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3/20/2017 5:03:23 PM
Posted: 8/19/2001 9:42:54 AM EDT
What is Patriotism? I've always considered myself as being patriotic but never really gave thought to exactly what that word means to me. Patriotism is something that is a bit difficult to express in words. It is not only something that is displayed, it is also a feeling. A good feeling. It is a true love and appreciation for your country, your country's flag, your God and your fellow man regardless of race, creed or color. It is a show of appreciation for our country's servicemen and women and veterans who served selflessly to protect the freedoms we, as Americans, enjoy, appreciation shown to those who made the ultimate sacrifice by laying down their lives for their country and appreciation to those still missing and praying that one day they will all come home to the homeland they so loved. It is believing in, having faith in and praying to a God of your choice in thanks for allowing you to live in a free nation. Patriotism comes in every shape, size and age. If you watch a soldier, sailor, airman, or veteran standing at attention facing Old Glory while the National Anthem is playing, you just might catch a glimpse of a tear running down his/her cheek or you might notice goosebumps on their arms. Patriotism is displayed in many ways. By displaying the American flag on a daily basis, by not only attending or participating in holiday celebrations but also attending the memorial services associated with that holiday. It could be a young boy standing at attention and saluting a last farewell at his father's funeral. It could be a soldier in uniform standing at attention, saluting, with tears running down his face as taps is being played in tribute to his brothers and sisters lost at war or lost through cowardly acts of terrorism. It could be an older gentleman standing at attention facing Old Glory at a ballgame with his hand over his heart while listening to our country's National Anthem. Or it could be a young person walking up to a person in uniform or a veteran for no other reason than to reach out his or her hand in thanks for serving your country. Patriotism could be summed up in three short words...God Bless America.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 9:52:01 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 10:26:09 AM EDT
I'm pleased to see someone post about this. Sometimes, I feel like I'm in a distinct minority when I get feelings like this about America, or when I see a gigantic American Flag waving in the breeze. I think sometimes we get caught up in the conspiracy theories and the hopeless feelings of being trashed by the Liberal agenda. Like Paul said, the last 8 years were pretty tough on Patriotic Americans. There is still HOPE when we see our Flag flying in the winds. To know that others feel the same way makes my day. Thanks, gents.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 10:26:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2001 10:23:02 AM EDT by Scipio]
I consider myself a patriot... a patriot because I love my Country and the values and ideals for which it was established. However, to be a patriot, does one need to love their government as well? Although your post was touching, it struck me as a bit naive. My experience has been that many young service men and women are there to get their educations paid for, and to see the world. Things have changed in todays military and it is no wonder that many no longer call it the "Service"... Soldiers today really do not serve. Bootcamp in some of the branches of the U.S. military has become much like a summer camp where the major goal is to raise the self-esteem of young and confused post-adolescents. When U.S. troops are sent to small third world nations that are entangled deeply in civil wars or ethnic conflict, are those U.S. troops really serving their country??? or are they serving their government??? I've known many veterans who, due to their "service", have lost the ability to walk, or feed themselves, or shit on a the can, or even get it up... Most of them have seen the other side of the patriotic coin and have asked themselves the question whether or not there really is any honor and glory in death... no matter what you are dying for... I will always remember when I was a boy and I had just seen the Movie born on the 4th of July. That movie really touched me, and it made me want to join the corps. even more than before... a few weeks later I was visiting some relatives near radondo beach Cali. when I was informed that the man in the wheel chair dead ahead was none other than Ron Kovick, the man whose life that movie was based on... I approached him and told him that someday, when I grow up, I want to be a Marine just like he was... he looked at me and said..."Kid, what do you want to do a stupid thing like that for..." Those words spoken to me by that "patriot" stuck with me forever... I still went to OCS when I was old enough, but after that day, honor, patriotism, and love of my country had a different meaning... Your Resident Devil's Advocate, Scipio
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 11:22:29 AM EDT
God bless America and Ron and all of his brothers, they were the bravest of the brave. It takes great personal sacrifice of those few with that kind of courage to secure freedom for a sometimes ungrateful nation. But God bless them too.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 1:30:57 PM EDT
IF THE FLAG COULD TALK IT VERY WELL JUST MIGHT SAY: "Sometimes I am strong with pride, when men do honest work, fitting the rails truly together." "Sometimes I droop, for the purpose has gone from me, and cynically I play the coward." "Sometimes I am loud, garish, and full of that ego that blasts all judgment." "But always I am all that you hope to be, and have the courage to try for." "I am the days work for the weakest man and the largest dream of the most daring." "I am the song and fear, struggle, panic and hope." "I am the Constitution and the courts and statutes and the statue makers, soldier, sailor, street sweep, cook, counselor and clerk." "I am the battle of yesterday and the mistake of tomorrow." "I am the Mystery of the men who do without knowing why." "I am the clutch of an idea and the reasoned purpose of resolution." "I am no more than what you believe me to be, and I am all that you believe I can be." "I am what you make me, nothing more." --Unknown
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 4:10:39 AM EDT
The problem today, many confuse patriotism with anarchy.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 4:37:25 AM EDT
"Patriotism" is the word that makes liberals smirk and roll their eyes. They also do this when the hear the words "honor" and "hero".
