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3/20/2017 5:03:23 PM
Posted: 8/18/2001 2:28:22 AM EDT
I was wondering if gasoline could be, or is used for cleaning AR's. I am basing this question on the fact that Hoppes and other similar products are just basically petroleum distillates. Any help will be appreciated. Thank You
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 3:24:16 AM EDT
Gasoline is too volatile to use as a solvent. Besides it doesn't leave much of a residual film or layer of oil to do any good. Diesel gas works great as a solvent and would do a decent job of cleaning and protection. I'd only use it if there were nothing else around, though I'd never use gasoline.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 4:12:19 AM EDT
Volatile is a good description of gasoline. [b]Don't do it.[/b] It's highly likely that you could end burning down the house. Remember,It's the Fumes that are Explosive. Plus it can cause Cancer And Liver&Kidney damage. + Damage to your Nervous system... CLP and many other good cleaners are out there. Don't risk your life\health just to save a couple bucks. Del [:)]
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 5:47:15 AM EDT
YO GLOCK 20 THATS THE SAME THING I HAVE ON MY LICENSE PLATE IT WAS A BIG HIT AT THE GSSF MATCHES I HAVE BEEN TO GO "GLOCK 20".
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 5:49:06 AM EDT
Gasoline works fine, just remember to open all the windows on the trailer first and light the cig "before" you start. And don't lube with 10W-40 oil, stick to the 5W-30.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 6:32:21 AM EDT
'Gasoline is NOT your friend' Eric The(Burned)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 6:34:15 AM EDT
Not on my ARs!!!
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 6:51:16 AM EDT
NEVER use gasoline for anything except motor fuel!....it is highly dangerous......same for diesel....it may be less volatile, but if it does ignite.....watch out!....best thing to use is commercially available solvents....gun scrub etc......substitutes are brakleen...shop solve....these can be found at discount auto stores....nice thing is they evaporate rather quickly, and minimize any dangers...only have to be wary of fumes....NEVER USE SOLVENTS IN A BASEMENT WHERE FLAMES MAY BE PRESENT.....ie furnace/hot water tank.....people say.."Iknow that"...yet, every year somebody burns themselves.....ONE ACCIDENT...can never justify savings or short cuts.........
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:05:23 AM EDT
What the Hell have you got on your AR that takes Gasoline to remove?? I prefer sulfuric acid, and a sledge hammer to clean mine!
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:07:18 AM EDT
Taco sauce [:P]
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:44:08 AM EDT
Sulfuric acid cleans well but you still need to rinse in gasoline to get all the sulfuric acid off. I've never tried taco sauce. Is that hot or extra hot?
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:47:10 AM EDT
Remember! You are flammable![:O]
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:56:41 AM EDT
Gasoline works fine for cleaning most machined parts. Use a paintbrush, NOTHING STEEL OR SPARKING, do it outdoors, don't put it on your skin, and use a VERY small amount in a non-glass container. Before you do so, show yourself just how explosive the vapors can be by tossing matches near a teaspoonful. If you can't safely do that where you are, you're in the wrong area to use gasoline as a solvent. Gas leaves a slight residue; acetone would give a better clean. Both are quite flammable and should only be used with proper safety precautions and if nothing less flammable is available. Diesel doesn't evaporate readily and would have to be flushed off somehow.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 8:37:08 AM EDT
You can wash the diesel off with gasoline. But you can just leave the diesel on for a Glock because they don't need much lube.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 8:54:19 AM EDT
On a serious note - Cleaning guns with gasoline could easily level your double-wide - and you along with it. But paint thinner works great. Just get some paint thinner, mineral spirits, etc. (but [b]not[/b] lacquer thinner!!), at the local Wal-Mart, paint store, or hardware store. Best is the "odorless" mineral spirits. While straight mineral spirits works well, it's even better if you dump a quart of Mercon ATF into a couple of gallons. This is almost identical to the Saf-T-Kleen formula (they add green dye [:)] ) and is close to the famous "Ed's Red." (Ed added a little acetone and lanolin.) And you can use it in a cheap parts washer like those electrical pumped units from Harbor Freight: [url]http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Category.taf?CategoryID=502[/url] For $50 you can get a benchtop washer that will clean just about anything in minutes, and cleans up by merely closing the lid. If *that* doesn't do it for you, then you're even lazier than I am!! [:P]
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 8:55:39 AM EDT
I use gasoline for all the bolt parts and I squirt a little in the barrel lugs to clean them.I dont know where to buy bulk kerosene. GG
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 9:00:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/18/2001 8:56:49 AM EDT by SILVER SURFER]
Hey If that's all you have go for it just be carefull! I would let it dry before shooting it again [:)]
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:16:17 AM EDT
I sometimes use mineral spirits to get all the worse shit off. I put it in a clear plastic bird seed bottle the wife gets at Wal-Mart along with the gun parts, screw the cap back on and shake the hell out of the bottle. works good. JP4 mixed with Mobile 1 should work. The best is tequila or Wild Turkey, after your done cleaning your rifle you can drink it.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:19:17 AM EDT
Hey, always be careful with gas, but we used to come in from a few days in the bush and use MO gas (military octane), basically LOW octane nasty stuff you'd NEVER use at home, just dunked and brushed a little. Never had anyone blow up!
