage - you can at least get Airborne or Ranger School guaranteed in your contract. For OCS people, theres no promise of where they'll be put - and even if an OCSer wants infantry and gets it, who can guarantee he won't be assigned to a plain infantry unit rather than Airborne or Ranger? Well, thats my question anyway... Aside from that, the standard Marine Infantry unit has a reputation of getting more/better training than its standard Army Inf counterpart. Otherwise, the Army appears to have a larger force pool of elite infantry like Airborne, Rangers, etc. So if you want Airborne/Ranger option and can get it guaranteed, then go for Army; but if it looks like they want to put you in a regular Army infantry unit, you may want to consider Marines instead, JMHO.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 8:36:40 AM EST
There is a lot of good advice here. Just be careful and be sure you know what you want and try and get as much as possible guaranteed. I don't bother with the Army vs Marines thing, people have their preferences and lets leave it at that. I know people who've been in all the services and they each have their likes and dislikes. I was a paratrooper, 'cuz that's what I wanted to be. But, I was MI(don't everyone laugh) and got to do some pretty interesting stuff. There is definately something special about being Airborne!, but I'm sure that the other branches feel the same way to a degree. Good luck with whatever you decide. Learn to play the game and you will be fine.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 8:42:49 AM EST
Originally Posted By SliPkNoT: I love reading this Army/Marine rivalry stuff! Being an enlisted man is somewhat an advantage - you can at least get Airborne or Ranger School guaranteed in your contract. For OCS people, theres no promise of where they'll be put - and even if an OCSer wants infantry and gets it, who can guarantee he won't be assigned to a plain infantry unit rather than Airborne or Ranger? Well, thats my question anyway... Aside from that, the standard Marine Infantry unit has a reputation of getting more/better training than its standard Army Inf counterpart. Otherwise, the Army appears to have a larger force pool of elite infantry like Airborne, Rangers, etc. So if you want Airborne/Ranger option and can get it guaranteed, then go for Army; but if it looks like they want to put you in a regular Army infantry unit, you may want to consider Marines instead, JMHO.
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If he asks for it, he WILL get it in the contract. Apparently about 90% of enlistees (Army) have been prior service lately (since 11 SEP). Good bonus to top it off- early ship (leave the same week that he is sworn in $5K-$8K), another decent chunk for shortage MOS, College $???(plus can complete Bachelor's degree while doing 4-year hitch)(IF he has time around training). [b][size=1]Don Out[/size=1][/b] [b][size=4][red]AIRBORNE! 2/505 PIR H-MINUS[/red][/size=4][/b]
[i]You might be Airborne if... you Stand up and Yell "Sound off for equipment check" after the stewardess finishes giving seat belt operating instructions on a commercial flight. - Michael A. Andrascik III[/i]
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Link Posted: 11/6/2001 8:58:51 AM EST
No doubt about it, the Army will give you more "bonus" and "college money".
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:12:42 AM EST
Originally Posted By Major-Murphy: No doubt about it, the Army will give you more "bonus" and "college money".
