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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:38:01 PM EDT
[#1]
Have a love/hate relationship with it. It's cost versus net gain is relatively small but then again, considering it being a pistol caliber and size restrictions, any gains are hard earned.
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:39:16 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Nothing really wrong with it, but it does nothing other calibers won't do as well and cheaper. http://www.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=7297 Large wound channel and bullet expansion look pretty good with the .357 SIG, but overall they appear to be relatively similar to each other. ETA: Missed comment at top of pic...duh. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:43:08 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 40% faster? I'd say at least 20% faster, maybe it depends on the manufacturer. Oddly, Identical projectiles by Hornady (135gr critical duty) show a mere 20% difference in muzzle velocity, but a 50% difference in muzzle energy. I thought it was a linear relationship between velocity, mass, and energy... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: 9 mm performance, .40 magazine capacity. What's not to like? .357sig is ~40% faster than 9mm. Capacity is a non-starter for me. I carry 15+1, plus a spare mag. 40% faster? I'd say at least 20% faster, maybe it depends on the manufacturer. Oddly, Identical projectiles by Hornady (135gr critical duty) show a mere 20% difference in muzzle velocity, but a 50% difference in muzzle energy. I thought it was a linear relationship between velocity, mass, and energy... Velocity is squared, hence a small change in velocity is a large change in kinetic energy. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:44:12 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
40% faster? I'd say at least 20% faster, maybe it depends on the manufacturer. Oddly, Identical projectiles by Hornady (135gr critical duty) show a mere 20% difference in muzzle velocity, but a 50% difference in muzzle energy. I thought it was a linear relationship between velocity, mass, and energy... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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9 mm performance, .40 magazine capacity. What's not to like? .357sig is ~40% faster than 9mm. Capacity is a non-starter for me. I carry 15+1, plus a spare mag. 40% faster? I'd say at least 20% faster, maybe it depends on the manufacturer. Oddly, Identical projectiles by Hornady (135gr critical duty) show a mere 20% difference in muzzle velocity, but a 50% difference in muzzle energy. I thought it was a linear relationship between velocity, mass, and energy... Mine chronographed at 1,450 fps out of my Glock 31. The JHPs I had in my HiPower showed 1090 fps. Both were 125gr. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:46:36 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have there been any other bottle-necked pistol rounds that Americans like? The .30 Mauser and the .30 Tok were more curiosities than anything else IMHO. 30 tokarev is a curiosity? And all this time I thought it was one of the most common pistol and SMG rounds in existence. Just because it wasn't a U.S. Thing doesn't mean it wasn't popular. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:49:17 PM EDT
[#6]
I have the worst of both worlds, a Glock 23 and a .357 Sig barrel for it.
I was giving away a bunch of old ammo at the gun clubs end of the meeting ticket raffle. I gave them a couple boxes of 8mm, some .30 carbine ammo, some GP11 and some .357 SIG. The fuds had no idea what was going on. Guys kept picking up the .357 Sig thinking it was for a .357 and picking up the .30 ammo thinking it was for a 30-30.  |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:54:14 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Interesting. The wound channel is twice as large as 9mm. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Nothing really wrong with it, but it does nothing other calibers won't do as well and cheaper. http://www.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=7297 Interesting. The wound channel is twice as large as 9mm. What you are seeing is mostly the temporary cavity...  |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:58:09 PM EDT
[#8]
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You must be confusing it with something like 10mm.
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Just last week at the range I saw someone shooting one, first time I have ever seen that. It seems like a good round with a flat trajectory, why hasn't it become more mainstream? I didn't read all the derp but the fact is that .357 sig with 125 grain bullet is 150 fps faster than 9mm 124 +P at 3 times the cost. Derp. Balistics shamlistics. Go run a few mags, its the most fun you can get out of a semi auto pistol Frealz! You must be confusing it with something like 10mm.
Na, I like women |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:10:49 PM EDT
[#9]
I LOVED my .357sig. round was a hard hitter at pistol ranges. and reliable as hell with the case.
Ammo was just too expensive. Comparable with a 45 in price so i sold it and went with a 45. easier to find ammo |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:15:47 PM EDT
[#10]
Because for anyone who wants good power in an autoloader cartridge that you have to reload or be rich to shoot, there is 10mm.
