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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:49:07 AM EDT
[#1]
Someone will do a couple years in club fed, if any at all. Fucking financial crimes like this rarely hurt the rich, but bounce a check and you'll be doing 5 to life.
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:54:12 AM EDT
[#2]
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Holy shit From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" 1) That is a HUGE difference. 2) Did you all not read the fucking TOS? If you give the money to buy silver, and don't actually buy silver, what happens is silver actually goes up in price and then you want your silver? They wouldn't have the money to buy it. It sounds to me like a scam where they were counting on silver to tank but in the mean time spent too much of the money they were supposed to be holding. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holy shit From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" 1) That is a HUGE difference. 2) Did you all not read the fucking TOS? If you give the money to buy silver, and don't actually buy silver, what happens is silver actually goes up in price and then you want your silver? They wouldn't have the money to buy it. It sounds to me like a scam where they were counting on silver to tank but in the mean time spent too much of the money they were supposed to be holding. Sounds like a bank with cash. All accounts might total 20mil, but only 10% of the 20mil is really available should everyone withdrawal. I bet we see the owner on American Greed in a few years for selling silver and "storing" it so that every single ounce is promised to 4 different people. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:58:01 AM EDT
[#3]
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I will. They offered a discount if you sent a check in the mail, thats why I was doing it that way. Now you know why. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:07:45 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You didn't have ANYTHING stored there; there was no physical metal for you to actually go put your hands on. You gave them money, and they made a notation in a ledger that you had "ownership" of a nonexistent commodity. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I have/had 5 oz in Canadian Maple Leaf rounds stored there. I was waiting to buy a few more before having them all shipped to me. I guess I better start doing some research on what, if anything, I can do to get my rounds. You didn't have ANYTHING stored there; there was no physical metal for you to actually go put your hands on. You gave them money, and they made a notation in a ledger that you had "ownership" of a nonexistent commodity. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:09:13 AM EDT
[#5]
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Not at all. Banks might not have the physical cash, but dollars is dollars. You put in $1000, they add $1000 to their pile. When you come back you can take out $1000. Inflation may or made no have made your $1000 "worth" more or less, but $1000 is $1000. And while the physical amount of cash isn't as large as the amount on the books, we could theoretically pull out the money from the banks and everyone is even. They were selling a commodity. Which fluctuates. So if I buy $1000 worth a silver, which translates to 10oz (or what ever, simple numbers for example), they should have added 10oz of silver to their pile. If they don't buy the actual product, and the price of that item goes up, how are they going to pay you back when you want what you paid for? Now your 10oz went up in price and is now worth $1500. You try to pull out that 10oz and they lose money on the deal. If everyone demanded the silver they were supposed to have, they would come up short even if they still had every time others sent them. Aside from a stupid business plan, I don't know why anyone would give someone money for silver, and they don't actually buy the silver. Logic says if they don't buy the silver and just sit on your money, that is no different than you putting it in the bank and then pulling it out and buying silver when you want it. Only at least in a bank you are FDIC insured the money will be there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" SCAMSCAMSCAMSCAMSCAM Banks work the same way. Try to cash a check for $100,000. Your going to have to wait a day or two. It was a scam but other legitimate businesses work like this. Not at all. Banks might not have the physical cash, but dollars is dollars. You put in $1000, they add $1000 to their pile. When you come back you can take out $1000. Inflation may or made no have made your $1000 "worth" more or less, but $1000 is $1000. And while the physical amount of cash isn't as large as the amount on the books, we could theoretically pull out the money from the banks and everyone is even. They were selling a commodity. Which fluctuates. So if I buy $1000 worth a silver, which translates to 10oz (or what ever, simple numbers for example), they should have added 10oz of silver to their pile. If they don't buy the actual product, and the price of that item goes up, how are they going to pay you back when you want what you paid for? Now your 10oz went up in price and is now worth $1500. You try to pull out that 10oz and they lose money on the deal. If everyone demanded the silver they were supposed to have, they would come up short even if they still had every time others sent them. Aside from a stupid business plan, I don't know why anyone would give someone money for silver, and they don't actually buy the silver. Logic says if they don't buy the silver and just sit on your money, that is no different than you putting it in the bank and then pulling it out and buying silver when you want it. Only at least in a bank you are FDIC insured the money will be there. I think you contradict your own statement. The deposit to a bank for $100 is recorded and you can withdraw that $100 at anytime, but if every member showed up to withdraw their full amount the bank would be in trouble. Your $100 deposit results in 10% held by the bank and 90% given out as loans. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:10:30 AM EDT
[#6]
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Banks work the same way. Try to cash a check for $100,000. Your going to have to wait a day or two. It was a scam but other legitimate businesses work like this. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" SCAMSCAMSCAMSCAMSCAM Banks work the same way. Try to cash a check for $100,000. Your going to have to wait a day or two. It was a scam but other legitimate businesses work like this. It's a bit different when you're talking about fiat currency and banks with solvency requirements and deposit insurance, but yeah. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:15:57 AM EDT
[#7]
Wait, you mean I can start a business where people send me money and I just have to send them a message saying I sold them something?
