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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:51:35 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well-parented children are the retirement plan that God intended. Build a shed in your back yard and your parents can live there. Problem solved. No need to take 12% of your wages for your entire life. If my 4 children won't take care of me and my wife when we are too old to work, then so be it. I should have been a better father. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They better hope they were good to their kids. Well-parented children are the retirement plan that God intended. Build a shed in your back yard and your parents can live there. Problem solved. No need to take 12% of your wages for your entire life. If my 4 children won't take care of me and my wife when we are too old to work, then so be it. I should have been a better father. 27% of the US adults choose to live alone as a single person household - they don't have kids to rely on, and they don't save enough to retire. I'm not justifying SS, just stating that without some sort of forced retirement savings plan a lot of people won't be able to make it in retirement. Luckily, I saved enough to retire early.... 
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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:52:38 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I want my money back. I don't require interest but I want all the money I've paid over the last 28 years. That is quite a bit of money. I want it back if SS gets disassembled. Rofl @ your wants. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:54:46 PM EDT
[#3]
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I want my money back. I don't require interest but I want all the money I've paid over the last 28 years. That is quite a bit of money. I want it back if SS gets disassembled. Sigh |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:55:42 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
27% of the US adults choose to live alone as a single person household - they don't have kids to rely on, and they don't save enough to retire. I'm not justifying SS, just stating that without some sort of forced retirement savings plan a lot of people won't be able to make it in retirement. Luckily, I saved enough to retire early.... They chose to live alone as a single parent household? Chose not to save? Okay? Sucks to be their ass, then. Not my problem. Have kids that can and want to take care of you, and/or save enough money to care for yourself. Either way, leave my paycheck out of it. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:08:10 PM EDT
[#5]
Oh, I see, let's end SS now and let people who have paid into it for 30 years take the hit, if I was a young buck I would feel the same way, no skin in the game. Forget it. I would settle for an end date if SS remained the same for those who paid in and cut off anyone after that date and any entitlements associated with it. New payers to SS better come up with a better plan other than cutting off long time payers or this whole conversation will remain the joke it is. Most here wouldn't be around to see the crash anyway.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:08:14 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So fuckin what? They should have raised some children that are competent and give a shit about them, then. Jesus Christ, people forget that our species survived for quite some time without a godamn government check. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
My point for most, is that currently even if they weren't paying that 7.6% tax they won't, couldn't, or wouldn't, be able to save enough to live in retirement right now. So fuckin what? They should have raised some children that are competent and give a shit about them, then. Jesus Christ, people forget that our species survived for quite some time without a godamn government check. You're good people 
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:09:52 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh, I see, let's end SS now and let people who have paid into it for 30 years take the hit, if I was a young buck I would feel the same way, no skin in the game. Forget it. I would settle for an end date if SS remained the same for those who paid in and cut off anyone after that date and any entitlements associated with it. New payers to SS better come up with a better plan other than cutting off long time payers or this whole conversation will remain the joke it is. Most here wouldn't be around to see the crash anyway. Oh okay, we will put you firmly in the "not until I get mine" camp. Thanks for playing. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:10:27 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh, I see, let's end SS now and let people who have paid into it for 30 years take the hit, if I was a young buck I would feel the same way, no skin in the game. Forget it. I would settle for an end date if SS remained the same for those who paid in and cut off anyone after that date and any entitlements associated with it. New payers to SS better come up with a better plan other than cutting off long time payers or this whole conversation will remain the joke it is. Most here wouldn't be around to see the crash anyway. This is NOT a young buck thing. I'm 52 and will walk away from it. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:33:38 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is NOT a young buck thing. I'm 52 and will walk away from it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Oh, I see, let's end SS now and let people who have paid into it for 30 years take the hit, if I was a young buck I would feel the same way, no skin in the game. Forget it. I would settle for an end date if SS remained the same for those who paid in and cut off anyone after that date and any entitlements associated with it. New payers to SS better come up with a better plan other than cutting off long time payers or this whole conversation will remain the joke it is. Most here wouldn't be around to see the crash anyway. This is NOT a young buck thing. I'm 52 and will walk away from it. Socialists never want to admit they are socialists. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:38:01 PM EDT