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:30:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/18/2001 10:32:14 AM EDT by glock20]
Since the methamphetamine explosions in the trailer park start early, I was up at 6:00am. Apparently none of you guys are in the same situation, so I did it before I got any responses. 1. Our meth lab is in the shed so I don't have to worry about fires. 2. I only smoke the meth from a vaporizer, no flames needed. BTW- Gasoline works very well. I've never gotten that carbon off of the area behind the gas rings so quickly. Instead of scrubbing the bolt and carrier for an hour with hoppes distilled petroleum product, I was done in 20 minutes. I am definitely going to consider using diesel next time as the lubricating properties of it look better. For general lubing I use and recommend Militec. Thanks for chiming in Gun Guru and those who've done it, and thanks to the rest of you clownz for the hilarious responses. [:D] PS- Oslow, would hydroiodic acid work? That's all I have. [;)] Edited to add smiley and give credit where it is due.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:35:16 AM EDT
I use gasoline from my outboard motor mix to clean preservative off of USGI magazines, etc., then I spray them down with gun oil. Watch it around certain plastics, etc. as gas will melt them down.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:56:21 AM EDT
hmmm wonder what would happen if u didnt get all the gasoline off the gun then went to shoot it can we say KABOOOM!!!!
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 12:46:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cyrax777: hmmm wonder what would happen if u didnt get all the gasoline off the gun then went to shoot it can we say KABOOOM!!!!
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It will break down the breakfree. thats all. I normally clean my weapon after I shoot not before. Kaboom, get real. Gas is very volatile, which means it goes to vapor very fast and easily. GG "What do they teach in school"
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 12:48:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By glock20: I was wondering if gasoline could be, or is used for cleaning AR's. I am basing this question on the fact that Hoppes and other similar products are just basically petroleum distillates. Any help will be appreciated. Thank You
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Ya gotta be joke'n.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 1:07:40 PM EDT
Nooooooo, I am *not* joking. I did it, it works very well. What do you think Hoppes is QCMGR? Lilac oil? It's petroleum distillates. Hoppes is just thicker than gasoline, that's all. It all comes from crude oil, and it's all flammable. I'll admit gasoline is highly flammable, more so than hoppes, but they are both just simply petroleum products. No matter how much you guys furrow your brows, it doesn't change the fact that hoppes is just a refinement process or two away from being gasoline or some other highly volatile and highly combustible fluid.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 2:58:07 PM EDT
[i]glock20, are you..... Oh, never mind (BTW, gasoline makes good Molotov cocktails, which work well on bald eagles.)[/i] I'll assume you're talking about ARs. The stocks, & handguards are really tough, acid resistant, blah, blah, blah - but gasoline (or ANY solvent) WILL eventually fuckemup. It's the "eventually" part that'll fool you. Safety considerations aside - gas is cheap, so you'll be tempted to slop it on, & won't notice anything wrong until you compare it to another AR, & realize how "washed out" yours look. By that time the plastic, especially the handguards are brittle, & you've almost certainly "unglued" your heat shields too. If you're set on something that strong, & want to save money, ER is a lot safer, and you can play with the recipe & come pretty close to (a) CLP. [url]http://www.recguns.com/XC1a.html[/url] Competitive shooters, gun clubs and police departments who use a gallon or more of rifle bore cleaner annually can save by mixing their own, and they will give up nothing in safety or effectiveness. This cleaner has an action very similar to standard military issue rifle bore cleaner, such as Mil-C-372B. Users report it is more effective than Hoppe's for removing plastic fouling in shotgun bores, or caked carbon fouling in semi-automatic rifles or pistols, or in removing leading in revolvers. It is