User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 10:29:31 AM EDT
[#1]
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing.
Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 10:35:39 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 10:38:10 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 10:43:49 AM EDT
[#4]
BOOYAH
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 10:54:40 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
According to the DOJ report, APD officers aren't very concerned about any of that stuff... Based on our investigation, we have reasonable cause to believe that APD engages in a pattern or practice of use of excessive force, including deadly force, in violation of the Fourth Amendment and Section 14141. (1) Albuquerque police officers too often use deadly force in an unconstitutional manner in their use of firearms. To illustrate, of the 20 officer-involved shootings resulting in fatalities from 2009 to 2012, we concluded that a majority of these shootings were unconstitutional. Albuquerque police officers often use deadly force in circumstances where there is no imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm to officers or others. Instead, officers used deadly force against people who posed a minimal threat, including individuals who posed a threat only to themselves or who were unarmed. Officers also used deadly force in situations where the conduct of the officers heightened the danger and contributed to the need to use force. (2) Albuquerque police officers also often use less lethal force in an unconstitutional manner. We reviewed a random sample of the department’s use of force reports completed by officers and supervisors between 2009 and early 2013. Our sample consisted of over 200 force reports. We find that officers frequently misused electronic control weapons (commonly referred to by the brand name “Tasers”), resorting to use of the weapon on people who are passively resisting, observably nonthreatening but unable to comply with orders to their mental state, or posed only a minimal threat to the officers. (3) A significant amount of the force we reviewed was used against persons with mental illness and in crisis. (4) The use of excessive force by APD officers is not isolated or sporadic. The pattern or practice of excessive force stems from systemic deficiencies in oversight, training, and policy. Chief among these deficiencies is the department’s failure to implement an objective and rigorous internal accountability system. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ability opportunity and intent is some made up stuff try Graham vs Conner its what is actually used, the main 4 are 1.severity of the crime 2. Immediacy of the threat 3. Actively resisting arrest 4.attempting to evade arrest by flight. Other sub factors size, age, weight, number of suspects, mental state and lots more usually all go towards the most important factor the immediate threat to the officer or others. The no 20/20 hindsight rule only what is known to the officer at the time not what is later learned. Its FACTS that make force reasonable. Some case law on some of this Montoute v carr. Morgan v Cook. In both these cases note verbal commands were given first. Its a good shoot applying what led up to the shooting based on the subjects actions. According to the DOJ report, APD officers aren't very concerned about any of that stuff... Based on our investigation, we have reasonable cause to believe that APD engages in a pattern or practice of use of excessive force, including deadly force, in violation of the Fourth Amendment and Section 14141. (1) Albuquerque police officers too often use deadly force in an unconstitutional manner in their use of firearms. To illustrate, of the 20 officer-involved shootings resulting in fatalities from 2009 to 2012, we concluded that a majority of these shootings were unconstitutional. Albuquerque police officers often use deadly force in circumstances where there is no imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm to officers or others. Instead, officers used deadly force against people who posed a minimal threat, including individuals who posed a threat only to themselves or who were unarmed. Officers also used deadly force in situations where the conduct of the officers heightened the danger and contributed to the need to use force. (2) Albuquerque police officers also often use less lethal force in an unconstitutional manner. We reviewed a random sample of the department’s use of force reports completed by officers and supervisors between 2009 and early 2013. Our sample consisted of over 200 force reports. We find that officers frequently misused electronic control weapons (commonly referred to by the brand name “Tasers”), resorting to use of the weapon on people who are passively resisting, observably nonthreatening but unable to comply with orders to their mental state, or posed only a minimal threat to the officers. (3) A significant amount of the force we reviewed was used against persons with mental illness and in crisis. (4) The use of excessive force by APD officers is not isolated or sporadic. The pattern or practice of excessive force stems from systemic deficiencies in oversight, training, and policy. Chief among these deficiencies is the department’s failure to implement an objective and rigorous internal accountability system. HA! The same trustworthy, straight-laced, competent, unbiased, apolitical DOJ that looked into Hillary? THAT one?!?! 