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3/20/2017 5:03:23 PM
Posted: 10/15/2001 9:20:48 AM EDT
I had to take it off for the sake of shutting up all the idiots who think having and sharing knowledge is a criminal offense. Sorry people who only got half the files. Blame the real trolls.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 9:34:09 AM EDT
Huh? What did I miss?
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 9:38:12 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Scarecrow: I had to take it off for the sake of shutting up all the idiots who think having and sharing knowledge is a criminal offense. Sorry people who only got half the files. Blame the real trolls.
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To all the people I helped stay out of jail today...YOUR WELCOME!! Sgtar15 [img]http://www.tartarus.net/images/people/satan.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:04:05 AM EDT
sgtar15 I wanted to offer my deepest gratitudes to you for your loyalty to the information police. I hope now that you have stiffled the flow of information here you can go back to banning text books.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:05:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sgtar15: To all the people I helped stay out of jail today...YOUR WELCOME!! Sgtar15
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Feel free to NARC on www.1919a4.com They have the same blueprints on their site that Scarecrow sent me.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:22:02 AM EDT
Just what we need...a censor to decide what we can or can't see. MG conversion plans must be just like guns. If you have a gun it makes you shoot people and if you have a diagram showing you how to make a machinegun you can't stop yourself from making one. What a crock.....tell the complainers to go screw themselves and post it somewhere else on the net if you want people to have access to them. If it was GoatBoy or someone else who asked them to be taken down then that would be a different story because they own this place, but everybody else should just shut up and not look at it if they don't like it. Bunch of crybabies.... Michael
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:29:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:36:10 AM EDT
LEGALIZE IT! Oh, it already is.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 7:00:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 7: Feel free to NARC on www.1919a4.com They have the same blueprints on their site that Scarecrow sent me.
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That would be because I sent them those.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 7:57:29 PM EDT
Information in and of itself is not illegal. Even classified information that the government deems "national security" is not by itself illegal. What's done with the information can be a crime. For small arms, I'm not aware of a statute that deems the dissemination of such information illegal. That said: * a site can decide what they want passing through it * it can be to one's advantage not to post some types of info on a public site like this * it's up to the site to decide what the rules for that site is...if someone in a nonsupervisory position claims foul...then I say let them claim away.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 8:19:49 PM EDT
As long as you put in a disclaimer that such information is for academic and informational purposes only and that it is illegal to actually perform a conversion.. Such information is perfectly LEGAL (ie. Cannot be construed as conspiracy to commit a crime) and it is Constitutionally protected.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 8:43:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Bostonterrier97: As long as you put in a disclaimer that such information is for academic and informational purposes only and that it is illegal to actually perform a conversion.. Such information is perfectly LEGAL (ie. Cannot be construed as conspiracy to commit a crime) and it is Constitutionally protected.
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Maybe you'd like to tell that to the people of Paladin Press. I'm sure that thought was real consoling as they were shelling out a million or two for the civil suit against them.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 9:29:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/15/2001 9:24:41 PM EDT by Jewbroni]
Originally Posted By Striker: For what it's worth..GoatBoy has stated before that this site is monitored by "big brother". This is a fact not a rumor. He also told me in an e-mail he personally knows of sites that have been shut down for posting info such as that. If you don't like it..go to one of the sites that has the info or e-mail someone who has it.
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In this matter, I would have to agree. If you "want" to do one of these schematic transfers, be my guest. But take it to your own private e-mail / chatroom connection and don't use AR15.com as the medium for illegal information. Just because we don't like the rules doesn't mean we can blatantly break them or chastize those who want to keep everything from ultimately crashing down the site.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:10:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/15/2001 10:08:00 PM EDT by Scarecrow]
Sorry people we all live in communist countrys and people are content with bending over and taking it up the ass with a smile on their faces such as garandman and sgtar15 over there. When a country can punish you for certain kinds of information is disgusting. Even worst is that people on this board would rather run and hide then stand up for the right thing. btw: garandman and sgtar15, next time you dont like a topic I bring up, do everyone a favor and go fuck yourselves, k? thanks.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:14:55 PM EDT
Jewbroni: Thing is none of the information was illegal.
Link Posted: 10/15/2001 10:26:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/15/2001 10:43:12 PM EDT by shaggy]
Scarecrow - If you feel so strongly about this, how about putting your money where your mouth is? Its easy to criticize others when its not your ass on the line. Why not to purchase liability coverage or sign an indemnification agreement to cover the owners and operators of this site for legal fees, loss of income, and any civil or criminal liability arising from such info? Its legal, but then again, publishing what was legal still cost Paladin Press big. Come to think of it, I believe SOF lost and paid out on a few suits. Even on the ones they won, I'm sure the cost of defending themselves was quite high.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 1:59:55 AM EDT
Shaggy I DID PUT MY ASS ON THE LINE I dint post the fucking plans on this site, all I said if people wanted the plans to contact me in a private manner! I took all liability in doing so. Next time shut the hell up before you know the full story.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 2:06:50 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 2:47:45 AM EDT
For those who dont understand or want in. [url]http://ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=61137[/url]
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 5:50:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By shaggy: Maybe you'd like to tell that to the people of Paladin Press. I'm sure that thought was real consoling as they were shelling out a million or two for the civil suit against them.