not as effective as Sweets 7.62, Hoppe's Bench Rest Nine or Shooter's Choice for fast removal of heavy copper fouling in rifle bores. However, because "ER" is more effective in removing caked carbon and abrasive primer residues than other cleaners, metal fouling is greatly reduced when "ER" is used on a continuing basis. I originally came up with this mix because I am an active high power rifle competitive shooter and hand loading experimenter who uses a lot of rifle bore cleaner. I was not satisfied with the performance and high price of commercial products. I knew there was no technical reason why an effective firearm bore cleaner couldn't be mixed using common hardware store ingredients. The result is inexpensive, effective, provides good corrosion protection and adequate residual lubrication so that routine "oiling" after cleaning is rarely necessary, except for long-term storage of over 1 year, or harsh service environments, such as salt water exposure. This formula is based on proven principles and incorporates two polar and two nonpolar solvents. It is adapted from the one in Hatcher's Notebook for "Frankford Arsenal Cleaner No.18," but substituting equivalent modern materials. I had the help of an organic chemist in doing this and we knew there would be no "surprises." The original Hatcher formula called for equal parts of acetone, turpentine, Pratts Astral Oil and sperm oil, and optionally 200 grams of anhydrous lanolin added per liter. Some discussion of the ingredients is helpful to understand the properties of the cleaner and how it works.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 2:59:53 PM EDT
(part II) Pratts Astral oil was nothing more than acid free, deodorized kerosene. I recommend "K1" kerosene of the type normally sold for use in indoor space heaters. Some users have reported successful substitution of civilian aviation grade kerosene such as Turbo-A. I am reluctant to "recommend" substitution of aviation grade kerosene, because the effects upon firearm components of the additives required in aviation fuels are unknown. Some "jet- fuels" are gasoline/kerosene blends and absolutely should not be used, because of their increased flammability. An inexpensive, effective substitute for sperm oil is Dexron (II, IIe or III) automatic transmission fluid. Prior to about 1950 that most ATF's were sperm oil based, but during WWII a synthetic was developed for use in precision instruments. With the great demand for automatic transmission autos after WWII, sperm oil was no longer practical to produce ATF in the quantity demanded, so the synthetic material became the basis for the Dexron fluids we know today. The additives in ATFs which include organometallic antioxidants and surfactants, make it highly suitable for inclusion in an all-purpose cleaner-lubricant-preservative. Hatcher's original Frankford Arsenal No. 18 formula used gum spirits of turpentine. Because turpentine is expensive today, and is also an "aromatic" solvent, which is highly flammable, I chose not to use it. Safer and cheaper is "aliphatic mineral spirits," a petroleum based "safety solvent" used for thinning oil based paints and also widely used as an automotive parts cleaner. It is commonly sold under the names "odorless mineral spirits," "Stoddard Solvent" or "Varsol". Acetone is included in "ER" to provide an aggressive, fast-acting solvent for caked powder residues. Because acetone is an aromatic, organic solvent, it is recommended that users leave it out if the cleaner will be used in enclosed spaces lacking forced air ventilation. The acetone in ER will evaporate, liberating volatile organic compounds (VOCs) into the atmosphere unless containers are kept tightly closed when not in use. The cleaner is still effective without the acetone, but it is not as "fast-acting." There isn't anything in Ed's Red which chemically dissolves copper fouling in rifle bores, but it does a better job removing on carbon and primer residue than anything else which is safe and commonly available. Numerous users have told me, that exclusive use of "ER" reduces copper deposits, because it removes the old impacted powder fouling which is left by other cleaners, which reduces the abrasion and adhesion of jacket metal to the bore surface, leaving a cleaner surface condition which reduces subsequent fouling. Experience seems to indicate that "ER" will actually remove metal fouling it if you let it "soak," so the surfactants will do the job, though you have to be patient.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 3:01:06 PM EDT
