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Posted: 6/19/2001 5:03:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2001 5:09:21 PM EDT by Striker]
Everyone is pretty clear on the circumstances of the Holocaust and how terrible and sick it was. Jews around the world, since the Holocaust, make a VERY large point in not letting anyone forget what they experienced in the 40's at the hands of the Nazi's. I have no real complaint about that. It was a historical moment that shouldn't be forgotten, and should be learned from. For the Jews, the Holocaust is frequently resurrected on many levels, from their own experiences 50 years ago, to reparations for the lost wealth taken from them, to their claims to Israel, to any other issue even remotely related. One would think, given this propensity to "never forget" or let anyone else forget for that matter, that the Jews would be acutely sensitive to similar experiences of others who have experienced forms of attempted genocide also. After all, if anyone is able to speak out against such crimes against humanity, it certainly would be the Jews, right? Why is it then that when something similar occurs, in say, Cambodia under Pol Pot, the attempted genocide in Rwanda of 800,000 people or the situation in Bosnia there isn't a peep out of the Jewish communities? Does it only matter to them if it's Jews being mass murdered? Now I'm sure that someone here is going to point out a "peep" from the Jews in response to some of these events. However, considering how incredibly vocal and active they are towards their own experiences 50 years ago, I would think that they would be the first to speak out vigorously, to act against vigorously, to provide aid or sanctuary vigorously to those who are experiencing or have experienced attempted genocide. Why such repeated silence from those who understand the horrors the most clearly? I'm not suggesting any particular course of action on the part of the Jews. I'm just wondering why they appear so self absorbed regarding their own experiences and don't reflect any real concern if something equally as horrible happens to another group. No, the numbers of the murdered are not the same, however, in total, millions and millions of various groups have been killed in genocidal actions. Why is it that those who never forget, never speak up if it's someone else? ------------------------------------- ***This is not intended as a flame, though I'm sure I'll be branded a total hate-monger for just bringing it up.***
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 5:12:33 PM EDT
Come on, that's a silly question. Collectively, Jews only REALLY give a shit about themselves. Ever heard the term Goyem? Look into it, it might give you a good insight into how they feel about people not like them and how it's justified.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 5:28:34 PM EDT
no more replies needed to this thread, seamus said it all.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 5:43:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2001 5:41:42 PM EDT by ARlady]
so what, we bash the Jews because they worry only about themselves and bash a good chunk of the european continent for NOT worrying only about themselves? but to answer the question: i took a class in college on the holocaust (keep in mind that i don't think this makes me an expert, but you'll see the relevance i hope). one question the prof asked was why would the Jews LET something like this happen? a lot of people in the class agreed that it probably had a lot to do with some of the religious inclinations. In the old testament, God often dictated (i use that word loosely) when to fight, and whom. And i think somewhere God says that He (emphasis) will vanquish the enemies. also, there are parts in the Bible telling us how God told them they were going to be a persecuted people. a couple thousand years of this kind of mentality probably had a lot to bear on the (in)action of the Jews in the holocaust. but make no mistake, they did not all go "like lambs to the slaughter."
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 5:59:53 PM EDT
I went to a top 10 law school. About a quarter of the class was Jewish. One day the super libs were going off in class about stuff like my lai in Vietnam and how evil the enlisted soldiers were for following the orders to shoot and how they should all be locked up for murder and stuff like that. I’d say half the super libs are Jewish, aggressively Jewish. Like everything is about being Jewish and Israel. They organize all the rallies to stop America from doing this or that, or have more abortions, or have more affirmative action, but then dictate what kind of pizza can be eaten there, or what hours people can protest (they may not go to temple Friday nights, but even so everything must stop in the world during those hours). Anyway, I got tired of their bashing enlisted men for following orders, so I asked about the punishment for Jewish police agents who tortured Arabs, following a court order, in an attempt to get information. After a brief attempt to shift the subject by the prof, which I resisted, the entire topic was dropped and the room was silent. The topic never came up again, even when the class hit areas totally ripe to compare it to. Odd how that works….like it never happened.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 6:05:33 PM EDT
Ya, it's kind of funny how they can go on and on about the holocaust, and then perpetrate one upon the arabs. But then, if I were them I think I'd want to keep the kind of political leverage that simply calling somebody an anti-semite envokes.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 6:37:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By seamusmcoi: Ya, it's kind of funny how they can go on and on about the holocaust, and then perpetrate one upon the arabs.
