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Posted: 9/14/2001 9:28:32 AM EST
After the memorial service, Billy Graham's son was being interviewed and was advocating using ALL our weapons, including WMD if need be (that's nukes) against our enemies before we send in our young men and women "as cannon fodder." Now THERE is a Christian I like! [:D]
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 9:44:41 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 9:46:46 AM EST
There was an article in the local paper here several years ago. He rides motorcycles and plays with class 3 firearms for hobbies.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 9:55:05 AM EST
That being the case, the general public must be every bit as pissed as the people on this board.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 9:58:39 AM EST
If what you say and quote is true.....he is an imposter. True Christians don't talk like that. Unfortunately, there seems to be more imposters pretending to be Christians than there are true Christians. And that is a big part of the problem with the world today.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 10:42:53 AM EST
Originally Posted By levi: If what you say and quote is true.....he is an imposter. True Christians don't talk like that. Unfortunately, there seems to be more imposters pretending to be Christians than there are true Christians. And that is a big part of the problem with the world today.
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Levi, While I do see what you are saying about imposters (people who go to church on Sunday and act holy but their lives are unchanged) but I also know that I have many Christian friends who do agree with these statements... including myself. I know many Christian men that are true to God and love him and their lives show it that believe we should seek revenge for what has been done at any cost. In fact, one of them was a pilot that was shot down and ended up becoming a POW in Vietnam for over a year.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 10:56:25 AM EST
Post by levi -
True Christians don't talk like that.
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That's odd, levi, I'm a 'true Christian' and that's precisely how I would expect to handle the same question! If we can't come up with some [u]other[/u]plan with which to slap the crap outta those who are the perpetrators of this outrage, and those who gave them any assistance whatsoever, then any alternative, including the use of low-yield, low radiation nuclear weapons, would still be under consideration! Maybe not to used, mind you, but certainly not off the table! Eric The(RighteouslyIndignantANDChristian)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 11:10:20 AM EST
Biblically, the government has the responsibility, and authority, to protect its citizens just as a husband and father has the responsibility to protect his family. I do not see any contradiction between what he said and what a "true Christian" believes.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 11:13:57 AM EST
Originally Posted By levi: If what you say and quote is true.....he is an imposter. True Christians don't talk like that.
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Really? I guess you're one of those people who's never read the Old Testament. At any rate, I don't give a damn what your opinion is, since you're obviously ignorant, uninformed and lacking in cognitive ability.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 12:06:42 PM EST
Our preacher was suggesting the rototilling of half of Afghanistan (if they are singled out) for starters over the pulpit. Only about 800 in our congregation. Amens abounded. Planerench out.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 1:29:53 PM EST
I'm not religious, but I've always respected Billy Graham because he follows what he preaches, and actually puts donations to the use they are intended for. Now I respect him even more, because his son revealed that he also raised his kid right.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 1:40:54 PM EST
Originally Posted By levi: If what you say and quote is true.....he is an imposter. True Christians don't talk like that. Unfortunately, there seems to be more imposters pretending to be Christians than there are true Christians. And that is a big part of the problem with the world today.
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Totally wrong my friend. Christ did say turn the other cheek when others persecute you but........but.............God does expect and command that we should defend ourselves, our property, our families and our way of life. The bible clearly states that there is a time to beat plowshares into swords......it also states for he that hath a sword to pick it up and for he that hath not a sword to sell his cloak and buy one. Defending onesself is a God given right. I am a true christian myself.............yep.........I don't always talk like and I don't always act like it but that is between me and God. Forgiveness is mine if I repent and try to change my unchristianly like behaviors but I can also guarantee you that this true christian is and would be a force to be reckoned with in a time of national emergency such as this. Gad saved me..............He did not take away my brain, my strangth or my abilities to fight and use weapons. I advocate total anniahlation of anyone responsible for this action against our Republic.
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 1:45:18 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 1:53:51 PM EST
And there ya have it......straight from our in-house "connection."
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 3:05:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By levi: If what you say and quote is true.....he is an imposter. True Christians don't talk like that. Unfortunately, there seems to be more imposters pretending to be Christians than there are true Christians. And that is a big part of the problem with the world today.
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Whaddya mean levi? Are you saying that Christians wouldn't advocate the massacring of innocent women and children? You can't be correct, look, all these "christians" say its OK. And they are christian just ask them! BTW- I am painfully aware of all the innocents that died this week. The perpetrators certainly weren't remotely Christian, but I don't see how that makes it OK to cast aside our decency and morality by indiscriminately killing children. Or is this OK with "your" G_d? Carpet bombing is the easy way, the path of least resistance. Being Christian isn't the easy way. Far be it from me to quote scripture to "christians" but it seems *VERY* clear and appropriate here. Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. Better yet why don't we all read all of Romans 12, it is a short but very good chapter. But we all knew that anyway. After reading this I think Levi is correct, in the minority, but correct. rDAm
Link Posted: 9/14/2001 3:43:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By Invictus: Far be it from me to quote scripture to "christians" but it seems *VERY* clear and appropriate here. Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. Better yet why don't we all read all of Romans 12, it is a short but very good chapter. But we all knew that anyway. After reading this I think Levi is correct, in the minority, but correct. rDAm
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Or maybe you should read Numbers 31, where the Biblical God ORDERS the Israelites to murder every single male, down to infants, and every married woman, including pregnant ones, of the tribe of Midian. Or maybe you should read basically ANY of the Old Testament. Or even this verse from Romans, which you conveniently ignore: Romans 13:1-4 1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. Yet again we see that you lack knowledge of the argument into which you insert your increasingly long nose.