And .357Sig is bottleneck, which complicates reloading. Tangentially, some states have stupid rules about no bottleneck cartridges being legal for handgun hunting (to ban T/C rifle handguns), but 10mm is acceptable. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:18:16 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Na, I like women Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just last week at the range I saw someone shooting one, first time I have ever seen that. It seems like a good round with a flat trajectory, why hasn't it become more mainstream? I didn't read all the derp but the fact is that .357 sig with 125 grain bullet is 150 fps faster than 9mm 124 +P at 3 times the cost. Derp. Balistics shamlistics. Go run a few mags, its the most fun you can get out of a semi auto pistol Frealz! You must be confusing it with something like 10mm.
Na, I like women So do I, and I've got a G29 that has 40 Short and Weak and 357 Sig barrels. Nothing compares to the boom of a hot 10mm.
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:38:25 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nothing really wrong with it, but it does nothing other calibers won't do as well and cheaper. http://www.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=7297 Idk but it seems as though the wound cavity is larger and pronounced in the 357 sig. And of course this is data from a long time ago, I wonder if they can start using a new picture instead of this old one |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:39:03 PM EDT
[#13]
45 GAP
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:46:26 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Most folks don't consider trajectory in a handgun. I think people associate straight cases with reliability in handguns. Maybe that's it. The bottlenecked round actually is more reliable than a straight wall case. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:49:24 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Idk but it seems as though the wound cavity is larger and pronounced in the 357 sig. And of course this is data from a long time ago, I wonder if they can start using a new picture instead of this old one Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Nothing really wrong with it, but it does nothing other calibers won't do as well and cheaper. http://www.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=7297 Idk but it seems as though the wound cavity is larger and pronounced in the 357 sig. And of course this is data from a long time ago, I wonder if they can start using a new picture instead of this old one Always looked like a Rorschach image to me. If you like .357 sig you see a great temp wound cavity. If you don't like .357 sig they all pretty much look alike. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:58:58 PM EDT
[#16]
It is sort of a chicken and egg scenario for me.
If cases were readily available and inexpensive, I would be all over this round. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 12:03:58 AM EDT
[#17]
I've got a .357SIG barrel for my Glock 20. Can't find any plinking ammo locally. On the verge of buying some online because I really want to try the caliber.
I was hiking in bear country 2 years ago, stopped dead in my tracks and said "Why am I carrying a 9mm when I could be carrying a .40SW or .357SIG in the same amount of space?" |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 12:10:45 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
30 tokarev is a curiosity? And all this time I thought it was one of the most common pistol and SMG rounds in existence. Just because it wasn't a U.S. Thing doesn't mean it wasn't popular. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Have there been any other bottle-necked pistol rounds that Americans like? The .30 Mauser and the .30 Tok were more curiosities than anything else IMHO. 30 tokarev is a curiosity? And all this time I thought it was one of the most common pistol and SMG rounds in existence. Just because it wasn't a U.S. Thing doesn't mean it wasn't popular. Strictly referring to Americans, |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 12:26:19 AM EDT
[#19]
I have a Glock 32 that is my woods carry. My Dad seemed impressed with the round so he got a Glock 33 to carry. As far as ammo goes, I've got threaded barrels for it in 357 SIG, 40 S&W, and 9mm to run through an Osprey 45. Also a .22 conversion slide. The best of both worlds really.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 12:29:44 AM EDT
[#20]
I love the round for my carry piece. Glock 33 or 32 rocks. I can practice my G19 most of the time and carry my G32. A fast +p 9 mm is still not as fast as the 357 sig. Ammo cost is higher but I don't mind spending a little more to carry a round that is superior to the 9mm in my opinion.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 12:34:31 AM EDT
[#21]
I didn't like the excessive muzzle flash. It just seemed ridiculous.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 12:53:32 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My Action Works custom Hi-Power has .40 and .357 SIG barrels <a href="http://s802.photobucket.com/user/ndandosu/media/Hipower/BHP1_zps30702992.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i802.photobucket.com/albums/yy303/ndandosu/Hipower/BHP1_zps30702992.jpg</a> It shoots like a frickin' laser. My piggy bank now hates you. I just shook the hell out of it trying to come up with the coin for one of those, but only a couple of nickels and some lint fell out. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 1:38:52 AM EDT
[#23]
