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Link Posted: 12/5/2016 10:21:14 PM EDT
[#1]
What kind of finishes or alloys would you recommend for a general purpose SHTF AR rifle?

We'll start here and talk about barrels after.

Take pp2
Link Posted: 12/5/2016 10:36:44 PM EDT
[#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
What kind of finishes or alloys would you recommend for a general purpose SHTF AR rifle?

We'll start here and talk about barrels after.

Take pp2
View Quote


Go spend $750 on any of the name brand M4 look alike rifles.  Shoot 2-3,000 rounds trying different sites, stocks and shit. Decide what you like and what doesn't work for you.

That 3,000 rounds of trigger time will be more effective in a pinch than a chromed fluted whirly gig.

Any decent AR will last 15,000 rounds if you take care of it.  Just change the wear items and keep a few small spares on hand.

Link Posted: 12/6/2016 4:09:23 AM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
What kind of finishes or alloys would you recommend for a general purpose SHTF AR rifle?

We'll start here and talk about barrels after.

Take pp2
View Quote


Lol coincidence! We were having a conversation on lunch break the other day about SHTF rifles.

This isn't verbatim but is the highlights and gist of it.

AR15's are pretty durable just as they come.  Infantry M4's go from new to looking like hammered crap pretty quick and they work. M16's and M4's aren’t pretty like dads Browning but they work.

Earlier generations fought two world wars and Korea with un lined bores and corrosive primed ammo. The bores survived fine if they were looked after.  They also hunted all big and dangerous game with unlined bores and corrosive ammo and the bores survived if they were looked after.  The rifle you have when the SHTF is your SHTF rifle. If the only rifle you have handy then is grandpas hunting rifle then it's a good idea to have learned it beforehand.  

Chrome lined or nitride bores are more durable and more resistant of moisture than non lined and that makes it a plus.  Hard chrome lining was spec'd for the bore of the M16 for corrosion resistance, wear resistance and lubricity. If you can get a chrome or nitride bore for only a little more than non lined then there is no practical reason not too.  

Hard chrome plating was the finish spec'd for the BCG by the designer of the AR15 / XM16 for lubricity, wear resistance and corrosion resistance. There are other treatments and coatings available. Awesome, this lets the end user decide which one best meets their particular needs.

Ceracote, Durakote, Alumahyde and GunKote are popular final finishes.  I get the feeling most people who use them do so for aesthetic reasons. Nothing wrong with that and besides some of those finish jobs are wicked cool. Extra finishes provide an additional moisture barrier and a sacrificial wear layer to take the beating before the finish of the metal beneath it can be subject to wear or moisture. These extar finishes can be applied to internal parts if you watch what you are doing.  Hey don't laugh at that idea. GunKote was developed in the 1960's as their response to the Navy’s SEAL team 1 request for moisture sealing and run dry capability for their weapons.

The .223 Wylde chamber is controversial mostly because it's not really understood. The against it at all costs crowd probably doesn't have correct info and aren't aware of that. ( for this discussion thread I will post a quote of what Bill Wylde, the guy who invented it, had to say about it )

The case dimensions of the Wylde reamer are that of one of the NATO prints. Not a thing tight about it. As I recall, there were two NATO prints in use. I don't recall the print number used, but do have it in old records somewhere.

Throating was about the only change. The decision was made to make the freebore diameter .2240" as a good bullet seal. That done, excess freebore made little difference to accuracy. One of the reasons the magazine length 69's shot so well in the chamber. It so happened that the 80 grain Sierra seated to the lands was about ideal at .2470" OAL. Simple luck.....All of it.


In practice a Wylde chamber starts the bullets down the bore a little straighter than usual and with a good gas seal. It makes sense that when the bullets  start out straighter they travel down the bore straighter and exit the muzzle straighter and tend to arrive at the target in smaller groups.  Whether a chamber is .223 Wylde or 5.56 NATO doesn't have to be a deal breaker, the rifle will go bang with either one.
Ball ammo is not match ammo by any stretch of the imagination.

