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3/20/2017 5:03:23 PM
Posted: 10/11/2001 1:46:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2001 1:41:39 PM EDT by kill-9]
Do you think that, given the current situation, California law enforcement would overlook someone with no criminal record, but without a CCW carrying a loaded pistol in a glove compartment? To me, it just seems prudent. -kill-9
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 1:49:03 PM EDT
In the PRK? No.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:04:37 PM EDT
Don't count on it, this is Kalifornia after all. I had my P220 in my glovebox last weekend while I was away from home and got pulled over for speeding on 99. CHP officer asked who the smoker was and I said me, he said he smelled pot and wanted my pack of smokes to check them. I handed them over and thought, great he's going to search my car and come up with my pistol and I'm FVCKED. He asked if I had been smoking pot and told him last time was in 1984 and I was fairly sure I wasn't stoned anymore. He laughed and sent me on my way with a warning. Funny thing is even though I'm a park ranger I can't get a CCW in this stupid state, hell we can't carry at work because managment thinks it sends a bad immage to the public. I can't tell ya any more cause I left my tin foil hat at home. Pig
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:25:42 PM EDT
Just remember one thing, "I would hate to be in jail when the SHTF!"
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:36:53 PM EDT
Here in Louisiana, concealed carry permits are handed out pretty liberalily provided you aren't a convicted felon. The cute part is that a concealed carry permit isn't required here in most cases because your vehicle is considered to be an extension of your home and therefore a concealed gun anywhere in the car, loaded or unloaded, assembled or unassembled, within easy access or not is still legal here. Maybe the PRK should take note from us "backwards ass people!"
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:40:46 PM EDT
Yeah right!
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:42:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kill-9: Do you think that, given the current situation, California law enforcement would overlook someone with no criminal record, but without a CCW carrying a loaded pistol in a glove compartment? To me, it just seems prudent. -kill-9
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I live in Virginia but I would not do this. If you get caught/prosecuted and end up with any form of felony or 1-year misdimeaner you can get denied on firearms purchases...
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:45:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kill-9: Do you think that, given the current situation, California law enforcement would overlook someone with no criminal record, but without a CCW carrying a loaded pistol in a glove compartment? To me, it just seems prudent.
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Prudent, maybe. Illegal, definitely. Jail-worthy, most likely. I'm guessing that even the most anti-government person here is not going to suggest in an open forum that you do something illegal -- which is what you're asking. But here are some points to consider: You might be able to argue your fear / paranoia / apprehensions as a justification for committing an illegal act later in court. But you're still going to jail if/when the cop finds it. I'm told it's not a happy experience. What is it exactly that you expect you might need to do with your pistol? How much good is a firearm in your glovebox (unless you plan on being in your car at ALL times)? If you're going to carry it, do you really think you're going to be able to conceal it so well that NO ONE will call the cops on the guy w/ a gun? (Remember, everyone else is nervous right now) I think you can tell which way we're all going here.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:49:57 PM EDT
Move to a free state [img]http://wsphotofews.excite.com/001/bA/s9/6M/Qg15556.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 2:54:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By PYamasaki: I'm guessing that even the most anti-government person here is not going to suggest in an open forum that you do something illegal -- which is what you're asking.
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I have pre-ban uppers on post-ban lowers. I have been carrying a concealed handgun without a permit since I was 16. No illegal F/A conversions, but then again, if I did, that's one I D-E-F-I-N-I-T-L-E-Y wouldn't speak up about.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:07:27 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:07:37 PM EDT
Basically, you’re damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Given the current situation, I think cops are more likely to want to search your car and probably more likely to lock you up if they find an excuse. I’d store it legally (unloaded in the trunk, maybe? - if not a handgun, possibly a rifle). While anything is possible, terrorist attacks are probably more likely to be with explosives and chemical/biological agents. However, it makes sense to take reasonable efforts to be ready.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:14:19 PM EDT
Cops always say they smell weed smoke just so they can search your car.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:22:37 PM EDT
I know, my next step was to call his bluff and tell him your not searching my car on your nose, call a dog if ya have to, I'll wait. Pig
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:03:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kill-9: Do you think that, given the current situation, California law enforcement would overlook someone with no criminal record, but without a CCW carrying a loaded pistol in a glove compartment? To me, it just seems prudent.
