I think man boobs are coc;)

Holy shit!!  

you still can't figure out the reason for this particular rule?.....here's a hint, it ain't a "puritan" thing. It is simply because the kiddies here have to push the envelope.

 
So I've been told.

Dang, those Eleveners are getting uppity!

In his defense he's not the first person that has started acting like a mod the past few days.

That's one of the things that concerns me, With tighter reins, there will be more people trying to emulate Dave_A and bait people into saying things that will get them banned. He had essentially declared himself Mod, Jury and Executioner.

Many people don't have enough sense to just walk away.

We're guests. We're customers. We're on a front porch. We're on a happy adventure in the rain Forrest. Whatever. '

GoatBoy is trying to interject more civility into the process and doesn't like the harsh tones of GD. Many of us are trying to clarify and understand what the limits/rules/off-limits areas will be.

To say the line is clear is not entirely true one bit.

Additionally, GB has made it clear that while humor is not off limits, biting humor that drips in sarcasm and funny pictures should be used with caution as they could be misinterpreted. It shouldn't be that confusing when those of use who use a healthy dose of humor, especially sarcasm, asked for clarification. (That those questions annoyed people is somewhat amusing to me). Very frankly, stifling the discussion to merely technical back and forth with no humor is very dull to me. As a paying customer I respect that GB's wishes and assume he will respect me spending time elsewhere should the product I am buying stop being worth the money.

Further complicating matters is that some of those enforcing the line have been, shall we say, less than consistent in placing the line in the same spot.

That would pretty much encouraging smarter trolling, which is actually more dangerous.  I mean there are some trolls that just suck at it, and that's why it's funny.  You can spot what they're doing from a mile away.  Then you have the ones where you think either this guy is a master troll, a fucking idiot, or just an asshole.  That's where it gets tricky.

I still don't know what to make of our own resident Lon Horiuchi.

There are/were people here under 30 I never would have guessed that they were based on their maturity.

Some over 30 happen to get off on being asshats.

Seems like it is more of a "I really want to say something about this but I'm not allowed to say what  I want to about this...."

Because sometimes there really is nothing 'good' to be said about a situation....but merely pointing out the 'bad' in a situation, even without insult,  can hurt feelings.  

We're never gonna handle some of these issues if we cannot discuss them,  burying them like a cat buries shit does not eliminate the stink....

Then perhaps you should have another secret forum for people who have opinions contrary to the opinions of the special people.   A place where those people can safely express their feelings without fear.

If you are going to be honest with yourself, you should consider the fact that creating these special groups, is what led directly to the dissension you see today.     Human nature being what it is, it really couldn't go any other way.  

Here is one thing I would like to see addressed. I would like to see the ignore button fixed so that when you ignore someone you don't get to see their post at all and they don't get quoted.

Never...

Mines more like a "click here if you want to read something that is probably retarded" button.

A bit off topic but don't let them get under your skin.

In the final analysis, if someone doesn't "pay your bills", who gives a fuck what they think of you?

I certainly don't care.............just laugh it off and be done with it.

Heck, I just use it as a marker---I read every post, but if I have to click to read it, I know there's some reason I wanted to indicate something about that person.

e.g.:  I click to read what Grizzledumpferdatch posted in a thread about some interesting scientific topic.  I see that what he wrote makes sense and seems valid, but since it is flatly contradicting the premise of the OP, I go to my ignore list and see why I marked Grizzle---and I see that he's a 9/11 truther who also thinks we never landed on the moon and that electrons are a manufactured good.  So I know not to take his post very seriously after all.

Wait, you don't have an SQL database of your ignore list you can just query?

The "No Comment"   comment, is a very mild form of protest against censorship.   The user of that phrase is basically saying "I wish I could offer my opinion on this, but I'm it might get me a lock or ban."         It's very similar in that regard to the old standby "COC"     the poster is saying, "I wish I could speak my mind, but I won't, because I value my membership, more.  

Did you honestly not know this?       Arfcom serves many functions, but one of the chief reasons people come here, is to voice their opinions about things which they feel stifled about in real life.  

So, the real question is:  Are people allowed that mild forms of protest, or is that considered "Trolling"?    

I can look up what an SQL database is, and have, but for all practical purposes it might as well be a shorthand way of describing a list of good BBQ places to me.

I do the same thing.  Too many people on here for me to remember everyone.

What I take away from reading the last ten or twenty pages is this; Goatboy doesn't know how GD has been operating for the last decade. He doesn't read or participate here, so he doesn't know the culture he has created with various decisions about how to join the forum, or what tweeking the CoC over time, has created.