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 10:55:33 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. I certainly understand that you and others closer to the incident have context that I don't. I only have the information drawn from the video with admittedly little context. Far be it that I would ever condone someone being convicted, or charged for that matter, because of feelz. I truly hope for justice for the accused no matter what the outcome. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:16:09 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bums threaten to kill people out walking their dogs... Sometimes they make good on it, too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Those dudes rolled heavy to get a bum off a hill.  bums start brush fires, brush fires spread and burn houses. Bums threaten to kill people out walking their dogs... Sometimes they make good on it, too. oh, I agree. I was just stating why there are rules on where people can camp. Its funny so many people "care" about this asshole now when not even his family gave a flying fuck till the realized the city of Albuquerque could make them rich. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:17:06 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't even of had my hand on my concealed carry if a guy with a knife was at that distance on that terrain. This video is an embarrassment for police. Such an appropriate comparison. I'm sure you would have told dispatch you didn't need a cover officer. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:35:00 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're right - earning a BSME means I'm illogical and ADD. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Because you're illogical. Nope - I find it incredibly boring and a waste of time. Illogical and ADD. Winning! You're right - earning a BSME means I'm illogical and ADD. All I can see from your posts is that you make fallacious arguments and don't have the attention span to care about it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:36:04 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He refused multiple lawful orders to cease his actions. That is clear resistance. Further, he did turn towards them and raise the knife at the end. There was a GIF of it in the previous thread. Either way, he doesn't have to be charging towards you for you to shoot him. He was given 6 hours and numerous chances to comply. He chose to resist. He wasn't free to depart the scene, pack his gear, or do anything other than what he was told at that point. It was getting dark. It wasn't going to end with peaceful compliance. At some point, the officers had to bring the situation to a conclusion. Knife in hand...failure to obey lawful orders...trying to depart...turn towards officers. If this were a training scenario, the officers would be a Go. It is that clear. They got jammed up because they talked shit on camera...the kind of thing you say in jest but it sounds bad. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Bang. Not tracking. He never made a move to stab anyone or did anything else that would show he intended to do so. He refused multiple lawful orders to cease his actions. That is clear resistance. Further, he did turn towards them and raise the knife at the end. There was a GIF of it in the previous thread. Either way, he doesn't have to be charging towards you for you to shoot him. He was given 6 hours and numerous chances to comply. He chose to resist. He wasn't free to depart the scene, pack his gear, or do anything other than what he was told at that point. It was getting dark. It wasn't going to end with peaceful compliance. At some point, the officers had to bring the situation to a conclusion. Knife in hand...failure to obey lawful orders...trying to depart...turn towards officers. If this were a training scenario, the officers would be a Go. It is that clear. They got jammed up because they talked shit on camera...the kind of thing you say in jest but it sounds bad. He's still 15 yards away over very difficult terrain. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:39:52 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. Everything in ABQ will kill me. Hell my doctor tried to kill me there. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:51:11 AM EDT
[#12]
Homeless guy with multiple edged weapons and a history of waving them at people? See ya.
