User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 4:29:21 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am not at all concerned about the rights and feelings of the Muslim community. I am VERY concerned about the rights of U.S. citizens that could be undermined by giving the government the power to arrest/punish citizens simply by the classification of words. Imagine a leftist future government declaring the NRA a "terrorist" organization, and then saying that anyone who ever sent money to them or was a member has "materially supported" a terrorist organization. Ludicrous? Sure - but you also KNOW that someone like Pelosi would have no problems with that, if she had the power. My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations.  constitutional rights should not be extended to those who wish to destroy them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 4:35:30 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The citizens that live there continue to talk out of both sides of their mouths in a best case scenario. Worse case is they only talk out of one. Even worse is that we aren't far behind them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 5:39:29 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This goes back to my comment on the weakness of Western society in terms of identity. If you've looked the other side in the face, even the good dudes, you know that they're set up for success against us, and why, when living in contemporary Western and US culture. This thread, quite unfortunately, gives hint to the underpinnings of the issue. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 5:42:18 PM EDT
[#4]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 5:43:54 PM EDT
[#5]
Fears over 'second bomb' after police find huge chemical explosive cache in Salman Abedi raid
link |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 5:55:28 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Fears over 'second bomb' after police find huge chemical explosive cache in Salman Abedi raid link |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 5:59:23 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Egalitarianism only works when everyone in the playground understands and agrees to it. As they say, when it comes to going to war, the enemy has a vote. We fail to recognize said vote. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:05:57 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Egalitarianism only works when everyone in the playground understands and agrees to it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This goes back to my comment on the weakness of Western society in terms of identity. If you've looked the other side in the face, even the good dudes, you know that they're set up for success against us, and why, when living in contemporary Western and US culture. This thread, quite unfortunately, gives hint to the underpinnings of the issue. Doesn't matter to Leftists though, no amount of facts or statistics will change their minds, it's all rainbows and unicorns. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:07:11 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'd like to say that it's an obvious concept, but.... As they say, when it comes to going to war, the enemy has a vote. We fail to recognize said vote.  Failed To Load Title |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:13:29 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Should we fail to contain and reverse the islamization of the Western World, rest assured those rights will no longer exist to be abused. constitutional rights should not be extended to those who wish to destroy them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I am not at all concerned about the rights and feelings of the Muslim community. I am VERY concerned about the rights of U.S. citizens that could be undermined by giving the government the power to arrest/punish citizens simply by the classification of words. Imagine a leftist future government declaring the NRA a "terrorist" organization, and then saying that anyone who ever sent money to them or was a member has "materially supported" a terrorist organization. Ludicrous? Sure - but you also KNOW that someone like Pelosi would have no problems with that, if she had the power. My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations. constitutional rights should not be extended to those who wish to destroy them. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:17:15 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Western culture is also sometimes fatally gullible.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjPN8wnNP0g |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:27:41 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:31:37 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryThat imam, Tawhidi, is based lol! The other dude is part of the problem. "These attacks have nothing to do with islam, we condemn them. We have these scriptures for hundreds of years, they've just now started inciting violence because of daesh (ISIS)", Tawhidi stops him, chastises him for lying and gives him a history lesson, explains how islam has always been at war and has been spread by the sword. Well worth the watch guys. Can't find it on YouTube but it's worth visiting that site to watch. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:32:03 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. 1: Stop all immigration of Muslims from every nation on the planet 2:Deport every non citizen Muslim currently here |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:34:03 PM EDT
[#15]