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Yeah, but that is not why the enlistment numbers for prior service are so high. I get NO bonus (I could if I chose something besides Airborne Infantry), and am signing for 6 years (max enlistment period). Troops, Country, and career are more important to me. Even with the bonuses, there are few 1st-timers signing up. Sad. [b][size=1]Don Out[/size=1][/b] [b][size=4][red]AIRBORNE! 2/505 PIR H-MINUS[/red][/size=4][/b]
[i]Airborne Toast I have ridden the skies in great machines, hooked up and jumped with the best of men. I have fought long and hard, and when I felt I had no energy left, I have been fired by the fear that if I stopped fighting, my comrades would die. And when I was in danger, enemy all around, I heard the thunder from my left and my right, as my life was defended. I have never been alone. I live, jump, fight and battle to victory with the greatest assemblage of men on earth. Gentlemen, to the BROTHERHOOD of the AIRBORNE. To the AIRBORNE ![/i]
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Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:37:06 AM EST
Here are your options for 11B. After 16 weeks of O.S.U.T.(one station unit training)at Ft.Benning,GA.You will go to one of the following units. 82nd ABN(Ft.Bragg,NC)you will go to jump school enroute. 1st,2nd,3rd Ranger Bn. 1st Bn(Hunter Army Airfield,Savannah,GA) 2nd Bn(Ft.Lewis,WA) 3rd Bn(Ft.Benning,GA) you will go to jump school and R.I.P.enroute. 10th Mountain(Ft.Drum,NY)light infantry. 101 ABN(Ft.Campbell,KY)you will go to air assault school upon arrival. 25th ID(Schofield Barracks,Hawaii)light infantry You will train your ass off in all of these units. Do not listen to the Marines,you will be as well or maybe even better trained than they are because there are more schools available to you in the Army.They just joined the Corps to get that bulldog tattoo. Pottsy B co,3/17INF 7th ID(Light)
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:38:37 AM EST
Thanks guy's for all your help. I know now unless I get that Ranger school guaranteed in writing not to go in. I had also called the Border patrol today to ask them a few thing's. They said that It would not matter to them in the hieing processe if I was a SEAL or Ranger. But after I got in it would open a lot more doors if I wanted to go in to there SWAT team and other special duty's and I would be about 10x more likely to be places in to the training schools because of my experience. I also ask them about the pay scale and if I would state out as a G-5 or G-7 they told me that if I make it in after the military the lest I will get is a G-7.They also said that if you rank up to a Sgt you maybe able to make more money.The guy who said
BarracudaBob Border Patrol? Lowest paid G-Agency there is? Hell, they can't keep people in
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I'll just tell you if $50 thou in your first year as a G-5 is low money then I must be crazy. They make almost twice as much as any of the P.D I have tried to join. Anyway I'm going to reread all of what you guy's have said and just to let you know there is no way in hell I'm not going to Ranger or any of the jump school's. I have to goals before I get out one is to be a Stg and second is to be a Ranger.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:47:56 AM EST
Marines who attend army schools ALMOST ALWAYS graduate at the top of the class. The common response to this is: "but the Marines only send the really exceptional Marines..." This sometimes the case, but not so with Artillary or Armor schools. The Marines who attend these schools always graduate at the top. I really don't need to explain why. We all know why. If a Marine wants to join the army, they don't even require the Marine to go through army basic. If an Army Special Forces Captain wanted to enlist in the Marines.... He'd have to go to boot camp. These are facts. Draw your own conclusions.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:49:47 AM EST
Former Marines take care of each other in the civilian world.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:50:20 AM EST
Originally Posted By tayous1: Thanks guy's for all your help. I know now unless I get that Ranger school guaranteed in writing not to go in. I had also called the Border patrol today to ask them a few thing's. They said that It would not matter to them in the hieing processe if I was a SEAL or Ranger. But after I got in it would open a lot more doors if I wanted to go in to there SWAT team and other special duty's and I would be about 10x more likely to be places in to the training schools because of my experience. I also ask them about the pay scale and if I would state out as a G-5 or G-7 they told me that if I make it in after the military the lest I will get is a G-7.They also said that if you rank up to a Sgt you maybe able to make more money.The guy who said
BarracudaBob Border Patrol? Lowest paid G-Agency there is? Hell, they can't keep people in
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I'll just tell you if $50 thou in your first year as a G-5 is low money then I must be crazy. They make almost twice as much as any of the P.D I have tried to join. Anyway I'm going to reread all of what you guy's have said and just to let you know there is no way in hell I'm not going to Ranger or any of the jump school's. I have to goals before I get out one is to be a Stg and second is to be a Ranger.