Cop sounds like a bit of a tool, but hey, I'm looking at the final outcome and I see a bum who will never again brandish a blade in anger |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 11:53:06 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well. Whatever. We don't have a place for crazies, so they are essentially just roaming the country doing side quests until somebody kills them. Lol @ homeless dually knives I would lol @ geardo coperator, but based on that terrain i can see why it might be a good idea to have some magnification available. My MMQB assessment is mediocre shoot. If he wasn't approaching them should have waited for bean bag gun to roll first. I wouldn't send an expensive police dog to fight a dude with two knives. I encourage anyone mad about it to open a local homeless shelter so the rest of us don't have to deal with them. this is the inevitable outcome of ignoring these fuckers they will get killed somehow whether it is cops , cars , or exposure Whats the answer? I don't know ,but fuckers like this are a menace and can have devastating effects on a communities quality of life if left unchecked Did he deserve to die? No Will I lose any sleep or gnash my teeth over it ? Not a bit my folks had a business (car lot/pawn shop) somewhat close to the city mission that fed these types of feral people 5 years 48 burglaries of the showroom/shop area twice a week one would knock the window out of a vehicle and sleep in it about every other time they would piss/shit/vomit in the vehicle while they were sleeping in it and the fun when one showed up throwing knives and screaming it was "his land" yeah good times cops arrest um see um wandering around the very next day I lurve feral catch and release crazy people people like this are a drag on the quality of life of actual productive people in the area fuck him |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/20/2016 12:44:26 PM EDT
[#14]
Once upon a time, something like this would have rated a one line entry on page 14 of the newspaper 'Knife wielding man shot by police'. Now, they watch the video, and see that it's not exactly what it sounds like. It's harder to bury things like this with all of this video running around... and it would seem that these things are becoming less and less acceptable. This is not unlike the recent shooting in Oklahoma... non compliance is a death sentence.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 1:49:37 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is no such thing as a good or bad shoot. There is legal and illegal. This was clearly legal. All UoF is sub optimal but at times, needed. You don't know the first thing about how LE UoF works. Ask...tell...make. They asked. They told. Then they made him do it. That is the reality and it is legal. He presented the required threat (Ability to cause harm, has opportunity, and has demonstrated intent via refusal/arming). Go study up on the cases that shape UoF laws. Its cut and dry. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Holy fuck. Ive never seen a bunch of heavily armed men so afraid of a dead guy before. Its hard to justify deadly force at that distance, they had distance, time and open space to their advantage. I don't see the critical threat this guy was posing. And the beanbagging... Fuck that guy should catch charges just for being an idiot. How close would you like him to be before the Police are allowed to use force? Close enough for there to be a threat. 15yds from an out outnumbered guy with a knife makes it pretty hard to articulate fear for your life, imminent threat, or whatever wording your union tells you to use. Youve got backup, long guns, less-lethal and a dog but you think the right thing to do is to dump 6 rounds in his back from 15yds as he is turning away and bending over? I get it, your LE, but that doesn't mean you have to be a robot. This is a bad shoot. There is no such thing as a good or bad shoot. There is legal and illegal. This was clearly legal. All UoF is sub optimal but at times, needed. You don't know the first thing about how LE UoF works. Ask...tell...make. They asked. They told. Then they made him do it. That is the reality and it is legal. He presented the required threat (Ability to cause harm, has opportunity, and has demonstrated intent via refusal/arming). Go study up on the cases that shape UoF laws. Its cut and dry. So your first argument was based on the fact it was getting dark and now you're making assumption to impugne my knowledge of use of force. So you think they acted justly. You still havent explained how a guy facing away from you justifies deadly force or why they used less lethal and the dog on a fucking dead guy. Justify it for us please. Learn us some use of force. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 2:14:06 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If people continue to be disappointed in the police the electorate will ask for changes in the law. It's already starting to happen. They have feelings even if they don't have facts. And it won't be cases like this that sway them it will be Crawford and Rice etc. The next generation of cops will be lucky if they don't have a statutory duty to retreat. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Care to elaberate on that? Please go into resisting a lawful arrest. Also please add the 6 hour standoff and arming ones self while under arrest during said standoff. Also what is the public fixing to do other than listen to all the technical facts of the case and base their decision on that info. If people continue to be disappointed in the police the electorate will ask for changes in the law. It's already starting to happen. They have feelings even if they don't have facts. And it won't be cases like this that sway them it will be Crawford and Rice etc. The next generation of cops will be lucky if they don't have a statutory duty to retreat. And that is really fucking bad because society will become even more chaotic than it is now. More innocent people, and more police will get hurt and killed because of it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 2:18:27 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So your first argument was based on the fact it was getting dark and now you're making assumption to impugne my knowledge of use of force. So you think they acted justly. You still havent explained how a guy facing away from you justifies deadly force or why they used less lethal and the dog on a fucking dead guy. Justify it for us please. Learn us some use of force. Why is less than lethal or K9 on a dead body even an issue? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 2:21:59 AM EDT
[#18]
He was making a move man, I had to get it on...