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Careful - CCW in CA is a "wobbler" meaning it can either be a misdemeanor or a felony. Basically it'll be a felony [b]unless[/b] - It's your first arrest for CCW, [b]and[/b] the gun is registered to you with the state - i.e., you bought it new from a dealer and filled out a DROS - then it'll be filed as a misdemeanor. But you'll still lose the gun, spend ~$10k in legal fees, and have a conviction on your record, but probably get off with probation. What you want to do is carry in your car in a way that's not open to search. Glove compartments and center consoles are bad!! Instead, run down to your local office supply and buy a cheap briefcase. Keep your pistol, drugs, whatever, in the briefcase on the passenger seat. If you run into a bad guy, it's right there for instant access. But when the cops pull you over, you merely spin the combination dials and now it's a "locked container" and you have an "expectation or privacy." Even if the LEO decided to illegally search your car, they can't touch your briefcase without a warrant. Either that, or they have to explain to the judge why they felt compelled to pry it open with no probable cause. Trust me - this works! [:D]
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:14:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Steel_Rat: Instead, run down to your local office supply and buy a cheap briefcase. Keep your pistol... Trust me - this works! [:D]
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In Arizona I carry everywhere but work. However, when traveling to Kali I do EXACTLY as [b]Steel_Rat[/b] recommended here.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:28:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:31:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DVDTracker: Chances that I get a pro-gun cop - average?
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Where in California is this?
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:34:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:20:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:30:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kill-9: Do you think that, given the current situation, California law enforcement would overlook someone with no criminal record, but without a CCW carrying a loaded pistol in a glove compartment? To me, it just seems prudent. -kill-9
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WOW that is for sure the stupidest thing I have seen in a while. You must be a troll???
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:49:00 PM EDT
Just wait until the SHTF for real and there has been a few car bombs and other fun terrorist type stuff happening, with result that the sheep and most of the rest of the people start to really panic. Then you might get away with carrying a weapon to defend yourself with, because there might be a large number of people carrying without a license and maybe the jury might be on your side. But right now I would not take the chance.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:56:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kill-9: Do you think that, given the current situation, California law enforcement would overlook someone with no criminal record, but without a CCW carrying a loaded pistol in a glove compartment? To me, it just seems prudent. -kill-9
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NOt in CA. Specially if you are in the following city/county: Any city in the Bay Area specially S.F. and Alameda L.A. County Cops in these areas are more anti-gun than pro-gun. Orange County Sherriffs might look the other way depending on the deputy and the offense you committed.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 6:16:33 PM EDT
I have carried concealed before. But then again a Sherrif in Alabama is nowhere near as likely to give you trouble as some 2-Bit PRK Cop who wants nothing more than to ban guns all together. Here in Florida we can carry any non-handgun concealed anywhere in our vehicle. Handguns have to be unloaded & securely encased. Interstingly FL defines a glove box as securely excased. If SHTF, open the glove box insert mag and you are ready. I carry a Carbine in my truck which is legal in Florida. Sometimes when I pass through Alabama I "forget" to unload my guns. Mississippi and Louisiana are real nice about Concealed Carry in cars. But for some reason AL is a little Anti-Gun in some ways. Carry in Vehicles must be unloaded. Yet they allow open carry on the street but not in a car, WTF ? For some reason AL considers an air pistol a Firearm. I will never understand that one. BUt, truthfully I am rarely stopped. I have been pulled over 4 times. Only one of those since I turned 18. Three times I got stopped for going 87 in a 70, 72 in a 55, and 33 in a 30 with a tag that expired 2 days earlier (The UCF Police actually ran my tag for whatever reason.) I was stopped once for peeling out of a McDonald's parking lot after sitting at the drive thru for 20 minutes waiting for somebody to take my order. I talked way out of all of these and never had a cop want to search my vehicle. Then again I didn't a gun any of those times. A Knife