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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:22:42 PM EDT
[#1]
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NF says in the video at 8:46-8:55 he shot it in 2009 and states some of the video in the snow is from 2009, "sledgehammer". Which would be before SHOT 2010. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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3. The 2010 Shot Show video doesn't concern me as him contradicting himself. I know quite a bit of people with so many uppers and rifles that they will take a year or possibly longer to get out and shoot a specific item they bought. From his own words. LaRue stuff costs a lot. But there is nothing LaRue that I've regretted buying. From their optics mounts (the best in my opinion) to the their Stealth Uppers, all LaRue stuff is engineering to minimize weight (how refreshing) and maximize durability. I have never seen or heard of any LaRue product failures either. In this Nutnfancy 2010 SHOT Show booth review, we talk with Mark Fingar of LaRue and discuss their 5.56 and 7.62mm OBRs or Optimized Battle Rifles. Once past the sticker shock, I come away impressed. The 5.56 version is extremely lightweight, durable, and was to me one of the most impressive tactical carbines of the show. Its DI system is nothing new but it works and works well and is proven. Most impressive is its compact and trim monolithic rail (with user placeable Picatinny), innovative barrel/receiver interface (no heat transfer), LW-50 stainless steel, M16 bolt carrier, and the Geissele trigger. Expect top performance if my experience with my LaRue products is any indication. The OBR 7.62mm is also a great gun but very expensive and it lacks the lightweight of its smaller brother, weighing a very stout 9.7 lbs naked (wow, heavy). I still am waiting to see a 7 to 7.5 lb 7.62x51mm battle riifle these same levels of durability, quality, and innovation (FN Heavy SCAR [17S] comes close but still $$$). It will get here in time. However I think the new LaRue free float rail on these OBRs is will become an industry standard setter (Troys TRX rail similar): very light, trim, and seemingly lightweight. LaRue continues to have high levels of customer service and commitment to the military war fighter and law enforcement dudes. But they never forget or take for granted their good civilian buyers either. Great job LaRue. ////////////////////////////////////////////// Music: http://www.archive.org/details/Torley_Wong_-_The_Final_Selection You have no problem with this? Do you not see he is a supposed trusted reviewer and lacks credibility now? This last video was click bait. I would if I knew for sure that Nutnfancy had shot his problematic upper before making that claim. As of now, we don't know. NF says in the video at 8:46-8:55 he shot it in 2009 and states some of the video in the snow is from 2009, "sledgehammer". Which would be before SHOT 2010. Good catch. Gotta go to work, I'll reply later. Does indeed look like Nutn screwed up his own now. Still stand behind my other comments about manufacture professionalism in regards to dealing with negative reviews - however illegitimate they may be |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:27:15 PM EDT
[#2]
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Of course he's done "something" right. That's why we're even having this discussion. 
Maybe it hasn't hurt him... But I see people right in these threads who think that Mark defending himself is a bad thing. And you know what? In some small way, they're right. It's the old "don't wrestle with pigs if you don't want to get muddy" adage. I like how accessible Mark is - it's great. But for him to spend time on stuff like Nutn's video? No way. Let someone else get muddy. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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snip Then at least you have some integrity... I just have to laugh at the guys who are all "LOL @ LaRue slappys..." then later they're all "Hey Mark if you wanted to send me an upper I'd test it for you" ... Look, I'm a brand guy. Not just a fan of brands - I literally do branding for a living. Branding involves every aspect of the public's interactions with you. That includes stuff like this. This is only my opinion... LaRue gains nothing from rolling in the mud like this. He should leave it to his fans and some brand ambassadors. I say this as a fan of LaRue's gear for whom their gear has *earned* their place in my safe and on my rifles. They have lots of my hard earned money, not because I am a sloppy, but because it's legitimately excellent gear that will outlive me. I enjoy having things that are well designed, engineered, and made. LaRue does this well. No homo.  I'm just a lawyer and have never had so sell products, just my time. So what do I know? But, IMHO, Larue has obviously done something right. This is not the first time he's done this. And it doesn't hurt him. It never hurts him. I think it helps him. Because he is accountable - even to random people on the internet. I find more comfort in that than I would someone speaking through PR professionals hired to manipulate me. Of course he's done "something" right. That's why we're even having this discussion.