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Well no. They aren't trying to eradicate all Arabs from the face of the Earth. They may, depending on your view on the matter, be badly treating some Arabs that live in a very small part of the Middle East. That isn't a "Holocaust" except in the PC-ified perversion of the term.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 6:46:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2001 6:45:14 PM EDT by M4]
Good replies, but what about the specific question I asked? Several examples of attempted genocide have occurred since the holocaust, and what I want to know is this. If the Jews think resurrecting THEIR holocaust has credibility, how can they silently ignore the same thing happening around the world to others? Personally, until I see some concern on their part about genocide happening to other people, I don't give a rats ass about what happened to them in Nazi Germany. Yes, it was terrible, no one doubts that, but to think that a group who has experienced what they have, and at the same time are "too busy" to notice it happening to others makes them intolerably hypocritical and self centered in an extemely ugly way. I've been to a concentration camp in Germany, and scrawled in about 15 languages there reads a huge sign that says "Never Again". They forgot to finish the sentence...."Never Again....Except For Non-Jews"
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 6:54:28 PM EDT
Rule #1 cover your own ass first. Whats happening in those other countries is an autrocity but EVERYONE looks out for themselves first then everyone else a distant second. I have been to Israel and if you follow what happens there the arabs are blowing up civilians and have absolutely no other intentions but to eradicate the Jews. No compromise. The are still bitter they got their asses handed to them in the 6 day war... they are lucky Israel stoppd then. I could go on and on but I can see it would be a pointless argument.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 7:04:28 PM EDT
Given the history of the Jew I would expect fanaticial support for the 2nd. Amendment. This is not the case; most Congressional anti-gun legislation is sponsered by Jewish members of Congress. Ethiopian Jewry has suffered tremendous loss of life yet American Jewry and Israel have not been very supportive.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 7:08:06 PM EDT
Three years ago I told my catholic parents that I was converting to Judaism. My mother cried, not because of my lack of faith in the religion she wanted me to believe in, but because she knew I would now be the target of shit like this. By the way, goyim is the plural of goy, which literally means nation or a people. Yes, it is a word that applies to non-Jews, but not in a pejorative connotation. Shalom aleichem, Allen NRA/JPFO/ISRA
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 7:14:20 PM EDT
Ok you guys are making it hard not to get in to this. What I have to say will a fend may people on this bored it's pissed off my wife many times. Ok I have nothing agents the Jews or anything like that I do have something agent people that are to weak to fight and rather die in a death camp then die from trying to be free. It was just like that movie with that Russian getting his head chopped off he was weak he did not want to be free or he would of taken a few out with him or at lest try to.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 7:20:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2001 7:18:19 PM EDT by sluggo]
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 7:28:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By tayous1: Ok you guys are making it hard not to get in to this. What I have to say will a fend may people on this bored it's pissed off my wife many times. Ok I have nothing agents the Jews or anything like that I do have something agent people that are to weak to fight and rather die in a death camp then die from trying to be free. It was just like that movie with that Russian getting his head chopped off he was weak he did not want to be free or he would of taken a few out with him or at lest try to.
