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Posted: 2/19/2017 12:49:50 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's my point. If you have no way to quantify but know it when you see it, that's subjective. Not objective. And that's fine. But others are going to disagree. Or as the dude says, that's just like..your opinion, man. But that's all good. Fun topic. Haven't had this little argument since college, when it was inevitably followed by a discussion about whether a monkey could successfully day trade, or something ridiculous like that. It is a fun conversation. My definition is pretty much the OP's. I discuss this with band and cheer kids several times a year. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 12:54:07 PM EDT
[#2]
Anything involving any type of ball is NOT a "sport", it's a game.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 12:55:49 PM EDT
[#3]
Any activity you can participate in while drinking alcohol is not a sport. Game, yes.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 12:57:51 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It is a fun conversation. My definition is pretty much the OP's. I discuss this with band and cheer kids several times a year. Yep. I tend to think you have to define sport more broadly than you and OP to be able to arrive at a consistent and objective definition. And I think high level golf is a lot more physically demanding and takes more athleticism than people realize. But yeah, it's absolutely not the same as playing professional hockey, for instance. I do however like an objective scoring system (which golf has). |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:00:44 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Golf does not require "physical exertion" unless your definition of physical exertion is as broad as can possibly be interpreted. Chess technically requires physical exertion, as one must physically exert himself in order to move the pieces. The level of exertion required to play golf is that of leisurely walk, and therefore is not a sport. Also, golf is not a sport because: 1. You can be good at it after a hip replacement. 2. Anything that requires you to iron your shirt before you play is automatically not a sport. Golf, darts, pool, bowling = games that are difficult to master. Not sports. And yet, being a racing driver, who constantly is dealing with G forces that would make a normal persons neck snap, or arms weak is not participating in a sport? If that is not "physical exertion" then idk what is. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:02:50 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This couldn't be more wrong. If you're walking a PGA course for 4 days in a row, all while having to swing with the intensity they do, it's truly grueling. That level of exertion is wildly different than playing your local course with a golf-cart. How many miles is 18 holes? 3-4? If walking a mile every hour is "grueling" you are out of shape. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:07:26 PM EDT
[#7]
It's a drinking game.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:08:31 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not arguing that golf is a sport. I am arguing that you need to have an objective definition of sport, which is what you asked for in this thread. I have never played a round of golf, nor even watched it played. I would bet that tournament play is much more physical than 18 holes on a Sunday afternoon. But I don't personally consider it a sport. As I suggested; you time the run through the course THEN you would have a sport. You are making your "physicality" definition subjective (and you hate subjective scoring as stated) You are conflating my lack of specificity (as to how much exertion is required to be a sport) with subjectivity. I could come up with some arbitrary level of exertion to go with my definition, but it wouldn't really changing anything. For example, I could say the player's heart rate must average 170bpm to be defined as a sport, but it's still up to everybody to decide whether or not they accept that definition. In my definition, due to the lack of specificity, there could be a gray area. Maybe curling (that weird ice shit where you sweep) is in the gray area because there is a moderate level of exertion (I doubt it, but it's the best example I can come up with right now). |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:09:22 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many miles is 18 holes? 3-4? If walking a mile every hour is "grueling" you are out of shape. The better you are, the less you walk. Bad golfers go in zig zags, good golfers keep the ball in play and spend less time hunting for it and walking to errant shots. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:09:45 PM EDT
[#10]
It's a game, not a sport.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:10:51 PM EDT
[#11]