Western culture is also sometimes fatally gullible. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:42:44 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When globalist control the media, the banks, and have bought off every important judge and politician, it's easy to say the public is gullible,, but very few can resist cradle to grave social indoctrination. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Western culture is also sometimes fatally gullible. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:44:39 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So much BS here & in the article... 1. Holding extreme views is not against the law. The authorities can't just go round arresting anybody with questionable views (because we are not a police state) 2. Do you know how many people are being reported with similar views? People need to prioritise investigations, and there are likely to have been others with more concrete evidence against them. 3. How do we know that nothing was done? He might have been investigated, but there wasn't enough evidence to take it further (see previous points). 4. Hindsight is a beautiful thing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Some of his "friends" turned him in, then even someone in his mosque turned him in after a row with the imam. It only gets worse from there. ETA: I'm not laying blame, just saying it's terribly sad 1. Holding extreme views is not against the law. The authorities can't just go round arresting anybody with questionable views (because we are not a police state) 2. Do you know how many people are being reported with similar views? People need to prioritise investigations, and there are likely to have been others with more concrete evidence against them. 3. How do we know that nothing was done? He might have been investigated, but there wasn't enough evidence to take it further (see previous points). 4. Hindsight is a beautiful thing. No, I don't know how many people are being reported for similar views, but I do know a lot of people are being investigated for benign social media posts. U.K. Police, "Hate speech will not be tolerated"......by "westerners" if they post anything even resembling a negative view of islam, but they/you will tolerate actual hate speech that breeds extremist who blow people up, children included. BS indeed... |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:50:19 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's an interesting issue, and a very legitimate concern. Those not constrained by Constitutional concepts seem to do an even worse (despite what I've seen posted here over time) job of dealing with the issue at hand. It's why I don't apologise for the concept of American exceptionalism, beyond the bizarre libertarianist concept of denying such a thing in the name of some kind of victim status in the light of all things official, which oddly correlates to the general Western trend of self-effacing, despite the fundamental differences. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Snip... My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations. We don't. But the prevent the usurpation of power and destruction of the Constitution we need to prevent these cultural enclaves from forming in the first place. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:52:46 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which is why I say what works for us doesn't work for the Middle East. Some need to be ruled by an iron fist. We don't. But the prevent the usurpation of power and destruction of the Constitution we need to prevent these cultural enclaves from forming in the first place. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:55:35 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 6:59:20 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://metro.co.uk/2017/05/23/manchesters-top-police-say-we-wont-tolerate-hate-after-ariana-grande-terror-attack-6656860/ This is precisely what I'm on about. "We must not tolerate hate!" But you did. And you have. It's just tolerance of islamic hate. And after yet another one of their number has slaughtered yet more of your citizens their activists elbow their way in front of cameras and microphones and lament about the "hate" and "reprisals" they are supposedly getting in the form of tweets or comments. And then you make a big show of backing their fucking murderously duplicitous play by treating people who might tweet something mean like they're on the same playing field as the guys who are slaughtering teenagers at a fucking concert. There is no victory over this bullshit until you stop playing their fucking game. This whole spirit of cooperation and unity bullshit has been attempted for the last 16 years. The end result of that is more bombings, more death, and more militancy from islamic circles. Time to try a different approach. They are actually four square in favor of hate, they just prefer a particular variety. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:31:00 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've said the same. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Which is why I say what works for us doesn't work for the Middle East. Some need to be ruled by an iron fist. We don't. But the prevent the usurpation of power and destruction of the Constitution we need to prevent these cultural enclaves from forming in the first place. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:31:39 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I learned during the clinton administration that the only constitutional rights I possess are those democrats think they can't take away at the moment. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:37:02 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I am not at all concerned about the rights and feelings of the Muslim community. I am VERY concerned about the rights of U.S. citizens that could be undermined by giving the government the power to arrest/punish citizens simply by the classification of words. Imagine a leftist future government declaring the NRA a "terrorist" organization, and then saying that anyone who ever sent money to them or was a member has "materially supported" a terrorist organization. Ludicrous? Sure - but you also KNOW that someone like Pelosi would have no problems with that, if she had the power. My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations. constitutional rights should not be extended to those who wish to destroy them. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. The drastic steps apply only to followers of Islam. Case closed. Don't try to make any sort of universal standard out of it, apply it very strictly and narrowly. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:40:20 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
