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Posted: 6/21/2017 12:34:11 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Somebody tell me how you can accidentally not see an entire cargo ship. Don't they have radar? A cargo ship is kind of big. Yes they are... |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 12:39:00 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Navy and Marine Corps Medal Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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One of the 7 sailors who died aboard the USS Fitzgerald saved more than a dozen of his fellow shipmates before he ultimately lost his own life, The Daily Beast reported.
When the Fitzgerald collided with the merchant ship, 37-year-old Fire Controlman 1st Class Gary Leo Rehm Jr., "leapt into action," according to The Daily Beast. The Fitzgerald was struck below the waterline, and Rehm Jr.'s family was told by the Navy that he went under and saved at least 20 sailors, according to WBNS-10TV in Columbus, Ohio. But when he went back down to get the other six sailors, the ship began to take on too much water, and the hatch was closed, WBNS-10TV said. http://www.businessinsider.com/this-sailor-sacrificed-himself-save-20-lives-the-uss-fitzgerald-2017-6?utm_content=buffer6fb51&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer-bi |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 12:43:39 AM EDT
[#3]
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FWIW, they're not the only ones constrained by draft and there have been incidents where one was run over by a merchie with both constrained by draft. My point was that a lot of merchant ships have an attitude that everyone else has to make way for them and it leads to accidents from time to time. I frequently take my little ski boat out to near the shipping lanes (w/in 1nm) to anchor and watch the ships go by. I'm anchored in 8' of water sometimes. A 60' motor yacht limping on one engine at low tide and with a north wind in the Houston Ship Channel would likely be constrained as well, but well and truly fucked by the 6 knot container ship running up his ass. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 12:46:08 AM EDT
[#4]
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I'm sure he'll be decorated for that. What's the highest that he could get these days? I recall a sailor in the interwar period getting the Medal of Honor for similar actions, but the law was changed to not allow non-combat MOHs sometime before WWII. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
One of the 7 sailors who died aboard the USS Fitzgerald saved more than a dozen of his fellow shipmates before he ultimately lost his own life, The Daily Beast reported.
When the Fitzgerald collided with the merchant ship, 37-year-old Fire Controlman 1st Class Gary Leo Rehm Jr., "leapt into action," according to The Daily Beast. The Fitzgerald was struck below the waterline, and Rehm Jr.'s family was told by the Navy that he went under and saved at least 20 sailors, according to WBNS-10TV in Columbus, Ohio. But when he went back down to get the other six sailors, the ship began to take on too much water, and the hatch was closed, WBNS-10TV said. http://www.businessinsider.com/this-sailor-sacrificed-himself-save-20-lives-the-uss-fitzgerald-2017-6?utm_content=buffer6fb51&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer-bi |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 12:58:38 AM EDT
[#5]
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What's the highest that he could get these days? |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 1:03:13 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They could have just done an unrep and those stores weren't put away yet before they went to the GQ drill. That looks like one of the ladderwells on a carrier. Sometimes it takes a day or two to get it all stowed. On the Stennis there was a line of food in boxes (gedunk junk food) running right outside our berthing. One of the nuke blackshoes (their berthing was across from ours) grabbed a box of chips and got caught. Not good for him at all. 
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Posted: 6/21/2017 1:07:58 AM EDT
[#7]
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Navy and Marine Corps medal? I think that's the highest non combatant award. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
One of the 7 sailors who died aboard the USS Fitzgerald saved more than a dozen of his fellow shipmates before he ultimately lost his own life, The Daily Beast reported.