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 3:58:18 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So your first argument was based on the fact it was getting dark and now you're making assumption to impugne my knowledge of use of force. So you think they acted justly. You still havent explained how a guy facing away from you justifies deadly force or why they used less lethal and the dog on a fucking dead guy. Justify it for us please. Learn us some use of force. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Holy fuck. Ive never seen a bunch of heavily armed men so afraid of a dead guy before. Its hard to justify deadly force at that distance, they had distance, time and open space to their advantage. I don't see the critical threat this guy was posing. And the beanbagging... Fuck that guy should catch charges just for being an idiot. How close would you like him to be before the Police are allowed to use force? Close enough for there to be a threat. 15yds from an out outnumbered guy with a knife makes it pretty hard to articulate fear for your life, imminent threat, or whatever wording your union tells you to use. Youve got backup, long guns, less-lethal and a dog but you think the right thing to do is to dump 6 rounds in his back from 15yds as he is turning away and bending over? I get it, your LE, but that doesn't mean you have to be a robot. This is a bad shoot. There is no such thing as a good or bad shoot. There is legal and illegal. This was clearly legal. All UoF is sub optimal but at times, needed. You don't know the first thing about how LE UoF works. Ask...tell...make. They asked. They told. Then they made him do it. That is the reality and it is legal. He presented the required threat (Ability to cause harm, has opportunity, and has demonstrated intent via refusal/arming). Go study up on the cases that shape UoF laws. Its cut and dry. So your first argument was based on the fact it was getting dark and now you're making assumption to impugne my knowledge of use of force. So you think they acted justly. You still havent explained how a guy facing away from you justifies deadly force or why they used less lethal and the dog on a fucking dead guy. Justify it for us please. Learn us some use of force. Had 2 lethal weapons, was within danger radius, refused legal orders to surrender for 6 hours, becoming increasingly agitated, attempting to flee/move to possible populated area, turned to face officers after bang detonated with knives in attack posture. Go dig through the archives for the thread when this happened. Someone put together a second by second GIF of it. The suspect turned, raised the knives, got shot. They could have shot him hours earlier and it would have been justified. This would be clear to you if you knew anything about how it works. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 4:22:07 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why is less than lethal or K9 on a dead body even an issue? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
So your first argument was based on the fact it was getting dark and now you're making assumption to impugne my knowledge of use of force. So you think they acted justly. You still havent explained how a guy facing away from you justifies deadly force or why they used less lethal and the dog on a fucking dead guy. Justify it for us please. Learn us some use of force. Why is less than lethal or K9 on a dead body even an issue? because it makes them look even more retarded..the guy was clearly down for the count. Sorry, all i see is what appears to be a guy getting shot as he turned around and bent over. Cops had less lethal available to them as well as a dog...I don't see how anyone can defend these guys. What was the blade length on the knives? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 4:45:20 AM EDT
[#21]
Police state and all that
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 4:57:04 AM EDT
[#22]
In for liberal media...
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 5:35:32 AM EDT
[#23]
Fucking murderers.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 6:21:12 AM EDT
[#24]
Reasonableness is still the standard of judgment...
Absent the bang, the turn and crouch might be worthy of gunfire. But it's piss poor tactics to deploy LL and then shoot someone for turning away from the bang. You know he's armed, this has been going on for hours, so maintain distance and deploy the LL. Twitching the trigger because motion occurs after the bang isn't the same scenario is turning and raising the knives. I'd argue legal, but department policy violation. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 6:30:12 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah that was bullshit the guy was packing up and complying they didn't need to flashbang him bunch of trigger happy assholes Agreed. That was uncalled for. The police precipitated that bad outcome. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 8:34:31 AM EDT
[#26]
Nice back shot...