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 5:13:14 AM EDT
Patriotism is crying in public, and not caring what others think, whenever the Star Spangled Banner is played, especially the part: [i] And the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air, Gave proof thro' the night that our flag was still there. [/i] I mean, those British bastards threw everything at us but we kept it flying. And yes, I do cry whenever I hear it.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 5:45:57 AM EDT
Patriotism is also: [b]"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." [/b] And I know, I have said it.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 6:23:32 AM EDT
Many of you seem to see a direct connection between God and patriotism. I submit to you that patriotism and religious beliefs may "feel" similar, but they aren't the same thing. Clearly, all the various religions can't all be correct, yet there are patriotic jews, patriotic Muslims, patriotic Catholics, patriotic Buddhists, and (yes) patriotic Atheists. It is the way of things that everybody in a war believes that God is on their side, but that is also manifestly not the case. Patriotism, IMO, is respecting and living according to the ideals on which this nation was founded (as outlined in the Constitution), respecting its institutions that still respect me, and acknowledging the sacrifices made by those who came before.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 6:34:37 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 1:48:23 PM EDT
Patriotism is when one gives unconditional respect and support to those that enforce the laws.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 2:12:58 PM EDT
I am a patriotic person and for all of us who are and even though Imbrolio is only an attetion starved individual it is my goal to locate him and kick him in the butt for all of us. That is all. [sniper]
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 2:24:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Rifles4Me: I am a patriotic person and for all of us who are and even though Imbrolio is only an attetion starved individual it is my goal to locate him and kick him in the butt for all of us. That is all. [sniper]
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Thank you. Imbroglio: NO, what you describe is the current liberal mindset. Patriotism is loving one's [i]country[/i], and not particularly one's [i]government[/i]. Stop ruining good threads please.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 2:28:45 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 6:23:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:
Originally Posted By stubbs:
Originally Posted By Rifles4Me: I am a patriotic person and for all of us who are and even though Imbrolio is only an attetion starved individual it is my goal to locate him and kick him in the butt for all of us. That is all. [sniper]
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Thank you. Imbroglio: NO, what you describe is the current liberal mindset. Patriotism is loving one's [i]country[/i], and not particularly one's [i]government[/i]. Stop ruining good threads please.
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Christ, you guys. Have you never heard of sarcasm? He is one of the most ardent among us--or a helluva imposter. Either way, his post was intended the same as mine. Sheesh. I am prompted to say--Lighten up, Francis.
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I don't know. I havn't read a post from him that wasn't sarcasm in some time. It get's annoying/aggrivating after awhile.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 6:45:52 PM EDT
I just read an essay on this today, by Robert Heinlein. He defined "Patriotism" as the idea of 'women and children first' on a national scale. The willingness to die for others outside yourself, even if you don't know them personally.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 6:50:52 PM EDT
Ever find yourself stopping in the middle of the sidewalk because you see the big flag waving? Sometimes I just get captivated by it and I start thinking about how much I love my country. Then I notice that not one person around me does the same, its sad that people take so little notice anymore. Of course, I also cry on our nations birthday (notice I didn't call it "July 4" or "fireworks day" I'm tired of people thinking it is just a day to party, it's a day....it's THE day to remember what we, as a nation, are all about., and to remeber those few outnumbered rebels who formed our country)
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 7:04:53 PM EDT
Patriotism means paying taxes to president George and not king George. A patriot is someone who can sacrifice himself for the nations greater good.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 7:48:42 PM EDT
Patriotism is protecting and defending the Constitution of the United States from all enemies foreign and domestic. It means caring enough to protect Liberty, against all odds. Even when you think you are out numbered, out gunned, and hopeless. It means living your life according to the principles this country was founded on.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 7:57:42 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 12:20:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Rifles4Me: I am a patriotic person and for all of us who are and even though Imbrolio is only an attetion starved individual it is my goal to locate him and kick him in the butt for all of us. That is all. [sniper]
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Why the threats of violence? This is all the more reason for increased restrictions on civilian gun ownership.
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 1:01:16 AM EDT
Patriotism is the way one shows love for the meaning of America and all it stands for. Here is some thing I did for the guys at the VFW after my Grandad died. Alot of guys my age give older guys a tuff time and reallt act like jerks some times so I came up with this to maybe make them feel a lil. better,it's a lil silly but they liked it. Silly Old Men:Silly old men in old fade uniforms sit and talk about young men they used to know in places they used to be.As I watch them and listen I see there faces grow sad then happy time and time again. I begin to see in my mind's eye. There I am on a strnge boat in a strnge place with bombs and gunfire tracing overhead. Then suddenly I come to an abrupt stop.The man driving yells "Everybody out" The door opens with a great sllash and a loud thud. Smoke and foam roll in through the opening. Aman in front turns and yells "Lets go".Then one of the bullets hit him and he dies right there in the boat. We got out as fast as we could,I jumped out in to the water and looked down. The water was red with bloos. The dead are everywhere and just as many are badly wounded.They lay on the ground seeming to outnumber the grains of sand on the beach. I can hear them calling out to me but I can't help them,I just run as fast as I can. Then some one pulls me down ,I am confused and I can't see anything.He asks me"Buddy are you ok?" I can see some men up on a hill up ahead with machine guns, they scurry around killing everyone they can. I grab my rifle and begin to shoot at them. After a timethe shooting seems to slack off. The olny voices I can hear now are other Americans.So I slowly stand up and look around. What's this? I'm home and free! No war just feedom and prosperity. Thank you sillt old men.
