I don't follow?

They haven't stopped making Miatas yet. Every year, $10k gets you a slightly newer used Miata than it did last year, all things being equal. On average, of course. No one is saying he has to get a first year NA in mint condition.

In my opinion, if it's a car you're going to drive a lot and don't really want to wrench on every other weekend, keep it under 10 years old. For $10k, a used Miata is perfect.

It's not laziness. A Miata really is the answer to many automotive questions, including his.

~ 24.5 with me at probably 70% highway usage.

4000 rpm at 75?



My SL500 is around 2200 in 5th.........what's your Miata top out at?

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Datsun-Z-Series-Coupe-2-door-/161770228935?forcerrptr=true&hash=item25aa41ccc7&item=161770228935

And sometimes a person needs to let their inner Joe Dirt out.

Fuck the Miata.



Both of these can be plenty of fun without the need for "hhhhhnnnnngggggg momentum" fanboi bullshit.

There are lots of ways to have fun.   Being in a devoid of style miata isnt fun to me no matter how good they good they handle.

Would rather, and did, add suspension/brakes/gears to make my 95 more agile so that it could still test the limits of it's tires.

there is more than one way to have fun.

Exactly. It's not the answer to everything, but if someone asks "hey, what's a cheap reliable sports car" then someone is going to answer "Mazda Miata" and they'll be correct in doing so.

Well everyone knows its a good answer to a cheap sports car so you see tons of them, its over played a bit lately so there's zero exclusively. I dont care wbat anyone says, when you see your basically same exact car it gives you a weird feeling.

Its is reliable and with that comes a boring engine and overall design philosophy inside and out.

IMO the s2k is so much more of interesting take on a cheap, small roadster. It has way more character and a much better engine.

To just say "miata" when someone asks about a cheaper sports car it just seems lazy, why not try to find a car with more power or better looking or a better interior?
There are tons out there.

Used Scion FR-S are getting down to about $15k now, with some shopping.

I agree. However, they were produced in much lower numbers, and as such are quickly becoming collector's cars in clean original condition. You won't touch one below $10k.

The early ones also have a reputation (deserved, IMHO) for being rather twitchy cars; they can easily get away from you if you aren't careful.

About 120 (drag limited). I've had mine to 100, and that was plenty. It honestly sucks driving a Miata that fast on a freeway for more than a minute or so.

They're not fast cars. Miatas have never been "numbers" cars. That's not why you buy one.

IMO if we're going to keep calling a straight up "sports car" we might as well include a mini.
Same idea: no power, stupid small but it turns good.

Find me a car with rear wheel drive, a 50:50 weight distribution, total weight WELL under 3,000 lbs, an excellent manual transmission, and long term reliability and maintenance needs that rival even the most boring of appliance cars, all for under $10k.

When you can meet all that criteria with a car that isn't a Miata, let me know. I probably want one.

 

I had an 05 Mustang GT. My Miata is a lot more fun to drive around town, and on twisty backroads. My GT would absolutely clobber my Miata in every performance metric you cared to measure, on any road (or track) you decided to compare it on. And I still enjoy driving my Miata more. Way more.

Toyota
MR2 The newer ones.

When I used mine to commute I got 30-31 @ 65-70 MPH running regular.



 

Having had an '08 Mustang GT Bullitt and now this '06 NC Miata I would echo this statement too. Unless you like to tinker more than you drive you're just not going to beat a Miata.



 

There's a give and take with everything.
You guys clamering for reliability cause you dont want to get your hands dirty are crossing a good amount of cars off your list.
Are these your daily drivers? I would think a roadster is a 2nd or 3rd car.

And the lack of sub-3000lbs cars is a culture thing, you cant have powerful/torqey engine, awesome interior and a safe vehicle and have it be less than 3k lbs so cars like that are hard to come by in the states and for good reason.

That makes a lot of sense.....kind of like an old MG

I had a Shelby Charger with the Turbo 2.2 decades ago that was super fun on twisty back roads

Now that I live in Kansas though there are no twisty backroads and you have to be able to run 80 mph all
day on the highway

Fine. We can include them in the discussion, but the answer is still going to be Miata when we're done.

