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4/25/2017 7:42:44 PM
Posted: 5/6/2001 3:18:59 PM EDT
Heya, new to the forum, but anyways, I'm looking for a AR-15 in texas. Now, the only problem is that I don't know much about the gun. I've shot them before and my friends own some, so I'm not a total stranger, but as to pre and post ban specifications, I have no clue. I'm guessing the post-bans have smaller cap mags and such, but I'm not totally sure. Anyways, what should I look for when shopping for a nice used or new rifle? I'm just gonna be plinking with the gun so I'd like to have something accurate, easy to take care of with the possibility of being able to do a fast take down? I'm not looking to spend a whole lot, probably around a grand or so. anyways, thanks alot and the website looks good! Chris
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:26:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:27:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/6/2001 3:27:01 PM EDT by Juggernaut]
First off, welcome! Secondly, the diff between pre and post is minimal for most people, unless you're taking it to war, skip the preban for the first gun. Your post ban cannot have more than one evil features besides the detachable magazine(both pre and post bans can use any capacity mag you want, BTW). Your post ban can't have a telescoping stock, flash hider, threaded barrel, bayonet mount/stud, if you get a normal config post ban with a pistol grip and detacheable mag. Your best bet for a great postban setup under a thousand is Bushmaster. Mil-spec all round, and well made, you can score one for under $700. Spend the rest on mags and ammo. Almost any of their configs will do, but most people prefer the 16 bbl for an all around gun. they have a new lightweight barrel out now, too. Any BM should serve you well, out of the box. Other members will, I'm sure, have things to add, but this is my take. Enjoy! Juggernaut
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:30:38 PM EDT
That is why you are here asking the questions. Post-ban cannot have a flash surpressor,supressor telescoping stock or bayonet lug. All AR/M16 take the same magazines. I recommend bushmaster as I am biased [:)]however; many companies produce quality AR's. You should be able to have a nice setup if you are willing to go post-ban for under a grand. Good luck, im sure you will get many other helpful pointers. Welcome to the board, lots of good info available.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:31:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:36:55 PM EDT
Be sure when buying hi-cap mags, that they are PRE-ban. Only use USGI or thermold or ordlite.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:39:04 PM EDT
3 reasons to get a pre-ban that have not been mentioned: 1. You can buy any upper with a barrel length of 16" or more and use it--you don't have to worry about the muzzlebreak being permanantly attached, etc. 2. The ATF considers Supressors (Silencers) to be flash hiders, so if you ever want to put one on an AR, it has to be a pre-ban. 3. If you want to pay the $200 tax and make a Short Barrel Rifle (less than 16"), you need to have a pre-ban receiver to use a flash hider on it. AFARR
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:43:55 PM EDT
Great, thank you all for the replies. Does bushmaster have a website? I did kind of like the idea of the flash hider and telescoping stock, just because it made the rifle more compact. Well! I think I'll start looking in earnest soon. Maybe I should browse the classified forum. :) Also, if anyone has any words on the AK series of guns I'd be happy to hear those, but by far those are a second choice.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 3:51:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AFARR: 3 reasons to get a pre-ban that have not been mentioned: 1. You can buy any upper with a barrel length of 16" or more and use it--you don't have to worry about the muzzlebreak being permanantly attached, etc. 2. The ATF considers Supressors (Silencers) to be flash hiders, so if you ever want to put one on an AR, it has to be a pre-ban. 3. If you want to pay the $200 tax and make a Short Barrel Rifle (less than 16"), you need to have a pre-ban receiver to use a flash hider on it. AFARR
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Silencers are illegal and you can NOT put them on an AR15 whether it is pre-ban or post-ban. Warning: if you buy a pre-ban (built before 1994) stripped AR15 receiver today and assemble an AR15 in a pre-ban configuration, that weapon would be ILLEGAL !! by doing so, you have just built an illegal Assault Weapon after the 1994 Federal Ban. It needs to have been in a pre-ban configuration when the law took effect in 1994.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 4:00:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Mr-Spain: Great, thank you all for the replies. Does bushmaster have a website? I did kind of like the idea of the flash hider and telescoping stock, just because it made the rifle more compact. Well! I think I'll start looking in earnest soon. Maybe I should browse the classified forum. :) Also, if anyone has any words on the AK series of guns I'd be happy to hear those, but by far those are a second choice.