The people here that don't think golf is a sport have obviously never played it competitively or at all.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:12:36 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gordie Howe played hockey at age 52. When was the last time you WALKED 18 holes of golf for 4 days? How many miles did you walk total? And did you arrive 3 hours early to practice, stay an extra hour or two to continue to work on your game? Then travel to another location, practice for another 2 days and do it all over again for months at a time? And are you strong enough mentally to play at such a high level based only on your skill at the game such that you could win enough to afford to continue to play? Was Tiger Woods a pussy playing an activity or an athlete? Give us 4 days of continuous golf and report back on how easy it was. I have never walked 18 holes, but I walk much more than that every week (at least when it's not raining). My walk to work is over 2 miles each way. I only allot myself about 40 minutes to get there. So every week in the summer and spring I walk 4 miles a day, 5 days in a row, at average speed greater than during a game of golf. I would hardly consider this a high level of physical exertion. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:13:14 PM EDT
[#13]
Its a game not a sport IMHO
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:13:23 PM EDT
[#14]
No - almost as fucked up as soccer
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:15:21 PM EDT
[#15]
Walking a full 18 holes carrying your own clubs and swinging the club over a hundred times like I have to do, while it's no running a marathon, will wear you out.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:15:26 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The people here that don't think golf is a sport have obviously never played it competitively or at all. The problem with your argument is that it's bullshit. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:16:57 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
I don't think so. If I may ask: why do you think it isn't? Are you so good at it that it isn't a challenge? Do you think it's too easy? Inquiring minds want to know. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:18:44 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, competitive shooting is just high velocity darts. ETA: I am not talking about things like biathlon, which obviously fulfills my 2 requirements. My requirements to be a sport: 1) Has a non-subjective way of determining the winner. This rules out ice dancing, as the only way to win is at the whim of a panel of judges. 2) Requires a high level of physical exertion. Basically, if a person claiming Social Security can compete with 23 year olds, it's not a sport (sorry, golf). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Is competitive shooting a sport? How you feel about one will directly correlate to how you feel about the other... No, competitive shooting is just high velocity darts. ETA: I am not talking about things like biathlon, which obviously fulfills my 2 requirements. My requirements to be a sport: 1) Has a non-subjective way of determining the winner. This rules out ice dancing, as the only way to win is at the whim of a panel of judges. 2) Requires a high level of physical exertion. Basically, if a person claiming Social Security can compete with 23 year olds, it's not a sport (sorry, golf). Ok, so how about the matches like the Mammoth Sniper Challenge or 24 hr sniper challenge; where you are required to hump all your gear over long distances/obstacles, navigate...? If that is not physically taxing what is? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:19:31 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If I may ask: why do you think it isn't? Are you so good at it that it isn't a challenge? Do you think it's too easy? Inquiring minds want to know. Any inquiring minds can read my other posts where I answer that question. Have you read any of my posts? I spelled this out quite clearly. Lots of shit is "challenging". Throwing a pencil at a ceiling tile and getting it to stick in one of the holes is challenging, so what? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:19:40 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any activity you can participate in while drinking alcohol is not a sport. Game, yes. I've had beer in my water bottle on the net while playing with ex-NHLers. So, now hockey isn't a sport?  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:21:23 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any inquiring minds can read my other posts where I answer that question. Have you read any of my posts? I spelled this out quite clearly. Lots of shit is "challenging". Throwing a pencil at a ceiling tile and getting it to stick in one of the holes is challenging, so what? You didn't say shit in your OP, which is what I replied to. So, what "sports" do you excel at? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:21:49 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ok, so how about the matches like the Mammoth Sniper Challenge or 24 hr sniper challenge; where you are required to hump all your gear over long distances/obstacles, navigate...? If that is not physically taxing what is? I wasn't aware those were a thing, but as you describe it, I suppose whatever that is called would be a sport. The shooting itself isn't a sport, though, which is the point I am making. Biathlon is a sport, but the shooting aspect, in and of itself, is not. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:23:34 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You didn't say shit in your OP, which is what I replied to. So, what "sports" do you excel at? I don't play any sports that competitively. I "play" (the use of the term for this being controversial for this sport) judo but I only "compete" maybe once a year. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:23:44 PM EDT
[#24]
It's a sport. It takes physical activity and physical and mental skill. It may not be as physically demanding as some other sports , but it is a sport.