Maybe it hasn't hurt him... But I see people right in these threads who think that Mark defending himself is a bad thing. And you know what? In some small way, they're right. It's the old "don't wrestle with pigs if you don't want to get muddy" adage. I like how accessible Mark is - it's great. But for him to spend time on stuff like Nutn's video? No way. Let someone else get muddy. It's my name and I'm up-to-speed on defending it. I got nearly 35,000 virtually flawless posts on here, job requires keeping your wits about and it's nowhere near suitable to let an apprentice learn on the job. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:27:31 PM EDT
[#3]
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Still stand behind my other comments about manufacture professionalism in regards to dealing with negative reviews - however illegitimate they may be Sort of like rules of engagement? |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:27:50 PM EDT
[#4]
so youtube takes down content that violates copyright,
because they do not want to be accused of distributing content that is in violation,
I wonder if youtubes liability for the distribution of libelous content has similar protections in place... |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:30:20 PM EDT
[#5]
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It's my name and I'm up-to-speed on defending it. I got thirty-thousand virtually flawless posts on here, job requires keeping your wits about and nowhere suited to let an apprentice learn on the job. Then you jump in and get muddy. If that's what you signed up for and are prepared to take the bads with the goods, I can't say it's not working for you. 
(Personally I don't see a benefit to it from a brand standpoint. You seem more iconic and unassailable when the Nutntoseeheres of the world don't have an effect on you). |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:31:39 PM EDT
[#6]
Tag for Schadenfreude.
This ends badly for Nutn. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:33:37 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryThat's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:35:20 PM EDT
[#8]
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No, the smart variation of that would be to invite him to LaRue's facility (with his 'least reliable' upper) and film his visit. First, look over his upper and discuss his 'improvements' on it. Then take a bone-stock upper, identical t the one he bought, put it on his lower and shoot the holy crap out of it with PMC Bronze and what ever other ammo he used trying to replicate the fault. Then have him pick (at random so he can't claim they were ringers) an various rifles to shoot (on site). The guy is coming across as a loose cannon with an agenda. He apparently fucked up his $1200 upper and then made a video that placed the blame on the manufacturer. And your "modularity" comment.... The gas block on my Stealth upper is not "modular". It doesn't quick-detach, unscrew, secure with set screws, or bolt on. It looks to me like it was meant to stay on there. If someone wants to change it, that's their choice, but at that point any malfunction related to the gas system is their problem, not LaRue Tactical's. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I own 6 larue rifles. Unlike some of the fanboys in this thread, I can understand why sending an upper back twice and not having an issue resolved would solve some frustration. It would aggravate me as well. I'm also not buying the whole "well it's not a larue gas block" deal, since AR's are made for modularity and change over time. That said, I think the classy thing to do would be to show the product's strength by offering to send him an OBR/Predatobr so he can review it. Then end the argument there and move on. No, the smart variation of that would be to invite him to LaRue's facility (with his 'least reliable' upper) and film his visit. First, look over his upper and discuss his 'improvements' on it. Then take a bone-stock upper, identical t the one he bought, put it on his lower and shoot the holy crap out of it with PMC Bronze and what ever other ammo he used trying to replicate the fault. Then have him pick (at random so he can't claim they were ringers) an various rifles to shoot (on site). The guy is coming across as a loose cannon with an agenda. He apparently fucked up his $1200 upper and then made a video that placed the blame on the manufacturer. And your "modularity" comment.... The gas block on my Stealth upper is not "modular". It doesn't quick-detach, unscrew, secure with set screws, or bolt on. It looks to me like it was meant to stay on there. If someone wants to change it, that's their choice, but at that point any malfunction related to the gas system is their problem, not LaRue Tactical's. If talking shit on a 45 minute video gets you the golden ticket, I'm breaking out my camera... |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:35:37 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. http://www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. Quote HistoryQuoted: That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. http://www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:36:12 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
 Looks like that one is gone now too ? |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:36:31 PM EDT
[#11]
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I got a topic doesn't exist Quote HistoryQuoted:
I got a topic doesn't exist So I got banned from ARf.com
Post by Die-Tryin » Sat Dec 04, 2010 11:38 am LoL..apparently they need to change their motto to "Be an individual, just like us", cuz if you go against the grain there, they get sand in their maginas. :ham'r Re: So I got banned from ARf.com
Post by Die-Tryin » Sat Dec 04, 2010 12:13 pm No it was in the Laboob (larue) camp..There was a discussion about all the FREE stuff you get when you order their over priced AR components. I simply said that Free isnt Free and that Promo items are calculated into the product cost and the over all business expense. I said that Id rather they keep their free stuff and lower cost. But i understand the promo stuff is under advertisement budget, etc. But apparently this went over like a lead balloon and the laboob pack wanted to say that this isnt how businesses are run, that the owner gives the free stuff out of his pocket. lol. I explained that this isnt how business' run and they failed Econo 101..and then it just got ugly from there. lol. Re: So I got banned from ARf.com