The fact that it's FWD is already a strike against it (I say it outright disqualifies it, bit that's just one man's opinion ). Come on man - engine in the front, drive in the back. There are rules.

We're enthusiasts, right? This is classic sports car stuff. They're not as reliable as a Miata, they're more expensive to maintain and repair than a Miata, and you're not getting a good one that hasn't been used up for less than $10k.

The S2000 you mentioned earlier ticks all the enthusiast/visceral driving experience boxes, but not for less than $10k. A $10k Miata is always going to be a better buy than what's left of a $10k S2000.

There's a reason people keep coming back to Miatas in discussions like these. You're almost forced to.

I'll admit my SL500 is a porker for a Roadster, but man if you were in an accident I'd rather be in it than a sub 3000 pound anything......

I'd go with more muscle and longer wheelbase in your situation then too.



 

They're sold down the street from the gunshop with $200 Model 19s, $100 SKSes, and $1,000 Pythons.

Well........I have two toys.....

a Mercedes SL500 and a Supercharged Crown Vic......both are perfect Kansas cars......
one of these days I'll pick up a S600 with the twin turbo V12

I don't mind getting my hands dirty working on things and Mercedes don't scare me.....

Those would both do the trick. What year CV did you S/C?



 

Its a 2000 Police Interceptor with 3:55 gears, J mod shift kit and an Allen Supercharger
on a 4.6 with 60,000 miles......its nothing particularly fancy but it has run a 12.9 on the 1/4
and its a good family car

In my discussions with people and crossing cars off the list to meet requirements the vette is always the last car remaining on that list. You have to have the power to back up the entire premise of a sports cars as they are not practical and they're really an extra vehicle.

I know its an opinion thing but I dont run into alot of people who pull thr trigger on sports car and are ok with dealing with all the trade offs a sports car bring and not have the power to back it all up. Of course this could be more who I associate with more than the general publics view, Im not sure.

As much as I dont like the pre LS engines Id buy an LT1 vette over a miata.

See and that is my 95 Cobra for me.

I love that it shakes the whole car to death simply sitting at idle.   I love that it is an uncivilized and nasty smelling belching asshole of a car.   Put it through tight corners is a ton of fun, maybe the balance and lightness of the car isnt that of a miata but the sensations coming out of a turn and braking before the turn are more fun to me because there is so much less finesse.

It still hauls ass.   If a miata can get through a turn 5mph faster than my 95 it wont matter because sanity is going to slow both cars down when you consider that around the next corner could be road debris, a cow, or a damn bicycle crawling up the hill at a standstill.

The 95 matches my never grew up mentality.   It is my midlife crisis mobile given it is my graduating year of high school.

Cannot wait to get my built 331 into it.

Goal is to get to the Silver State Classic with it next year.   If it isnt ready the 2005 is going instead.

Holy frickin' cow...

I know right!



But you would never know it driving it.

If the thing weighed 3200 pounds it would be an animal

but as is, its very lively and quick.

E36 M3.   Declared value of $6500 with Hagerty insurance...5k miles a year allowed...$270 for a year.    
If it's a collectible/performance car that's eligible for something other than your regular insurance...you may be able to get cheap insurance on it...

That's the only way I get in/out of mine.  6'4" 260lbs here.  Removed the armrest in order to fit my left leg between the door and steering wheel.  Fun little cars.

How about spending that 10k on your jeep? I would not buy a sports car for 10k. Ever.

Because when he's done, he'll have $10k worth of mods to his Jeep, but he still won't own a sports car.

My YJ was just as fun as my Miata, but in a much different way. It's application specific, ya know?

I have more fun off road than I do on so me personally I don't see the point of ever owning a flashy sports car. Flashy truck or jeep on the other hand? Now you're speaking my language. I wish I had 10 grand to dump into my truck right now.

A Miata is a flashy sports car?  Who knew!?

