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Posted: 6/25/2001 10:56:00 AM EDT
Can we see registration comming soon thru the 4473 forms? I guess its time to private sale everything from now on c-rock WaSHINGTON — The National Rifle Association lost a Supreme Court appeal Monday over whether the government can retain information about gun buyers under the landmark Brady gun control law. The court, without comment, turned aside the NRA's challenge to the way the FBI handles information gathered from on-the-spot background checks in gun stores. The NRA claimed the FBI's practice of keeping identities of legal gun buyers on file for several months is illegal under the 1993 Brady Act itself, and is akin to compiling a national registry of gun owners. "The Brady Act was a historic compromise in which firearm purchasers submit to background checks in exchange for the assurance that, once cleared as law-abiding, the government will not compile any record of their identities," lawyers for the NRA wrote. So-called instant checks replaced five-day waiting periods under the Brady Act in 1998. The phone checks are performed through the FBI, while the would-be gun buyer waits. In planning for the change to instant checks, the Justice Department, under then-Attorney General Janet Reno, decided the FBI would keep the records for up to six months. Keeping the information would help the FBI debug the system and audit its performance, according to the administrative rule the Justice Department issued. Keeping the log would also protect privacy by helping catch dealers or others who might run unauthorized background checks on people who were not trying to buy a gun, the department said. The FBI eventually cut the length of time it would hang on to records to three months, but the NRA said any record retention should be banned. The NRA sued Reno in federal court on the day the instant checks took effect. The court dismissed the NRA's claim, and a federal appeals court agreed last year. Two of the three judges on the appeals panel found "nothing in the Brady Act that unambiguously prohibits temporary retention of information about lawful transactions." The dissenting judge called the FBI records retention "an unauthorized power grab" by the Justice Department. The NRA then appealed to the Supreme Court, setting up a common question for the justices: How does a law passed by Congress square with government regulations imposed later on? The Justice Department urged the high court to let the lower ruling stand. The appeals court correctly found that the FBI's buyer log was a temporary list and was not intended to track gun buyers, the department's lawyers argued. The case is NRA v. Ashcroft, 00-1332.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 11:07:34 AM EDT
f*ucked up!
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 11:59:02 AM EDT
When it says "turned aside" does that mean they refused to rule on the case? If that is what occurred, then NO ONE lost or won as the court filed no opinions on it.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 12:10:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Imbrog|io: When it says "turned aside" does that mean they refused to rule on the case? If that is what occurred, then NO ONE lost or won as the court filed no opinions on it.
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The SCOTUS let the lower Court ruling stand. WE THE PEOPLE LOST. THE NRA LOST. THE FBI WON.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 12:27:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/25/2001 12:25:20 PM EDT by radioman]
The FBI can lick my sack cuz I got private party transfers and I watch my back. Wiggety Wiggety Whiteboyeeez in da house. [img]http://www.somethingawful.com/cliff/ihateyou/page8-06.jpg[/img] radioman
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 4:57:32 PM EDT
This really sucks. [heavy]
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 5:01:53 PM EDT
There was more of your freedom sailing away. Now I see that they will be able to track your location using your cell phone. I used to call mine a leash, now it is a tracking device even James Bond wouldn't believe.
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 5:07:15 PM EDT
Is there anybody out there who still believes that the USA does NOT permanently register gun owners and guns, on a national basis? Ignorant gun owners or dissembling antis, maybe.. Oh, yeah....Dubya, the Republicans, and the conservatives on the Supreme Court are going to save our gun rights. Suuuuure..... "I have not one doubt, even if I am in agreement with the National Rifle Association, that that kind of record keeping procedure [gun registration] is the first step to eventual confiscation under one administration or another." Charles Morgan, Director, Washington DC ACLU ...
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 5:08:15 PM EDT
erosion is the ultimate in pacification tools. the theory is that no one will object until it's too late. The german jews let them (the SS) take their rights, their guns and everything. once the erosion is complete the real ugly's start to happen. Same policy in play here in USA. Zaz
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 5:20:39 PM EDT
Man, the Supreme Court hasn't been very consistent at all lately. More like arbitrary--maybe they flip a coin? "If its heads, we'll uphold the Constitution today, tails, well we'll just decide on our own. It's tails..." What part of "shall keep no record" is so hard to understand?
Link Posted: 6/25/2001 7:00:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2001 3:05:44 AM EDT
I'm confused. NRA had a case before the Supremes? Everyone tells me that they don't do anything to defend our gun rights!
Link Posted: 6/26/2001 3:26:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Sweep: BTW, do they have to keep those things permantly? Or do they get to toss them after awhile? Oh yeah, is there a carbon copy? I don't think there is, I just can't remember.
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They have to keep them permantly... here is the info strait from ATF (C6) What records am I required to forward to ATF upon discontinuance of my business? The records consist of the licensee's bound acquisition/disposition (A/D) records, ATF Forms 4473, ATF Forms 5300.35 (the Brady forms), ATF Forms 3310.4 (Report of Multiple Sale or Other Disposition of Pistols and Revolvers), and records of transactions in semiautomatic assault weapons. If the licensee was granted a variance to use a computerized recordkeeping system, the licensee is required to provide a complete print-out of his entire A/D records.
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