I'm out of the loop, why the hate

 

Wasn't to start with

 

Because people expect a $1500 safe to be unbeatable by even the best thieves as well as nuclear blast proof.

Idk, those fridges aback in the day were tanks. Maybe that'd be a better place for guns?

concealment is key

Although a Liberty safe is not my first choice of gun safes they are hardly junk.
Cant't view this safe until I get home due to a firewall but they make so many models with so many different layers of insulation depending on how bad the fire was it's really hard to tell how much protection it really gave.

I'm confused, that video you linked is posted by NWSafe, which if you go to their website they heavily push liberty safes.  You're telling me they showed prying a liberty safe with the name covered up, and said, "if you don't want this to happen, buy a liberty safe"? Seems odd.

Depends on your house, but if 4 people can stand in a room, you should be ok.


I would always put it where there is a main supporting structural wall and also not above living space like a couch or bed.

All insurance companies limit the amount of cash you can claim to something mediocre like $500 or so.  They basically make it so that you can't insure cash.







 

Nothing?  



That's the point.  



There are some seriously dedicated RSC (residential safety container) and Liberty safe haters around here.  They'll try to make you feel bad if you don't have some $10,000 safe that's barely big enough to store rifles in.  



The point of this thread is that the RSC in the picture worked as advertised, and didn't cost 5 figures.  



 

You passed up a discount on a Liberty safe because of a supposed weak spot?







All safes have "weak spots."



 

I specifically asked my insurer (Farmers) about this and was able to raise my coverage to the approximate value of my collection.

Depends a lot on the location of the safe. My friend kept all his guns in a stack on cabinet in the basement. His house was a total loss. It got so hot it torched the cars in the driveway and they were pretty far back. I was amazed at the level of damage. A grill he had just bought melted to a ball of metal. He brought the cabinet to my house and we pried it open. I was expecting it to be bad but none of his guns were damaged.

Informative post from "the safe guy" (not me) from the safe forum link here:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_46/401046_Questions_for_AMSEC_TheSafeGuy.html


" I was browsing the threads tonight, and I happened on the tack'ed thread "An Informative Thread: Most frequently asked gun safe questions and answers." I see a lot of misinformation in that thread. I wanted to set the record straight for those of you interested in truly understanding these products. I'll keep the explanations brief here, and we can expand if there are any questions.

Let's start with fire protection.... but first lets set the stage so there is clarity. I will bring you truth.

For those that have not figured it out yet, I am the VP of Engineering for AMSEC. I have been engineering AMSEC product for over 25 years. I have tested fire and burglary safes at Underwriters Labs, Omega Point, ETL and other labs all over the country. I am a charter member of the Underwriters Laboratories UL72 Standards Technical Panel (STP), consulting on fire standards development at UL. I am also a charter member of the UL687, UL768 and UL2058 STPs for Safes, Mechanical Locks and Electronic Locks. I am also a member of the ASTM F15 committee on security and child safety containers. I was the lead industry adviser in California for the publication of the CalDOJ safety Standards, and in fact I wrote the draft standard (before the liberal bureaucrats mutilated that work). So, I put forth my credentials such that you will not doubt the facts I will provide.

Okay, now we need to break down the walls of myth and deception. First, let's get this on the table... most of the players that manufacture products for weapons storage do only that, and similar small light duty unlisted products. They don't have genuine UL Fire Listings. They have never even seen a UL Fire Safe test. This lack of experience has brought a lot of bad, misleading and deceptive information, much of it in print.

The Gunsafe business is one that grew from small sheet metal shops looking for a new market. This industry has gone thru four major shake-ups that drove the industry into rapid expansion. First, the Gun Control Legislation in 1994, then the Y2K scare in 1999, the WTC terrorist attack on 9/11/2001, and finally the one we are currently rolling out of from the liberal gun-ban push taking advantage of the Sandy Hook tragedy. During each of these industry changing events, demand for safes went ballistic, and provided opportunity for anyone that could weld steel and paint to jump into the market.

With all these expansions, reversals came and many small players dropped out when demand slowed again. But, also from that growth, some survived. Many of these young companies make fine looking products, and some have provided strong consumer appeal. But, from this fray came a lot of people with no experience in security and fire protection. The marketing went out of control, and higher and higher claims for fire resistance grew out of dishonesty and ignorance. I'd like to lift the veil for you...

First, the most important thing you must understand is that a GOOD firesafe, almost ALL good fire safes, work on the premise that the insulation holds water. The water is stored as free water moisture and chemically bonded water in the crystalline structure of Hygroscopic materials like Gypsum Board (drywall) and cementitious poured mixes based on cement (the key ingredient in concrete). When exposed to high temperatures, the water is released as steam. The steam saturates the inner atmosphere of the safe as it expands. The steam is at the boiling point of water (212ºF), and the environment is regulated at that temperature as long as there is enough venting to release any build-up of pressure, and there is ample water to keep steam generation going. In reality, measured temperatures inside a safe rise above 212º, but that is due to other factors where heat energy is entering the safe by modes other than Convection (i.e., Conduction and Radiation).

The expanding water vapor vents out thru any breeches in door seals, anchor holes, electrical ports and structural breeches. The escaping steam prevents the super-heated gasses outside from entering the safe. The free water is released early, then the process of decay of the insulation called Calcination frees significantly more steam volume, until the insulation has decayed to it's constituent dry ingredients. The free water in the media is not really "free", it's absorbed to the point of balance with atmospheric humidity in the environment. Insulations commonly use water retaining materials like Diatomaceous Earth, Perlite and Vermiculite to help hold free water moisture.