Post by Die-Tryin » Sat Dec 04, 2010 12:40 pm echo6 wrote: The survival forum wont be the same without you and your mad cow avatar. Thanks..I appreciate it. My own fault for being baited like that. Ill be honest, I play it on shear boredom, I ventured into that arena and shouldve known better. That was the biggest abortion Ive ever seen, the icing was the thread theyve got going about me and some ppl had to get his punches in. I guess it goes to show money dont buy class. lol There's more. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:36:38 PM EDT
[#12]
My bad |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:37:10 PM EDT
[#13]
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But Nutnfancy is talking in the video. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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................ What was the fraud? Did NF conceal the changes he made to the upper? He said LaRue couldn't fix his gun and he had to do it? watch grim's video dude lied through his teeth, the dates and what he says dont match up at all this is slander plain and simple Slander is spoken. Libel. But Nutnfancy is talking in the video. You might be right.
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:38:45 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Quote HistoryQuoted: Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people.  |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:40:27 PM EDT
[#15]
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works great when you post a hour long video that everyone already has saved on their hard drives Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:41:16 PM EDT
[#16]
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Looks like that one is gone now too ? Quote HistoryClearly he thinks this thread is not helping his case. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:41:36 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is kinda how I pictured it when he checked on his youtube video to see the views and comments.  http://i.imgur.com/8rV82xC.gif Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: go read the comments on youtube under the video This is kinda how I pictured it when he checked on his youtube video to see the views and comments. http://i.imgur.com/8rV82xC.gif Nutnfancy's videos get on my nerves, so maybe I'm just being a dick, but he doesn't strike me as that much of a tough guy. If Mark is still pissed when his lawyers call him back this could be a "life changing event" for Nutnfancy, and not in a nice way
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:41:45 PM EDT
[#18]
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I got a topic doesn't exist Quote HistoryQuoted:
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That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. http://www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. Try this www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:45:24 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I will say that I suspect that nutnfancy knows little to nothing about Mark LaRue. I watched the whole video yesterday and cringed at some of the bombastic "hey it just sucks" crap he was saying in that video. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: go read the comments on youtube under the video This is kinda how I pictured it when he checked on his youtube video to see the views and comments. http://i.imgur.com/8rV82xC.gif Nutnfancy's videos get on my nerves, so maybe I'm just being a dick, but he doesn't strike me as that much of a tough guy. If Mark is still pissed when his lawyers call him back this could be a "life changing event" for Nutnfancy, and not in a nice way |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:47:57 PM EDT
[#20]
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I got nearly 35,000 virtually flawless posts on here,.[/span] 
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:52:42 PM EDT
[#21]
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Looks like that one is gone now too ? Quote HistoryAppears to have been deleted. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:53:24 PM EDT
[#22]
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He also duracoated the PRI gas block as seen in the video and stated here: https://twitter.com/Nutnfancy/status/7021475660 and he couldn't even reassemble the sight portion of the PRI gas block correctly as stated here: https://twitter.com/Nutnfancy/status/7082334094 and yet I am supposed to believe he didn't dick up the gas block install and alignment? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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This thread is predictable. Larue creates thread knowing the dogs will come out in force. Larue and dogs bash said customer. Larue changes tone after bashing customer some more, claims damage to business. Tell me if you have heard this one before.. http://i.imgur.com/ul4COAn.jpg http://i.gyazo.com/7fc1c36f1b6ccb9936c4244c1dcab231.png He also duracoated the PRI gas block as seen in the video and stated here: https://twitter.com/Nutnfancy/status/7021475660 and he couldn't even reassemble the sight portion of the PRI gas block correctly as stated here: https://twitter.com/Nutnfancy/status/7082334094 and yet I am supposed to believe he didn't dick up the gas block install and alignment? Not too sure about his mechanical aptitude, but this does show how he DOCUMENTS everything, yet doesn't have a video or text entry on the web of him shooting the LaRue upper in stock config. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:53:43 PM EDT
[#23]
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Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? It might be wise to have your lawyers send NF a preservation letter.
