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6/21/2017 8:25:40 PM
Posted: 6/10/2001 11:25:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/11/2001 3:02:09 PM EDT by HANGFIRE]
"OUR FATHER WHO ART IN HEAVEN..." 1000hrs. 09JUNE2001 Hernando Sportsmans Club Practical/Tactical Rifle Match. Our group was on the 200yd. range and my name was called as first shooter. I staged my rifle on the table, my mags on the chair halfway between the table and the starting square, and waited for the timer to signal go. The timer signaled go and I "ran" to pick up my mags and then "ran" to the rifle. I loaded the rifle pulled the charging handle and dropped to one knee found the first target and pulled the trigger, nothing happened. I looked at the bolt and saw that it was not fully closed. I banged on the assist with the heel of my hand and the bolt didn't move. I dropped the mag, cleared the rifle, inserted another mag, pulled and released the charging handle, and the bolt did not close. I banged on the assist for all I was worth then the RO said to clear my rifle. A fellow competitor and I went to the back of his van and broke my rifle down, pulled out the boltand checked the barrel. Pitch black, no light, no tunnel. We took a GI cleaning rod and tapped out a .223 bullet. The bullet had somehow seperated from the case as I cleared the rifle at our last shoot. The timer the scorekeeper and I were blessed. I was able to shoot the 200 stage and the rifle was singing. On stage 2 I had shot the ipsc paper targets and the bowling pins when I changed mags and found the bolt no closing again. This time I dropped the mag and broke the rifle down and pulled the bolt out to view the chamber. I had a case stuck in the chamber. I called it quits for the day.
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 11:34:49 AM EDT
bad ammo?
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 11:37:39 AM EDT
I had a very similar thing happen to me with my Glock 17. I had just began reloading and I have only had two bad rounds out of the thousands I have reloaded. Even to this day, Im not sure if the round was mine because I had got some other reloads from a friend of mine the previous time we went out and I had just dumped the extras in my box, so its possible that it wasn't my fault. If it matters, the other bad round that I know was mine was a backwards primer. Anyways, to the meat of the story. I was shooting an IDPA match and was in the middle of a string when I had a malfunction. I did a quick tap-rack-bang, but it didn't go bang. The trigger would not engage. About that time I heard other people telling me to stop. In the heat of the moment I had not noticed a difference in the sound of my shots but the other shooters had. I removed the magazine and ejected the live round and quickly took the slide off and barrel out right there on the line and saw only darkness in the barrel. Apparently there was a squib that had disloged the bullet just enough to get it out of the case and was just far back enough to not let another round chamber, which is why the trigger wouldn't engage after I cleared the initial malfunction. The bystanders had started yelling at me immediately, but I had cleared the malf and resumed shooting so fast (plus the adrenaline) I had not heard them. Its a good thing it wouldnt go into battery or I would have blown that gun up and maybe my hand with it. Somebody was looking out for me that day. Michael
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 11:41:39 AM EDT
Somebody was looking out for me that day.
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You're welcome [beer]
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 11:51:51 AM EDT
Out of the thousands I've reloaded one was bad.Or at least danderous.I was shooting my Star PD.200gr H&G 68 and 231 powder.It had just enough powder to cycle the slide,but the bullet was sticking out the end of the barrel.I had just finnished shooting plates.My last mag full was for the 100 yard gong.I shot and was going to shoot agian but something didnt feel right.The guy standing and watchin says if your going to shoot agian wait until I leave.then told me about the bullet.
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 12:16:44 PM EDT
I was standing about 10 feet away from my brother one afternoon when he fired a powderless reload in his M1 carbine. The bullet lodged about halfway up the barrel. He racked the slide and fired another round off. The side of the barrel and the stock blew out. Lucky SOB....I don't even think he got any splinters in him.
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 12:24:22 PM EDT
A "squib" is a round with no charge or a small charge/defective charge that won't drive the bullet out of the barrel. It's dangerous because the gun WILL chamber a round. What you had sounds like the bullet pulled loose from the brass. That's annoying, but it's not a squib. I had a 44 mag. load yesterday squib on me. No powder in the case. Primer drives the bullet about an inch into the barrel. Then you need to find something to tap it out -- something that wont dig into the side of your bore.
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 12:38:54 PM EDT
I had a squib with my Makarov a few months ago. I was shooting it for the first time and had gone though almost all of my Fiocchi ammo, about it pack it in for the day. On the last magazine, one round the gun clicked, but no report. I cleared the cartridge and loaded the next round and fired. BOOM! The gun all of a sudden had the recoil of a .44 magnum. First thing I thought was "Wow, crappy ammo. First a dud and then a hot round. Serious QC problems." Then I thought, "Oh SHIT! WHERE'S THAT CARTRIDGE I HAND EJECTED?" Looked around and found a case 9x18mm with powder in it, and quickly figured out I cleared the bullet with another bullet. I shot one more round out of it and packed it in. i haven't shot the Mak since, and I haven't gotten around to having a gunsmith examine it.
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 1:41:23 PM EDT
I had a squib with my first handgun, a 6" Colt Python. I had handloaded some .38 Special with a minimum charge, and was working on mastering the DA pull in rapid fire. I dumped a fresh speedloader in and started burning rounds into the target. I noticed my first 3 shots missed the paper, but I couldn't understand why, all my previous shots had been in the black. I figured my sight setting had changed, so I unloaded the weapon and examined it all around. No light could be seen through the barrel, my first round was a squib, I had 3 stuck in the (now slightly bulged) barrel. Scratch one Python barrel. [>(]
Link Posted: 6/10/2001 3:02:48 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 12:53:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raf: (2) Heavy crimp used, just like in military rounds. It's there for other reasons, but the crimp helped save me. And just maybe other things, too...
