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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:23:23 PM EDT
[#1]
their plane their rules?
check what's 'agreed' upon when buying a ticket. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:23:27 PM EDT
[#2]
I am the captain of this thread and I demand the OP to be removed immediately.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:31:07 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:31:13 PM EDT
[#4]
Pretty sure it is in the fine print they can boot you for just about anything. It's not good business to make a habit of it, and probably costs the airline money when they do, but I'm pretty sure they can none the less.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:35:11 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pretty sure it is in the fine print they can boot you for just about anything. It's not good business to make a habit of it, and probably costs the airline money when they do, but I'm pretty sure they can none the less. Hopefully, cooler heads will prevail, everyone will behave and the worst that will happen is the FA will just bitch about it in the galley and maybe give you the stink eye but everyone gets where they're going when they expect to get there. TC |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:40:45 PM EDT
[#6]
Captain has complete control of aircraft and everyone on it.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:45:40 PM EDT
[#7]
The airline agrees to get you to your destination. It does not guarantee what flight, what day, what time, or even what seat that will be on. You have the right to sit down, shut up, and do what your told.
Enjoy the friendly skies. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:46:14 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That is how some carriers are choosing to play it now - but not what is lawful or even appropriate. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. People pay their money, the deal is made. AFTER completing an agreement is not the time to rescind your service or product when someone that has purchased your service or product is playing by the rules. Think about this exact same thing in other aspects of life and what would happen. If the grocery store took back the last Thanksgiving turkey you paid for while your loading your car or a theater owner taking you out of your seat for someone else, or...... Airlines have been getting away with shit for a LONG time. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:49:42 PM EDT
[#9]
For all the people bitching about the airlines....
Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:51:33 PM EDT
[#10]
Allow me to answer with a question:
What do you suppose happens, if the airline tells the Captain to vacate his seat? Assume a veteran Captain with 25 years of spotless service. Further, assume he really, really does Not want to surrender his seat. Let's say, the flight is going to PHX, where his dieing mother resides. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:54:30 PM EDT
[#11]
The FAR's say one thing, the handbooks and company policy say another, they got you right then and there at that instant, you have to follow a "lawful" company reg and flight crewmember's instructions, but in a court of law, since it's interstate will have to be Federal court, the FAR's take precedence. With the FAA, the governing body of aviation, the laws cannot contradict handbooks and company policy
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:55:19 PM EDT
[#12]
double tap
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:56:15 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For all the people bitching about the airlines.... Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. Sheeple. 
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:57:35 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Allow me to answer with a question: What do you suppose happens, if the airline tells the Captain to vacate his seat? Assume a veteran Captain with 25 years of spotless service. Further, assume he really, really does Not want to surrender his seat. Let's say, the flight is going to PHX, where his dieing mother resides. Assuming captain is not PIC - he has to go. Private property, he is unwanted. If captain is pilot in command, unless there is some fruity maritime / aviation / aerospace regulation or law, I think he'd have to go, as well. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:57:36 PM EDT
[#15]
It always seemed like going to prison. Do as you are told and watch what you say and how you say it.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:57:56 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
So, I thought I had a good handle on aviation law, but from reading all the threads, I may be missing something (which, doesn't surprise me) lol Not interested in arguing either (or any) of the recent cases, go do that in the other threads. Hypothetical: You are a regular, plain jane, citizen. No special rights, protected class, whatever. You buy what I will call a 'regular ticket' on a commercial aircraft (Delta, United, Allegiant) to somewhere. You are seated, belted in. You are sober, paying attention to the flight crews' commands, not even verbally argumentative. What are your rights to remain on that aircraft if the owner of the aircraft wants you off? I see this as a confluence of contract / civil law and criminal (FAR) law. My position is, that is a private conveyance, and they can boot you for any reason, or no reason, just like a cabbie can pitch you out; but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. I recognize that there are special rules for aircraft due to the unique nature of air travel; they can't just pull over if there's a problem. Also - I'm not looking for binding legal advice, just trying to get it straight in my head. PFFFT Fuck off with your logic..the airlines are bad and are the whole source of the problem, the poor passengers are all victims 
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:58:41 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For all the people bitching about the airlines.... Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 1:59:05 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
NO that is how it has been. That is the way it was when they removed the doctor. If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. People pay their money, the deal is made. AFTER completing an agreement is not the time to rescind your service or product when someone that has purchased your service or product is playing by the rules. Think about this exact same thing in other aspects of life and what would happen. If the grocery store took back the last Thanksgiving turkey you paid for while your loading your car or a theater owner taking you out of your seat for someone else, or...... Airlines have been getting away with shit for a LONG time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. People pay their money, the deal is made. AFTER completing an agreement is not the time to rescind your service or product when someone that has purchased your service or product is playing by the rules. Think about this exact same thing in other aspects of life and what would happen. If the grocery store took back the last Thanksgiving turkey you paid for while your loading your car or a theater owner taking you out of your seat for someone else, or...... Airlines have been getting away with shit for a LONG time. You can, and will be forcibly removed. You are simply wrong. The airlines offer incentives to avoid hurt feelings, because they do care about customer satisfaction. This is common sense. Not a matter of civil rights. When did the whole country lose it. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:02:55 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