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Yes, they do.[url]www.bushmaster.com[/url]. Be forewarned, though, that you can't build a preban on any reciever you buy from them, because they're all postban. Also, the preban gun is going to eat up all $1000+ of your money, no mags, no ammo. FYI, you can have a Telestock legally fixed in any position, or buy an ASA short stock(short as a collapsed telestock). that way could still get a postban. also, the flash hider, while somewhat useful, may not be worth the extra $300-$500 bucks, especially since the Wilson Combat muzzle brakes do a pretty darn good job of hiding flash, and are post ban legal. Just a thought.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 4:20:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Juggernaut:
Originally Posted By Mr-Spain: Great, thank you all for the replies. Does bushmaster have a website? I did kind of like the idea of the flash hider and telescoping stock, just because it made the rifle more compact. Well! I think I'll start looking in earnest soon. Maybe I should browse the classified forum. :) Also, if anyone has any words on the AK series of guns I'd be happy to hear those, but by far those are a second choice.
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Yes, they do.[url]www.bushmaster.com[/url]. Be forewarned, though, that you can't build a preban on any reciever you buy from them, because they're all postban. Also, the preban gun is going to eat up all $1000+ of your money, no mags, no ammo. FYI, you can have a Telestock legally fixed in any position, or buy an ASA short stock(short as a collapsed telestock). that way could still get a postban. also, the flash hider, while somewhat useful, may not be worth the extra $300-$500 bucks, especially since the Wilson Combat muzzle brakes do a pretty darn good job of hiding flash, and are post ban legal. Just a thought.
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It doesnt matter if Bushmaster sells pre-ban stripped receivers. If you assemble an AR15 after 1994 it HAS to be in a post-ban configuration.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 4:20:53 PM EDT
That sounds good, the flash hider isn't that big of a deal. I was looking at thier site, but they didn't have any prices mention, except for the kits...I guess you can't order the entire rifle over the net :D and you have to build it around the reciever. Hmmmm.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 5:20:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Bush Hamster:
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It doesnt matter if Bushmaster sells pre-ban stripped receivers. If you assemble an AR15 after 1994 it HAS to be in a post-ban configuration.
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Also true. There's no way he can either buy a preban rifle direct from Bushmaster. He also can't assemble any prebans, except on a lower that was in preban config(two evil features) before the ban. If you find one of these, it'll cost you around $1000 dollars for the lower alone, then $550-650 for the cost of the kit to build it on the preban lower. Is it worth it, just to build a preban Bushmaster? Maybe for some people who have serious deneiro to burn, but not me. Now, do our interpretations match up, Bush Hampster? I should have been clearer at first. Juggernaut
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 5:36:13 PM EDT
The Bushmaster website is a good place to go to see what they have to offer but you will need to go through a regular dealer to buy one. I have a Bushmaster A2ES that I am very happy with using USGI magazines. I paid $815.00 for mine and you might be able to do better than that.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 5:38:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 6:30:00 PM EDT
You can order this on the web: [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/announcement.html?id=16#lastPost[/url]
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 7:24:34 PM EDT
if you are looking into a used one pull the back pin remove the bolt and look at the throat of the barel they get chewed up. there are a lot of good deals in here you just have to take the time and look at the posts. you can get one for around 650
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 7:53:42 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 8:21:33 PM EDT
The rifle from calvary arms looks very appealing, actually. not bad, and for about that grand I can get a scope with the better looking handle on it. Not bad at all. I do appreciate all of the responses though...I'm in the DFW area but I'll be moving back down to Houston in may, and there's sure to be a gun show at the George R. Brown or somesuch soon. So! hopefully I'll get in to the group buy before it closes. :-) maybe I can find a smith that would pull the psuedo flash-supressor and put a legal muzzle brake on it for cheap.
Link Posted: 5/6/2001 10:20:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Juggernaut:
Originally Posted By Bush Hamster:
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It doesnt matter if Bushmaster sells pre-ban stripped receivers. If you assemble an AR15 after 1994 it HAS to be in a post-ban configuration.