Booyah !!! |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:21:09 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Had 2 lethal weapons, was within danger radius, refused legal orders to surrender for 6 hours, becoming increasingly agitated, attempting to flee/move to possible populated area, turned to face officers after bang detonated with knives in attack posture. Go dig through the archives for the thread when this happened. Someone put together a second by second GIF of it. The suspect turned, raised the knives, got shot. They could have shot him hours earlier and it would have been justified. This would be clear to you if you knew anything about how it works. What's the "danger radius" and how did he get himself close enough to the officers to make that a problem? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:37:24 AM EDT
[#28]
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!!
BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 3:24:53 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy You sure about the part in red? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 3:35:25 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You sure about the part in red? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy You sure about the part in red? he did not have "a" knife he had "Two" of them one in each hand. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 3:35:40 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy  opinions of the uninformed
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:10:27 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy Former Marine? I thought it was once a Marine, always a Marine. Unless.... |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:12:12 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Former Marine? I thought it was once a Marine, always a Marine. Unless.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy Former Marine? I thought it was once a Marine, always a Marine. Unless.... Ex-Marine is the unacceptable term. Former Marine is generally acceptable. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:22:14 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ex-Marine is the unacceptable term. Former Marine is generally acceptable. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy Former Marine? I thought it was once a Marine, always a Marine. Unless.... Ex-Marine is the unacceptable term. Former Marine is generally acceptable. I sit corrected. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:32:40 PM EDT
[#35]
I assume arguendo that the decedent was a frequent flier, a bad guy, a nut, had threatened people, had two knives, had kept the cops out there for 6 hours, and was disobeying orders. All those things taken together don't justify deadly force. In the videos I've seen, the decedent was turning counterclockwise away from the cops when the shots were fired, and no potential victims are visible in the direction to which he was turning.
I have a very hard time seeing that the shots were justified at the time they were fired. Do we have an autopsy report showing the entry wounds? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:35:42 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy LOL. So much going on here. People that feel the need to add qualifiers to statements generally make me think they don't know what they're talking about. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:36:54 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ex-Marine is the unacceptable term. Former Marine is generally acceptable. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
COLD BLOOD MURDER.....Put them all in jail!!!! Homeless lives Matter....Even if he had a knife, which he did not. There pussy lives where not in danger!!!! He was 50ft. away. Simply say if necessary drop the knife or you will force me to fire on you. And they use the bean bag after killing him. What pussies!!!! BoyScout4Life.... Former Marine Former Deputy Sheriff Current WiseGuy Former Marine? I thought it was once a Marine, always a Marine. Unless.... Ex-Marine is the unacceptable term. Former Marine is generally acceptable. I've never heard a Marine say that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:37:53 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I assume arguendo that the decedent was a frequent flier, a bad guy, a nut, had threatened people, had two knives, had kept the cops out there for 6 hours, and was disobeying orders. All those things taken together don't justify deadly force. In the videos I've seen, the decedent was turning counterclockwise away from the cops when the shots were fired, and no potential victims are visible in the direction to which he was turning. I have a very hard time seeing that the shots were justified at the time they were fired. Do we have an autopsy report showing the entry wounds? A cautious frame-by-frame shows the bullet from the first shot exiting the suspect as he's facing the dog and handler. The exit of the projectile is obvious when looking at the suspect's clothing on his back and corresponds with the sound of the first shot. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:38:57 PM EDT
[#39]
ALBUQUERQUE— A New Mexico judge has dismissed a juror in the trial of two former police officers charged with second-degree murder in an on-duty shooting because she was overheard talking about a defense attorney.