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Do you know any history behind the Holocaust? Do you think that it happened over a long weekend? Anyone that the Germans did not find fit, not only Jews, were systematically stripped of all rights as months and years passed. If we are to believe your speculation as stated above, then most of conquered Europe 'was weak..(and) did not want to be free'. Allen
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 9:43:50 PM EDT
I agree with M4's second post 100%. I also have got to visit the concentration camps. War is war. Whether it is right or wrong. By the rules, or not by the rules. You do what you believe "you" have to do for your countries best interest. And when your in the midst of it, you do what "you" have to do to keep yourself and your buddies alive. You have a choice to either kill or be killed. Yes, the clip of the Russian soldier being beheaded is not rational. But I will say it again, "war is war". Whether "you" like it or not. The mass killings of the Jews was not rational. But it just happened to be woven in Hitlers plans. "Whether we like it or not". Hitler had his reasons for his attempted genocide of the Jews. We all know these reasons. If Hitler was not so single minded in his own beliefs and was a little more open minded and used Einsteins wealth of knowledge during the beginning of the war, he could have probably nuked the whole world, especially with the strength of the Luftwaffe. But no, just because Einstein had Jewish decent, he had no use for him. The Jews and all the rest of the world should quit their damn crying and be happy that the outcome of WWII turned out the way it did. It could have been a lot worse. Everyone suffered losses during this war, but just remember who really suffered the most losses. A minimum of 25 million USSR's soldiers and civilians, and quite possibly more, were lost in battle. This does not include the millions that Stalin persecuted himself.
Link Posted: 6/19/2001 11:11:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By seamusmcoi: Come on, that's a silly question. Collectively, Jews only REALLY give a shit about themselves. Ever heard the term Goyem? Look into it, it might give you a good insight into how they feel about people not like them and how it's justified.
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I don't even want to get started!! Of course they care only about themselves. "Rowanda? No dead Jews, Bosnia? No dead Jews, on and on. But, When money is involved???.In two hundred years, they will still be extorting money(repatriations??) and killing people they took land from. All in the name of security and "Never again". Bullshit. they mean screw you we will take what we want and then throw a guilt trip on the whole world(at least where there is money to be had) about the "Holocaust" aimed at people who had nothing to do with it. his isn't directed at any individuals per se, but at organizations who make a living at trying to portray themselves as "victems". This will probably get me branded an "anti-semite" but who cares, I feel better now. [:D][:D][:D][:D][:D}[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 5:46:23 AM EDT
You'll notice its "the" holocaust, as if it was the only one that ever happened. A few years ago when the holocaust museum opened in Wash DC, some naive goya thought they were going to be able to include displays from all holocausts. No way. "It would detract from the unique experience of the Jews" was the Jewish answer. Unique experience? When millions of Russians were being exterminated by the bolsheviks, who do you think was running the bolsheviks. The Jews killed more Russian goya than the Germans did Jews. And that's the truth.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 5:57:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 6:03:05 AM EDT by Major-Murphy]
Originally Posted By Kalash: Unique experience? When millions of Russians were being exterminated by the bolsheviks, who do you think was running the bolsheviks. The Jews killed more Russian goya than the Germans did Jews. And that's the truth.
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Wait, are you actually saying that: 1) ...bolshevism was jewish plot, and therefore 2) ...the jews killed more non-jews, in Russia, more than 6 million? So, everything that the USSR did, is the fault of the jews, becasuse they made the USSR. The last time I heard this bogus stat, it was being said by a Nazi holocaust doubter. Not that you're a Nazi, or anything like that[8)].
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:03:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 6:01:41 AM EDT by Major-Murphy]
Originally Posted By HANGFIRE: Ethiopian Jewry has suffered tremendous loss of life yet American Jewry and Israel have not been very supportive.
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Nonsense, go to Isreal. There are Ethiopian Jews everywhere, all refugees, all supported by the many charities set up there for them.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:13:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:28:11 AM EDT
I was in Temple one Saturday and a muslim walked in. Want to know what happened? Our Rabbi welcomed him, we all sat and had Coffee and cake. We talked to him about his experiences in Bosnia and he was welcome to come back. I went into a Muslim mosque, I scared the guy at the door, I had a cop jacket on. After I spoke with the Inman for an hour, he thanked me. I was charged with being a racist on the job. A Inman defended me. Yet, I have meet Jews that had no time for me because I was not their kind of Jew. People are people, we love we hate. And most of all there are assholes in every group.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:29:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Major Murphy: Wait, are you actually saying that: 1) ...bolshevism was jewish plot, and therefore 2) ...the jews killed more non-jews, in Russia, more than 6 million? So, everything that the USSR did, is the fault of the jews, becasuse they made the USSR. The last time I heard this bogus stat, it was being said by a Nazi holocaust doubter. Not that you're a Nazi, or anything like that[8)].