So... the internal temperature is regulated by STEAM. That means the inside of the safe is drenched with water. During a fire test, it's not uncommon to see water boiling out of the bottom edge of the door vigorously. Yes, that's not very good for our precious guns. But, that is how it works. The "other" types of fire-resistant safes that work are "data" safes, where additional measures are taken to maintain the internal at 125º or 150º for computer media storage. These safes use other technologies I can explain later, but they are typically based on the same steam generating outer safe bodies.

So, yes, get those guns out as soon as you can after a fire. Keep your guns well oiled. Use Gun Socks to help keep soot and other deposits from getting on your goodies. Keep valuables in air-tight containers like Tupperware and microwave safe cooking containers. Anything that can resist temperatures under 350º should make a big difference."

 

I'm glad somebody got it. I thought it was gonna be a hit too.

TL/DR = yours guns get a steam bath in a gun safe so if they survive a fire get them out of the safe ASAP as they will rust.

But what kind of safe do you own?

Put it in a corner supported by two load bearing walls.  No problem.

THE USS LIBERTY SAFE WAS BURNT TO A CRISP! GOYIM ARE CATTLE! 5 BILLION A YEAR! WHITE RACE IS GOING EXTINCT! ETC.

Interested as well. I couldn't tell what make or model the safe was so why did they spray paint it up?

I was told by a pro mover the issue isn't the floor, but the stairs to get it there..I have a liberty D-48 and at 900 pounds empty the mover said it would most likely break the step overhang off  trying to get it up the staircase...so its in the garage..which actually works out fine for me...

Second one.......

The guy with the safe that he cut open in the OP.  Now this, what is going on here?

Link?

Get both.

My $1200 Cabelas branded Liberty safe will stop 99% of your typical B&E types. Im not too worried about Neil McCauley and his crew breaking into my safe for a whopping 20k worth of stuff at best. The best defense is good insurance, i pay about 15 bucks a month for my collection to be fully covered. You guys can keep your $5k safes that weigh 3/4 ton, have fun moving that heavy bitch around.

I am all good and cozy with a good and secure gun safe but don't get to preachy with the advantage of insurance until you actually have to deal with an insurer on the value of said contents including firearms of what's in said gun safe.

WWJSD?

What would Jim Scotten do?

Seriously though. I thought the liberty Lincoln line was built pretty well and had a lot of options. I have a 2008 Cannon. Big fucker! But was planning on making that my safe for mags & kit when I move.

What brand can a guy trust for 3-5 grand? Who gives good LEO discounts?

and how long and hot was the fire?



 

How do they hold up against a burglar?



 

I read a book about the Civil War in Lebanon. There was an apartment in the building that the author lived in that had a bank vault doorfor an entrance. The owners had fled to Cyprus and the local Commander of a militia wanted that apartment for his own.

He brought a 20 mm antiaircraft gun up the elevator and blasted through the safe door. All a safe ever does is slow someone down.

A safe buys you time. My safe is a Liberty brand. It is 950 lbs empty and it ain't empty. I bolted it to the floor as well.


It could still be stolen. Just cut some holes in the wall and wrap a winch line from a tow truck around it and take Safe, Wall and Floor with you.

I have insurance and an alarm as well as barking dogs and a nosy stay at home mom across the street. The Liberty safe and the other layers make me feel fairly protected.

ETA: the book I read was From Beruit to Jerusalem

No one wants FUDD guns



 

Agreed

Which is why its important to do your homework when purchasing firearm insurance.

What model Liberty would that be?   I don't see any bolts at the top of that door and the inside of the door doesn't look like any Liberty I have seen.



 

Who do you insure with?

thats sadly mistaken.

Best to have both.

I have a similar safe.  My house was burglarized.  They had LOTS of time, and tried to get in my safe.  Bolted to the concrete, in the corner.   They were unable to get in.  Would a $20,000 safe have done any better?  Since they didn't get in, nope.

I have a National Security, really nice safe.

It's against a corner, full weighs around 1600-1700lbs.


Not bolted, if you can get it into it/take it. You deserve it.

Yep.  Forest fire is how I lost my safe.  Haven't even bothered opening it.  FD estimated 3000 degrees for hours.
Place looked like moonscape.



That's what's left of a two story home.  Fire started 20 miles away by a tweaker who "got mad" and kicked over a barbeque.

Wow...  If it was a Liberty, don't they pay to open it?  Would be interesting to see what it looks like inside...

Yes...that is included in new safe sales as of 2000.  I bought mine in 1996.
There's really no reason to drill mine...it's done.  I'm just going to cut the back off of it, and that only for the amusement of ARFcom and my own morbid curiosity.
It was full.

Sold guns safes for over 10 years. Liberty, Champion, AMSEC, gardall, grafthunder, and a few others.  Safe manufacturers are some of the most dishonest people I ever meet. Liberty and champion being two of the most dishonest ones. So glad I got away from that field, now work in bio tech.

My own safe is a older champion, back before the made in mexico/china craze started. Only safe I would buy now would be a grafthunder or summit.

The fire protection in just about all your gun safes are dry wall. Its cheap and heavy. It does work a this safe proves it. Liberty's are way over priced for what you get now days. 12ga doors over dry wall for 4k.

Amsec BF.
You will get superior fire protection over a sheet rock lined gun safe and with it's half inch plate steel door you will get much better pry resistance.
It also has an inner steel wall which no Liberty safe has.

Liberty FB Jr 48 - 11 ga body, 12 ga door for $1200-$1500 MSRP.

Again, a Liberty would not be my own personal first choice of safe but they are a decent and many times an affordable gun safe and they have absolutely stellar customer service.
And for the most part are made in the USA.