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3/20/2017 5:03:23 PM
Posted: 10/15/2001 7:51:05 PM EDT
Well, I flew down to Vegas and drove to Pahrump, NV on Saturday. On sunday, I got up real early and went out to FrontSight to take the free 1-day submachinegun class. The summary is -- this class ROCKS! If you don't do this before they quit offering it, you are a "clueless newbie". [;)] We got there around 7:30AM, got signed in, had nametags taped to our front & back, and went into the temporary lecture facility. Various members of the staff (including Dr. Piazza) then lectured for about an hour on various subjects (school philosophy, gun safety, current FrontSight efforts at supporting the 2nd admendment, etc). After that, we all donned our safety equipment and headed out to Range #1. The range was nice, high hard-pack berms all around, sun-sheltered area for lectures, and 20 turnstyle targets. We then received about 3 hours of lectures and dry-fire practice covering shooting safety, marksmanship, surviving a gun-battle, loading/clearing the weapon (UZI), and post-action procedures. Then we spent the next 3-4 hours shooting various combinations from the 5, 7, and 10 yards lines. Almost the entire class was taught with the selector on Full-Auto. Everyone was taught how to modulate the trigger to get 1, 2, or 3 round bursts. Usually, we were asked to bring the weapon up from either the ready, high-ready, or field-ready position; acquire the target, deliver 2 rounds of full-auto fire into the chest area of the target, then deliver a single round into the cranial-occular cavity. Some of the exercises we "raced" the instructors to see who got the rounds off the fastest WITH accuracy. All through the class we got TONS of one-on-one instruction on accuracy, speed, after-action procedures, etc. At the end of the day (after shooting about 300 rounds of ammo EACH) we got to shoot two clips of ammo in "rock & roll" mode. Once on a dirty target for practice and then the last clip on a clean target to "take home". Even though you really wouldn't want to shoot FA in a gun-battle the instructors wanted us to experience emptying a full clip (this was a riot). Frontsight provided, food, drink, guns, ammo, sun-screen, targets, and range. Cost = NOTHING. Not a single penny. So, "What's the catch?". Nothing, nada, zip. At the end of the day, you are offered a chance to listen in on the pitch for memberships however, this is NOT mandatory. After the post-class free pizza, the instructors said "If you want to stay and listen to the membership info, great. If not, thanks for coming and be sure to tell your friends." My Friend and I didn't stay so I can't tell you anything about the membership stuff. What I can tell you is that the instruction was: 1) Thorough 2) Professional 3) Incredibly informative 4) Useful & Interesting 5) FUN!! Tons of FUN! More fun that a human should be allowed to have. [;)] Our class had about 40 students (7 instructors) about 1/3 were women and about 1/4 had never shot *any* weapon before. The instruction was tuned for NOVICES and while there was some stuff that was "old hat" for a long-time shooter (like me) there was still LOTS of good content (like the post-action procedures). I can't say enough about the FrontSight folks - they promise a lot -- AND THEY OVERDELIVER. This is the *best* firearms training I have ever had and I only got to do the 1st day of a 4-day SMG class. FrontSight ROCKS!! Get out there NOW -- I promise you won't regret it. - CD
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 7:54:15 PM EDT
The URL is: http://www.frontsight.com/1day_smg_course.htm - CD
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 7:54:45 PM EDT
...trying that again... [url]http://www.frontsight.com/1day_smg_course.htm[/url] - CD
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 7:59:18 PM EDT
COOL!
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 8:46:23 PM EDT
Grrr....now I'm sorry that I didn't go with you, CD. I'll sign up ASAP. Thanks for the long writeup. -kill-9
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 8:50:43 PM EDT
kill-9, Yep, you blew it. [;)] Tomorrow, I'll come by the San-Mateo office and show you my full-auto take-home target. I shot the best target in the whole class (even better than the instructor). You can EASILY cover my whole group of 20+ rounds with one hand. - CD
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 11:51:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CamperDad: Some of the exercises we "raced" the instructors to see who got the rounds off the fastest WITH accuracy.
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Yah, those instructors sure are fast. Drawing from the holster, They can usually beat you even with a submachine gun stock locked into your sholder, just needing to raise the gun and align the sights.