For a time it was against the CoC to troll. It was written right in there. Mods and staff took action on it, and members took the trolls to The Pit as well. The Pit was very effective at getting rid of obvious trolls, and often it would end with the troll being found familiar (retread) and banned right there.

About the time of the military forum April Fools trolling month, the trolling rule was changed. Suddenly trolling was a sport. The email rules were relaxed about the same time, which allowed banned members to make new accounts faster than staff could ban them. It caused a lot of grief, and it raised the level of traffic as well. Eventually it became a huge problem and the email requirements were tightened up again.


The result has been;
When a new person posts in GD, the first knee jerk response is "welcome back" or "what was your name before you were banned?". That is rude, but it is often a fair question and an accurate assessment of what is going on.

As an obvious troll would go about his task of making threads and trolling people, we became more snarky and cynical about the troll. But since trolling creates traffic, the troll was allowed to persist and the membership became more and more abusive toward the troll. Now The Pit is for "conflict resolution" and making friends, not dragging a troll there and telling him to shut up, fuck off, find another place to spread his troll dung, etc.

So now trolling is against the CoC again, but the rules on what trolling is has changed. From what I understand, "in", "+1" and several other non-replies are now not allowed. But I can't tell you what is safe to post and what will get me in trouble.

From now on, if anyone says anything insulting to a member regarding gay marriage, homosexuality, or transgenders, I will be mashing the report button and expecting results. And that...is going to piss off a LOT of people. But if we are going to treat each other with respect, there is no room for insulting queers gays or lesbians by telling them they have a mental disorder or that they are not welcome here. I guess we won't be insulting obvious anti-gun plants or such as that, either.

We need the troll rules written down in black and white with no room for questions or personal judgement calls if this is the direction you want to take the site.

Edit; I edited my post (transparently) to remove a slur that rolled off of my tongue. The word doesn't bother me in particular, but it is disparaging, so I changed it. To clarify further, I am not exactly 100% straight. I'm a closeted gay that has been married for years and raised children. So...yeah. If we are going to be a polite society, I will report gay bashing every time I see it.

 
That thread has really taken on a life of its own.  He never really believed that--it was parody!  He even admitted in a later thread that his own grandparents were electron farmers during the depression.

You're exactly who this thread is targeting, but you simply don't get it, do you?

I think that Goatboy, and members of the private forums should know about the following;

It has been stated in one of the threads here, and also on another site, that one of the members of the restricted LEO forum has screenshots and information pulled from "the thread", and has mused about posting it on another forum.

There is a saying about paying members. "$24 doesn't buy you class". In other words, there are undesirables in EVERY group here. What you say in your private forum may possibly show up on some other website, or become shared in some other way. You should think twice before you spill your guts in private.

Something to think about.

You don't have freedom of speech on private property.

I only lasted 1 day with an empty ignore list.

eta: it would be nice if the reason text would display so i dont have to go back to my profile to see why i ignored them.

I am relieved that someone can define a universally fitting description of 'Dick".    Please explain to the rest of us, thanks!

This is exactly the discussion that preceded the WAHTF meltdown. That had been brewing for years, and when it finally boiled over it was obvious that none of the problem children were willing to mend their ways. Ed Sr appealed for reasonable behavior and was ignored. A few were banned, more left of their own accord. It's taken years for that forum to return to a functional condition.

That attitude, and internet anonymity leads to poor behavior. Arfcom is exactly real life, and its best contribution is for firearms advocacy.  

At the risk of sounding like a total drama queen I glossed over pretty much every thread in GD this morning.

Any thread that might hold the slightest shred of controversy suddenly didn't seem worth opening.

Sorry, but there it is. Suddenly, having to measure my words, carefully consider which one of 30,000 members might possibly, could, maybe, if they read it a certain way, if they squinted real hard might maybe get their panties in a wad take umbrage and find discomfort in my words sucked the life out of posting. Most of my gifs are out the window because someone maybe might could get offended and think I'm being a dick.

Not saying I'm the words greatest poster, and me not commenting on much doesn't effect the board one iota. I do reckon I'm not the only one who thought "I have something interesting to share...........nah".

So.....I guess I could do the 24/7 thing and say "good evening" to everybody?

 
Free Grizzledumpferdach!

Can I get a ruling on "bless your heart"?  It's a well known Southern euphemism for "you're a fucking idiot".

I can attest to that.  Many years ago I was given a timeout 'of indeterminate length' from being able to post in GD for making a joke that violated what was a recent warning from a particular Mod to all members.  This new 'rule' was implemented in the form of a thread.