lol happens every day in Chicago Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I disagree, I don't believe Americans would protect mass murderers. happens every day in Chicago |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:41:23 PM EDT
[#26]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:43:56 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's pretty simple to me. The drastic steps apply only to followers of Islam. Case closed. Don't try to make any sort of universal standard out of it, apply it very strictly and narrowly. you can't couch your murderous seditious political system as merely a religion when the religion seeks to eviscerate the free practice of other religions. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:46:47 PM EDT
[#28]
I think GD hates Ariana Grande worse than the jihadi
Mostly parents look like got killed |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 7:49:46 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryThat couple collecting their daughters...at least two instant orphans. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:02:54 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am not at all concerned about the rights and feelings of the Muslim community. I am VERY concerned about the rights of U.S. citizens that could be undermined by giving the government the power to arrest/punish citizens simply by the classification of words. Imagine a leftist future government declaring the NRA a "terrorist" organization, and then saying that anyone who ever sent money to them or was a member has "materially supported" a terrorist organization. Ludicrous? Sure - but you also KNOW that someone like Pelosi would have no problems with that, if she had the power. My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Here is a thought for those here who are concerned about the rights and feelings of the Muslim community: A law that would criminalize and make subject to deportation anyone participating in or materially supporting terrorism anywhere in the world. Go to fight with ISIS...get arrested and deported when you get back. The "known bomb maker" living down the street from Abedi could then be arrested and deported. I am VERY concerned about the rights of U.S. citizens that could be undermined by giving the government the power to arrest/punish citizens simply by the classification of words. Imagine a leftist future government declaring the NRA a "terrorist" organization, and then saying that anyone who ever sent money to them or was a member has "materially supported" a terrorist organization. Ludicrous? Sure - but you also KNOW that someone like Pelosi would have no problems with that, if she had the power. My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:03:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think GD hates Ariana Grande worse than the jihadi Mostly parents look like got killed |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:14:55 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nine, apparently. Care to do the math? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I think GD hates Ariana Grande worse than the jihadi Mostly parents look like got killed |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:16:33 PM EDT
[#33]
I counted 11 possible parents, maybe fans
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:32:26 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I counted 11 possible parents, maybe fans |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:33:13 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I am not at all concerned about the rights and feelings of the Muslim community. I am VERY concerned about the rights of U.S. citizens that could be undermined by giving the government the power to arrest/punish citizens simply by the classification of words. Imagine a leftist future government declaring the NRA a "terrorist" organization, and then saying that anyone who ever sent money to them or was a member has "materially supported" a terrorist organization. Ludicrous? Sure - but you also KNOW that someone like Pelosi would have no problems with that, if she had the power. My concern is about the unintended consequences of new government powers against US citizens that could be abused by future administrations. constitutional rights should not be extended to those who wish to destroy them. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:35:21 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In the past we declared we are at war and certain exceptions will be made to our liberties. I guess that would be too difficult to do in our "current social climate". |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:37:44 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So they were filming his movements and still he pulled this off? |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 8:53:55 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How do they say it? For 16 years America has been at the mall? So, what war at this point? Besides...Top Men and such. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
In the past we declared we are at war and certain exceptions will be made to our liberties. I guess that would be too difficult to do in our "current social climate". |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 9:16:06 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 9:18:33 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
At some point I expect a war will be declared. It will take the use of WMD or multiple beslan type attacks here in the US to do it but eventually it will happen. It took a lot to get us into WW2, I expect this time will be no different. Given the nature and determination of the enemy it is inevitable. Until then the drip, drip, drip will continue. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
In the past we declared we are at war and certain exceptions will be made to our liberties. I guess that would be too difficult to do in our "current social climate". |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 10:52:47 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