[#10]
I'd love to opt out of social security, just move all my contributions over to my TSP please.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:40:25 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'd love to opt out of social security, just move all my contributions over to my TSP please. You sure you want a pile of IOUs in your TSP? |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:46:14 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Late to this wonderful ss thread. Fuck SS, I've been saying it for 20 years, fuck SS disability also. It's not the taxpayers job to take care of you, it was stupid when it was created and it's still stupid today. I can retire in a few years myself, guess what, it's because I saved and have 3 retirement plans, no ss needed. Gonna' file for the benefits? SS and Medicare? |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:58:24 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Serious question for you "young" guys saying to eliminate all benefits immediately or means test it. If you paid into the system for 47 years and were 6-12 months away from getting your $2300/month, would you really be saying the same thing? It's not a matter of means, it's a matter of what is right. Could you really walk away from that? Yep without question. People who actually think SS is bad and unconstitutional shouldn't care about 'getting theirs' it shouldn't even factor into their position. If I fought my whole life and supported any politician who mentioned dismantling it and was finally successful one day before I became eligible that'd be a huge victory for me. I've come to realize that the number of actual conservatives in this country is very small. Even on ARFCOM, which is not by any means a good sampling of the country this is a hotly contested debate. We have no chance of fixing this problem and its disgusting how many people claim to be conservative, yet when they have the chance to eliminate a huge chunk of taxation and government spending in this country they turn into the FSA. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:01:17 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Socialists never want to admit they are socialists. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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Oh, I see, let's end SS now and let people who have paid into it for 30 years take the hit, if I was a young buck I would feel the same way, no skin in the game. Forget it. I would settle for an end date if SS remained the same for those who paid in and cut off anyone after that date and any entitlements associated with it. New payers to SS better come up with a better plan other than cutting off long time payers or this whole conversation will remain the joke it is. Most here wouldn't be around to see the crash anyway. This is NOT a young buck thing. I'm 52 and will walk away from it. Socialists never want to admit they are socialists. Yup, SS is socialism at its finest. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:04:27 PM EDT
[#15]
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Easy - you attrition out all the people under the current system. What we should have is a federally guaranteed 401k system where your taxes go to fund the 401k instead of a federal slush fund. That way the money gets put to work in the market and everyone retains individual control over their retirement accounts. Why do people bring up this federal 401k/retirement stuff? Why can't we just remove the needless IRA contribution limits and let people maintain control of their own assets. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:05:06 PM EDT
[#16]
leave it it's my retirement salary w00t
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:08:36 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gonna' file for the benefits? SS and Medicare? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Late to this wonderful ss thread. Fuck SS, I've been saying it for 20 years, fuck SS disability also. It's not the taxpayers job to take care of you, it was stupid when it was created and it's still stupid today. I can retire in a few years myself, guess what, it's because I saved and have 3 retirement plans, no ss needed. Gonna' file for the benefits? SS and Medicare? Read the part, where I said I CAN retire in a few years. All you need to retire is money/wealth/income/savings/retirement...age ain't got shit to do with retirement. I can retire because I have saved, if I did retire in a few years ( I won't) it would be several years before you could even file for benefits. So to answer your question...nope, I want nothing to do with these bs socialist programs. .gov tit is .gov tit no matter how you slice it, people bitch about all the welfare/social programs, but then stick their own hand out for some. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:22:05 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why do people bring up this federal 401k/retirement stuff? Why can't we just remove the needless IRA contribution limits and let people maintain control of their own assets. FYI: you misspelled "tax shelter for the 1%". AFRCOM can't have that. can ARFCOM? ar-jedi |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:40:31 PM EDT
[#19]
Countless people rely on SS. You can't "dismantle" it. You don't want that, you best have a bill coming that has something close to a "guaranteed universal income".