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i think what kalash is saying that yes, most people under the USSR did infact blame the jews for the USSR, therefore, their misery. their misery included: 10 (that's a lot more than 6) million ukrainians STARVED to death between 1931 and 1933. 2.5 million deported, another 500,000 "dissappeared" 3 million sent to siberia. i didn't even mention the other MILLIONS from other countries. NEVER AGAIN to a ukrainian means something entirely different! NOT BOGUS STATS FROM HOLOCAUST DENIERS, HISTORICAL FACT! so, these people, along with others, lithuanians, etc. 1) had problems of their own at the time, 2) were being sent to the SAME CAMPS 3)most had NO IDEA AT THE TIME WHAT WAS GOING ON! afterwards, you could say that jews felt that no-one cared about them, why should they care (i'm not jewish, so i'm guessing) the Vatican said/did nothing, and the jews are VERY bitter about that. again, FACT
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:37:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 6:40:40 AM EDT by Major-Murphy]
Originally Posted By fattym4: 10 (that's a lot more than 6) million ukrainians STARVED to death between 1931 and 1933. 2.5 million deported, another 500,000 "dissappeared" 3 million sent to siberia. i didn't even mention the other MILLIONS from other countries. NOT BOGUS STATS FROM HOLOCAUST DENIERS, HISTORICAL FACT!
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...and all of this was the fault of the jews. Wow, I never realized how evil the jews were/are. Who can blame the Germans for what they did? They were just trying to save us from those evil jews.[rolleyes] All of these historical "facts" are never something that one just comes across in books, compiles, and deduces on their own. These collections of "facts", along with their conclusions always seem to be published by jew-haters. fatty, I challenge you. Show your sources.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:42:27 AM EDT
Jews supported the early communist movement in Russia. It seemed to be an escape from the excesses of the Czar. But ass Marx said each government creates its own destroyer, Thesis- antitheis. The true believers were replaced by those who exploited even worse than the Czar. Stalin was not a communist...he was out for himself.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:45:27 AM EDT
Come on guys, wake up. Israel does not have to ability to move troops or the economic resources to move troops around the globe to fight in foreign wars. They are a small country with limited resources surrounded by countries filled with people who want them all dead. They have hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees arriving from the former Soviet Union each year that they have to provide housing, schools and hopefully jobs for and all the while anti-Semitism is growing in Europe and being acted upon in the former Soviet Union. M4 Aside from the above most of these genocides you mention involve sovereign nations and most often Muslim nations or in the case of Cambodia a nation that until recently closed to western influence. The united states as a great power may be able to break international laws and take action against sovereign nations but a small regional power like Israel without air craft carriers or large ships cannot. It is hard for most of us to care for other people who would kill you at the first available chance merely because you are a Jew. THISISME
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:46:27 AM EDT
MajorMurphy, these are not MY views...these are views as told to me by people who were there. the germans lost the war because they didn't realize the ally potential in Ukraine. they were NOT there to help, they were there to exterminate EVERYONE as slavs were seen as inferior. my point was that, historically jews and ukes have been bitter enemies. each blaming the other for their problems. after the jewish holocaust, jews started blaming everyone else.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 6:54:33 AM EDT
...you heard these specific numbers and stats word of mouth? c'mon. Those stats were a compilation, not from one area. Not one person's experience. I'm not saying it's you, fatty, but check your source.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:03:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Major Murphy: All of these historical "facts" are never something that one just comes across in books, compiles, and deduces on their own. These collections of "facts", along with their conclusions always seem to be published by jew-haters. fatty, I challenge you. Show your sources.