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....Now, do our interpretations match up, Bush Hampster? I should have been clearer at first. Juggernaut
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Didnt want him to get the idea that he can just simply buy a pre-ban stripped lower receiver, assemble a kit-gun with evil features and think its legal.
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 3:35:10 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 8:14:21 AM EDT
Mr-Spain welcome to the board. If you got only $1,000.00 to spend then get the post ban rifle. It will shoot like any other AR (pre or post ban). But if you are into collecting as well as to shoot it (and have the money), then get the Pre-Ban. It has the features that no Post-Ban ARs will ever have.
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 8:46:45 AM EDT
Get the AR15.com Limited Edition as a first rifle. Later you can get different tops for it. Anyone willing to sell me a Limited Edition? [:D]
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 12:47:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/7/2001 12:46:26 PM EDT by CPL_Punishment]
Originally Posted By Garand Shooter: Gee, all those guys who paid the ATF $200 and had one transferred to them with paperwork must not know whats going on then. Check the laws before you go giving advice, suppressors ("silencers") are regulated under the NFA but are legal for individuals in many states, including Texas if I am not mistaken, to own and use.
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...My bad. "Forgive my ignorance" as most everything here in Kalifornia is illegal. However, you still can NOT put a suppressor on a weapon assembled from stripped pre-ban lower if it wasnt originally built with all the evil features before the AW ban of 1994. ---BH
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 1:44:01 PM EDT
Welcome to our site Mr-Spain! Looks like you had already gotten a bunch of info. regarding your questions. FYI, the reason why Jug knows so much about weapons is because he spends all his time here while getting all F's in his online classes. j/k [:D] Nice to have you here! -RoadDog
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 2:22:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 2:52:36 PM EDT
NFA Notes on Suppressors and Flashhiders... Any Suppressor (Silencer) that is not a phoney can - sold as a novelty item, usually) is NFA regulated and subject to the $200 NFA transfer tax. THe Phoney cans are usualy a solid tube inside a lookalike can, and are neither flashhiders or suppressors, are and merely cosmetic barrel extensions. Any flashhider (not for the M4 COmmando, I'll get to that in a minute) is legal. However, if it is to be mounted upon a post-ban upper, it MUST be pinned or welded to the end of the barrel to become a permanent attachment to comply with the 1994 Crime Bill asininity. Pre-bas may have removable flashhiders, muszzle brakes, or whatever. A post-ban may NOT have a threaded muxxle for attachments, but a post-ban may have a LEGALLY OWNED AND REGISTERED suppressor permanently attached via weld or pin. The Flashhider as used on the M4 Commando (short-barrel M-16 carbine wiht telestock and 11.5" bbl) IS classified as a suppressor by ATF. Notwithstanding the fact that it was designed to reduce the sound of the extremely short barrel to be equivalent to a similar round discharged from an 18" bbl, it is still designed to suppress the sound signature of a firearm and is terefore the loudest suppressor available. When you find an M4 lookalike upper, it is usually a short barrel with a dummy suppressor or a full-length barrel with cosmetic machine work. Suppressors are legal for PRE or POST-ban configurations, but MUST be PERMANENTLY mounted to post-ban rifle uppers. This assumes, of course, that the suppressor is legally owned and NFA registration/transfer taxes were paid, AND t is not a violation of State law to own NFA listed firearms and suppressors. FOr a first rifle, I would say go ahead and get the lower with the fixed A2 stock, and get the 16" or 18" barrel. Keep in mind that you can always build more uppers for the rifle, you need only get the LOWER RECEIVER CASTING through an FFL. If you like, you can actually get the lower casting from the FFL of your choice and assemble the rest of the rifle youself, it is fairly easy, and there is a certain measure of pride in hitting x-rings with a rifle you built. Also, assembling the rifle yourself gives you the chance to do a "final fit and finish" on machined parts that are often left with burrs and lets you tune the rifle to fit ywhat you want more than if you bought a factory piece. If you buy a lower receiver, you can get complete rifle kits from many distributors (American Spirit Arms, Model 1 Distributors, J&T Surplus) and put the rifle together for a cost comparable to buying one! If you go this route, there are two books I highly recommend... 1) The Complete AR15/
Link Posted: 5/7/2001 5:18:05 PM EDT
I see your point Troy. There is no such thing as a "pre-ban" lower receiver. Only pre-ban rifles.
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