I had a barrel for my G22. Now I run 357 sig out of a G30 using a barrel for the G29 in it. Works fine and is accurate. I reload and cast my own bullets so it is cheaper for me to shoot than 45 ACP because the sig boolits I load weigh 125 grains vs 200 grains for the 45ACP. Really it is about recycling all of that 40 brass I pick up at the range. I load it under a bit, and toss it after use, but there is plenty of 40 brass to be had to convert. I wont own another 40 in my lifetime, and for pump and dump ammo this is a great solution for me.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:06:45 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For civilian use its quite finicky to reload (compared to straight walled cases) so its not popular. . I played with .400 Cor-Bon a few years ago. If it's as much of a headache to load as that was, I'm glad I never bought one. Both rounds are promising on paper though. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:12:39 AM EDT
[#25]
I prefer 9x25 Dillon.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:15:32 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Tangentially, some states have stupid rules about no bottleneck cartridges being legal for handgun hunting (to ban T/C rifle handguns), but 10mm is acceptable. Yep-although they allow T/C in .444 Marlin and .45-70. I'll never understand how IA DNR makes their decisions, but my last deer was with my 12" .45-70. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:28:06 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do love the "sample size of one" chart... So statistically significant. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Nothing really wrong with it, but it does nothing other calibers won't do as well and cheaper. http://www.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=7297 I do love the "sample size of one" chart... So statistically significant. 
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:30:00 AM EDT
[#28]
Boutique caliber.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:40:52 AM EDT
[#29]
I've owned a lot of pistols in my day, but I've never been interested in .357 SIG.
The reasons have already been covered. 1) Difficult to reload, and I won't buy factory ammo 2) Lower mag capacity than 9mm 3) Pointless for shooting competitions 4) Offers terminal ballistics that are superior pretty much only on paper |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:49:27 AM EDT
[#30]
If you just think about it, it seems to make sense, a FASTER 9mm, right?
Just doesn't really do much for you, modern ammo and all. At least, this is what I have been led to believe. Haven't really researched it. Honestly, I am just posting to test my new sig and avatar. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:52:36 AM EDT
[#31]
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I'd like to see the PS90 in other calibers. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Because they never made a carbine chambered for it I'd like to see the PS90 in other calibers. In a few years you will be lucky to find PS90s chambered in anything. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 3:01:48 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I played with .400 Cor-Bon a few years ago. If it's as much of a headache to load as that was, I'm glad I never bought one. Both rounds are promising on paper though. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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For civilian use its quite finicky to reload (compared to straight walled cases) so its not popular. . I played with .400 Cor-Bon a few years ago. If it's as much of a headache to load as that was, I'm glad I never bought one. Both rounds are promising on paper though. The 400 Cor-Bon headspaces on the shoulder, not the neck, so it isn't as finicky and can take a roll crimp. It's also more forgiving with pressure ranges. I've always wanted a 400CB/45ACP Les Baer TR Special combo, with a Bazooka Bros based AR with both uppers. 
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:01:42 AM EDT
[#33]
Was always claimed to equal 357 magnum performance, but when they compared it to 357 magnum they always cherry-picked the 357 magnum ammo, going for the stuff purposely stepped down in power. Even in the weights offered in 357 sig, regular 357 magnum full house loads were a step above, to say nothing of what a handloader could do, nor what was available with heavier bullets for the 357 magnum vs the 357 sig.
Also, had issues with ammo being available Also, a higher performance 9mm projectile out of a pistol makes sense, but should have been made a non-bottleneck for greater capacity in a magazine, an 'improved 38 super' if you will, something like the 9x23 Winchester. Heck, just rename 9x19mm 'Major' (9x19mm pushed past +P levels to achieve 'major' ratings for some of the shooting sports) thing is, getting straight wall cased higher velocity 9mm cartridge either by going with a slightly longer cartridge or a hotter standard length cartridge would mean gunmakers couldn't just swap barrels to make an alternate version. Something built for 9x19 luger would need a fully supported chamber to handle super-hot 9x19 (also cartridge would probably need some design feature like possibly a tiny bit more diameter at case base to prevent it's accidental use in 9x19 luger) or for a 9x23 Winchester type load, you need a longer mag and different mag-well. The reason the 40SW was able to take off is how easy manufacturers could offer the 9x19 guns they already had in this new chambering. This attempt to have size uniformity just a different size hole at the end is what stuck us with the bottleneck case of the 357 sig, and what the thought process behind the 45 GAP. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:04:22 AM EDT
[#34]
Glock should have done the opposite of the 45 GAP. Should have created the the 9 GAP, a longer hotter 9 and offered it in their Glock20/21 sized gun. (This might have led to more Glock-nades though...)