yes, a gun no. In Alabama at least on the interstates there is only a minimal chance of being pulled over even if your doing over 100. Hell I've seen Texans drive through AL going over 100 and not get pulled over in the 60 miles it takes to cross the state. As far as being pulled over: Florida- Depends on where you are. South Florida and some parts of Central Florida are crawling with cops. Alabama- On the interstate I have yet to see an AL Cop. I see a few in Robertsdale, etc. Mississippi- Only if you are driving likle an asshole. I saw 1 guy w/ LA plates get pulled over after driving up on peoples asses. Louisiana- When I was in New Orleans I actually saw New Orleans cops patrolling the Interstate. I wonder if any other states give locals that authority. In Florida only Highway Patrol or CDL Police (Big-Rigs) can pull over on the interstate. Georgia- Sparse, but they are there. Especially near I-475 and Atlanta North Carolina- At least in the mountains 0 chance unless its just dumb luck. Tennessee- The times I was there never saw a cop on the Interstates. Then again I never went further west in TN than Knoxville. S. Carolina- Varies depending on where you are Virginia- Varies also depending on where you are Maryland- Some areas are crawling. Again it varies. Pennsylvania- Didn't see any but I didn't go that far into Pennsylvania's Central Southern section.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 7:39:25 PM EDT
cc48510- I graduated from UCF two years ago- damn that McDonalds across from school is slow! I got stopped for doing the exact same thing there. IMPORTANT: There is no such FL law stating that the gun must be unloaded in your car! 790.25 (l) states that "when travelling by private conveyance (your car), the weapon must be securely encased." The courts have found that this means in a glovebox, center console, zippered case, etc. It is not neccessary to carry an unloaded weapon, when you can carry a much more effective loaded weapon.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 7:45:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2001 7:42:29 PM EDT by dissipator556]
Also, if you have a CWP, you can carry the weapon concealed on your body, while in (and out of, of course)your vehicle. Hope this clears up any confusion that you've had.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 7:50:25 PM EDT
Move to Louisiana guys! I don't see how you'all can stand to live in a place that doesn't give you the right to protect yourself. Man I'd rather flip hamburgers and live in the projects first.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 7:54:37 PM EDT
Thanks dissipator. I wasn't sure about whether it had to be unloaded or not. As of yet I don't carry a handgun except for my Antique Revolver and that is considered a non-gun. My 9mm Carbine remains my main form of protection in my vehicle.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 8:01:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Troy: You *do* know that according to the recently revised law, you can only have a gun (unloaded, ammo seperate, in a locked container or locked in the trunk) when traveling *directly* to and from a gun store, range, or other gun-related location. They passed this law specifically to prevent people from keeping guns in their car. Send your Thank You notes to Don Perata. -Troy
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While this true, it's still as Steelrat said. If you are the registered owner, aren't a "gang" member and are not otherwise prohibited from owning firearms then it's not a big thing. And unless you are in the SF bay area or LA area you most likely will get the gun back. Heck in my county, admittedly a pro gun conservative one, most everyone I know keeps a loaded gun -handgun, rifle or shot gun- in their vehicle. One day one of the local deputies and I compared firearms from the back of our vehicles (he thought my M4 was way cool!)
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 8:13:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2001 8:37:43 PM EDT by SSD]
Originally Posted By sf46: Here in Louisiana, concealed carry permits are handed out pretty liberalily provided you aren't a convicted felon. The cute part is that a concealed carry permit isn't required here in most cases because your vehicle is considered to be an extension of your home and therefore a concealed gun anywhere in the car, loaded or unloaded, assembled or unassembled, within easy access or not is still legal here. Maybe the PRK should take note from us "backwards ass people!"
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If I remember correctly, the passage of this law a few years ago stopped (99.9%) the rampant car jackings in 2 days. See some gun laws work.[;)] SSD edited to add, I have AR15 in trunk all times, hope to make this an AR10 soon.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 8:38:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2001 8:40:04 PM EDT by SSD]
Even if you look like the kind of 'people' that that particular LEO tends to like, it is still a big risk.
cc48510 Hell I've seen Texans drive through AL going over 100 and not get pulled over in the 60 miles it takes to cross the state.