I think the best way is basically manage it like a 401k. What you put in, is what you get back. The amount you put in now, grows with interest until you start taking it out. Choose how many years you want to use it for. Collect at 65, want it for 30 years? Amount / 30 = your payout the first year. Amount / 29 = your payout for the next. Give people the incentive to actually work to put into it. Problem is, you have too many collecting on it without having put into it. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:44:20 PM EDT
[#20]
Anyone got the stats on what the average person draws vs how much they contributed ?
I know there are multiple variables but someone has put the pencil to it and averaged it out. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 6:56:46 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Countless people rely on SS. You can't "dismantle" it. You don't want that, you best have a bill coming that has something close to a "guaranteed universal income". I think the best way is basically manage it like a 401k. What you put in, is what you get back. The amount you put in now, grows with interest until you start taking it out. Choose how many years you want to use it for. Collect at 65, want it for 30 years? Amount / 30 = your payout the first year. Amount / 29 = your payout for the next. Give people the incentive to actually work to put into it. Problem is, you have too many collecting on it without having put into it. You don't think there won't be countless news articles about feeble widows forced to eat dog food with your terrible "you don't get other people's money" plan? |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:04:13 PM EDT
[#22]
go ahead shut it down. i want to reimbursed EVERY DIME i put into it..
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:08:28 PM EDT
[#23]
Go ahead, shut it down. Give me back 75% of what I put in.
If not, I will find some rich millenial's kids and hold them for ransom until their parents pay me what I am owed. 
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:09:31 PM EDT
[#24]
I have been paying into Social Security for 25 years and I would gladly give up anything that I have coming to me from if they would just let me not have to pay in anymore.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:13:07 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Go ahead, shut it down. Give me back 75% of what I put in. If not, I will find some rich millenial's kids and hold them for ransom until their parents pay me what I am owed. You paid in $0.00. 75% of that is jack shit. My children and I will not be your slaves. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:18:24 PM EDT
[#26]
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You paid in $0.00. 75% of that is jack shit. My children and I will not be your slaves. 
Good luck. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:19:14 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
You paid in $0.00. 75% of that is jack shit. My children and I will not be your slaves. Strange - my paycheck says otherwise. And, yes, you and your children WILL be my slave. 
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:25:21 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Strange - my paycheck says otherwise. And, yes, you and your children WILL be my slave. I know you people won't accept this but you really didn't 'pay in' to anything for yourself. You're paying for current retirees. You're paying a tax to send checks to people who are drawing social security right now. Thats the program. The same way we pay a tax to send checks to other government services. There's no money being banked or held for you, when and if you decide to accept a government check - other citizens will be taxed in order to write that check to you. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:27:06 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know you people won't accept this but you really didn't 'pay in' to anything for yourself. You're paying for current retirees. You're paying a tax to send checks to people who are drawing social security right now. Thats the program. The same way we pay a tax to send checks to other government services. There's no money being banked or held for you, when and if you decide to accept a government check - other citizens will be taxed in order to write that check to you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Strange - my paycheck says otherwise. And, yes, you and your children WILL be my slave. I know you people won't accept this but you really didn't 'pay in' to anything for yourself. You're paying for current retirees. You're paying a tax to send checks to people who are drawing social security right now. Thats the program. The same way we pay a tax to send checks to other government services. There's no money being banked or held for you, when and if you decide to accept a government check - other citizens will be taxed in order to write that check to you. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:27:07 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know you people won't accept this but you really didn't 'pay in' to anything for yourself. You're paying for current retirees. You're paying a tax to send checks to people who are drawing social security right now. Thats the program. The same way we pay a tax to send checks to other government services. There's no money being banked or held for you, when and if you decide to accept a government check - other citizens will be taxed in order to write that check to you. Dont worry about them. They love their old people welfare just as much as bonquifa loves her section 8 and SSDI. Both groups are equal leaches. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:28:04 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Welcome to the way of life since 1935, it will be OK. I only hope I get to be so smug when I or my children vote to cut off your elderly welfare. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:30:21 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Welcome to the way of life since 1935, it will be OK. I'm a realist about it. I know its not going anywhere. I just think its absurd that people will defend this garbage and proclaim to be a conservative or rage against the FSA. My retirement plans do not account for SS at all and I will not be accepting a check if its still around when I'm of age, there is no way I could personally accept a check or deposit that was forcefully taken from other people. I feel sorry for people who think thats an ok way to live your life. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:30:34 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I only hope I get to be so smug when I or my children vote to cut off your elderly welfare.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:34:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think the best way is basically manage it like a 401k. What you put in, is what you get back. The amount you put in now, grows with interest until you start taking it out. Choose how many years you want to use it for. Collect at 65, want it for 30 years? Amount / 30 = your payout the first year. Amount / 29 = your payout for the next. Give people the incentive to actually work to put into it. Problem is, you have too many collecting on it without having put into it. wait, why is your desire to have the government involved in the middle of this? the US government has proven time and time again that can not do much of *anything* correctly. they can not efficiently manage a medical system (VA), they can not successfully instantiate and operate an insurance system (ACA/Obamacare), they can not economically procure anything (hello F-35a/b/c), and as we all are aware they sure as shit can not run a safety net retirement system (SSA). so now, tell me something that the US government is good at? NASA? is that it? the US government is not good at economics. QED. ergo, i don't want them as a middleman in my economic standing. ar-jedi |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:35:25 PM EDT
[#35]
While we are at it, I want all of the alcohol excise taxes I have paid over the last 4 decades returned to me with interest.
People who want to be made whole on SS crack me up. Even assuming SS continues paying retirees for decades to come, you are not guaranteed anything. Slip on a banana peel during that first month that you are drawing SS, crack your skull open, and it is all gone. I am jealous of my Amish neighbors, they don't have to pay SS. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:40:35 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know you people won't accept this but you really didn't 'pay in' to anything for yourself. You're paying for current retirees. You're paying a tax to send checks to people who are drawing social security right now. Thats the program. The same way we pay a tax to send checks to other government services. There's no money being banked or held for you, when and if you decide to accept a government check - other citizens will be taxed in order to write that check to you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Strange - my paycheck says otherwise. And, yes, you and your children WILL be my slave. I know you people won't accept this but you really didn't 'pay in' to anything for yourself. You're paying for current retirees. You're paying a tax to send checks to people who are drawing social security right now. Thats the program. The same way we pay a tax to send checks to other government services. There's no money being banked or held for you, when and if you decide to accept a government check - other citizens will be taxed in order to write that check to you. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:42:39 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
While we are at it, I want all of the alcohol excise taxes I have paid over the last 4 decades returned to me with interest. People who want to be made whole on SS crack me up. Even assuming SS continues paying retirees for decades to come, you are not guaranteed anything. Slip on a banana peel during that first month that you are drawing SS, crack your skull open, and it is all gone. I am jealous of my Amish neighbors, they don't have to pay SS.  "Weird" Al Yankovic - Amish Paradise (Parody of "Gangsta's Paradise" - Official HD Video) |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:42:52 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're good people Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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My point for most, is that currently even if they weren't paying that 7.6% tax they won't, couldn't, or wouldn't, be able to save enough to live in retirement right now. So fuckin what? They should have raised some children that are competent and give a shit about them, then. Jesus Christ, people forget that our species survived for quite some time without a godamn government check. You're good people You're forgetting about how shitting things were before that happened. Quit wearing tinted glasses and wake up. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:43:34 PM EDT
[#39]
 How About No |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:44:03 PM EDT
[#40]
ITT: People bitching about SS that will one day collect SS and be mad when their check doesn't come.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:44:52 PM EDT
[#41]
This may get me flamed for "socialisms and shit" but here is my plan:
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:45:37 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