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It is good that you have your goals. Like I said, you WILL get RIP in your contract if you ask for it. Your contract will be done at MEPS, not the Recruiter's office. You will deal with the Army Career Councelors when filling out your contract. If they do not put it in writing, walk away, but you will get it. Do your 11x, Airborne and RIP right off the bat. You can then transfer to other units (82d, 101st, whatever) should you desire to continue your career. [b][size=1]Don Out[/size=1][/b] [b][size=4][red]AIRBORNE! 2/505 PIR H-MINUS[/red][/size=4][/b]
[i]You might be Airborne if... you do a PLF off the roof rather than use the ladder. -Don Carter[/i]
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Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:52:35 AM EST
Try to get ranger school prior to becoming a SGT. It will help you in the process. Here are a few links to show you a career path of the Infantry Soldier, basicly here are the school links everybody's talking about. [url]http://www-perscom.army.mil/epinf/11b.htm[/url] [url]http://www-benning.army.mil/itb/[/url] [url]http://www-benning.army.mil/RTB/rtbmain.htm[/url] [url]http://www-benning.army.mil/airborne/[/url] [url]http://www.benning.army.mil/fbhome/tocdrop.htm[/url]
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:52:44 AM EST
Potsy What schools are you referring to? Air Assault- not necessary in the Marine Corps, we all train to do vertical envelopment. Other than sling loading, no real reason to go to the "ten toughest days" If you knew why the school and badge existed you probably would think that is a pretty stupid reason. Jump school- it is a means of insertion once on the ground you hump like everyone else. You learn no TTP for war fighting. Path Finder school- may be worth wild for a few, but not real use to many. Sniper- The Marine Corps course are considered some of the best in the world and are a bit longer than the army school Ranger School- its a leadership school, all the Marines that I have know that have gone, say the only thing they learn is being hungry and tired sucks. They learn no new TTP. Lets face it, other than those schools we have our own similar schools and some that even army personnel go through, but we are not really wrapped up in the acquisition of "fear badges" to drive up the cost of uniform maintenance.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 9:57:51 AM EST
Major Murphy... Are you saying that the Infantry Corp of the US Army or just soldiers don't try to take care of soldiers in the army? They do here at Fort Bragg and in the 82D ABN DIV.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:00:17 AM EST
Maj Actually I know why the Marines do better at both Fort Sill and Fort Knox. There are only normally 2 slots to be tankers in each TBS class. They normally are in the top 2 QDS thirds. And since they normally go fast in those two thirds, normally only the top officers get them. For artillery officers, they are required to an 85% in graded materials. It is know as the Marine standard at Ft Sill. Because of that most Marines tend to study more and perform better. Also arty is one of the combat arms in the Marine Corps so it draws the typical types that want combat arms, so you actually get a lot of people that want to be artillery officers. The army on the other hand looks down on FA and has tacit policy of assigning some of the not so bright stars, many are only paying back their school commitment, to FA in the Army ensure that Marines do much better at that school.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:02:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/6/2001 9:56:30 AM EST by Major-Murphy]
No acftgrunt, I am saying that in the civilian world there is a much greater feeling and expression of Esprit De Corps amongst former Marines, than former soldiers. You see it all the time. The phrase "Former Marine" carrys weight.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:19:47 AM EST
I guess it depends where your at???
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:30:48 AM EST
Major-Murphy to make you happy if I can't get locked in Airborne or Ranger school in my contract then I'm going back over and talking to the Marines. I'm not going to go in the Army just to be a infantrymen I want to go in to it to be Airborne or a Ranger. If they just want to place me as a grunt then I'll be a Marine grunt. I was also thinking if after my four years is up and I'm Airborne and A Ranger and I like the military I may do four years and try and get on Marine recon
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:39:52 AM EST
MajorMurphy, Let me relate a first hand story. We had already jumped in to Sicily DZ, had humped most of the night and sat up for a night defensive position. We did a live fire range in the AM and was waiting to move out for a movement to contact. It was getting dark but still light enough for some BSing around. Some commotion caught our attention. We looked behind us and the most unorganized, undiciplined, out of uniform group of "soldiers" came over the hill top. We all got to looking at each other, going who the hell is this bunch of rag muffins. They went past us, got on line and started walking across this field, screaming and shooting from the hips. We then realized, because of the uniforms, "Marines". No overwatch, no supporting fire, no mortars, no machine gun cover fire, no squads providing cover, no bounding of teams/squads/platoons -NOTHING. Everyone in a skirmish line, walking - UPRIGHT - across this field. Oh by the way, the M60 gunners, were right there with them in the line. There goes the theory of supporting fire......... Sir, if that is the way the Marine Infantry fights, thanks but no thanks. I realize God, Country, Mom, Apple Pie and the Corps for you guys but there is no finer example than Infantry so willing to walk into hell, than those guys we saw that day. They may not have been too awe inspiring but we were definately impressed with the Jarheads from Anglico that deployed with us to Desert Shield/Storm. Now, there were some impressive Marines. Leg Marines - no thanks Anglico Marines - harder than woodpecker lips and they were on jump status - even better! Pakrat - out!