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:55:47 PM EDT
[#24]
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I got nearly 35,000 virtually flawless posts on here,.[/span]
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:56:16 PM EDT
[#25]
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go read the comments on youtube under the video "TNP'ers" talking about fan boys, oh the irony. Sounds like this jerkoff is pulling a page out of the SOE handbook, make youtube video, piss off arfcom and profit (Maybe not so much after LaRue and Arfcom are done ).
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:57:33 PM EDT
[#26]
I'd say he's on the run now.
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:57:47 PM EDT
[#27]
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That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. I think a call-out thread is in order.
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:58:30 PM EDT
[#28]
I like how everyone defending Larue is called a fan boy, I don't even own anything Larue but I do have common sense
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Posted: 1/27/2015 2:58:54 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I got nearly 35,000 virtually flawless posts on here,.[/span]
Don't you mean:  ?
Whenever I see that smiley, I always think it is Mark posting. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:03:58 PM EDT
[#30]
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Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? I'd bet.... Youtube has them....Good luck though |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:04:34 PM EDT
[#31]
internet archive...?
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:05:58 PM EDT
[#32]
MARK if you send me one of dose upper i will gladly test it out for you i will even make a 45 min long video just to out do poopatnothng
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:07:16 PM EDT
[#33]
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Yep, and delete/hide the SHOT video. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Yep, and delete/hide the SHOT video. NutnFancy has squatted low and squarely stomped his junk with these cowardly actions. There is nothing there is no difference between a liar and one who allows face saving claims to stand. Man I really wish Nutn would grow a pair and deal with this with integrity. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:09:14 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think a call-out thread is in order. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. I think a call-out thread is in order. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:09:21 PM EDT
[#35]
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NutnFancy has squatted low and squarely stomped his junk with these cowardly actions. There is nothing there is no difference between a liar and one who allows face saving claims to stand. Man I really wish Nutn would grow a pair and deal with this with integrity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Yep, and delete/hide the SHOT video. NutnFancy has squatted low and squarely stomped his junk with these cowardly actions. There is nothing there is no difference between a liar and one who allows face saving claims to stand. Man I really wish Nutn would grow a pair and deal with this with integrity. Without reading the two threads.... Is nuttin a member here? |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:11:32 PM EDT
[#36]
Since he was allegedly a tanker jockey, who gets the humor hidden in this training video / small arms review ?
" The Jerk" 
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:11:52 PM EDT
[#37]
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It might be wise to have your lawyers send NF a preservation letter. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? It might be wise to have your lawyers send NF a preservation letter. I'd actually be more put off by Larue suing, even if there is standing to do so. There's no need for Mark Larue to put himself in the same company as Ron Smith, Dick Swan, or the guys from Tactical Rifles. Simply put, if the gas port was well within spec for what a 20" rifle should have, then it was Nutn's goof for selecting a precision type upper and expecting it to operate like an AK. It's the 87 octane gas in a Porsche 911 that needs premium to perform. Mix adverse weather and environment, some low power ammo, and maybe even questional lubrication, and you are going to have an upper that doesn't meet your "operational criteria", whatever it is that Nutn' thinks his are  . He bought a Subaru rallycar when he really wants a pickup. Heck, if opening the gas hole is his solution because he's in the small percent of people that want to use a Stealth in some really rough conditions, fine. But I wouldn't say that's a design or manufacturing failure on Larue's part. If Nutn' wants a precision upper that will work in ice, mud, mountains, whatever, perhaps he should have considered that in the first place and looked elsewhere. But his disparaging comments that it was a 100% QC error on Larue's side are disingenuous IMO.
