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3/20/2017 5:03:23 PM
Posted: 5/10/2001 1:41:50 PM EDT
Hey all, What do you think about Smart Guns? And before I get flamed, I will say that no one should be forced to buy technology that they don't need or want to use. But in a non-political atmosphere, I could see situations where I might buy a smart gun, loosely defined as a gun that only I or my wife could fire without tampering: [list] [*]My sister visits often with her children, who are good kids, but can be curious.[/*] [*]I would like to keep a gun hidden in the family room, where we spend most of our time, instead of far away in the bedroom.[/*] [*]I would like to keep a gun in the car.[/*] [/list] Of course, any smart gun could be eventually defeated, just as any one can eventually break locks, gun safes, etc. The additional safety built into a smart gun should not replace the more traditional gun safety rules we are familiar with. Politically, we should absolutely oppose any smart gun [b]mandate[/b], but it might be useful to see if a practical and reliable smart gun could actually be developed. Any ideas?
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 1:48:35 PM EDT
Here's the unfortunate part; once the technology is perfected, the industry may have to start putting them in new guns, whether they want to or not. Its less a matter of legislation than litigation. Once its perfected, gun companies could be held liable for not including it in newly manufacturwed guns under theories of products liability.
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 2:11:28 PM EDT
Is there such a thing as a "Smart" gun? I thought there were only stupid people who would need these. I guess a Police Department might want these, to keep their officers safe in gun take away situations. Certainly, all the criminals will be sure to only steal/buy "Smart" guns.
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 2:20:28 PM EDT
Smart Guns = Dumb Idea Most of the "smartgun" ideas I have been seeing usually involve batteries - which are prone to failure. Of course, the workaround for htis is to have the smartlock release if the batteries go flat, leading into more questions... What kind of battery life can we expect? What warning do we get when the battery goes flat? How much are replacement batteries? Moreover - What is the "key?" Will it be essentially biometric, or will it be the electronic/magnetic/radio "ring" most often mentioned? Will the firearm be keyed to only one user, or will my wife be able to use my sidearm? Will I be able to add additional users if necessary, or will I have to send it in to the factory for reprogramming? How can an unauthorised user put it to work in an emergency? How much time is required for the lock to release? What do you do to clear the lock in a malfunction? What is the reliability of the lock in the first place? When it comes to these so-called "smart" guns, I see a lot of intelligent questions and no smart answers. If we have to have any sort of smartgun, I would rather it be something that allows a user interface to the firaerm for aiming purposes... FFZ
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 2:30:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 2:35:39 PM EDT
just a little info on so called (smart gun technology) STAY AWAY FROM IT!!! if you had to use this rifle to defend yourself against a government force of some nation, with the way world politics are? Anyway my point is these weapons will be easily disabled by an electro magnetic burst bomb. all the government has to do to do is set one off in your area and kiss your smart gun electronics good bye!!!! government agencies will love this stuff being sold to the masses
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 2:38:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2001 2:39:21 PM EDT by Wadman]
I think that the implementation of "smart gun" technology that involves some type of chip being near the gun to "activate" it as a wonderful thing for criminals. Just think of the criminal/electronics whiz who engineers a device to spoof it. He could deactivate all "smart" guns within, say, a two block radius. Anyway..... Your car is a terrible place to store firearms. Didn't we just have a thread discussing gunsafes? I was personally moved to get one after chilling stories about thefts on the FAL Files forum. A couple of LEO forum members added their stories of tactical guys either having their cars broken into or having the whole car taken. Imagine all the goodies badguys could get (vests, clothing, selectfire weapons, etc). Even if your weapon were somehow rendered safe in your car, would you still want to lose it?
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 2:51:38 PM EDT
the new remington 700 with the electronics and new cartridges i believe are the wave of the future and if this is what you have and the kimshee hits the fan your done!
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 3:05:25 PM EDT
hhhrmmmmmm ..........computers in guns why not, mine NEVER crashes. i dont think computers crash ever anymore. and if they did what could be at stake? your life? well thats not much of a big deal (dripping with sarcasam)
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 3:08:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By preacher: just a little info on so called (smart gun technology) STAY AWAY FROM IT!!! if you had to use this rifle to defend yourself against a government force of some nation, with the way world politics are? Anyway my point is these weapons will be easily disabled by an electro magnetic burst bomb. all the government has to do to do is set one off in your area and kiss your smart gun electronics good bye!!!! government agencies will love this stuff being sold to the masses
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unfortunatly that makes sense. i allways see shows about ABC agencys trying to make EMP weapon. preacher may need a tin foil cap, but that all could happen.
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 3:09:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By preacher: Anyway my point is these weapons will be easily disabled by an electro magnetic burst bomb.