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challenge accepted: for some depressingly accurate reading, please check out books: ukraine's forbidden history, smith, perks,smith and sheffield; 1998 ukraine, a history, subtelny; 1998 enough, fitzhenry & whiteside; 2000 the refugee experience, vsevolod,; 1992 video: (strong caution!!!) Harvest of Despair : i believe it is now available in english - in fact, start there. the reason you have never heard about it, is because the people who run the media have a vested interest in proclaiming the jewish holocaust ABOVE ALL OTHERS.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:22:41 AM EDT
it will probably take a while to read all those sources i listed, so let me continue: i don't have the answer that M4 was looking for, but i do have another question: why did the jewish-owned new york times fall for stalin's trickery when he was asked about the rumors that his collectivisation programs were starving millions - only to turn around and ask why didn't anybody do anything when jews were dissappearing???
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:25:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fattym4: the reason you have never heard about it, is because the people who run the media have a vested interest in proclaiming the jewish holocaust ABOVE ALL OTHERS.
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Ahhh yes, say no more.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:34:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 7:54:17 AM EDT by Striker]
I swore that I was never going to get into one of these "I'm not an anti-semite, but how come the Jews--" things again, and one of the reasons that I don't hang out much on the AK site was the number of that kind of crap that kept coming up, but I'm going to give it this one shot on this site, and then I'm going to ignore you "innocent question" askers. I am appalled at how many of you are still carrying the disease of hatred. Look at some of the BS posted on this thread by apparently educated people. "If there's no money in it the Jews don't care" Right. That's why 2 of the 3 boys buthered in Mississippi during the civil rights movement in the '60s were Jews. Guess they were there for the money. Oh yeah, that's also why the survivor sniffing dogs that found those still alive in the rubble after the earthquakes in India recently, were from Israel. Hell, I could go on and on, but why bother. I'm not going change the minds of any of "the Jews only care about money" idiots, because you all have known a Jew who was a money grubber; maybe even two. "Why didn't they fight the Nazis instead of going like sheep to the slaughter?" Imagine you're a young man in his late 20's, with a wife and a couple of kids, and the Nazis come to town. You're going into the streets to fight them; or join a partisan band in the woods? Like hell you are! You're going to stay with and try to protect your family; and when they herd you on the train in cattle cars, and keep you there for three or four days with little or no food, and unload you in a strange place, and tell you that you have to go to delousing showers, that's when you're going to revolt? Like hell you are! And when the "shower turns out to be a gas chamber, that's when you're going to fight? Yeah---right! So who did fight? The young men and women who had already lost their families; the ones left alive who had already discovered that the "showers" were gas chambers, the Jewish soldiers of the Polish and Russian Armies who were cut off and knew that surrendering meant death. In short, those who didn't have to worry about wives, children, aged parents, and so on. We'll never have the exact figures, because the Soviets hid the statistics on how many of their partisan groups were wholly or mainly Jewish, but from those areas where we can get figures, the Jews were a higher percentage of the partisan fighters than their percentage of the population. Example: In 1940 Jews were about 2 % of the population of Paris, France. They ended up being 20+% of the membership of the French underground in Paris. Know why the Soviets concealed the participation of Jews in their partisan bands? Because Joseph Stalin was a violent anti semite. Oh yeah, by the time the slaughters in the Ukraine happened, it was Stalin in charge and ordering it. Leon Trotsky, the one Jew in the early days of the USSR who had any power, was long since gone from Russia, and living in exile in Mexico. I could go on and on, but I've learned that the fair minded among you don't need me to, and the haters won't change your minds no matter what I say. If you want to read the story of a WWII US soldier who makes Audie Murphy look like a Cub Scout, and who didn't get the Medal of Honor because he was a Jew www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=21849 said article being written by Joe Farah, an American of Arab descent, and a damn good journalist. Oh, but that's right, the Jews didn't fight.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:34:45 AM EDT
Originally Posted By thee12nv: I have been to Israel and if you follow what happens there the arabs are blowing up civilians and have absolutely no other intentions but to eradicate the Jews. No compromise. The are still bitter they got their asses handed to them in the 6 day war... they are lucky Israel stoppd then. I could go on and on but I can see it would be a pointless argument.