The juror was excused Wednesday after a television journalist testified under oath to hearing her speaking on her cellphone outside the courthouse the night before. She reportedly told her daughter that Sam Bregman, the attorney for now-retired Detective Keith Sandy, spoke loudly in court. Jurors are under strict instructions not to discuss the case with anyone and can't mention the names of people involved. http://www.santafenewmexican.com/news/local_news/juror-dismissed-in-police-shooting-trial/article_e4d1d667-0d1a-507a-9b58-ac950532e069.html |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:39:07 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Jeez. I remember when New Mexico cops were content just banging women on their cruiser hood. New Mexico was a nice place to live back then. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:42:25 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't even of had my hand on my concealed carry if a guy with a knife was at that distance on that terrain. This video is an embarrassment for police. You wouldn't have your hand on your CC if you were forced to deal with a raving lunatic, holding two knives, at that distance? You're either stupid or you're being obtuse, because I sure as fuck would. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:45:49 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ALBUQUERQUE— A New Mexico judge has dismissed a juror in the trial of two former police officers charged with second-degree murder in an on-duty shooting because she was overheard talking about a defense attorney. The juror was excused Wednesday after a television journalist testified under oath to hearing her speaking on her cellphone outside the courthouse the night before. She reportedly told her daughter that Sam Bregman, the attorney for now-retired Detective Keith Sandy, spoke loudly in court. Jurors are under strict instructions not to discuss the case with anyone and can't mention the names of people involved. http://www.santafenewmexican.com/news/local_news/juror-dismissed-in-police-shooting-trial/article_e4d1d667-0d1a-507a-9b58-ac950532e069.html Man, they're not messing around. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:47:49 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Those dudes rolled heavy to get a bum off a hill. Who threatened to stab several people on the nearby walking path, hence why LE was called http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-to-someone-with-a-hammer-everything-looks-like-a-nail-mark-twain-87-46-45.jpg This quote is always good for a laugh when used in this context. Every week of work, I'm a social worker, a roadside mechanic, a medical first responder, an animal control officer, a taxi service, a mental health crisis worker, and a cop. I've not killed any persons or dogs. Take your trendy bullshit quote and 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:56:05 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 9:59:34 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. I find that surprising. Even the FBI determined that there was insufficient evidence for charges. That DA had to circumvent the GJ to make it happen, and we have a pretty good idea as to why she might do that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 10:01:50 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. Good doesn't necessarily = legal shoot. I'd argue no shooting is good. It's actually a giant shit sandwich for all parties. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 10:02:51 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Trying to be as objective as I can for what it's worth: I predict the cop will be found not guilty and to not have violated department policy. "Normal" don't like this shoot because the cop likes killing. Not being objective: I hope the cop gets an honest psyche eval and retired from police work permanently. I don't want him anywhere around me or anyone else I care about. Yet, nearly to a person, the people posting who actually live in Albuquerque are fine with it. In fact, personally, there's at least one other crazy bum I wish APD had killed before he was able to murder someone I knew. I do not know anyone here in Abq (including fellow LEO's) who believe this was a 'good shoot'. I don't believe you. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 10:05:07 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Had 2 lethal weapons, was within danger radius, refused legal orders to surrender for 6 hours, becoming increasingly agitated, attempting to flee/move to possible populated area, turned to face officers after bang detonated with knives in attack posture. Your assertions are flawed He agreed to surrender He had become far less agitated He wasn't attempting to flee or move to a populated area He agreed to come down with the officers He turned to face them after they REscalated the situation....knowing he became agitated each time they had done so prior He never moved towards them with the knives |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 10:05:47 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good doesn't necessarily = legal shoot. I'd argue no shooting is good. It's actually a giant shit sandwich for all parties. It doesn't have to have been the best solution in order to be legal. If it was legally an option, then it was legal. There's no 20/20 hindsight applied to what a reasonable LEO would have done given the information he had at the time of the action. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/21/2016 10:06:04 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't believe you. Want a cookie? |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