I e-mailed the Mod and told him that I hadn't seen the thread, and couldn't find anything in the CoC that I had violated.  I tried to get him to see that my joke was, in fact, reinforcing exactly what he was trying to convey.  I e-mailed him several more times, each time getting the response: "I'll let you out when I'm good and ready."





After a year of me being on my best behavior, I e-mailed him again, and asked whether he might be taking this personally.  He did not like that.  Not one bit... And I got another year on the sidelines.





I could have e-mailed Ed Sr., but I really felt like it would do no good.  This Mod had been given the power to create a rule that was not part of the CoC, enforce that rule, and mete out punishment for what he believed was a violation of that rule.  I simply accepted that that's the way things were done around here.  I've accepted that that's the way they are done ever since then.





There is no court here.  There is only a room with some couches and a TV set, and hosts who decide who and who should not be invited back.  And I don't have a problem with that.  What I and so many others expressing opinions in this thread want is more consistency in how rules are applied, and rule-breakers are punished.





I think that's the real crux of the matter, and I'm glad it's being addressed.





 

Of course you do.  But the owners of the property have the right to remove you.
 

I could not care less if the entire thread were posted in its entirety. I don't believe I ever posted in it. I think it would be quite entertaining to watch the butthurt flow. My ignore list probably had more names on it.

 

jfc

I've never had an account lock or ban (that I know of), but I have had some thread locks.  I only remember one involuntary one, actually.  It was a thread about a libertarian leaning Republican candidate (Rand Paul).  Locked by TBK (of course).  I don't remember ever hearing from him after trying to contact him, I don't remember how I tried to contact him.  But I did bring it up in a few threads he was active in so it wouldn't be something he could just avoid.  I do remember sending a PM to another mod that I thought was more level headed, and that mod ignored me as well.  Finally TBK responded inside one of the threads I called him out in.  But it was still a BS reason for locking the original thread.  Or so I thought, of course.  Others agreed with him, others did not.

I feel like the guy at the gun store that wants to look at an HK in the display case, but all the guys behind the counter wearing Glock shirts just walk away when I ask to see it.  Consequently, TBK and his attitude that appears to be shared by some other staff/admin is 90% of the reason I haven't contributed a dime to this site.

Never seen so many people whine about not being able to act like a dick. What a bitchfest. I've been here for a little while and have never received so much as a warning. The only contact I ever had was a request to change my avatar because too much cartoon cleavage was showing. If it is so difficult to keep you emotions from controlling your mouth maybe this isn't the place for you.

 

If you're going to have an ever-evolving set of written and unwritten rules, vague standards, 100 different people trying to apply them ...

Then there should be no rules, only a benevolent dictator and his deputies, whose word is final.

No rules to interpret, no bitching and moaning, only a swift banhammer if anyone acts a fool.

I'm fine with that. In fact, I was a mod on a (very different kind of) forum years ago, and that's exactly how it worked. But there was no pretense of rules, fairness, etc. there as we see at AR15.com. So either drop the pretense of that and let people decide whether to stay and how to act, or do the "rule of law" thing correctly.

sooooooo.....

how many people got whacked in this thread?

Last page I read was page 9.  

and CLIFFS?

To add, arfcom is filled with turds reliving/living their adolescence who have nothing to add but bull$hit.  They never create interesting posts for discussion, nothing intellectual.  All they do is shoot down people and crap in posts.  There are people like this in real life as well.  I call them snipers because they simply sit back and just shoot at people.  They appear edgy because they never have to invent anything or take risks.  So these turds need to be flushed at every chance.


Like kids, some want or need to test their boundaries, getting kicked out is surely one way to teach them.

 

This is an impressive example of the kind, gentle discourse GoatBoy is looking for.

I'm not saying I want to go in and "act like a dick" I'm saying I'm avoiding posting because (1) the rules aren't clear (2) I have to worry about 30000+ people potentially getting ass-rash over something I post and (3) the mods all interpret things vastly differently.

What I'm talking about is not even in the same universe, let alone planet, as "whining about not being able to act like a dick".

Holy shit, you were a mod on /b/.

Cliffs:  "Don't shit in the sandbox."

*Where shit is vaguely defined and will vary from mod to mod.

If they had it they'd be burning troll accounts left and right spamming it here.

The island of misfit toys is not exactly a shining beacon of self control, and they're generally so full of shit their eyes are brown.  That's how they got there.  

well that's a shitty way to put it.

If you are so scared how your words are interpreted you must be thinking in your mind that you're dickish or a smart ass. I don't know your posts enough to to say.  How have thousands of members gotten along for years without this conundrum? This isn't the huge, ground breaking event people are making it out to be.


 

ETA: If you think my post was out of line, feel free to hit report and let a mod decide.