Holy shit.    
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:16:05 AM EDT
[#8]
Looks like a pyramid scheme feeding off on the rise of gold price. Now that gold has gone down 35%, they cant pay their investors. This is why I never pay for paper gold, I want the real thing in my hands.
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:16:34 AM EDT
[#9]
Is this what is known as a "Naked Short?"
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:17:03 AM EDT
[#10]
I thought precious medals was the way to invest. Glenn Beck says so
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:17:51 AM EDT
[#11]
Sorry to hear, but I value the lesson learned.
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Posted: 7/30/2015 1:18:55 AM EDT
[#12]
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Looks like a pyramid scheme feeding off on the rise of gold price. Now that gold has gone down 35%, they cant pay their investors. This is why I never pay for paper gold, I want the real thing in my hands. It's my belief that commodities shouldn't be traded on "paper" at all, too easy to manipulate and very damaging. That said, OP was buying real bullion, just never got it. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 2:08:16 AM EDT
[#13]
I thought that you were supposed to get your gold from Rosland Capital. At least that's where William Devane gets his from.
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Posted: 7/30/2015 2:27:42 AM EDT
[#14]
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People who think precious metals are a good investment are ideal candidates for a swindle. I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 2:31:49 AM EDT
[#15]
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I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People who think precious metals are a good investment are ideal candidates for a swindle. I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? Some of them have legitimate scientific and industrial purposes and are hard to come by. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 2:38:16 AM EDT
[#16]
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Some of them have legitimate scientific and industrial purposes and are hard to come by. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People who think precious metals are a good investment are ideal candidates for a swindle. I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? Some of them have legitimate scientific and industrial purposes and are hard to come by. Sure, but I don't think that's what's going on. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:00:18 AM EDT
[#17]
Their value is based on much firmer ground than USDs, that's for damn sure. You can't print gold/silver and even if no one in the world wanted gold/silver for investments or jewelry, magically, it has commercial uses.
I wouldn't call pms an investment, but that doesn't mean they aren't worth buying. They are a way to store buying power and shtf bartering goodies if nothing else. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:03:39 AM EDT
[#18]
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At least im out only $538. Some of the people on the 3rd party forum are out $20,000 and more. Plus they had "their" bullion and bars stored in BD's vaults. Those people are idiots. Just as shady as central banks "leasing" gold reserves. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:11:18 AM EDT
[#19]
This is why I used to use APmex, and just throw the bricks into the safe after they were delivered.