NO that is how it has been. That is the way it was when they removed the doctor. If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. People pay their money, the deal is made. AFTER completing an agreement is not the time to rescind your service or product when someone that has purchased your service or product is playing by the rules. Think about this exact same thing in other aspects of life and what would happen. If the grocery store took back the last Thanksgiving turkey you paid for while your loading your car or a theater owner taking you out of your seat for someone else, or...... Airlines have been getting away with shit for a LONG time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. People pay their money, the deal is made. AFTER completing an agreement is not the time to rescind your service or product when someone that has purchased your service or product is playing by the rules. Think about this exact same thing in other aspects of life and what would happen. If the grocery store took back the last Thanksgiving turkey you paid for while your loading your car or a theater owner taking you out of your seat for someone else, or...... Airlines have been getting away with shit for a LONG time. This is the thought process I was referring to. Can anyone quote where this is rooted in law? As far as the examples, I can speak to them. In the turkey example, you're confusing a good with a service. In the case of the theater owner, for a fact, I can tell you if the theater wants you out for whatever reason, you go. State trespass laws trump civil contract law. Just like a restaurant booting a patron for any reason, that's pretty well settled in case law, too, as far as I know. I know for a fact people have been booted from fast food places, even after buying a soda to ensure they couldn't be removed, and that never went anywhere courtwise. (If I'm wrong there, love to see the actual law) |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:03:14 PM EDT
[#20]
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:05:32 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your thought is unclear to me. Assuming captain is not PIC - he has to go. Private property, he is unwanted. If captain is pilot in command, unless there is some fruity maritime / aviation / aerospace regulation or law, I think he'd have to go, as well. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Allow me to answer with a question: What do you suppose happens, if the airline tells the Captain to vacate his seat? Assume a veteran Captain with 25 years of spotless service. Further, assume he really, really does Not want to surrender his seat. Let's say, the flight is going to PHX, where his dieing mother resides. Assuming captain is not PIC - he has to go. Private property, he is unwanted. If captain is pilot in command, unless there is some fruity maritime / aviation / aerospace regulation or law, I think he'd have to go, as well. Answer: He unceremoniously packs his shit up, and walks off the airplane. It actually happens that way, from time to time. Point is: nobody is "Special". I am mystified as to when this became a thing. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:06:14 PM EDT
[#22]
Air line rules of engagement exist for your safety and for that of the crew. They are not flexible, nor am I.
Either obey them, or you're history. Is that clear? |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:06:41 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. They offer money to try to get volunteers and avoid bad publicity, and are required to compensate those who do not volunteer, but are still denied a seat, but they can and do deny those seats if they choose to. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:13:17 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Of course you can be - and I defy you to show me where, in law, it is stated otherwise. They offer money to try to get volunteers and avoid bad publicity, and are required to compensate those who do not volunteer, but are still denied a seat, but they can and do deny those seats if they choose to. http://www.9news.com/news/local/verify/verify-can-an-airline-kick-you-off-a-flight-thats-too-full/430168875 |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:18:04 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LoL. Soooo entitled! NO. You did not "Buy your seat". You don't "Own the seat". You never did. You can, and will be forcibly removed. You are simply wrong. The airlines offer incentives to avoid hurt feelings, because they do care about customer satisfaction. This is common sense. Not a matter of civil rights. When did the whole country lose it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. If you are obeying the rules and not causing trouble, you can not be forcibly removed. That's why airlines offer money to get people to give up their seats and that is appropriate. People pay their money, the deal is made. AFTER completing an agreement is not the time to rescind your service or product when someone that has purchased your service or product is playing by the rules. Think about this exact same thing in other aspects of life and what would happen. If the grocery store took back the last Thanksgiving turkey you paid for while your loading your car or a theater owner taking you out of your seat for someone else, or...... Airlines have been getting away with shit for a LONG time. You can, and will be forcibly removed. You are simply wrong. The airlines offer incentives to avoid hurt feelings, because they do care about customer satisfaction. This is common sense. Not a matter of civil rights. When did the whole country lose it. The airlines DO NOT off incentives to avoid hurt feelings , it is law. They wouldn't offer you the sweat off their balls if they didn't have to. Common sense is that they have a monopoly more or less and know it and have been supported by our lawmakers for a long time. http://www.9news.com/news/local/verify/verify-can-an-airline-kick-you-off-a-flight-thats-too-full/430168875 When did the whole country become so ignorant. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:22:34 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I see you have never sat in a plane on the tarmac for 7 hours with stinky people, crying babies, stifling heat, etc. while the airline won't let you get off. Sheeple. Special snowflakes.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:23:08 PM EDT