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I was going to stay out of this but I can't. Terrorism is wrong, but the Arabs have no hope of keeping their land and houses so their actions do not surprise me. The Israelis regularly shoot unarmed citizens, bulldoze people's houses, and pour concrete into Arabs' wells. I HAVE SEEN THIS!!! The US media (controlled by Jews) do not report these incidents, but if you watch BBC or read foreign newspapers you can get a more unbiased view. The Israelis DO NOT want the Arabs anywhere near them, and will never allow them to be anything more than second-class citizens. Kind of interesting how they can get so abused in Germany and then do the same thing in the Middle East (while asking for sympathy from everyone else).
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:44:47 AM EDT
...wait, isn't the BBC controlled by jews, too? I thought they control everything. Isn't that why we hate them so much? Isn't that why we research and seek out info to show that they kind of deserved the holocaust. C'mon guys. Sum it all up. What's the real point, the conclusion that you're getting at. A judgement. Don't give me this "oh, I'm just airing some little reported facts" crap. What are you saying? One sentence. Jews are bad? or.. Look at the jews, they control everything from the US media to the USSR, the deserved it? Speak straight. Be a proud jew-hater. Sum it all up for us.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:47:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fattym4: challenge accepted: for some depressingly accurate reading, please check out books: ukraine's forbidden history, smith, perks,smith and sheffield; 1998 ukraine, a history, subtelny; 1998 enough, fitzhenry & whiteside; 2000 the refugee experience, vsevolod,; 1992 video: (strong caution!!!) Harvest of Despair : i believe it is now available in english - in fact, start there.
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...I thought you said that these were things that people, who were there, told you? Looks like a bibliography, to me.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:47:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By shamayim: Know why the Soviets concealed the participation of Jews in their partisan bands? Because Joseph Stalin was a violent anti semite. Oh yeah, by the time the slaughters in the Ukraine happened, it was Stalin in charge and ordering it. Leon Trotsky, the one Jew in the early days of the USSR who had any power, was long since gone from Russia, and living in exile in Mexico.
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you are correct, stalin under marx's ideology, not the jews was responsible for the uke's miseries. but try telling that to an uneducated, 1930's peasant. THAT is why i do not hate jews, THAT is why i won't ressurrect my grandparent's fight - because it was spawned by deciept, control of information, and would in my mind, propogate the VICTEMHOOD of ukrainians, which is a bad idea...hint, hint.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:58:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Major Murphy: ...I thought you said that these were things that people, who were there, told you? Looks like a bibliography, to me.
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the things i have heard first hand, were the reeasons ukes blamed jews... the sources listed spell out the numbers. if you think that jews don't control the flow of info from their "enemies" than you have been fooled, sir. again, i DON'T hate jews, i work for one, i live among them, my sister married one, in fact, i love most jews! i believe that at birth, each jew was given an extra teaspoon of intelligence and good humor. BTW, some of my "sources" include these very jews - smart enough not to let the past dictate their thoughts! wise enough to see through pride, and tell it like it is - it has been my experience that some of the most outspoken critics of jews, are themselves jewish.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 7:59:10 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:05:19 AM EDT
So many extreme points of view.. I for one see Israel as a country besieged. I don't fault them for tough tactics...they want to continue to exist. I also hate stereotyping when you allow it to influence the way you treat individuals. Individuals belonging to virtually every "sect" can be found with any trait you want.. History shows us that the foundation for Hitler's power came from the frustration of the German "nationalist" with the terms of the treaty of Versailles... the impoverished German needed someone to blame and the Jew fit the bill. A religion which visibly establishes business practices such as preferential hiring and patronage is bound to develop "victims". If you lived in pre-war Germany, you may have experienced a situation where a Jewish shop owner turned you down for a job in favor of a equally qualified Jewish worker....poof, instant anti-Semite.... I personally have experienced this practice in modern day America... my career has suffered as a result. I don't hate all Jews as a result and my future plans don't include participating in genocide, but I sure as heck can see where the foundations of hatred come from, and it's the conspicuous practice of discrimination on the part of many Jews... Perhaps if we all just thought of ourselves as members of our various "nations" and stopped all the discrimination based on religion (especially the Jews who are VERY guilty), this whole thing would go away...
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:07:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fattym4: the things i have heard first hand, were the reeasons ukes blamed jews... the sources listed spell out the numbers. .