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That was me.[:D] (Houston to NC in 16 hours) SSD
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 6:01:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By dissipator556: cc48510- I graduated from UCF two years ago- damn that McDonalds across from school is slow! I got stopped for doing the exact same thing there. IMPORTANT: There is no such FL law stating that the gun must be unloaded in your car! 790.25 (l) states that "when travelling by private conveyance (your car), the weapon must be securely encased." The courts have found that this means in a glovebox, center console, zippered case, etc. It is not neccessary to carry an unloaded weapon, when you can carry a much more effective loaded weapon.
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and don't forget my favorite exemption h) A person engaged in fishing, camping, or lawful hunting or going to or returning from a fishing, camping, or lawful hunting expedition;
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 6:15:18 AM EDT
Here is my question: Can I transport a handgun from my home to my parents 2nd home without problems? Gun would be unloaded, locked in case. Traveling from N. IL to Green Bay area (Oconto). My fiance and I are going to spend the weekend there, and if SHTF over the weekend I want some sort of protection. Av.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 6:36:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By cc48510: As of yet I don't carry a handgun except for my Antique Revolver and that is considered a non-gun.
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that's cool, here, a pre-1898 revolver is a non-gun UNLESS any manufacturer of ammunition makes rounds for it. then, even if you don't own the ammo, the antique must be placed on your valid permit. same is true for a blackpowder revolver. you can own one without a permit, UNLESS you also own powder AND bullets. if things get worse, i'll just wear orange 24/7 and carry my 870 to work!
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 7:49:40 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 8:31:51 AM EDT
Avalon01: In Wisconsin you can legally transfer a firearms only if: 1. It is unloaded and in a case (keeping ammo/mags separate is probably a good idea, but IMHO not necessary); and 2. It is not readily accessible from the passenger compartment. This use to mean the trunk, but SUV's have changed that. ("All I have is an SUR in the back of my SUV, Officer." [:)]) Keep in mind that if you are pulled over for speeding or another traffic related offense, an officer MAY ask you whether you have any drugs, weapons, or other illegal items in your vehicle as long as the question does not unreasonably extend the purpose of the traffic stop. [i]State v. Gaulrapp[/i], 207 Wis.2d 600 (Ct. App. 1996), held that "Mere police questioning does not constitute a seizure." The [i]Gaulrapp[/i] court was citing a SCOTUS decision, [i]Florida v. Bostick[/i], 501 U.S. 429 (1991). [b]However[/b], a recent 7th Circuit case, [i]US v. Childs[/i], 256 F.3d 559 (2001) held that "questions outside the scope of investigating the traffic offenses were acceptable -- but only [when] they were 'brought on by the [officer's] reasonable suspicion.'" This decision is in conflict with the [i]Bostick[/i] decision inasmuch as [i]Bostick[/i] seems to allow an officer to ask you "Do you have any weapons in the car" whereas [i]Childs[/i] would all an officer to ask you that question only if he or she had reasonable suspicion to believe that you were commiting an criminal offense not related to the (presumably civil in nature) traffic violation. I was surprised when I read the [i]Childs[/i] decision, though question whether it is really good law in light of [i]Bostick[/i] and [i]Gaulrapp[/i]. Bottom line, is I believe that if you're stopped for speeding in Wisconsin an officer may ask you if you have drugs or weapons in the car, as long as the question does not unreasonably extend the length of the traffic stop. I believe that you have one of three answers to that question: 1. "Yes" (note, only applicable if you actually [i]do[/i]). At this point the officer has probably cause to believe you have commited a criminal offense may search you and the vehicle. 2. "No" (either being truthful or not truthful). I believe that the officer can follow up and ask you for consent to search, at which point you can respectfully decline the invitation. At that point, the officer must get back to the original purpose of the traffic stop and cannot badger you about your denial of consent. I [b]do not[/b] advocate lying to police officers (see #3). Nor do I advocate breaking the law by carrying a concealed weapon without a permit.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 8:34:58 AM EDT