I'd chuckle. I enjoy a good inside joke.

LS swap a Miata.

/thread

While I TOTALLY get the idea of shoehorning a massive engine (with it's attendant horsepower and torque) into a lightweight two seater (AC Cobra anyone?) because 'Murica, I still think it defeats the purpose of owning a Miata to begin with. It misses the point.

If you want a balls out fast car on the cheap (and to hell with everything else), there are easier and cheaper ways to go about it.

Truth.

What's out there really?

240SX?  MR2's?  Corolla GT-S (AE86)?  

They're going to be old and in need of some kind of work.

Lots of Miatas are driven very sparingly AND aren't modded AND are babied.

That opens up a ton of good options for the price range.  

Most of the other RWD Japanese cars will be fucked with in one way or the other.

MR2 Spyders are close. They're lighter but are less reliable,have a tiny portion of support and have the pros and cons of being mid-engined.They also have no practical space at all. I love mine but prefer the Miata.

Infiniti G35

either in the Four Doors = More Whores variety, or the coupe.

it's aged well, decent power, fun to drive, great chassis, respectable, comfortable, safe, reliable. and in your price point.

You can take a nice girl somewhere classy. Or take 3 not nice girls somewhere exciting. It'll be decently quick and handle very competently. It's a Nissan underneath, so services wont be expensive and it'll be pretty reliable.

/thread.

 
Much lower production numbers on those too so they're tougher to find. That was on my list last year too.

The thing about reliability is, guys who want a project car can buy a project car, guys like me that want to drive want to drive, not spend their time off and "extra" money fixing shit. When the pieces fall into place and I get the opportunity to take my Miata out for a long drive, I like being fairly certain it's going to work.

And that leads me to another issue with reliability. When I take my Miata out, I go out into rural areas, and I often go down random roads just to see how that road is. I use major terrain features like rivers, Interstates, and US highways as boundaries, and I play with the car. If something breaks when I'm out, I'm screwed. I'd probably need to call in GPS coordinates for someone to find me on a map.  If I had a more temperamental car like a traditional British or Italian roadster, I wouldn't even consider taking it the places I've taken my Miata or driving it as hard as I do my Miata.

Then there's weight. I guess I understood the physics at a textbook level, but it took me a long time to appreciate what weight really means to a car. Amusingly enough, the vehicle that gave me my first clue was a Jeep XJ. I learned how to drive in trucks, vans, and SUVs. When I bought my XJ, it was the smallest, lightest thing I'd ever driven on a regular basis. I found it really fun to pound around in, even on pavement. I knew part of it was the power to weight ratio, but I couldn't really put my finger on what made it so fun to toss around. Buying my 2009 Civic was eye-opening, and that was mostly just an appliance car. When I took the Miata out for that test drive, it was sublime.

For most purposes, when you're talking about vehicle performance and dynamics, weight is a bad thing, and it's more important that just about any other quality of a vehicle. Improving your brakes improves your ability to brake, and that's it. Adding power improves your acceleration, maybe towing power if you're talking about a truck, and that's it. Reducing weight improves acceleration, handling, braking, and efficiency all at once. 3,000 lbs isn't necessarily a hard limit, but it is a really good milestone. The further you can get a fun weekend vehicle below that point, the better. The higher a "fun" vehicle weighs in above that point, the less fun it is, unless you're talking about a military surplus truck for offroading or something. The new Mustang GT weighs 3,705 lbs. That's not okay. That's in the same ballpark as my mother's old 1987 Mercury Grand Marquis land yacht. Sure, you can make something fast by giving it a ballsy V8, and you can make it corner better by giving it really fat, sticky tires and putting a lot of work into the suspension, but at the end of the day, you're still throwing around a thing that weighs two tons with a driver and a tank of gas. And just because it can do it doesn't mean it's as fun as doing the same thing with a car that weighs over 1,000 lbs less.

240SX IF the engine swap has happened, and a Miata will run circles around it if it hasn't. (driven both extensively).