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Boy, this is like pulling teeth. Do you, personally sit around researching and crunching numbers, to back up the uke's hatred of the jews? Or were these numbers, and this bibliography, compiled for you. Please just show it. Is it David Duke's web-site?
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:11:41 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Major Murphy:
Originally Posted By fattym4: the things i have heard first hand, were the reeasons ukes blamed jews... the sources listed spell out the numbers. .
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Boy, this is like pulling teeth. Do you, personally sit around researching and crunching numbers, to back up the uke's hatred of the jews? Or were these numbers, and this bibliography, compiled for you. Please just show it. Is it David Duke's web-site?
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what is YOUR point?? i think you were too busy typing to read my last 2 posts (above striker's) please read them, and tell me if you still have a point!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:14:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/20/2001 8:17:10 AM EDT by Major-Murphy]
read them. Same question. Do you, personally sit around researching and crunching numbers, to back up the uke's hatred of the jews? Or were these numbers, and this bibliography, compiled for you. If so, by whom? (by the way, I'm like everyone else. I have predjudices and hatreds. Especially when driving. I know that all too often, groups support and back-up the stereotypes of themselves. Blacks do it, jews do it, gun owners do it. But statistics are usually supplied by an organization.)
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:20:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Major Murphy: read them. Same question. Do you, personally sit around researching and crunching numbers, to back up the uke's hatred of the jews? Or were these numbers, and this bibliography, compiled for you. If so, by whom?
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this information was what YOU asked for! i gave it to you! most opinions that i expressed were from my relatives. again, i REJECT their views, and prefer to form my own opinions. if you want to call my parents racist, be my guest, but know this: my mother's family risked their LIVES to hide jews during the war. my father (god rest his soul) was a boy, but his parents may have harbored some animosity towards jews - these were my bedtime stories: starvation, brutallity, a world war or two, three depressions and somehow I CAME OUT OF IT WITHOUT HATING JEWS!!!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:24:23 AM EDT
this is incredible! sixty years on and the SAME crapola is being churned in the mill. jews did this - jews did that - why don't the jews... m4 and fatty m4, and the other jew haters why don't you just print a new copy of "the protocols of zion" and run thru the streets with proof of a world wide jew conspiracy! fact: when germany was in world war one and der undermenchen were within the ranks of the imperial german army - germany was never invaded, she only surrendered. because the secretary of state was jewish and started the talks that began the treaty of versilles (under behest of the kaiser) ludendorf (?) used this oppportunity to blame the jews as 'back stabers'. fact: aside from all the other incredibly stupid blunders commited by hitler the SINGLE most important reason he lost the war was the persecution of the jews. (it was oppenhiemer not einstein who developed the bomb by the way guys) - he lost so much intelligence 'core' of the society his defeat was stamped the day he did that. her borders were invaded and germany crushed to rubble. millions of german women were raped by the invading russians. a question coming from this could be "since german women as a society have been raped more than any other - why don't they go around the world to stop rape? why did they not do anything when the serbs were raping muslim women IN MASS only a few hundred miles away?" or an equally stupid question could be "i met a german woman once, and accross town, there was a rape and she did or said nothing -DIRTY GERMAN WOMEN!!" or i met an affluent german woman and there was a rape in fiji and she didn't send any money "CHEAP DIRTY GERMAN WOMEN!" or "i got pulled over by a cop who was a german woman. my sister was raped once and she cut me no slack. HEARTLESS CHEAP DIRTY GERMAN WOMEN!" do you see how f*ing stupind your arguements are? how pointless? how racist? sorry to tell you, but you ought to give it up guys - you only make yourself look bad..... steve
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:24:55 AM EDT
MM, let me explain what your questions sound like to me by drawing an analogy: you tell me that X number of american's died on the beaches of normandy. i demand you list sources, you provide them. i say, these figures didn't come out of thin air, there must be some hate-group behind them. sounds pretty stupid doesn't it??? its called HISTORICAL FACT: numbers and figures and dates and places - FACT = proven.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:31:53 AM EDT