At some point I expect a war will be declared. It will take the use of WMD or multiple beslan type attacks here in the US to do it but eventually it will happen. It took a lot to get us into WW2, I expect this time will be no different. Given the nature and determination of the enemy it is inevitable. Until then the drip, drip, drip will continue. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 10:59:24 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think GD hates Ariana Grande worse than the jihadi Mostly parents look like got killed |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 11:01:38 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
By in large is it not our constitutional and civil liberties that are preventing us from pushing back on militant Islamism, it is an unquestioning conformity to political correctness and an obsession with "diversity" for it's own sake (or rather, for the sake of diminishing Western Civilization). With a group of friends, tell them America and the sons of the British Empire are the best in the world and the only true heirs of liberty and freedom. All others are just second rate and don't deserve our degree of self-determination. Let us know how big of a racist asshole they think you are. And remember these are your friends. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 11:11:00 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
sounds like you are still free to practice christianity, judiasm, hinduism, buddhism, confuscision, taoism, zorastrianism, sikh (ism?) so hard to say you are establishing a religion. you can't couch your murderous seditious political system as merely a religion when the religion seeks to eviscerate the free practice of other religions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It's pretty simple to me. The drastic steps apply only to followers of Islam. Case closed. Don't try to make any sort of universal standard out of it, apply it very strictly and narrowly. you can't couch your murderous seditious political system as merely a religion when the religion seeks to eviscerate the free practice of other religions. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 11:23:05 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Try this: With a group of friends, tell them America and the sons of the British Empire are the best in the world and the only true heirs of liberty and freedom. All others are just second rate and don't deserve our degree of self-determination. Let us know how big of a racist asshole they think you are. And remember these are your friends. Makes Christmas shopping a cinch! |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 11:29:19 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not trying to one up you but try it with your family too. Makes Christmas shopping a cinch! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Try this: With a group of friends, tell them America and the sons of the British Empire are the best in the world and the only true heirs of liberty and freedom. All others are just second rate and don't deserve our degree of self-determination. Let us know how big of a racist asshole they think you are. And remember these are your friends. Makes Christmas shopping a cinch! 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 5/25/2017 11:30:33 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Try this: With a group of friends, tell them America and the sons of the British Empire are the best in the world and the only true heirs of liberty and freedom. All others are just second rate and don't deserve our degree of self-determination. Let us know how big of a racist asshole they think you are. And remember these are your friends. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/26/2017 12:25:00 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First two steps are easy and involve zero "price " 1: Stop all immigration of Muslims from every nation on the planet 2:Deport every non citizen Muslim currently here Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. 1: Stop all immigration of Muslims from every nation on the planet 2:Deport every non citizen Muslim currently here You think that's easy? How exactly are you going to tell the difference between an Indonesian Muslim, and Indonesian Christian, and Indonesia Buddhist and an Indonesian pagan, if they apply for a student visa, or an H1B visa? Ask them? Obviously, the muslims extremists will just lie. By the same token, how will you identify every Muslim immigrant currently here? I am not sure that immigration documents list religion, so again, are you going to just ask them if they feel like being deported, and hope they don't lie? I am not sure a plan that relies on terrorists NOT lying to you is a particularly "easy" one. 
And second - that completely ignores the problem that I am talking about, which is what the fuck to do about CITIZENS who are potentially extremist muslims. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/26/2017 12:26:59 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
By in large is it not our constitutional and civil liberties that are preventing us from pushing back on militant Islamism, it is an unquestioning conformity to political correctness and an obsession with "diversity" for it's own sake (or rather, for the sake of diminishing Western Civilization). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm not saying we should NOT take drastic steps, I am just saying that we need to be VERY thoughtful and deliberate about how we do, so that we don't end up creating a whole different problem down the line. And we should be honest with ourselves about the constitutional and civil liberty prices we are willing to pay up front. Kicking ass and rooting out the extremist cancer within our own countries is what we need. |
|
|
|
Posted: 5/26/2017 3:27:41 AM EDT
[#50]
Total of 10 arrested. Raids still ongoing
2 released without charge. 8 remain in custody. Intel sharing resumed with US after Trump and May meeting. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