Sport - an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment: |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:24:58 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
2) Requires a high level of physical exertion. Basically, if a person claiming Social Security can compete with 23 year olds, it's not a sport (sorry, golf). OK, so, actually golf does meet your requirements then. No old guy can play from the tips against pros and be even remotely competitive. And swinging hard enough to hit a ball 300 yards off the tee and still have precision is pretty physically taxing. Most courses set up for pros would make even 3-4 handicap players cry and shoot over 100 from the tips with Sunday pin placements. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:25:31 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a sport. It takes physical activity and physical and mental skill. It may not be as physically demanding as some other sports , but it is a sport. Sport - an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment: The problem with that definition is that it's incredibly vague. You can play violin (or air guitar as others have stated) competitively. If you use as broad as definition as "involving physical exertion", well fuck, breathing requires physical exertion. Is breathing a sport? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:26:13 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OK, so, actually golf does meet your requirements then. No old guy can play from the tips against pros and be even remotely competitive. And swinging hard enough to hit a ball 300 yards off the tee and still have precision is pretty physically taxing. Most courses set up for pros would make even 3-4 handicap players cry and shoot over 100 from the tips with Sunday pin placements. Bringing in groceries is physically taxing. Not enough to be considered a sport, though. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:26:21 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't play any sports that competitively. I "play" (the use of the term for this being controversial for this sport) judo but I only "compete" maybe once a year. Somehow, I kinda figured that. 
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:27:08 PM EDT
[#29]
If poker and hotdog eating contests are sports, then golf is.
I voted No, according to my old boss, golf is a Daytime drinking game. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:27:09 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The problem with your argument is that it's bullshit. Way to give a counter example 
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:27:29 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bringing in groceries is physically taxing. Not enough to be considered a sport, though. People don't have destroyed backs by their 30's from carrying in groceries. They do from trying to have fast clubhead speed. FWIW, I've done an Ironman Triathlon (Madison) and think golf is more of a sport than triathlon. Triathlon, to use the quote, is just trying to be the best at exercising. But, opinions vary...... |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:27:46 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When an activity or game becomes specialized and money is to be made it becomes a sport. Professional golfing is a sport. This |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:28:00 PM EDT
[#33]
No. It is a competition however.
To be a sport there must be both an element of danger and risk of loss of life, and clear objective scoring criteria for points scored by the player(s) (i.e. no judging). Unless you count getting eaten by an alligator from the water hazard as the element of danger risk of loss of life, golf is not a sport it's a competition. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:29:37 PM EDT
[#34]
Shooting is not a sport , golf is a sport , how many sporting events do you know
that have a pay out purse of 5 million dollars every week , the general public have no idea how good professional golfers are just as most of the posters in this thread . |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:29:58 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No. It is a competition however. To be a sport there must be both an element of danger and risk of loss of life, and clear objective scoring criteria for points scored by the player(s) (i.e. no judging). Unless you count getting eaten by an alligator from the water hazard as the element of danger risk of loss of life, golf is not a sport it's a competition. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:30:44 PM EDT
[#36]
No, it's an activity like bowling or softball. If you can drink beer while playing, it's not a sport.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:32:01 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Shooting is not a sport , golf is a sport , how many sporting events do you know that have a pay out purse of 5 million dollars every week , the general public have no idea how good professional golfers are just as most of the posters in this thread . Holy fuck. Nobody is arguing that they aren't skilled, just as nobody is arguing that opera singers, professional violinists, and professional Xbox players aren't skilled. The argument is that an element to the game of golf is missing that is required for it to be a sport. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:32:44 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Shooting is not a sport , golf is a sport , how many sporting events do you know that have a pay out purse of 5 million dollars every week , the general public have no idea how good professional golfers are just as most of the posters in this thread . I played a course on the Big Island that was set up for a Senior PGA event (Waikaloa Kings or Ocean, I forget which) on the Monday after the event. To say it was eye-opening would be a massive understatement, and I already appreciated how good they are. The greens were like trying to putt down the hood of your car and make it stop at the fucking hood ornament. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:34:13 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The argument is that an element to the game of golf is missing that is required for it to be a sport. It's a pretty crappy argument, as a pro-level swing, ONE pro level swing, will put the average GDer into the hospital with a ruptured disk......if they could get the club going that fast, which they can't. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:34:23 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
People don't have destroyed backs by their 30's from carrying in groceries. They do from trying to have fast clubhead speed. FWIW, I've done an Ironman Triathlon (Madison) and think golf is more of a sport than triathlon. Triathlon, to use the quote, is just trying to be the best at exercising. But, opinions vary...... ROFL. So destroying your back is the litmus test? In that case, falling off a ladder hanging Christmas light is a sport, because my uncle is paralyzed as fuck from that. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:35:26 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a pretty crappy argument, as a pro-level swing, ONE pro level swing, will put the average GDer into the hospital with a ruptured disk......if they could get the club going that fast, which they can't. And one fall from my roof would send any pro golfer to the hospital. What's your point? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:37:50 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ROFL. So destroying your back is the litmus test? In that case, falling off a ladder hanging Christmas light is a sport, because my uncle is paralyzed as fuck from that. Logic isn't your strong suit, is it? The average joe trying to swing a club that fast will get hurt. The average joe hangs lights every year and doesn't get hurt. See any difference there? You are probably a dude that would be lucky to put a ball 200 yards off the tee, and have no fucking clue what putting it 50% farther off the tee does to your body. If it isn't exertion, well, nothing is. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:41:10 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You've clearly never seen Happy Gilmore. 