(part III) Addition of the lanolin to ER bore cleaner mix is entirely optional. The cleaner works quite well and gives adequate corrosion protection and lubrication for most users without it. Incorporating the lanolin makes the cleaner easier on the hands, and increases lubricity and film strength, and improves corrosion protection if weapons will be routinely exposed to salt air, water spray, industrial or urban corrosive atmospheres, or if you intend to use the cleaner as a protectant for long term storage of over 1 year. If you use other protective films for adverse use or long term storage you can leave the lanolin out and save about $8 per gallon. At current retail prices you can buy all the ingredients to mix ER, without the lanolin for about $10 per gallon. I urge you to mix some yourself. I am confident it will work as well for you as it does for me and hundreds of users who got the "recipe" on the Fidonet Firearms Echo. CONTENTS: Ed's Red Bore Cleaner 1 part Dexron II, IIe or III ATF, GM Spec. D-20265 or later. 1 part Kerosene - deodorized, K1 1 part Aliphatic Mineral Spirits, Fed. Spec. TT-T-2981F, CAS #64741-49-9, or may substitute "Stoddard Solvent", CAS #8052-41-3, or equivalent, (aka "Varsol") 1 part Acetone, CAS #67-64-1. (Optional up to 1 lb. of Lanolin, Anhydrous, USP per gallon, OK to substitute Lanolin, Modified, Topical Lubricant, from the drug store) MIXING INSTRUCTIONS FOR "ER" BORE CLEANER: Mix outdoors, in good ventilation. Use a clean 1 gallon metal, chemical-resistant, heavy gage PET or PVC plastic container. NFPA approved plastic gasoline storage containers are also OK. Do NOT use HDPE, which is permeable, because the acetone will eventually evaporate. The acetone in ER will also attack HDPE, causing the container to collapse, making a heck of a mess! Add the ATF first. Use the empty container to measure the other components, so that it is thoroughly rinsed. If you incorporate the lanolin into the mixture, melt this carefully in a double boiler, taking precautions against fire. Pour the melted lanolin it into a larger container, rinsing the lanolin container with the bore cleaner mix, and stirring until it is all dissolved. I recommend diverting a small quantity, up to 4 ozs. per quart of the 50-50 ATF/kerosene mix for optional use as an "ER-compatible" gun oil. This can be done without impairing the effectiveness of the remaining mix.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 4:15:47 PM EDT
Chicago, "Thank you" isn't enough here. You've done everyone on this board a great service. I'll be looking into chem houses in my area to find the reagents. I wonder how much a lb of lanolin will cost??? I know the rest is relatively cheap. Good advice on the plastic parts; I had my suspicions about that, so I only used it on my bolt/carrier and on the inside of the receiver. I owe you one.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 6:04:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By glock20: Nooooooo, I am *not* joking. I did it, it works very well. What do you think Hoppes is QCMGR? Lilac oil? It's petroleum distillates. Hoppes is just thicker than gasoline, that's all. It all comes from crude oil, and it's all flammable. I'll admit gasoline is highly flammable, more so than hoppes, but they are both just simply petroleum products. No matter how much you guys furrow your brows, it doesn't change the fact that hoppes is just a refinement process or two away from being gasoline or some other highly volatile and highly combustible fluid.
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Look dumb ass. If you are talking about a catalyst cracker, go back to school. Or go to http://www.chem.agilent.com/cag/isa/hpi/e1.htm.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:39:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By QCMGR:
Originally Posted By glock20: Nooooooo, I am *not* joking. I did it, it works very well. What do you think Hoppes is QCMGR? Lilac oil? It's petroleum distillates. Hoppes is just thicker than gasoline, that's all. It all comes from crude oil, and it's all flammable. I'll admit gasoline is highly flammable, more so than hoppes, but they are both just simply petroleum products. No matter how much you guys furrow your brows, it doesn't change the fact that hoppes is just a refinement process or two away from being gasoline or some other highly volatile and highly combustible fluid.