When it was time to sell I took it to the swap meet coin store and they guy paid me cash for them. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:17:36 AM EDT
[#20]
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Will they do a charge back on an insolvent company that appears to be involved in massive fraud? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And people wonder why I only pay with my Discover Card. I never have to worry about crap like this. most CC companies let you dispute a charge if the merchant doesn't deliver This. Anyone outed like this, call your credit card company if you paid with them. Most have a 90 day charge back. Some even will allow longer depending on the terms. Call your credit card company and discuss this with them. Keep in mind that a ATM bank card with a visa logo on it is not a credit card. Will they do a charge back on an insolvent company that appears to be involved in massive fraud? well, yes and no. Under the terms of their buyer protection you are covered by them. per example. Visa protects against fraud, and even extends warranties on products. also as part of their benefit they even may cover an item under theft they will attempt the chargeback to recoup their losses. http://usa.visa.com/personal/security/zero-liability.jsp EDIT: the above link is regarding unauthorized transactions. this would be considered fraudulently used. per example, you authorized the charge, and the vendor did not send the product in an attempt to defraud the consumer. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:24:01 AM EDT
[#21]
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I thought that you were supposed to get your gold from Rosland Capital. At least that's where William Devane gets his from. He gets the real stuff and stores it himself. If you buy metals, buy and hold it yourself. Let's assume the SHTF and dollars aren't any good, but you have been buying gold or silver from a company and they store it. Let's assume they are above board, and they have the coins in hand. So you call them on the phone (if it works) the pull your account and walk it over to Fed-Ex. (If they are open and their planes are flying and their trucks have gas to deliver it to you.) But you get your rolls. So you go to the market and hand them a $20 gold piece, tell them it is worth $2000. How well do you think that is going to work? Ask them to shave a little off the side? |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:27:11 AM EDT
[#22]
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Their value is based on much firmer ground than USDs, that's for damn sure. You can't print gold/silver and even if no one in the world wanted gold/silver for investments or jewelry, magically, it has commercial uses. I wouldn't call pms an investment, but that doesn't mean they aren't worth buying. They are a way to store buying power and shtf bartering goodies if nothing else. "That's nice, I'll trade you 2 hams for it." |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 3:46:14 AM EDT
[#23]
I think brass and lead would serve you better.
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Posted: 7/30/2015 4:33:40 AM EDT
[#24]
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So whose marketing spiel did you believe. Yo0u really think PMs are going to be good in a barter situation when 98% of the people have no clue what you are talking about. "Hey, Rufus, this here piece of metal is worth $300 " "That's nice, I'll trade you 2 hams for it." Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Their value is based on much firmer ground than USDs, that's for damn sure. You can't print gold/silver and even if no one in the world wanted gold/silver for investments or jewelry, magically, it has commercial uses. I wouldn't call pms an investment, but that doesn't mean they aren't worth buying. They are a way to store buying power and shtf bartering goodies if nothing else. "That's nice, I'll trade you 2 hams for it." As I see it, it's transportable wealth preservation for AFTER shtf. If you have to trade your gold for ham to get through shtf, then you're doing it wrong. You trade your ham for other people's gold, then when shit gets back to normal, you are goddamn JP Morgan. Historical hypothetical scenario: You are 1939 German Jew. Buy gold with your Reichsmarks and go hide in a Portugese cave. 1945 rolls around, you come out, hop a freighter to USA, use your gold to buy real estate in Manhattan. Disclaimer: I own zero gold. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 4:34:15 AM EDT
[#25]
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Holy shit From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" 1) That is a HUGE difference. 2) Did you all not read the fucking TOS? If you give the money to buy silver, and don't actually buy silver, what happens is silver actually goes up in price and then you want your silver? They wouldn't have the money to buy it. It sounds to me like a scam where they were counting on silver to tank but in the mean time spent too much of the money they were supposed to be holding. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holy shit From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" 1) That is a HUGE difference. 2) Did you all not read the fucking TOS? If you give the money to buy silver, and don't actually buy silver, what happens is silver actually goes up in price and then you want your silver? They wouldn't have the money to buy it. It sounds to me like a scam where they were counting on silver to tank but in the mean time spent too much of the money they were supposed to be holding. This is the case with a LOT of storage places. You're buying paper. Never ever ever ever ever ever do this. Sorry you got hosed guys. Always take possession of the stuff you buy! |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 4:43:41 AM EDT
[#26]
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At least im out only $538. Some of the people on the 3rd party forum are out $20,000 and more. Plus they had "their" bullion and bars stored in BD's vaults. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Ugh. This happened to another company whose name I can't recall at the moment. Jack Spirko of the Survival Podcast recommended them and, when it became obvious the ship was sinking, made a video and stood with them, telling everyone it was a solid company and would bounce back in no time. Shortly thereafter, they had their assets seized by the court. Apparently, quite a few people got hosed in the same manner as you are getting hosed right now. Before that happened, I thought Spirko was pretty suspect. After that happened, I was positive. At least im out only $538. Some of the people on the 3rd party forum are out $20,000 and more. Plus they had "their" bullion and bars stored in BD's vaults. I've ordered from them many times in the past. Never really understood the storage in their vaults. If it's not in my hands I don't have it. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 4:45:36 AM EDT
[#27]
Holy crap that sucks.