I usually try to exclude Hollywood movies, or other make-believe, from my logical arguments. 
ETA: apologies to Carl Weathers. |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:44:30 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Logic isn't your strong suit, is it? The average joe trying to swing a club that fast will get hurt. The average joe hangs lights every year and doesn't get hurt. See any difference there? You are probably a dude that would be lucky to put a ball 200 yards off the tee, and have no fucking clue what putting it 50% farther off the tee does to your body. If it isn't exertion, well, nothing is. Ugg I guess I have to Barney style this for you. Just because an "average joe" can injure themselves doing something does not make it a sport. A person being untrained in the proper technique of something is what leads to injury. It's not that golfers possess some immense physical abilities that they don't injure themselves. Reference the part about doing it when you are old as fuck and the fact that cripples can compete at the professional level, lol. https://www.law.uh.edu/healthlaw/perspectives/Disabilities/010831CaseyMartin.html |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:44:33 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I usually try to exclude Hollywood movies, or other make-believe, from my logical arguments. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You've clearly never seen Happy Gilmore.
I usually try to exclude Hollywood movies, or other make-believe, from my logical arguments. I try to exclude man-eating alligators from mine
Where does the life/death requirement come from? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:47:42 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ugg I guess I have to Barney style this for you. Just because an "average joe" can injure themselves doing something does not make it a sport. A person being untrained in the proper technique of something is what leads to injury. It's not that golfers possess some immense physical abilities that they don't injure themselves. Reference the part about doing it when you are old as fuck and the fact that cripples can compete at the professional level, lol. https://www.law.uh.edu/healthlaw/perspectives/Disabilities/010831CaseyMartin.html He couldn't compete at the professional level, because he needed a cart, which is not part of professional golf. That was the whole issue with him. Been meaning to ask, just out of curiousity, what your handicap is? |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:48:01 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I try to exclude man-eating alligators from mine
Where does the life/death requirement come from? Earnest Hemingway?
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:48:36 PM EDT
[#48]
The Champions Tour guys can rarely keep up with the regular tour guys. They don't have the distance anymore. That's why the old guys have their own tour. Most of the couldn't make the cut let alone win.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:49:58 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He couldn't compete at the professional level, because he needed a cart, which is not part of professional golf. That was the whole issue with him. Been meaning to ask, just out of curiousity, what your handicap is? Wrong. He sued and won. ""Without the ADA I never would have been able to pursue my dream of playing golf professionally," Casey says" "This year, Casey qualified for the PGA Tour, and now plays alongside the greatest golfers in the world. " Funny, I don't think somebody in his physical condition will be fighting in the UFC or playing in the NFL anytime soon... https://www.ada.gov/fmartin.htm |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 1:55:18 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holy fuck. Nobody is arguing that they aren't skilled, just as nobody is arguing that opera singers, professional violinists, and professional Xbox players aren't skilled. The argument is that an element to the game of golf is missing that is required for it to be a sport. just so you can go onto the following event the next week if you don't have your tour card . |
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