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:31:40 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'd like to see the PS90 in other calibers. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Because they never made a carbine chambered for it I'd like to see the PS90 in other calibers. Think about a PS90 SBR in 10mm....  |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:51:22 AM EDT
[#36]
Why not 9x25 dillion?
9mm projectile with a 10mm capacity case. The .357 sig is based on the .40 s&w case which is just a cut down 10mm. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:18:07 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
30 tokarev is a curiosity? And all this time I thought it was one of the most common pistol and SMG rounds in existence. Just because it wasn't a U.S. Thing doesn't mean it wasn't popular. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Have there been any other bottle-necked pistol rounds that Americans like? The .30 Mauser and the .30 Tok were more curiosities than anything else IMHO. 30 tokarev is a curiosity? And all this time I thought it was one of the most common pistol and SMG rounds in existence. Just because it wasn't a U.S. Thing doesn't mean it wasn't popular. Biggest problem with 7.62x25 Tokarev in the US, is the very limited options to shoot it with. the TT pistol the CZ52 pistol custom AR15 uppers 1911 conversion barrels If you have a set of dies for it, it's an interesting round to play with. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:25:27 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Expensive ammo. I reload for it so I love to shoot it. This! |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:26:29 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep-although they allow T/C in .444 Marlin and .45-70. I'll never understand how IA DNR makes their decisions, but my last deer was with my 12" .45-70. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Tangentially, some states have stupid rules about no bottleneck cartridges being legal for handgun hunting (to ban T/C rifle handguns), but 10mm is acceptable. Yep-although they allow T/C in .444 Marlin and .45-70. I'll never understand how IA DNR makes their decisions, but my last deer was with my 12" .45-70. For a few years, Tennessee Wildlife Resources decided it was legal to hunt deer with a handgun chambered for .25acp, but illegal to hunt deer with a handgun chambered for .223Rem (based the reg solely on bullet diameter, and they stuck to the claim that .223 was too weak for deer, but .243Win was enough). This was after they finally discovered that there were handguns being made in rifles calibers. Just accept that the people writing the hunting regs don't know much more than "you pull the trigger and the gun goes BANG". |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 11:32:17 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Most folks don't consider trajectory in a handgun. I think people associate straight cases with reliability in handguns. Maybe that's it. Right here. Hell, I shoot a .45 with 185gr SWC's at 750 fps at 50 yards. Trajectory is a non-issue. Besides... .357 doesn't do anything 9mm/.40/.45 won't do at greater cost, muzzle blast, recoil and bullshit. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 11:50:13 AM EDT
[#41]
Why does everyone say that .357 Sig is difficult to reload? Currently, I only reload rifle cartridges, which are all bottle neck, and it's easy as pie.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 11:51:48 AM EDT
[#42]
It didn't do anything the 38 super wouldn't do and it didn't catch on either.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:25:49 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Also, a higher performance 9mm projectile out of a pistol makes sense, but should have been made a non-bottleneck for greater capacity in a magazine, an 'improved 38 super' if you will, something like the 9x23 Winchester. All of the downsides of 357SIG are addressed with 9x23Win, other than the cost, but that point can be used against anything that isn't 9x19mm. Heck, many people do what 9x23Win does in fully supported 38Super barrels. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:36:22 PM EDT
[#44]
Why didn't the Sig become popular? Hmmm....
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Posted: 7/3/2015 2:46:37 PM EDT
[#45]
Too expensive. It has about the same recoil as the 40, but the $.40-.50/rnd is a deal breaker.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 9:18:01 PM EDT
[#46]
My P229 came with a .357 sig barrel. It was a lot of fun to shoot but the ammo was pricy so I sold the barrel.
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