[#27]
No shirt, no shoes, no service...if you are white. All other special snowflakes get carte blanche. Your disgusting whiteness maybe overlooked if you have a qualifying snowflake condition such as sexual confusion or gender identity disphoria.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:27:29 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Tell us more. http://www.9news.com/news/local/verify/verify-can-an-airline-kick-you-off-a-flight-thats-too-full/430168875 Does not change the fact they can involuntarily remove you from a flight, even if you are seated and otherwise well-behaved and have a valid ticket. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:27:39 PM EDT
[#29]
I see this as a confluence of contract / civil law and criminal (FAR) law. My position is, that is a private conveyance, and they can boot you for any reason, or no reason, just like a cabbie can pitch you out; but I am reading that if you can get to your seat and aren't being resistive or disruptive they can't do anything to you. As a former cabbie, no we couldn't. Not here, anyhow. Local law says if they're not abusive and can pay we MUST take them. "Abusive" is subjective, but if you wanted to keep your job it'd better be bad. I refused a guy once for pissing himself only to have the dispatcher put me on standby for the rest of my shift. They'd often send cabs to addresses known for run-outs and habitual no-shows too, getting pissy with drivers who'd been burned and wouldn't go back there. In my experience it's actually harder to get kicked out of a taxi than an airliner. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:30:13 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Actually....I have...several times. Longest time was in Denver. It sucked. I survived. I've survived much worse. Special snowflakes. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I see you have never sat in a plane on the tarmac for 7 hours with stinky people, crying babies, stifling heat, etc. while the airline won't let you get off. Sheeple. Special snowflakes. You'll do fine in the years coming down the road. You have the perfect attitude for it. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:32:29 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I see you have never sat in a plane on the tarmac for 7 hours with stinky people, crying babies, stifling heat, etc. while the airline won't let you get off. Sheeple. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
For all the people bitching about the airlines.... Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. Sheeple. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:33:03 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You must have been trying to quote someone else because I never said the above in bold. The airlines DO NOT off incentives to avoid hurt feelings , it is law. They wouldn't offer you the sweat off their balls if they didn't have to. Common sense is that they have a monopoly more or less and know it and have been supported by our lawmakers for a long time. http://www.9news.com/news/local/verify/verify-can-an-airline-kick-you-off-a-flight-thats-too-full/430168875 When did the whole country become so ignorant. On this matter you appear to be in the same group as you complain about in your last sentence. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 2:56:57 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:00:31 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It is all spelled out in each airline's contract of carriage, which is why they offer incentives. That is also why the incentives vary by airline. You are wrong that you are entitled to staying on the aircraft despite no wrongdoings. On this matter you appear to be in the same group as you complain about in your last sentence. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:01:39 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For all the people bitching about the airlines.... Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:10:47 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For all the people bitching about the airlines.... Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:17:56 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can you quote an airline's contract of carriage that states you can be removed from the aircraft if the flight attendant doesn't like your eye color or whatever other absurd example was given? Also, suffice it to say you will not win the argument at the aircraft. You could be 100% correct, but you won't win the argument at that point. It's like arguing with a cop at the side of the road, it's just not gonna go the way you hope it will. The captain of the aircraft has the final say over the operation of the aircraft. Period. The captain can remove anybody for any reason. That is not to say the captain won't have to answer for his/her actions later but as long as they are the captain of that flight...they win that argument. Right or wrong, it's the way it is and has to be. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:18:34 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Uh, that's exactly what I did. I have not been on a plane in over 10 years. I went to a gun store one time. Owner treated me like shit. I didn't spend any money there, left, never went back, and I told people about my bad experience there. The gun shop eventually closed....for a variety of reasons. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:19:35 PM EDT
[#39]
I honestly can't wait until I hit 1K so I don't have to deal with this shit anymore.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:19:47 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You'll have to excuse some of us we aren't as tough and understanding as you seem to be. Maybe it's just in your make-up. Maybe you like a little abuse now and then. You'll do fine in the years coming down the road. You have the perfect attitude for it. Flying on an American airline is hardly the brutal experience that you seen to think it is. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:21:15 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am the captain of this thread and I demand the OP to be removed immediately. Best way to think of it is you have no rights whatsoever in the post 9/11 world. You only have privileges that can be taken away at the leisure of your local overlords. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:31:56 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Frankly, it isn't important enough to me to spend time looking it up. If you don't think they can create a rationale for booting you off regardless of the actual circumstances, cool. Suffice it to say every airline has its own policies for passenger removal and the separate operating manuals for gate agents, pilots, and flight attendants also contain information on the process. Also, suffice it to say you will not win the argument at the aircraft. You could be 100% correct, but you won't win the argument at that point. It's like arguing with a cop at the side of the road, it's just not gonna go the way you hope it will. The captain of the aircraft has the final say over the operation of the aircraft. Period. The captain can remove anybody for any reason. That is not to say the captain won't have to answer for his/her actions later but as long as they are the captain of that flight...they win that argument. Right or wrong, it's the way it is and has to be. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Can you quote an airline's contract of carriage that states you can be removed from the aircraft if the flight attendant doesn't like your eye color or whatever other absurd example was given? Also, suffice it to say you will not win the argument at the aircraft. You could be 100% correct, but you won't win the argument at that point. It's like arguing with a cop at the side of the road, it's just not gonna go the way you hope it will. The captain of the aircraft has the final say over the operation of the aircraft. Period. The captain can remove anybody for any reason. That is not to say the captain won't have to answer for his/her actions later but as long as they are the captain of that flight...they win that argument. Right or wrong, it's the way it is and has to be. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:34:25 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Frankly, it isn't important enough to me to spend time looking it up. If you don't think they can create a rationale for booting you off regardless of the actual circumstances, cool. Suffice it to say every airline has its own policies for passenger removal and the separate operating manuals for gate agents, pilots, and flight attendants also contain information on the process. Also, suffice it to say you will not win the argument at the aircraft. You could be 100% correct, but you won't win the argument at that point. It's like arguing with a cop at the side of the road, it's just not gonna go the way you hope it will. The captain of the aircraft has the final say over the operation of the aircraft. Period. The captain can remove anybody for any reason. That is not to say the captain won't have to answer for his/her actions later but as long as they are the captain of that flight...they win that argument. Right or wrong, it's the way it is and has to be. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Can you quote an airline's contract of carriage that states you can be removed from the aircraft if the flight attendant doesn't like your eye color or whatever other absurd example was given? Also, suffice it to say you will not win the argument at the aircraft. You could be 100% correct, but you won't win the argument at that point. It's like arguing with a cop at the side of the road, it's just not gonna go the way you hope it will. The captain of the aircraft has the final say over the operation of the aircraft. Period. The captain can remove anybody for any reason. That is not to say the captain won't have to answer for his/her actions later but as long as they are the captain of that flight...they win that argument. Right or wrong, it's the way it is and has to be. Delta may refuse to transport or may remove passengers from its aircraft in any of the following situations: 1) When the passenger’s conduct is disorderly, abusive or violent; 2) When the passenger is barefoot; 3) When the passenger appears to be intoxicated or under the influence of drugs; 4) When the passenger attempts to interfere with any member of the flight crew in the pursuit of his or her duties, or fails to obey the instruction of any member of the flight crew; 5) When the passenger has a contagious disease that may be transmissible to other passengers during the normal course of the flight; 6) When the passenger has a malodorous condition; 7) When the passenger is unable to sit in a seat with the seatbelt fastened; 8) When the passenger’s behavior may be hazardous to himself/herself, the crew, or other passengers; 9) When the passenger is seriously ill, and fails to provide a physician's written permission to fly. 10) When the passenger’s conduct creates an unreasonable risk of offense or annoyance to other passengers; 11) When the passenger’s conduct creates a risk of harm or damage to the carrier’s aircraft and/or property, or the property of other passengers. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:35:22 PM EDT
[#44]
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I bet the airlines wish that they'd had you around when they were writing the CoC. United alone could have removed two whole sections based off your wisdom. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:38:21 PM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:
What are your rights to remain on that aircraft if the owner of the aircraft wants you off? ZERO.[/b] But that's just my opinion. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:40:08 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For all the people bitching about the airlines.... Since they are so bad......quit fucking flying. You can't or won't follow instructions? Quit fucking flying. Don't like the TSA? Quit fucking flying. Did your mommy tell that you are special? Guess what? You aren't. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:40:35 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Basically this. Captain says leave, you're getting off his plane. Best way to think of it is you have no rights whatsoever in the post 9/11 world. You only have privileges that can be taken away at the leisure of your local overlords. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I am the captain of this thread and I demand the OP to be removed immediately. Best way to think of it is you have no rights whatsoever in the post 9/11 world. You only have privileges that can be taken away at the leisure of your local overlords. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:40:56 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What am I wrong about? Specifically. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I bet the airlines wish that they'd had you around when they were writing the CoC. United alone could have removed two whole sections based off your wisdom. There is a contract and both sides are bound by it. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:49:36 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are wrong that they can boot you off for any reason or for no reason. There are very specific reasons listed and those are the only reasons that the airline can refuse to uphold the contract. It is not like AA717driver said "if a FA doesn't like your face, you're gone". There is a contract and both sides are bound by it. Again, you won't win that argument at the plane. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 3:51:45 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Captain has complete control of aircraft and everyone on it. |
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