stevem, YOU are the problem in this world! i have explained three times in this thread that i don't hate jews, did you hear or beleive me? no. did you label me like child? YES. debate, my friend, is the cornerstone of a free society. NOBODY should have to be afraid to speek-up for fear of being labelled. that is the PC world view, and YOU are carrying that flag!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:36:32 AM EDT
fattym4 - my deepest apologies - i see a bloody hatchet in your hand, hate in your eyes and a decapitated body at your feet. sorry - must of been o.j. you are obviuosly an angel of peace i'm sorry steve
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:42:27 AM EDT
oh but wait - i forgot the BEST part - i was born jewish! there it is man - right there. i am part of a greater conspiracy. I WROTE the protocols myself. you are right, i see the light now. I AM THE PROBLEM IN THIS WORLD! now i know what's wrong with me. god, and all this time i thought it was my choice of deoderant. fatty - seriously - if you really claim not to hate the jews - how can you champion the words of the 'haters'? you are right debate is what makes free speech so awesome. we are very lucky here in the u.s. honestly - what is it that you are trying to prove or emote by your information? what picture are you trying to paint? is it a picture of tolerance and understanding - or is it one of polarization and distrust of a people? ask you heart and ask your god. steve
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:45:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By steve m: fattym4 - my deepest apologies - i see a bloody hatchet in your hand, hate in your eyes and a decapitated body at your feet. sorry - must of been o.j. you are obviuosly an angel of peace i'm sorry steve
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that sounds all pretty, but if you have a SPECIFIC reason you feel this way, i'd love to hear it... or are you in PC boat of "casting labels is easier than tackling the real issues" ??? -walt, gentleman at peace, unthinkable bastard at war!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 8:58:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By steve m: oh but wait - i forgot the BEST part - i was born jewish! there it is man - right there. i am part of a greater conspiracy. I WROTE the protocols myself. you are right, i see the light now. I AM THE PROBLEM IN THIS WORLD! now i know what's wrong with me. god, and all this time i thought it was my choice of deoderant. fatty - seriously - if you really claim not to hate the jews - how can you champion the words of the 'haters'? you are right debate is what makes free speech so awesome. we are very lucky here in the u.s. honestly - what is it that you are trying to prove or emote by your information? what picture are you trying to paint? is it a picture of tolerance and understanding - or is it one of polarization and distrust of a people? ask you heart and ask your god. steve
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my original point was not to answer M4, but to raise some questions that I would like answered. my attempt to prove that this was NOT a hate-based perspective, obviously failed. like MajorMurphy said, there are those in EVERY group that are guilty of something, and i tried to see if he was right...ARE THERE, IN THE MEDIA, THOSE WHO WOULD REPRESS SOME INFO, WHILE STATING, AND RESTATING, AD-NAUSIUM, THEIR PERSPECTIVE??????? my heart and my god tell me to hate only hatred, and to question EVERYTHING else, thank you.
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:03:00 AM EDT
Fatty, this is debate. If you worked with me, and acted that way.....you would be out the door. Here is a different story. I can respect your beliefs but admit that you are an anti-semitic. I would rather look a snake in the eyes then a coward. By the way Steve, remember that when the PC no balls President carter, left our people in Tehran, it was the Israelis that offered any thing we needed. Remember they rescued their hostages at Entebbe. carter is a great humitarian, let him build houses, They were afraid of President Reagan....he carried two six guns!
Link Posted: 6/20/2001 9:09:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By TheWind: Fatty, this is debate. If you worked with me, and acted that way.....you would be out the door. Here is a different story. I can respect your beliefs but admit that you are an anti-semitic. I would rather look a snake in the eyes then a coward. By the way Steve, remember that when the PC no balls President carter, left our people in Tehran, it was the Israelis that offered any thing we needed. Remember they rescued their hostages at Entebbe. carter is a great humitarian, let him build houses, They were afraid of President Reagan....he carried two six guns!
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coward? look around, i am the only one talking, when i know there are those who can ask the same questions as i, but are afraid of being called an anti-semite. BTW, i am still waiting for SPECIFIC reasins that i am a racist from stevem, and now you.
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