Link Posted: 9/15/2001 4:27:12 AM EST
Originally Posted By RikWriter: Or maybe you should read Numbers 31, where the Biblical God ORDERS the Israelites to murder every single male, down to infants, and every married woman, including pregnant ones, of the tribe of Midian.
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So were in the Torah does it say to specifically kill all Palestinian women and children? Or specifically Afghanis? Please tell me exactly where? Are they just Midians with really good disguises? Let me ask you this. If the Israelis were able to identify a small group of surviving Midians today living on some rock would they be justified in whacking them out? If not, then why not? As it is ordered by their G_d. Hypothetically would "True Christians" support the abortion of an unborn child if there was proof that it was fathered by a surviving member of the Midian tribe? Now isn't the time to be a hypocrite Rik.
Or maybe you should read basically ANY of the Old Testament. Or even this verse from Romans, which you conveniently ignore: Romans 13:1-4 1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
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I didn't ignore anything Rik, I don't think it would have been polite to stuff the entire book of Romans here. Nothing you have quoted yet can be remotely used to justify indiscriminate bombing that will needlessly harm women and children. To do that will only increase the recruitment base of which the truly evil ones depend on. We don't need anymore generations of suicide bombers coming to visit upon our shores.
Yet again we see that you lack knowledge of the argument into which you insert your increasingly long nose.
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Not at all Rik, and I will have you know that your crack about a long nose would be found offensive to anyone of Semite extraction. Insult me as you wish but don't get racial on this board. If you don't want my long nose in this argument don't put it on a public forum. All I want is to see the perpetrators of this heinous act of barbarity against the women and children of the United States brought to justice. I want to see them brought to a fair trial, I want them convicted and publicly hanged if truly guilty. It surely can be done without blasting the crap out of an entire country or province. I have full faith in the capabilities of Americans to punish only the guilty, if that is what we want to do. I pray that is indeed the path we choose to travel. rDAm
Link Posted: 9/15/2001 5:15:48 AM EST
Originally Posted By Invictus: So were in the Torah does it say to specifically kill all Palestinian women and children? Or specifically Afghanis? Please tell me exactly where? Are they just Midians with really good disguises?
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The point was that the Bible is chock FULL of examples of killing innocent people, and you're being incredibly disingenuous to pretend that you don't understand this.
Now isn't the time to be a hypocrite Rik.
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Then why do you continue to be one?
I didn't ignore anything Rik, I don't think it would have been polite to stuff the entire book of Romans here.
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No, you just didn't feel like quoting anything that contradicts your opinion.
Nothing you have quoted yet can be remotely used to justify indiscriminate bombing that will needlessly harm women and children.
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In fact, what it shows is that a "true Christian" (which was the point we were arguing, since you seem to have lost sight of the point long ago) can in fact support the government use of force. And of course Numbers 31 shows that a "true Christian" should have no problem with the deaths of innocent women and children in war.
To do that will only increase the recruitment base of which the truly evil ones depend on. We don't need anymore generations of suicide bombers coming to visit upon our shores.
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Yeah, not doing it has worked so well up to now...
Not at all Rik, and I will have you know that your crack about a long nose would be found offensive to anyone of Semite extraction.
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Uh, Chuckles, you DO know that you never mentioned your ethnic background on here right? I have no idea if you are a Jew or a Martian. Just one more examples of your disingenuousness.
Insult me as you wish but don't get racial on this board. If you don't want my long nose in this argument don't put it on a public forum.
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Your long nose has nothing to do with your race (and I don't know that you ARE Jewish...given the way you misstate the facts over and over, you could quite likely be lying) and everything to do with the fact you quite obviously have an agenda and that agenda is the only reason you're here.
Link Posted: 9/15/2001 5:59:28 AM EST
I am not a military planner, but I would *ASSUME* that, if we attack a particular country, we would target government buildings and military targets, not schools and hospitals. It is a fact of war that innocents die with the guilty. You only need to cut the head off the snake to kill it. You don't need to grind the entire snake into hamburger.
Link Posted: 9/15/2001 6:26:09 AM EST
First off, in war innocents always die. If you can't accept that fact then you aren't living in reality. Sometimes innocents are guilty by the association of their government. Secondly, Bin laden (and all terrorist)was born by a women, children from early on are taught/grow up to be terrorist. Thirdly, Some people become so evil the normal rules towards fellow man no longer apply--Tuesday's terrorist fit that rule. Forth, Sometimes you just got to do what you feel is right at the time and accept GOD's judgement when your time comes. If you align your life with GOD, He will be with you when the time comes to make the hard decisions. sgtar15
Link Posted: 9/15/2001 9:37:56 AM EST
If the Bible doesn't work for you because of "ambiguities," then perhaps you should consider the Talmud. There is a passage that states something to the effect of "If someone comes to kill you, arise and kill him first." I am sure that you can get the direct reference from the JPFO. [url]http://www.jpfo.org[/url]
Link Posted: 9/15/2001 10:28:04 AM EST
I think RikWriter is a Closet Christian [;)] . . . [0:)]
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