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During the Gulf War Iraq bought many electronic weapons from foreign countries, and it just took a few computer commands to disable them. With the new electronics technology, the BATF could disable your gun from a central computer, or find it for you if it got stolen. Of course crooks are not stupid, they will find a way to disable it. Look at our new impossible to forge Calif. drivers licenses. I have heard from news reports that forged ones were beginning to appear a month after they were intoduced.
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 5:27:39 PM EDT
heres why a "smart gum is a moronic gun Guy starts to attack u u pull gun "click click" "WHYY WONT IT WORK" "ahhhhh" your dead the end rule of machinery more u add more chances to go wrong
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 6:28:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2001 6:28:54 PM EDT by erickm]
Originally Posted By preacher: these weapons will be easily disabled by an electro magnetic burst bomb. all the government has to do to do is set one off in your area
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Hah! they wouldn't even have to do that, I guarantee you when this stuff comes out it'll have remote disable built into it. "Central...this is codename lard-a..uh..hardhat, I need a a weapons disable for the city block of.."
Link Posted: 5/10/2001 9:39:33 PM EDT
"Smart Guns"? Guns are neither smart, nor dumb. They are inanimate objects. They do the bidding of whoever holds them. The only thing they do is expel a projectile when the trigger is pulled. That is neither "smart", or "dumb", it just "is" The person pulling the trigger may be smart, dumb, good, evil, clueless, but it's not the gun's fault for what happens. Personal Accountability. No lame excuses. Like, I didn't know it was loaded Or, I didn't mean for that to happen Or, That didn't happen on TV Or, Well, it just went off Or, I didn't know the kids would find it interesting when I left if loaded laying on the kitchen table Etc, etc, etc. Personal Responsibility Whatever happened to that concept? I guess, it isn't PC So, it has to be the gun's fault The gun needs education It needs to got to college It needs to "get smart" Damn, it's so obvious Why didn't we think of that? Lets all hold hands and sing kumbalaya or lets do the macarana or whatever that lame PC slogan is No, I have a better idea. Let's all bag work tomorrow and go to the range!
Link Posted: 5/11/2001 1:02:43 AM EDT
"F" smart guns! Bad idea. Soon after introduction they would pass a law saying your "old dumb guns" has to be retrofitted with this crap.
Link Posted: 5/11/2001 5:07:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/11/2001 5:11:36 AM EDT by Admiral_Crunch]
I don't think that's likely. You can't just pop the smart device on like a new grip for your pistol. I'd love to see them spend boatloads of cash trying to design a smart chip and mechanical parts for my Krag that won't affect its collectors value (impossible). Banning or restricting future non-smart sales is more likely, which is just as bad. Imagine $3000 for a NIB dumb Glock/Sig/Beretta? [puke] Of course, if they REALLY could design one that met all of the following requirements, and would not prompt legislation against dumb guns, I'd be more for it. 1. Requires no extra time to ready (or maybe just a half-second or so). 2. Cannot be fooled into not firing by an external device the intruder/gubmint might have. 3. Cannot be fooled into firing for an unauthorized user. 4. Will change to a dumb gun if it loses power, but not if an unauthorized user cuts the power. 5. Is not noticibly heavier or larger than a comparable dumb gun. 6. Does not cost significantly more. 7. Is capable of being programmed for multiple authorized users. 8. Will function repeatedly with no less accuracy or reliability than its dumb counterpart. How about this: a USB plug under the handguard that'll let you plug a computer into it and allow you to adjust preferences and features (or disable the gun completely for storage or disable smart features and make it permanantly dumb). Just a thought. (edited because I can't spell)
Link Posted: 5/11/2001 7:21:06 AM EDT
Some interesting replies here... shaggy, you are probably (and unfortunately) correct in saying that in our litigious society, the dumb gun mfrs would quickly get sued for not including smart gun technology. There are plenty of precedents in the auto industry's operations. Freefire Zone, you raised a list of very good questions, many of which I have thought of as well. My counter question - if such a gun could be devised which would answer your questions to YOUR satisfaction, would you consider buying such a gun? A number of people brought up the issue of smart guns being for stupid people. That is like saying that cars are equipped with locks and keys because their owners are stupid. I am [b]extremely[/b] careful with my guns and all my property, but would also welcome some additional safeguards and options. I have no illusions about a determined criminal being able to penetrate through any smart gun defenses, or through my car's door and ignition system. But I still like the idea of having a simple, reliable and easy to use security system that is completely within my control. I liked Admiral Crunch's ideas above. I think that the end user of any smart gun should be able to quickly disable the security features completely and change the gun to a dumb gun, where any EMP or electronic interference would not affect it. This would not be that difficult to test.
Link Posted: 5/11/2001 9:53:33 AM EDT
i want a smart gun like the ones in the Alien movies and the shadowrun rog with the cybernetic uplink [:)]
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