When the Fitzgerald collided with the merchant ship, 37-year-old Fire Controlman 1st Class Gary Leo Rehm Jr., "leapt into action," according to The Daily Beast. The Fitzgerald was struck below the waterline, and Rehm Jr.'s family was told by the Navy that he went under and saved at least 20 sailors, according to WBNS-10TV in Columbus, Ohio. But when he went back down to get the other six sailors, the ship began to take on too much water, and the hatch was closed, WBNS-10TV said. http://www.businessinsider.com/this-sailor-sacrificed-himself-save-20-lives-the-uss-fitzgerald-2017-6?utm_content=buffer6fb51&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer-bi The MOH citation I mentioned: For extraordinary heroism in the line of his profession while serving on board the U.S.S. Memphis, at a time when that vessel was suffering total destruction from a tsunami while anchored off Santo Domingo City, 29 August 1916. Machinist Willey took his station in the engineer's department and remained at his post of duty amidst scalding steam and the rush of thousands of tons of water into his department as long as the engines would turn, leaving only when ordered to leave. When the boilers exploded, he assisted in getting the men out of the fire room and carrying them into the engine room, where there was air instead of steam to breathe. It was approximated that he carried up 106 men on his shoulders, saving countless lives. He received serious 3rd degree burns from the steam himself. Machinist Willey's conduct on this occasion was above and beyond the call of duty. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 1:36:13 AM EDT
[#8]
tag,it looks like the cargo ship made a u turn to hit our ship to me
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Posted: 6/21/2017 1:59:58 AM EDT
[#9]
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tag,it looks like the cargo ship made a u turn to hit our ship to me |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 5:06:21 AM EDT
[#10]
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While periodically unmanned engine rooms are quite common there wouldn't be a delay in engine RPMs. The wheelhouse has control of the main engine while transiting on most (if not all marine diesels). In my experience the only ships that used the engine order telegraphs for speed changes were steamships. You'd have a duty engineer who would be responsible for the engine room during the "unmanned" portion of time. They would make a round and answer any alarms. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 5:40:38 AM EDT
[#11]
I served with Gary on the USS Ramage, along with another ARFCOM member. Gary was truly one hell of a sailor. He was within a few months of retirement. I consider it both an honor and a privilege to have had the chance to hoist a few cold ones with this hero. He was the kind of guy that you could always look to if you needed to vent, needed some cheering up, or just wanted to laugh your ass off. He had that grin that you could never put your finger on weather he was just happy or being a smart ass. He will be truly missed and anyone that has ever known him knows that he was the kind of sailor that you wanted to serve with. My daughter is graduating US Navy boot camp at the end of the month, I sincerely hope that she will be able to serve with others like FC1(SW) Gary Rehm.
Fair Winds and Following Seas Brother, We have the watch. 
Chris USN Retired Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One of the 7 sailors who died aboard the USS Fitzgerald saved more than a dozen of his fellow shipmates before he ultimately lost his own life, The Daily Beast reported.
When the Fitzgerald collided with the merchant ship, 37-year-old Fire Controlman 1st Class Gary Leo Rehm Jr., "leapt into action," according to The Daily Beast. The Fitzgerald was struck below the waterline, and Rehm Jr.'s family was told by the Navy that he went under and saved at least 20 sailors, according to WBNS-10TV in Columbus, Ohio. But when he went back down to get the other six sailors, the ship began to take on too much water, and the hatch was closed, WBNS-10TV said. http://www.businessinsider.com/this-sailor-sacrificed-himself-save-20-lives-the-uss-fitzgerald-2017-6?utm_content=buffer6fb51&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer-bi |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 8:54:16 AM EDT
[#12]
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I served with Gary on the USS Ramage, along with another ARFCOM member. Gary was truly one hell of a sailor. He was within a few months of retirement. I consider it both an honor and a privilege to have had the chance to hoist a few cold ones with this hero. He was the kind of guy that you could always look to if you needed to vent, needed some cheering up, or just wanted to laugh your ass off. He had that grin that you could never put your finger on weather he was just happy or being a smart ass. He will be truly missed and anyone that has ever known him knows that he was the kind of sailor that you wanted to serve with. My daughter is graduating US Navy boot camp at the end of the month, I sincerely hope that she will be able to serve with others like FC1(SW) Gary Rehm. Fair Winds and Following Seas Brother, We have the watch.