 Sorry for your luck not getting your PMs OP.
I use JM Bullion and Provident and every time I see the "IRA precious metals" and "precious metals storage" options I think to myself "if you don't have it in your hand you don't own it." and it looks like a lot of people got burned. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 5:16:25 AM EDT
[#28]
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Are you talking about social security? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I have/had 5 oz in Canadian Maple Leaf rounds stored there. I was waiting to buy a few more before having them all shipped to me. I guess I better start doing some research on what, if anything, I can do to get my rounds. You didn't have ANYTHING stored there; there was no physical metal for you to actually go put your hands on. You gave them money, and they made a notation in a ledger that you had "ownership" of a nonexistent commodity. Sure. At least when USG goes under, SS will be the least of our worries. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 5:19:57 AM EDT
[#29]
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Their value is based on much firmer ground than USDs, that's for damn sure. You can't print gold/silver and even if no one in the world wanted gold/silver for investments or jewelry, magically, it has commercial uses. I wouldn't call pms an investment, but that doesn't mean they aren't worth buying. They are a way to store buying power and shtf bartering goodies if nothing else. You shouldn't need more than 30 seconds of concentrated thought to realize why buying PMs now in order to barter during SHTF is a horrible idea. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 5:28:23 AM EDT
[#30]
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yeah Tulving went tits up last year Wow I purchased gold from them in the 90s. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 6:28:02 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: . You can file a claim as an unsecured creditor in their bankruptcy since they are under protection now and you are probably not going to see anything because you are not considered a secured creditor. Big fish will get 20 cents on the dollar, all little fish get screwed. I know hindsight is 20/20, but why would you deal with a company with their track record and only being in business 15 years? How does a company that sells a product with a built in profit and buys its product from people that HAVE to sell at a loss (again built in profit for Bullion Direct) go out of business? I will answer my own question, it is fraud or they had a criminal working there that stole inventory! They are not members of the BBB and only have complaints listed against them, not a good company to send a check to. Also however made the comment that this is why they use their Discover card, if they take credit cards you are being ripped off for what you paid for because nobody that works in the fixed daily priced metals market can afford to give away 2 to 4 percent margin on credit card fees unless they are ripping you off big time on the price or not actually selling you what you think you bought. The company I deal with has been in business since 1973 and I have been buying and selling with them since 1981. They are a member of the BBB and have an A+ rating. They offer fair pricing and line up deals when they can for additional savings. You place your order, get a total based on market, wire the money, and your order is immediately shipped out insured. When you sell, they receive the metal/coins, they verify it once received, immediately wire the money to your account. Its called good business and trust. If you can't trust the Metals Company you are dealing with and need to use a credit card to protect yourself, you are dealing with the wrong Metals Company and I can guarantee you are over paying for what you are receiving. What track record? Were they known to be scammers five years ago? Documentation? 15 years is a long time. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 6:40:30 AM EDT
[#32]
Why?
Why would anyone have a company store PMs for them instead of taking possession? |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 6:42:03 AM EDT
[#33]
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This guy gets it. It also pays to have your metal delivered not stored at some warehouse on your behalf. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And people wonder why I only pay with my Discover Card. I never have to worry about crap like this. This guy gets it. It also pays to have your metal delivered not stored at some warehouse on your behalf. Yep. If you're worried about someone breaking in and stealing it, put it in a mason jar and bury it in the flower bed or something. 