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Still sounds like a bad primer. A good primer WILL push a heavy CRIMPED bullet into the bore about 2"
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 1:54:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 1:56:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 2:09:52 PM EDT
Hangfire: Was that ammo you were using any particular or specific brand that we should all be made aware of? Or was it self loaded and if so, what in the heck happened? Glad to hear everyone came through without a scratch.
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 3:01:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/11/2001 3:00:06 PM EDT by HANGFIRE]
Originally Posted By Bowser: Hangfire: Was that ammo you were using any particular or specific brand that we should all be made aware of? Or was it self loaded and if so, what in the heck happened? Glad to hear everyone came through without a scratch.
View Quote
So. African 85/13 We think that the bullet was left in the forward part of the chamber when I cleared the rifle at our last match. I did not clean the rifle, LIKE I SHOULD HAVE DONE[V] The case not ejecting was a result of my picking up the rounds that did not chamber and reloading them in another mag.[V] The jamming of the cartridges against the "squib" caused them to seat further into the case causing a higher pressure to be generated. I have used this ammo for a couple of years and never had any problems.
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 3:01:50 PM EDT
I've encountered two myself (not too bad since I've been reloading since 1965), and I've seen a few others. My first "squib" load happened about 20 years ago when I was shooting silhouettes with a .44 Magnum revolver. I was shooting at the rams, and I fired a shot, and there was very little noise and no recoil. I stopped immediately and opened the cylinder. The primer had gone off, and driven the bullet and the powder charge (21 grains of 2400) into the barrel, and completely clear of the cylinder. The cylinder would open, so it would also have revolved to fire the next round, which would have been disastrous. When I opened the cylinder, I could see the powder packed into the forcing cone, and packed tightly together. What a pipe-bomb! The primer was definietly not at fault. All the other loads from that box had fired normally, so I don't really suspect the powder. I had stored that ammunition in my garage for several years, and it was subject to some temperature cycles and extremes. I attribute the problem to that. Moral: Even if you have safe and dependable ammunition, improper storage makes that suspect. Either store it in good conditions, or consider it suspect! My second problem (also many years ago) came with a 6mm Remington caliber Remington 700 rifle. I had been working up some handloads, and I had read that you get the best accuracy when the bullet just engages the rifling. Well, that seemed to be true. I had ended up with a load with the 100 grain bullet seated out to the point where I could just feel the bullet against the rifling as I closed the bolt. Accuracy was great, and I thought I had a good load. Then, fortunately, the range officer called a cease fire just after I had loaded a round and was preparing to fire. I opened the bolt and extracted the round. To my surprise, the case came out, spilling powder into the action. The bullet was nowhere to be seen! A quick look down the barrel confirmed that the bullet was stuck in the rifling, and had pulled out from the case. That incident wasn't dangerous on the range, since I wouldn't have been able to chamber another round without noticing the bullet stuck in the chamber. It could have been embarrasing, at the least, if it had happened on a hunting trip with no cleaning rod handy, or in other even more critical circumstances. Moral: When you think you have a good load worked up, try cycling them through the action INCLUDING EJECTING UNFIRED ROUNDS. I just approached the 3500 character limit, so I will continue this in another post. Until then, BE SAFE! GunLaw
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 3:13:18 PM EDT
As threatened above, this is a continuation of my sad stories about squib loads. Along that same line as above, I have discovered problems with .45 ACP loads which chamber and fire perfectly, but which are too long to eject from my Colt Gold Cup when I stop without firing the round. The loads are short enough to fit in the magazine, and are within specs for the cartridge, but they jam in the slide opening when I try to eject an unfired round. One more reason to try ALL reload combinations by cycling them through the action, INCLUDING EJECTING UNFIRED ROUNDS. On a previous post regarding a squib load, I have seen several pistols (and one revolver) that had ringed barrels from a squib load, followed by the shooter attempting to shoot another round. Most of these are visible on a casual look down the barrel. I just recently encountered one that wasn't immediately visible. A friend loaned me a Colt 1911 .45 ACP to try in an IDPA match. I did a quick visual inspection, tested the pistol at the range, then fired one IDPA match with it. The gun was very accurate, and functioned flawlessly! After the IDPA match, I cleaned the gun, and I noticed that the patch seemed to move a little bit more freely at a point about two inches in front of the chamber mouth. On careful inspection with a magnifier, I could see a slight ring in the barrel at that point. Again, this ring wasn't visible on a casual inspection, and the pistol shot flawlessly. I replaced the barrel, and there were no other problems. My friend had encountered a squib load (one of his, not mine) in his target loads, and had fired another round, ringing the barrel. He didn't even notice it at the time. His load was 4.0 grains of Bullseye, by the way. Moral: Pay attention to what you are seeing (or not seeing) when you clean your gun. If you suspect a squib load, or anything unusual when you are shooting, do a careful examination of the gun. That should include inspecting the barrel with a magnifier, and running an oiled patch down the cleaned barrel and paying attention to any "loose spots" which indicate a ringed barrel. You can often feel it before you can see it. BE SAFE! GunLaw.
Link Posted: 6/11/2001 6:30:44 PM EDT
I had a similar experience with one of my reloads. I don't reload for my semi autos any more. I can very close to blowing up my rifle. The only thing that saved me was that the following round would not chamber completely. Its economical to reload until you blow up your rifle. I will start again if cheap factory ammo dries up.
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