Chris USN Retired Hopefully your daughter will be able to serve ON the USS Gary Rehm. Sounds plenty deserving. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 10:24:06 AM EDT
[#13]
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tag,it looks like the cargo ship made a u turn to hit our ship to me No. The U turn was 30 minutes after the collision. The cargo ship returned to the scene to render assistance. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 5:13:29 PM EDT
[#14]
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Sounds like a great man--not surprised at all. So many people around the world question the spirit of the American Servicemember, and every time they are amazed with what the "average" American fighting member can do. Hopefully your daughter will be able to serve ON the USS Gary Rehm. Sounds plenty deserving. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 7:12:03 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
tag,it looks like the cargo ship made a u turn to hit our ship to me http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/2004497_US-Navy-destroyer-USS-Fitzgerald--flooding--after-container-ship-collision.html&page=15#i66671879 |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 7:34:30 PM EDT
[#16]
supposedly this is a pic of the Commanders cabin
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Posted: 6/21/2017 8:00:16 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
supposedly this is a pic of the Commanders cabin https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCzoPsIV0AAK9hM.jpg |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:52:12 AM EDT
[#18]
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Posted: 6/22/2017 12:00:32 PM EDT
[#19]
Meanwhile, below decks, the glancing blow of Crystal’s bulbous bow had ripped a 10-feet-by-10-feet to 14-feet-by-14-feet hole below the waterline of the ship, flooding a machinery space the berthing area that was home to about half of the crew, the sailor said. In addition to the damage to the spaces, the collision knocked out Fitzgerald’s communications for the better part of an hour. At about the same time the crew was able to reactivate their backup Iridium satellite communications to radio for help, Crystal arrived on the scene and called in its own distress call, the sailor told USNI News. 
Diagram of USS Fitzgerald showing where damage from ACX Crystal occurred. As for the ship, five days after collision active damage control efforts are ongoing to prevent further damage to the hull. The force of Crystal’s impact combined with the flood not only dented but twisted the ship’s hull. Crews are continuing to pump water in and out of the ship to keep Fitzgerald stable. Naval Sea Systems Command is now assessing if the ship can be repaired in Japan or would have to be transported to the U.S. for repairs. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 12:21:27 PM EDT
[#20]
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As for the ship, five days after collision active damage control efforts are ongoing to prevent further damage to the hull. The force of Crystal’s impact combined with the flood not only dented but twisted the ship’s hull. Crews are continuing to pump water in and out of the ship to keep Fitzgerald stable. 
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Posted: 6/22/2017 12:24:09 PM EDT
[#21]
It will be interesting to see what changes occur in design, construction, training, and methods due to this incident.
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Posted: 6/22/2017 12:43:45 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It will be interesting to see what changes occur in design, construction, training, and methods due to this incident. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 12:48:08 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think they should have some sort of underwater breathing systems that can be used in any of the compartments that can become flooded below the waterline in case crew is cutoff from a sealed door. This way they can breathe underwater until help can arrive. Have the air system run through the ship in every compartment with quick disconnects and scuba type masks located throughout the ship. Berthing areas should have a masks hanging on the walls at the ready. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 1:56:59 PM EDT
[#24]
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Any self contained apparatus for under water use in addition to the fire SCBA's just turns into too much equipment that won't be used enough. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 1:59:53 PM EDT
[#25]
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They make some that are the size of a 20oz water bottle, maybe even smaller. They could clip right next to the EEBD. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 2:25:24 PM EDT
[#26]
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I think in most cases like this one, that would just give you a few more minutes to contemplate your own death. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 2:36:05 PM EDT
[#27]
Build in some sort of man size escape tube that extends up to the next level deck. In case of flooding and the compartment it totally cutoff from sealed doors it can be used as an escape system up to the next level deck. Person swims into the chamber closes the air tight door and swims up to the next level. Person drains the water in the tube then opens the door to the next level. Next person floods the tube to equalize then enters the tube and so on. Obviously each person would need some sort of emergency breathing apparatus as it would take a few minutes to escape.