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 6:49:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By thebeekeeper1:
Originally Posted By stubbs: I don't know. I havn't read a post from him that wasn't sarcasm in some time. It get's annoying/aggrivating after awhile.
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I know what you mean. I don't know him (am VERY curious though!), but I think he will lighten up when the government stops shredding the Constitution. I have read lots of his posts and he is among the most ardent patriots here. If his posting style gets old, it's because the attacks on liberty get old. I hope everyone here is actively working to restore liberty. I read a good quote here last week--"The Constitution may not be perfect, but it's a whole lot better than what we have now!"
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The annoyance is all the more reason to fight for our rights!![:D] I too have read throught his posts through the years (has it been [i]years?[/i] Wow.), and I can agree with you on that.
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 7:02:00 AM EDT
I dunno about you guys but when I am in the shit, and bullets are flying along with other things, the last thing I'm thinkin about is the people back home...nooo...I'm thinkin about my ass and my buddies life.... Is that a bad thing? [(:)]
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 7:05:52 AM EDT
And my back hurts too dammit.[>:/]
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 7:11:12 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Golgo-13: Many of you seem to see a direct connection between God and patriotism. I submit to you that patriotism and religious beliefs may "feel" similar, but they aren't the same thing. Patriotism, IMO, is respecting and living according to the ideals on which this nation was founded (as outlined in the Constitution), respecting its institutions that still respect me, and acknowledging the sacrifices made by those who came before.
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Golgo - Please don your nomex, cuz you are about to get seriously flamed [}:D] Seldom in a single post do you see so obvious a contradiction. Actually, two of them. First, you equate God with religion. It has been WELL ESTABLISHED in THIS forum that the two are COMPLETELY unrelated. God is real, and living, and just and true and fair and loving and demanding of personal righteousness. Religion is dead and stifling and constricting and vain and meaningless and self-congratulatory and hypocritical. Now, on to the Second contradiction. You say patriotism has nothing to do with God, but everything to do with living by the ideals on which this nation was founded. Try actually reading the personal writings of the Founding Fathers. I'll recommend Bill Bennet's book "Our Sacred Honor." The FF made it unmistakably clear that personal holiness and relationship with God is the single indispensible support of national patriotism. Oddly enuf, God agrees with them (intentional irony) "Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord" -- The Book of Psalms. I'll spare you other Scripture references which further elaborate the connection between God and patritism. AGAIN, don't spin my words to say soemthing they are not. I'm talking about PERSONAL holiness and obedience to God. A state supported religion would become the SAME thing as "religion" (as I have described it above,) has already become. Again, your contradictory statements above lead me to believe you reading of the actual writings of teh FF may be sorely lacking.
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 1:56:13 PM EDT
Garandman, As for the establishment in this (or any other) forum that there is a difference between religion and a real, living, and all those other adjectives g/God...that is based on the presupposition that God exists, which is a matter of faith; in this case yours. From my agnostic POV, that is not at all the case, despite what you believe yourselves to have established. At the HCI (or whatever they call themselves now) website, you will find all sorts of things that they have established based on their "faith" , as well. I will not address anything further that is simply faith-based, such dialogs are endless and pointless for all concerned. As for your second point, I see no contradiction. Whatever else they might have been, the FF's were nothing but mortal men. Because I believe in the abstract ideals that they, as a group, lay down in the Constitution after a good bit of fighting among themselves, I am in no way obligated to believe what any of them believed in terms of religious beliefs. A good many of them were also Masons, does that obligate me to join a lodge? More than 1 of them owned slaves (and must, therefore, have believed that slavery was okay), am I obligated to believe in slavery, as well? I think the answer to all of the above is no. The FF's were an extremely erudite lot, and they took their ideas from many and varied sources, including Christian philosophy. The Greek and Roman philosophers come to mind, for example. The synthesis of all their learning, all their arguing, and all their work is a document that has proven to be the best yet method of governing for maximum individual liberty w/o degeneration into anarchy or mob rule (so far). It is to that abstract that I owe my loyalty. As for flaming you, I believe that after our last set-to, I told you that I would confine my conversations with you to technical matters...it is stretching to count this as technical, but it would have been rude of me to not respond to your well written post.
Link Posted: 8/21/2001 2:03:37 PM EDT
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