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Being sued for information and prosecuted for it are two completely different matters. Anyone can file a civil suit. It takes something like $35 + lawyers fees to file a lawsuit here in Houston, and you can do it to your heart's content. God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 5:59:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By GodBlessTexas: Being sued for information and prosecuted for it are two completely different matters. Anyone can file a civil suit. It takes something like $35 + lawyers fees to file a lawsuit here in Houston, and you can do it to your heart's content. God Bless Texas
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Thats my point. What Paladin Press and SOF published was legal - the gov't couldn't prohibit it or prosecute them for it, but that didn't prevent people from suing PP and SOF in a civil action which ultimately cost them a small fortune in settlements and judgements. Even where they escaped liability, they ended up paying a ton in legal fees to defend themselves.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:01:51 AM EDT
Uh-oh, I have a bunch of chemistry books that contain all sorts of "bad" information. Anyone for a book burning party?
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:08:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Jewbroni: But take it to your own private e-mail / chatroom connection and don't use AR15.com as the medium for illegal information. .
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Wow! You are falling into the trap too. The informationnn is not illegal. I am not amusued to see so many freedom loving individuals *laugh* sheeping out. Has anyone asked questions in the full auto form? I live in California and I ask full auto questions.. Nothing is wrong with wanting to know or collect information. Why do you scaredy cats keep calling it illegal information? Are you guys scared to be caught with good old fashioned porn too? That stuff is illegal you know.... gees
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:14:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By shaggy: Thats my point. What Paladin Press and SOF published was legal - the gov't couldn't prohibit it or prosecute them for it, but that didn't prevent people from suing PP and SOF in a civil action which ultimately cost them a small fortune in settlements and judgements. Even where they escaped liability, they ended up paying a ton in legal fees to defend themselves.
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That could already happen.... open your eyes and stop being scared... Anybody can sue anybody for any reason... are you going to be scared? If some stupid kid registers here, gets into Ar's and kills a bunch of people this site could get sued... we discussed tactics... or bullet performance... get it yet I can say... I aint afraid of the information police... grammer police yes, information police no...
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:15:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By hielo: Uh-oh, I have a bunch of chemistry books that contain all sorts of "bad" information. Anyone for a book burning party?
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Holy shit words of reason! Ban those nasty old text books!
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:24:15 AM EDT
BAN READING! IT GIVES PEOPLE THE ABILITY TO READ EVIL INFORMATION!
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:32:33 AM EDT
Ban Eyes! Without eyes one can not read, and after all, why does anyone really need eyes, you have other senses, senses that won't cause harm to anyone else!
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:42:17 AM EDT
You guys aren't "getting" it. I won't speak for others, but I am all for this information "existing" and DO NOT want it illegalized, banned, or restricted in any way. But by bringing it into this site, you raise "red flags" and bring GREATER BATF scrutiny of the board owners, the board advertisers, and MOST importantly, board posters like MYSELF. If you wish to be on BATF's "Top Ten" list, fine. Knock yourself out. But DO NOT put me there. It seems like ONLY common courtesy to consider how YOUR actionsn may affect others. But GOD FORBID some of you should be guilty of common courtesy.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:47:47 AM EDT
garandman This is what your not getting Constitution of the United States of America Amendment I Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances. Read the constitution now and then instead of forgetting of its existance like most people in your parliment.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 6:58:30 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Scarecrow: Read the constitution now and then instead of forgetting of its existance like most people in your parliment.
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Ummm, I thought garandman was American, his tag says SC, USA. Anyway, the management of the board is free to accept or reject anything that they want. But no information is illegal in this country. You can buy books in print at any gun show that tell you how to make silencers, machine guns, etc. Paladin Press was sued for publishing a book on how to assassinate someone, an activity clearly illegal from start to finish. Manufacturing machine guns is legal under many circumstances (for LEOs, with an SOT, replacement parts for existing legal machine guns, etc.). A disclaimer that "all relevant laws must be followed" will probably be useful.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 7:06:21 AM EDT
I made sure to post a extensive warning now.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 9:04:24 AM EDT
even with a "info purposes" you still can get SUED
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 9:31:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/16/2001 9:26:01 AM EDT by Mecheng]
Okay just call me guilty for exercising my freedom of speech!!
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 10:46:44 AM EDT
Keep up the good work, Scarecrow. The B.O.R is an all or nothing proposition. We can not and should not attemp to pick and choose the ones we like.
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 11:03:59 AM EDT
woohoo....I am with Garandman on this one...as stated before-no one has first amendment rights on this board (private board)hehehe me and Gman agree on something !!!! And if you know anything about me, the very fact that I am advocating this is phenomanal. But you do not go to your buddies house and take a dump on the carpet. If it was your house, do anything you want and invite anyone you like. But we are guests.......comprende
Link Posted: 10/16/2001 11:14:08 AM EDT
Why does this "you can get sued" stuff keep comming up. Are people so Marshal Faulking stupid that they don't understand the difference between getting sued and something being illegal? You don't get sued for doing something illegal you arrested, and you can be sued by anyone for doing anything or nothing. People get sued everyday for doing nothing wrong, its a by product of greed in our society. Who in the hell would have thought McDonalds would ever get sued just for serving coffee? If GoatBoy doesn't want it on his site then that is great. Its his place and he makes the decisions are we are obligated by law and common courtesy to abide by his rules. If you have nothing to do with this matter other than complaining and trying to restrict others quest for LEGAL information because you are sniveling little crybaby who hides under your bed from every boogeyman imaginable because you are afraid you might get "sued" for breaking the law although it is a Constitutionally protected right then do us all a favor and email all complaints to: i_hate_the_constitution@afghanistan.com I'm sure they would love to hear your complaints. If you would like to do something productive to stop these types of frivilous lawsuits such as what everyone here seems to be afraid of write your congressman and read up on tort reform. At the minimum read the dictionary and learn the difference between the words civil and criminal. Michael
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