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Posted: 6/22/2017 2:55:01 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Build in some sort of man size escape tube that extends up to the next level deck. In case of flooding and the compartment it totally cutoff from sealed doors it can be used as an escape system up to the next level deck. Person swims into the chamber closes the air tight door and swims up to the next level. Person drains the water in the tube then opens the door to the next level. Next person floods the tube to equalize then enters the tube and so on. Obviously each person would need some sort of emergency breathing apparatus as it would take a few minutes to escape. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 3:09:18 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think that is a realistic solution honestly. With the type of damage that occurred anything like that would probably be rendered inop. Any self contained apparatus for under water use in addition to the fire SCBA's just turns into too much equipment that won't be used enough. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I think they should have some sort of underwater breathing systems that can be used in any of the compartments that can become flooded below the waterline in case crew is cutoff from a sealed door. This way they can breathe underwater until help can arrive. Have the air system run through the ship in every compartment with quick disconnects and scuba type masks located throughout the ship. Berthing areas should have a masks hanging on the walls at the ready. 
I'd be willing to bet that the Navy focus is on the human element. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 3:54:04 PM EDT
[#30]
I'd like "what is an escape scuttle for five hundred Alex."
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Posted: 6/22/2017 8:33:44 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I served with Gary on the USS Ramage, along with another ARFCOM member. Gary was truly one hell of a sailor. He was within a few months of retirement. I consider it both an honor and a privilege to have had the chance to hoist a few cold ones with this hero. He was the kind of guy that you could always look to if you needed to vent, needed some cheering up, or just wanted to laugh your ass off. He had that grin that you could never put your finger on weather he was just happy or being a smart ass. He will be truly missed and anyone that has ever known him knows that he was the kind of sailor that you wanted to serve with. My daughter is graduating US Navy boot camp at the end of the month, I sincerely hope that she will be able to serve with others like FC1(SW) Gary Rehm. Fair Winds and Following Seas Brother, We have the watch.
Chris USN Retired Quote HistoryQuoted:
I served with Gary on the USS Ramage, along with another ARFCOM member. Gary was truly one hell of a sailor. He was within a few months of retirement. I consider it both an honor and a privilege to have had the chance to hoist a few cold ones with this hero. He was the kind of guy that you could always look to if you needed to vent, needed some cheering up, or just wanted to laugh your ass off. He had that grin that you could never put your finger on weather he was just happy or being a smart ass. He will be truly missed and anyone that has ever known him knows that he was the kind of sailor that you wanted to serve with. My daughter is graduating US Navy boot camp at the end of the month, I sincerely hope that she will be able to serve with others like FC1(SW) Gary Rehm. Fair Winds and Following Seas Brother, We have the watch.
Chris USN Retired Quoted:
One of the 7 sailors who died aboard the USS Fitzgerald saved more than a dozen of his fellow shipmates before he ultimately lost his own life, The Daily Beast reported.
When the Fitzgerald collided with the merchant ship, 37-year-old Fire Controlman 1st Class Gary Leo Rehm Jr., "leapt into action," according to The Daily Beast. The Fitzgerald was struck below the waterline, and Rehm Jr.'s family was told by the Navy that he went under and saved at least 20 sailors, according to WBNS-10TV in Columbus, Ohio. But when he went back down to get the other six sailors, the ship began to take on too much water, and the hatch was closed, WBNS-10TV said. http://www.businessinsider.com/this-sailor-sacrificed-himself-save-20-lives-the-uss-fitzgerald-2017-6?utm_content=buffer6fb51&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer-bi The country could use more like him. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 8:44:15 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They already have escape hatches in berthing compartments. They're great unless the deck has buckled and twisted or there's debris resting on top of it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Build in some sort of man size escape tube that extends up to the next level deck. In case of flooding and the compartment it totally cutoff from sealed doors it can be used as an escape system up to the next level deck. Person swims into the chamber closes the air tight door and swims up to the next level. Person drains the water in the tube then opens the door to the next level. Next person floods the tube to equalize then enters the tube and so on. Obviously each person would need some sort of emergency breathing apparatus as it would take a few minutes to escape. The Navy provides an EEBD (emergency escape breathing device) in a container in each crew members bunk, its good to egress from smoke filled environments but not underwater use. If your compartment is flooded you are fucked, no way around that. Most of realwars comment is not feasible other than an EEDB. Shit happens to quickly for complicated escape procedures, if you get out before it floods good for you, if not, well, Davy Jones locker awaits. My GQ station on WESTPAC was 2 decks underwater, the fire system was an 18" main that could fill the space to the top in less than five minutes, there were two ways out, you made it or else. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 8:44:57 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They make some that are the size of a 20oz water bottle, maybe even smaller. They could clip right next to the EEBD. Probably less if you are still alive after sleeping peacefully in you bunk when a container ship pierces the bulkhead at 15 knots and you are immediately pinned by a wall of water. Horrible way to die, no reason to prolong that. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 10:08:30 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They make some that are the size of a 20oz water bottle, maybe even smaller. They could clip right next to the EEBD. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Any self contained apparatus for under water use in addition to the fire SCBA's just turns into too much equipment that won't be used enough. Kharn |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:22:03 PM EDT
[#35]
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Pretty sure that buys you 3-5 breaths of air. Probably less if you are still alive after sleeping peacefully in you bunk when a container ship pierces the bulkhead at 15 knots and you are immediately pinned by a wall of water. Horrible way to die, no reason to prolong that. http://www.heed3.com/ |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:22:56 PM EDT
[#36]
On average, the unit provides 2-5 minutes of air or approximately 30 breaths at the surface |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:25:36 PM EDT
[#37]
The sea is a harsh mistress.
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:40:27 PM EDT
[#38]
Timeline was wrong. It turned after the collision.
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:43:26 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:43:52 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Timeline was wrong. It turned after the collision. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:57:59 PM EDT
[#41]
Sad situations like this are why I'd never take a waterline cabin on a cruise. It's deck 7 or higher, in the balcony zone.
Things like this show the risks our service members take daily that we take for granted - with rare thanks from those they protect. I await the investigation, but right now it looks to me like negligence caused 7 men to die. I hope it wasn't in vain. |
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Posted: 6/22/2017 11:58:33 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
it might have allowed them to swim out the hole caused by the container ship.....of course, then they have to worry about someone noticing them out in the water too.... |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:00:13 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sad situations like this are why I'd never take a waterline cabin on a cruise. It's deck 7 or higher, in the balcony zone. Things like this show the risks our service members take daily that we take for granted - with rare thanks from those they protect. I await the investigation, but right now it looks to me like negligence caused 7 men to die. I hope it wasn't in vain. |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:01:26 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's not like Dead Calm. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
it might have allowed them to swim out the hole caused by the container ship.....of course, then they have to worry about someone noticing them out in the water too.... |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:06:00 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
it might have allowed them to swim out the hole caused by the container ship.....of course, then they have to worry about someone noticing them out in the water too.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:06:44 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
About the same number of service members died in the Cold War as died in Viet Nam. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Sad situations like this are why I'd never take a waterline cabin on a cruise. It's deck 7 or higher, in the balcony zone. Things like this show the risks our service members take daily that we take for granted - with rare thanks from those they protect. I await the investigation, but right now it looks to me like negligence caused 7 men to die. I hope it wasn't in vain. |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:13:10 AM EDT
[#47]
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Fucking A right. Should be the next DDG approved by Congress. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Sounds like a great man--not surprised at all. So many people around the world question the spirit of the American Servicemember, and every time they are amazed with what the "average" American fighting member can do. Hopefully your daughter will be able to serve ON the USS Gary Rehm. Sounds plenty deserving. |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:13:16 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some of us consider Vietnam as just one theater in the Cold War... |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 12:21:27 AM EDT
[#49]
Let's get something straight here.
Quick Acting Water Tight Doors are designed in a way that you are able to close them if water is gushing out of a compartment. Edit: I only bring this up because I am drinking and misread a post, but the fact stands. |
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Posted: 6/23/2017 7:35:39 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The sea is a harsh mistress. |
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