4150 is not a higher grade of steel than 4140 ( as if CroMoly steel were crap ) it's a different grade of steel. Platinum is a "higher grade" of metal than steel. It's also a piss poor choice for making barrels. The vanadium in 4150 is there to keep belt fed machine gun barrels from splitting when they're white hot and drooping like noodle from sustained cylic fire.  Uncle Ray died of old age, not because the barrel of his BAR was made of 4140. He couldn't carry enough ammo to make his BAR barrel glow white hot, neither can you.
That said If you can get the barrel you want in 4150 instead of 4140 there is no reason not to so go for it.  Get the free float tube or rails that you like that works for you if it's decent quality. Don't get hung up on what so and so says is "best" or what’s trending most popular on the internet today. That will change in six days or a year. Popularity points count for nothing in gun fight or SHTF. Your stuff will still be working as good then as it does right now. If minimalism or weight savings are more important than rails, forget what I just said.  

Velocity is THE key to penetration, expansion and fragmentation. Longer barrels give higher velocities and flatter trajectories than shorter barrels do. What's the longest barrel length actually practical for you ?

My version of SHTF may be different than yours. My needs and requirements may be different than yours. Only you can decide what spec's will meet your needs for you.
Link Posted: 12/6/2016 5:54:39 AM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 12/6/2016 10:59:35 PM EDT
[#5]
Muscle car is a good analogy. 4150 in a semi auto rifle barrel is like having a dual quad big block and no possible way to unleash it's capabilities.

If it's something a person wants and is willing to pay for because it makes them happy there is nothing wrong with it. The Vanadium content is not going to make the barrel shoot  tighter, run faster or jump higher.






Link Posted: 12/7/2016 6:00:29 AM EDT
[#6]
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 6:54:58 AM EDT
[#7]
I had the gas key come loose on mine after about 500 rounds.  No issues other than that over the last 8 years of shooting it.
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 7:02:01 AM EDT
[#8]
I have a RR Coyote Rifle that does 1/2 MOA all day long...if I do my part. 

Link Posted: 12/7/2016 7:23:48 AM EDT
[#9]
My Rock River national match gun is a better gun than I am a shooter by tons . My brother has shot master with his .
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 7:44:00 AM EDT
[#10]
Most of the AR15's I build are for varmint/target shooting.

Of all the components in the "recipe" I use, the only Rock River part is one of their scope mounts.  Either 30mm or 1 inch depending on the optics.  Their mounts provide the correct height for centered sight picture.  Thank you PKFirearms for the picture.

Link Posted: 12/7/2016 7:46:28 AM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I would like to get some input on what to look for in a teir 1 barrel along worth BCGs.
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A lot of good choices out there. I was searching for a barrel myself earlier this year for my first build and ended up with a Larue Predator barrel. They were on sale too. I think I paid 200 for it. As far as BCG's I am using on of Aim Surplus they have been good for me.
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 7:48:52 AM EDT
[#12]
Had a RR Varmint, gave it to my son, ran great, never had any issues.
I ordered 2 of their bcg's during the black friday sale for $70 each.
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 8:15:40 AM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
My RRA varmint upper is probably the most accurate rifle I own.   .5 moa all day long.  
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This. I had a RRA Varmint upper. It ran like a top and shot better than anything I owned at the time. Had to sell it.

I've used over 15 RRA LPKs over the years in my guns and buddies that were building thier first AR. All good to go.
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 10:55:22 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Go spend $750 on any of the name brand M4 look alike rifles.  Shoot 2-3,000 rounds trying different sites, stocks and shit. Decide what you like and what doesn't work for you.

That 3,000 rounds of trigger time will be more effective in a pinch than a chromed fluted whirly gig.

Any decent AR will last 15,000 rounds if you take care of it.  Just change the wear items and keep a few small spares on hand.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
What kind of finishes or alloys would you recommend for a general purpose SHTF AR rifle?

We'll start here and talk about barrels after.

Take pp2


Go spend $750 on any of the name brand M4 look alike rifles.  Shoot 2-3,000 rounds trying different sites, stocks and shit. Decide what you like and what doesn't work for you.

That 3,000 rounds of trigger time will be more effective in a pinch than a chromed fluted whirly gig.

Any decent AR will last 15,000 rounds if you take care of it.  Just change the wear items and keep a few small spares on hand.


This man speaks the truth.

You can't spend your way out of bad fundamentals, it takes range time.

Getting a run of the mill upper & shooting it will pay off more than a chrome lined BCG.  Make sure that shooting includes a class like an Appleseed or something like that.  Get involved with some shooting sport to find your weaknesses and work them out.

Then as your skill increases you can spend the money high end barrels & the sort.
Link Posted: 12/7/2016 11:02:58 AM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I hear they make crap 1911s also.
View Quote


wat


Their 1911s use to be very nice.  Are they making them again?
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