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Look dumb ass. If you are talking about a catalyst cracker, go back to school. Or go to http://www.chem.agilent.com/cag/isa/hpi/e1.htm.
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I'm not claiming "dumbass" status, but that link seems to be obsolete - they have a new site - could you check it out and steer us again? I couldn't figure out where to look.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 7:50:04 PM EDT
Yeh, gasoline gets the job done, but it's unsafe. When you can get the real thing, why risk it? Chemically they are relatively close, but physical properties! You probably have read of a slightly leaky gas can in the garage, where a water heater was?
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:10:18 PM EDT
really bad idea. Kero would be safer, but is not good for you. Oven cleaner will take off the carbon, and the blueing, and will strip the aluminium to the bare metal. Knew a guy in the USMC that ended up getting in trouble for destruction of Govt. property that way.
Link Posted: 8/18/2001 10:17:22 PM EDT
Pour a few ounces of gasoline in grass, wait a minute or two, step way back, toss match. You will see the gas vapors flash over far from where you poured. Thats why so many folks get FUBARed with gas. The vapors are heavyer than air and creep along the ground till they find an ignition source.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 2:06:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2001 2:02:46 AM EDT by natez]
Originally Posted By BillofRights: really bad idea. Kero would be safer, but is not good for you. Oven cleaner will take off the carbon, and the blueing, and will strip the aluminium to the bare metal. Knew a guy in the USMC that ended up getting in trouble for destruction of Govt. property that way.
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Knew someone in the army who got in trouble for damaging his rifle. He was a mechanic in our wheeled vehicle shop. After a big live fire, he took his M16 apart and stuck it in the parts washer for a couple of hours. When he was done, his M16A2, which was less than a year old, looked like a shiny pimp gun. Or there was the guy in basic who brassoed his bolt and bolt carrier until it gleamed. A for effort, F for results. The Drill Sergeant was very irate.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 6:32:48 AM EDT
Gas is definitely a very good degreaser.....at one shop i worked in the (distant) past, everyone had a gas bucket next to their tool box.......go ahead and use it, BUT have one stupid accident, and then we can say..."TOLD YOU SO....."....................[pyro]
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 8:13:33 AM EDT
Tomorrows Headline [b] New recipient for Darwin Award is Glock 20 for his Judicious use of Petroleum products[/b] get Real or get blown the F Up.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 8:47:22 AM EDT
Bushmaster recommends "Breakfree". That is what I use on my XM15-E2S. I will never use anything else unless Bushmaster recommends it. I hear ammonia based solvents will damage the chrome lining in the barrel. Jim Hall
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 5:38:34 PM EDT
Why would you want to use gas when you could use break cleaner?
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 10:09:50 PM EDT
I still say aqua regia works the best.
Link Posted: 8/19/2001 11:49:16 PM EDT
If you are gonna use the petrol, remember.... 1. Never use indoors 2. Ensure adequet ventilation, and no open flame or smoking 3. Avoid contact with plastic furniture. 4. Avoid skin contact, use gloves 5. Only us the petrol on metal parts; and 6. Dry and Lube with CLP Solvents won't hurt the metal parts, but I would not recommend the use of petrol for cleaning purposes, but it will work.
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 4:25:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Ghostface: Why would you want to use gas when you could use break cleaner?
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Gas is already in the garage. GG
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 5:08:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: I still say aqua regia works the best.
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Also, a little splash of that in yer gin & tonic adds some zip to it. [:D]
Link Posted: 8/20/2001 5:46:54 PM EDT
Gasoline has a fairly high vapor pressure and is composed of a variety of hydrocarbons. Some of those hydrocarbons pose some serious long term health risks (beyond the risk of personal incineration). Repeated exposure to gasoline will put you at risk for cancer and liver damage. A couple of years ago, I read a letter from a man who's lifelong passion was building models. Years of exposure to the solvents in model paints (the ones that come in those teeny tiny little bottles) gave him liver damage. He was weak, in pain, and dying. The letter was a warning to others that they might avoid a similarly horrible fate. I say don't use it, it isn't worth the risk. BTW the model guy is a valid example because the health risks of gasoline are similar to those of aromatic solvents.
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