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Posted: 7/30/2015 6:50:41 AM EDT
[#34]
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What track record? Were they known to be scammers five years ago? Documentation? 15 years is a long time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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. You can file a claim as an unsecured creditor in their bankruptcy since they are under protection now and you are probably not going to see anything because you are not considered a secured creditor. Big fish will get 20 cents on the dollar, all little fish get screwed. I know hindsight is 20/20, but why would you deal with a company with their track record and only being in business 15 years? How does a company that sells a product with a built in profit and buys its product from people that HAVE to sell at a loss (again built in profit for Bullion Direct) go out of business? I will answer my own question, it is fraud or they had a criminal working there that stole inventory! They are not members of the BBB and only have complaints listed against them, not a good company to send a check to. Also however made the comment that this is why they use their Discover card, if they take credit cards you are being ripped off for what you paid for because nobody that works in the fixed daily priced metals market can afford to give away 2 to 4 percent margin on credit card fees unless they are ripping you off big time on the price or not actually selling you what you think you bought. The company I deal with has been in business since 1973 and I have been buying and selling with them since 1981. They are a member of the BBB and have an A+ rating. They offer fair pricing and line up deals when they can for additional savings. You place your order, get a total based on market, wire the money, and your order is immediately shipped out insured. When you sell, they receive the metal/coins, they verify it once received, immediately wire the money to your account. Its called good business and trust. If you can't trust the Metals Company you are dealing with and need to use a credit card to protect yourself, you are dealing with the wrong Metals Company and I can guarantee you are over paying for what you are receiving. What track record? Were they known to be scammers five years ago? Documentation? 15 years is a long time. Not really. 15 years mean they started in between the Y2K scares and Post 9/11 Scares. If it was a scam, that's a damn good run
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Posted: 7/30/2015 7:53:46 AM EDT
[#35]
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I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People who think precious metals are a good investment are ideal candidates for a swindle. I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? What value does currency have? |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 7:55:18 AM EDT
[#36]
If you can't hold it you don't own it.
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Posted: 7/30/2015 7:57:46 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's some pretty massive fraud. Also, Silver and gold have been going DOWN in price due to the Fed. Since these bullion companies really depend on precious metal prices RISING in the long term, other bullion companies may also be in trouble. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 7:59:49 AM EDT
[#38]
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APMEX jmbullion.com is usually cheaper. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 8:20:07 AM EDT
[#39]
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Ugh. This happened to another company whose name I can't recall at the moment. Jack Spirko of the Survival Podcast recommended them and, when it became obvious the ship was sinking, made a video and stood with them, telling everyone it was a solid company and would bounce back in no time. Shortly thereafter, they had their assets seized by the court. Apparently, quite a few people got hosed in the same manner as you are getting hosed right now. Before that happened, I thought Spirko was pretty suspect. After that happened, I was positive. Mulligan Mint |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 8:52:33 AM EDT
[#40]
Got Mt. Goxxed eh???
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Posted: 7/30/2015 8:57:35 AM EDT
[#41]
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What value does currency have? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People who think precious metals are a good investment are ideal candidates for a swindle. I'm starting to realize that. What value does it actually have? What value does currency have? Faith (with a heavy dose of ignorance).
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Posted: 7/30/2015 10:40:10 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like a pyramid scheme feeding off on the rise of gold price. Now that gold has gone down 35%, they cant pay their investors. This is why I never pay for paper gold, I want the real thing in my hands. This. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 10:56:03 AM EDT
[#43]
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Tulving? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Ugh. This happened to another company whose name I can't recall at the moment. Jack Spirko of the Survival Podcast recommended them and, when it became obvious the ship was sinking, made a video and stood with them, telling everyone it was a solid company and would bounce back in no time. Shortly thereafter, they had their assets seized by the court. Apparently, quite a few people got hosed in the same manner as you are getting hosed right now. Before that happened, I thought Spirko was pretty suspect. After that happened, I was positive. Tulving? No, I went and looked it up--it was the Mulligan Mint, also out of Texas. They went belly up with lots of unfulfilled orders on the books. The proprietor, Jack Spirko's best buddy Rob Gray, ended up abandoning ship and starting a new silver coin mint...in Indonesia (or Malaysia, I can't remember). They sold coins under TSPMint.com, CoinsForTheCause.com, OpenCurrency.com, and who knows how many other WWW fronts. Their bankruptcy caught the attention of the Wall Street Journal: From the WSJ piece:
Mulligan Mint’s business targets an antiestablishment clientele who feel estranged by traditional banking; its Deluminati coin, for example, “says no to inflation, crony capitalism and all-powerful government and yes to individual liberty, economic independence and opportunity.” A Web-advertised one-ounce copper coin reflects the image of Tea Party hero and former U.S. Rep. Ron Paul, while another one asks in copper, “Who is John Galt?” Perhaps a better question to ask Mulligan Mint executives: Where did the silver go? “That’s the big question,” Mulligan Mint President Rob Gray told Bankruptcy Beat. “We don’t really know.” Lots of people got left holding the bag. The empty bag, that is. ETA: Quoted:
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Ugh. This happened to another company whose name I can't recall at the moment. Jack Spirko of the Survival Podcast recommended them and, when it became obvious the ship was sinking, made a video and stood with them, telling everyone it was a solid company and would bounce back in no time. Shortly thereafter, they had their assets seized by the court. Apparently, quite a few people got hosed in the same manner as you are getting hosed right now. Before that happened, I thought Spirko was pretty suspect. After that happened, I was positive. Mulligan Mint Hah! I could have saved myself the trouble. That's it! |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 11:15:51 AM EDT
[#44]
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Banks work the same way. Try to cash a check for $100,000. Your going to have to wait a day or two. It was a scam but other legitimate businesses work like this. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" SCAMSCAMSCAMSCAMSCAM Banks work the same way. Try to cash a check for $100,000. Your going to have to wait a day or two. It was a scam but other legitimate businesses work like this. Banks are required to have certain percentage of deposits, I think it's ten percent. It appears BD had about 3%. Mind you, they should have had 100% because it's a physical asset but the comparison show apples to oranges. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:07:59 PM EDT
[#45]
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I think you contradict your own statement. The deposit to a bank for $100 is recorded and you can withdraw that $100 at anytime, but if every member showed up to withdraw their full amount the bank would be in trouble. Your $100 deposit results in 10% held by the bank and 90% given out as loans. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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From the site: "Most importantly, they show an inventory of the IDS vault that I calculate as having a value of roughly $633,000, compared to the estimated $20M+ of metal that Bullion Direct stored for customers. The declaration states: "[Bullion Direct] interpreted the provisions of the Terms of Service agreement such that when a customer placed an order, the precious metal was not actually purchased unless the customer agreed to take actual delivery of the product."" SCAMSCAMSCAMSCAMSCAM Banks work the same way. Try to cash a check for $100,000. Your going to have to wait a day or two. It was a scam but other legitimate businesses work like this. Not at all. Banks might not have the physical cash, but dollars is dollars. You put in $1000, they add $1000 to their pile. When you come back you can take out $1000. Inflation may or made no have made your $1000 "worth" more or less, but $1000 is $1000. And while the physical amount of cash isn't as large as the amount on the books, we could theoretically pull out the money from the banks and everyone is even. They were selling a commodity. Which fluctuates. So if I buy $1000 worth a silver, which translates to 10oz (or what ever, simple numbers for example), they should have added 10oz of silver to their pile. If they don't buy the actual product, and the price of that item goes up, how are they going to pay you back when you want what you paid for? Now your 10oz went up in price and is now worth $1500. You try to pull out that 10oz and they lose money on the deal. If everyone demanded the silver they were supposed to have, they would come up short even if they still had every time others sent them. Aside from a stupid business plan, I don't know why anyone would give someone money for silver, and they don't actually buy the silver. Logic says if they don't buy the silver and just sit on your money, that is no different than you putting it in the bank and then pulling it out and buying silver when you want it. Only at least in a bank you are FDIC insured the money will be there. I think you contradict your own statement. The deposit to a bank for $100 is recorded and you can withdraw that $100 at anytime, but if every member showed up to withdraw their full amount the bank would be in trouble. Your $100 deposit results in 10% held by the bank and 90% given out as loans. Not exactly. The bank takes your 100 bucks and then loans out 900 and keeps your hundred. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:25:45 PM EDT
[#46]
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Why? Why would anyone have a company store PMs for them instead of taking possession? It's the only way to keep PMs in an IRA. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:38:41 PM EDT
[#47]
Well, at least the silver you didn't receive had real value, unlike the fake fiat currency you traded for it...
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:38:42 PM EDT
[#48]
Ask your self this question when "storing" metals with anyone:
How many paper contracts for precious metals exist for every ounce of real metals that exist? My gues is this particular company isn't the only one playing games. |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:42:57 PM EDT
[#49]
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If you can't hold it you don't own it. I will go with this ! |
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Posted: 7/30/2015 12:44:39 PM EDT
[#50]
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I will go with this ! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If you can't hold it you don't own it. I will go with this ! Me too. I dont understand those who dont take physical possession of their bullion. Im not even sure if I will buy it online anymore. I might just find a local guy where I can see the silver before I buy it. |
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