On this generally conservative site you are going to get plenty of "I paid into it" and "Just give me my money back" answers. The unfortunate truth is that it needs to be broken apart and the longer we wait the more painful it will be, but our political climate rewards those that ignore tough problem or at least kick them down the road one more election cycle rather than fixing problems. QFT |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:48:13 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Serious question for you "young" guys saying to eliminate all benefits immediately or means test it. If you paid into the system for 47 years and were 6-12 months away from getting your $2300/month, would you really be saying the same thing? It's not a matter of means, it's a matter of what is right. Could you really walk away from that? If it meant my kids not having to deal with SS, you bet your fuckin ass I would. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:50:13 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This may get me flamed for "socialisms and shit" but here is my plan:
Whats wrong with turn it off right now and let people who didn't plan to live a non working private home lifestyle on their own dime live a lifestyle that they can support. Young people are perfectly capable of having roommates and living within their means while they build up their assets. Its insane that this country has been convinced that working people in this country are responsible for sponsoring people to not work. Some charities would pop up, some family would step up, some people would adapt and get roommates or sell off their house and live within their means. It wouldn't be the end of the world. Some people could even decide to keep being scumbags and steal money from others and run up credit before they die, at least they'd be stealing from someone who voluntarily gave them the money. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:52:03 PM EDT
[#45]
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no. not only no, but fuck no. as in, "vote from the rooftops no". i am forced -- under color of law -- to send you money, with the expectation that you give it back, and you don't? that's either fraud or felony theft, and you should expect a reaction to such criminal activity. how about we cancel all the existing pensions of government workers, perhaps that would be a different conversation? ar-jedi |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:52:04 PM EDT
[#46]
I don't expect my money back but I just say look at the money right now, calculate how far that would get them, add in a very small margin and call that the completion date. So no more collecting as of this moment, we have enough for 78 months of payments so we stop cutting checks 75 months from now. Somebody(s) will undoubtedly try to rob it thru sneaky accounting calcs, fancy money movement, falsifying the currect total etc so there better be oversight. Also if you work in an area that oversees something SS you are immediately cut loose the moment you are no longer needed.
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:53:08 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Whats wrong with turn it off right now and let people who didn't plan to live a non working private home lifestyle on their own dime live a lifestyle that they can support. Young people are perfectly capable of having roommates and living within their means while they build up their assets. Its insane that this country has been convinced that working people in this country are responsible for sponsoring people to not work. Some charities would pop up, some family would step up, some people would adapt and get roommates or sell off their house and live within their means. It wouldn't be the end of the world. Some people could even decide to keep being scumbags and steal money from others and run up credit before they die, at least they'd be stealing from someone who voluntarily gave them the money. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This may get me flamed for "socialisms and shit" but here is my plan:
Whats wrong with turn it off right now and let people who didn't plan to live a non working private home lifestyle on their own dime live a lifestyle that they can support. Young people are perfectly capable of having roommates and living within their means while they build up their assets. Its insane that this country has been convinced that working people in this country are responsible for sponsoring people to not work. Some charities would pop up, some family would step up, some people would adapt and get roommates or sell off their house and live within their means. It wouldn't be the end of the world. Some people could even decide to keep being scumbags and steal money from others and run up credit before they die, at least they'd be stealing from someone who voluntarily gave them the money. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:53:32 PM EDT
[#48]
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Why do people bring up this federal 401k/retirement stuff? Why can't we just remove the needless IRA contribution limits and let people maintain control of their own assets. Because freedom and responsibility are scary bro. Hard to have one without the other. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:53:48 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First thing is you and your buddies are gonna have to pay me back the max contribution to SS that was confiscated and given to you guys for the last 20 years, plus interest. After that, I don't care, as I am made whole. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 7:55:06 PM EDT
[#50]
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Well-parented children are the retirement plan that God intended. Build a shed in your back yard and your parents can live there. Problem solved. No need to take 12% of your wages for your entire life. If my 4 children won't take care of me and my wife when we are too old to work, then so be it. I should have been a better father. Hell no. It isn't your kids responsibility to take care of you. I would never put that burden on my kids. |
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