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:48:48 AM EST
Pakrat The enlisted ANGLICO Marines were all 0861 (same thing as a 13F in the army) and 2531 (radio operators). They are less trained than Marine infantry, in just about everything except falling from planes and spotting NGF/artillery. Until recent years most Marines that went to Fort Bragg for training were from 10th Marines. The 2nd Marine Divisions equivalent of the 319 AFAR. Hence they are often not infantry.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 10:58:38 AM EST
tayous did somebody drop you on your head when you were a child?...11Bravo? I had a couple o buds in the BP and your command of Espanol better be better than any Mexican or Texican...anyway I thought you wanted to be a fireman when you grew up...Better talk to some of the spec op guys arround here first..thought I heard you had to have the COs permission to get to Ranger school once you had an 11B assignment..you better get anything you want in writing take your dad or uncle or somebody with you as a wittness.. get jump school ranger school etc in writing.. but if you can get to the Language school at Monteray Ca....TAKE IT AND RUN...... My old first Seargent used to lament all his buddies from WWII and Korea who stayed 11B it didnt transfer to civilian life..nothing wrong with it...but if you want to be a cop..become an MP wanna be a fireman go to fire school..wanna be border patrol go to language school first...you can learn field craft later...imo no offense to you recruiters out there..but its their job to get you into the service its your job to look after your own hide..and once in look after your buddies hide...
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 11:00:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/6/2001 10:56:34 AM EST by Major-Murphy]
pakrat, that's an interesting story. ANGLICO are fine units, the fact that they went to jump school, however, isn't why. Hell, I used to date an NROTC woman Marine who went to jump school, and it didn't make her a warrior. I'm pretty sure we could all come up with examples of servicemembers not acting as they should (I can't count how many fat, sloppy, gum-chewing walkman-wearing, soldiers I've seen in the past week). It's a pointless exercise, though. There is no annecdotal evidence that can dispute the fact that Marine Corps infantry is superior to any on Earth. Jump school doesn't make an individual, or a unit better than another. Battle victories, esprit de corps, discipline and standards are what makes one unit better than another. Pride, discipline, esprit de corps, bearing. The Marine Corps leads the way. By the way, nice berets. Has it helped any? [;)]
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 11:06:01 AM EST
Originally Posted By tayous1: Major-Murphy to make you happy if I can't get locked in Airborne or Ranger school in my contract then I'm going back over and talking to the Marines. I'm not going to go in the Army just to be a infantrymen I want to go in to it to be Airborne or a Ranger. If they just want to place me as a grunt then I'll be a Marine grunt. I was also thinking if after my four years is up and I'm Airborne and A Ranger and I like the military I may do four years and try and get on Marine recon
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Please, join the Army.
Link Posted: 11/6/2001 11:06:38 AM EST
Being a Marine Infantryman does not suck.
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Here, for the sake of balance, are some of the less enjoyable aspects of life in the infantry: You will march for miles wondering how a &*$%#! rock found its way into your boot. You will endure humiliation, abuse and punishment because one of the many pieces of gear you drew from the armory or supply couldn't be found when you returned from the field. You will sleep in mud. Cold mud. You will feel chafing on the tenderest parts of your anatomy and be unable to relieve it. You will donate blood to thousands of hungry insects and arthropods. You will be crammed into the bowels of a ship with comrades who want to dispose of their used tobacco products in your personal space. You will wonder if your fingers are frostbitten or just numb. You will spend 24 hours a day for weeks at a time with fellow infantrymen whose emotional and intellectual development were arrested at age fourteen. You will hurry up and wait. You will live in fear that a Q-tip inserted in some obscure cranny of your weapon will emerge with a grey tint. And after your enlistment, when all of the pain, loneliness and silly mind games are just a memory, you'll apply for a civilian job with someone who believes all the negative stereotypes about Marines. But it's certainly not all bad. [(:)]
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