3. "I do not feel that I am legally obligated to answer that question, and respectfully decline to do so." I believe that this is a correct view of the law and you may decline to answer the question. I can see declining to answer this question just as I would decline consent to search -- I simply don't have to do it and it's none of the officer's business. However, the caveat here is that if it's 3:00 a.m. and you're in the middle of nowhere, the officer may say this answer provided him or her with "reasonable suspicion" to perform a pat down for weapons due to "officer safety" (basically, they think you're being a smart ass by not directly answering the question and they think you have something to hide). I wouldn't like to be an officer standing out in the middle of a dark highway with someone exercising their rights like this either. But, their job is to operate within the confines of the law and Constitution. I believe that anything found during a subsequent would be suppressed in court as fruit of an unlawful search. But, you may have won the battle only to have lost the war (in legal fees and other repercussions of criminal prosecutions). This discussion has gone much further than I initially intended. Keep in mind that I am not giving anyone legal advice, I'm simply stating my opinion. Judges don't alway agree with me, so don't rely on my opinion. I don't represent you, haven't gotten any money from you [:)] and am just running off at the keyboard here. This area of law is [i]very[/i] sticky in that it is constantly changing and extremely fact dependent. Probably the only advice of mine you should rely on here is "don't break the law in the first place and you (should) have nothing to worry about." But you're all adults and can make your own decision in that regard. Is that enough of a caveat emptor here? And how off topic did I end up straying anyway?
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 8:42:02 AM EDT
Oh, and I'd like to add one more suggestion that is in line with other recent threads. OPSEC/COMSEC Or all you responsible adults make your own decision about this but don't blab it all over the internet.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 9:57:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By JacRyan: 3. "I do not feel that I am legally obligated to answer that question, and respectfully decline to do so." I believe that this is a correct view of the law and you may decline to answer the question. I can see declining to answer this question just as I would decline consent to search -- I simply don't have to do it and it's none of the officer's business.
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Some people tend to get intimidated by the police into allowing unwarranted searches (they actually teach and practice how to do this to citizens), so in this case it's better to let the ACLU do your talking for you: http://[url]http://www.aclu.org/library/bustcard.html[/url] The first one I saw was given to me by a LEO who said a perp - er, I mean citizen [:D] - handed it to him while he was trying to "force a search consent" out of him. The nice thing about this little card is turns the encounter from an interrogation into a civil rights discussion and avoids that whole "I asked the suspect if he had any drugs and he said 'no' and that made me suspicious so I had to pry the trunk open with a crowbar" routine. Instead of having to either answer or lie to the officer, you can show him the card and say "according to the ACLU you can't even ask me these questions. Are we done with the traffic stop yet? Have a nice day, officer."
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 10:35:24 AM EDT
I live in a state that has just passed "Shall IOssue legislation. I have always felt, "Permit?...[b][size=4]PERMEIT ?![/size=4][/b] I don't need no stinking tin gods permission to exersize my 2nd amendment rights! What part of ,and bear, don't you understand? I was always on my best behavior when doing so though. Now that I'm elligble to get one I might....some day.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 10:55:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/12/2001 10:51:02 AM EDT by Avalon01]
JacRyan -- Since I am transporting the firearms from point A (my home) to point B (my parents second home), with no stops, do I need to worry about commiting a criminal offense? If I were stopped, the weapon would be unloaded and cased. Also seperate from the ammo. It would not be hidden in the dash, but stored in a bag in the back of the Blazer. Ammo would be in my regular range bag. I'm not doing this to have a gun in the car, I just want to move it to my parents place. I suppose in reality I have nothing to fear. I look like a clean cut 25 year-old, and always make sure to use "Sir or officer" when dealing with cops. Have yet to get a ticket, even though I have been stopped, and have never even had my car searched at checkpoints. Av.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 11:21:15 AM EDT
Avalon01 There are federal laws about transporting firearms interstate, to protect you from any bizzare requirements in any tin-pot county you pass through. Check it out at the NRA website. Everything you say you are doing should be more than adequate though. BTW, about having been searched while going through checkpoints- get used to that. The War on Terrorism, like the War on Drugs virtually requires it.
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