So, "What's the catch?". Nothing, nada, zip. At the end of the day, you are offered a chance to listen in on the pitch for memberships however, this is NOT mandatory. After the post-class free pizza, the instructors said "If you want to stay and listen to the membership info, great. If not, thanks for coming and be sure to tell your friends." My Friend and I didn't stay so I can't tell you anything about the membership stuff. - CD
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Should have stayed for the pitch. Aside from the memberships that they sell(very low pressure sales), they offer certificates that you can buy for half price. They are good for a single person taking a 4-day class, or 2 people taking the same 2-day class. If I remember correctly, the first cert was around $500, with discounts for additional certs. They are completely transferrable. If you are interested in them, have kill-9 buy some for you when he attends. Jack
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 8:22:36 AM EDT
Jack, We did hear the bit on the training certificates. They ARE a good deal $500 for 1, $800 for 2, $1000 for 3. There are some restrictions -- like you can only use these certificates for your first "for-pay" class. They are "transferable" so you can sell or give them to other people. FrontSight allows you a 7-day grace period to cancel your order for training certificates in case you change your mind. Even with the chance to cancel, my wife and I have an agreement that neither of us spends $$$ on an unusual purchase without talking to the other one first. Sticking to the letter of this agreement (and being stuck in a week-long training class for work) prevented me from buying any certificates at the class. What I'm hoping is that I can convince my wife (an almost total non-shooter) to go take the SMG class. If she goes (or kill-9), I'll have one of them buy the "appropriate" number of certificates. Anyway, take my earlier advice -- go to this class ASAP. Also, plan in advance to get 1, 2, or 3 extra training certificates so you aren't "stuck" like I was. - CD
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 9:27:48 AM EDT
Just got back from taking the smg course (10/14) with my friend Tyler. I'd recommend that you go with a friend so you that you have at least one person that understands why you are raving about this course. Absolutely more fun than a human should be permitted. I would only add that the range safety was first class and the level of individual attention was outstanding. You mostly likely arrive as a "UNCONSCIOUSLY INCOMPETENT" shooter but leave "CONSCIOUSLY INCOMPETENT" with the obligation to yourself and you family to become better. You also leave with a much better understanding of the skill level required to actually defend yourself and/or you family. Did I mention that it was fun? :-) To understand the 5 levels of competence see http://www.frontsight.com/newsltr1.htm chuck
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:42:52 PM EDT
I have taken the free sub gun course also - agree with CamperDad 100% - FRONTSIGHT ROCKS!!!! Shoot an Uzi all day, with great instructors, and food, all for FREE - does it get any better??? With the cheap airfares and cheap hotel rates it is worth coming to Vegas just to take the course and by the way, we have few other attractions you might also want to check out while you are here.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:46:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By spamtrap: Just got back from taking the smg course (10/14) with my friend Tyler. I'd recommend that you go with a friend so you that you have at least one person that understands why you are raving about this course. Absolutely more fun than a human should be permitted. Did I mention that it was fun? :-) chuck
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Chuck, you sure are correct in saying that you should go with a friend. A friend of mine from work went with me. For the next week at work, wheneven we would look at each other, a Shit-eatin grin would magically appear on our faces. Four other people we know ended up taking the class, and they too, came back giggling and grinnig when looked at. I'm not sure if it was the daytime shooting they did or the drive to the ranches afterwords that they enjoyed more. They did rate it comparable to sex.[sex] Jack
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:52:13 PM EDT
Yup! Brad outdrew me with his old 1911 from the hip everytime, me from the low ready. I have my target hanging up on my "ME" wall.
Link Posted: 10/17/2001 6:43:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/17/2001 6:38:11 PM EDT by Shaginator]
Well CamperDad came by to visit today, he had that crazy-look in his eyes and kept saying "this is more fun than a human should be allowed to have... this is more fun than a human should be allowed to have..."
Link Posted: 10/18/2001 12:51:23 AM EDT
Why would anyone want to shoot an Uzi out in the middle of the desert when they could be pouring all of their money down the toilet at the craps tables??
Link Posted: 10/18/2001 2:41:24 PM EDT
CamperDad, you certainly penned all my thoughts on the FREE subgun class I took there last Dec. Went with my neighbor, who's also an avid shooter. While neither of us bought the memberships offered, they sure did sound good. Just didn't have that kind of $$$ to plunk down. I'd love to go through it again and introduce others to it! Big fun! [:D]
Link Posted: 11/4/2001 7:29:26 AM EDT
I did the free SMG shoot at Frontsight yesterday, 11/3 and have to agree 100% If you haven't made the trip to Frontsight you have to do it soon. They are offering the course a few more times this year and will offer some next year but they said they are getting too busy out there to offer it for much longer. They are a great bunch of guys and besides the awesome courses they offer are doing very good things for all our 2nd Amend. rights. So get out there soon and support them as much as you can.
Link Posted: 11/4/2001 7:46:51 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/4/2001 8:32:16 AM EDT
Its only $400K for a Platinum First Family membership or $275K if you can write them a check. I wish I had that kind of cash laying around too. It sounds like a lot and it is but will probably be worth a lot more in a few years as they complete the project. Besides they throw in a Glock of your choice, Mossberg 590, an AR15 and an UZI SMG, a cool bronze eagle statue as well as an African safari. Its almost too good to resist.
Link Posted: 11/5/2001 1:00:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Fingers: They are offering the course a few more times this year and will offer some next year but they said they are getting too busy out there to offer it for much longer.
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Maybe, but they said the same thing back in June -- they weren't going to offer it any more because they had too many tourists willing to pay for it. I suspect it'll be around for a long time.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 8:35:09 AM EDT
I signed up and attended on November 10. It's exactly as CamperDad describes it. I [b]highly[/b] recommend it. I mean, where else for free can you do this: [img]http://www.vanfossen.org/images/rock_n_roll.jpg[/img] [uzi] -kill-9
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