Where does Nutn' live/shoot? Is the environment and altitude there not a factor when mixed with low power ammo? How about factory match rounds? |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:17:36 PM EDT
[#38]
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I'd bet.... Youtube has them....Good luck though Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Covering your tracks... Always the deeds of righteous people. Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? I'd bet.... Youtube has them....Good luck though I can't seem to find the URL for the ntf 2010 shot show video in this thread. Somebody could try to find it here https://archive.org/web/ ETA found it but no joy. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:17:37 PM EDT
[#39]
" . . . back to the shop. I'll probably be able to square it away."
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:17:53 PM EDT
[#40]
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I'd actually be more put off by Larue suing, even if there is standing to do so. There's no need for Mark Larue to put himself in the same company as Ron Smith, Dick Swan, or the guys from Tactical Rifles. Simply put, if the gas port was well within spec for what a 20" rifle should have, then it was Nutn's goof for selecting a precision type upper and expecting it to operate like an AK. It's the 87 octane gas in a Porsche 911 that needs premium to perform. Mix adverse weather and environment, some low power ammo, and maybe even questional lubrication, and you are going to have an upper that doesn't meet your "operational criteria", whatever it is that Nutn' thinks his are . He bought a Subaru rallycar when he really wants a pickup. Heck, if opening the gas hole is his solution because he's in the small percent of people that want to use a Stealth in some really rough conditions, fine. But I wouldn't say that's a design or manufacturing failure on Larue's part. If Nutn' wants a precision upper that will work in ice, mud, mountains, whatever, perhaps he should have considered that in the first place and looked elsewhere. But his disparaging comments that it was a 100% QC error on Larue's side are disingenuous IMO.
Where does Nutn' live/shoot? Is the environment and altitude there not a factor when mixed with low power ammo? How about factory match rounds? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? It might be wise to have your lawyers send NF a preservation letter. I'd actually be more put off by Larue suing, even if there is standing to do so. There's no need for Mark Larue to put himself in the same company as Ron Smith, Dick Swan, or the guys from Tactical Rifles. Simply put, if the gas port was well within spec for what a 20" rifle should have, then it was Nutn's goof for selecting a precision type upper and expecting it to operate like an AK. It's the 87 octane gas in a Porsche 911 that needs premium to perform. Mix adverse weather and environment, some low power ammo, and maybe even questional lubrication, and you are going to have an upper that doesn't meet your "operational criteria", whatever it is that Nutn' thinks his are . He bought a Subaru rallycar when he really wants a pickup. Heck, if opening the gas hole is his solution because he's in the small percent of people that want to use a Stealth in some really rough conditions, fine. But I wouldn't say that's a design or manufacturing failure on Larue's part. If Nutn' wants a precision upper that will work in ice, mud, mountains, whatever, perhaps he should have considered that in the first place and looked elsewhere. But his disparaging comments that it was a 100% QC error on Larue's side are disingenuous IMO.
Where does Nutn' live/shoot? Is the environment and altitude there not a factor when mixed with low power ammo? How about factory match rounds? Nutn goes on to say LaRue should have checked the gas port.... then goes to to say he measured it and it looked right.... 
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:19:53 PM EDT
[#41]
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That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. This has been a wild ride. 
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:20:40 PM EDT
[#42]
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Nutn goes on to say LaRue should have checked the gas port.... then goes to to say he measured it and it looked right.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? It might be wise to have your lawyers send NF a preservation letter. I'd actually be more put off by Larue suing, even if there is standing to do so. There's no need for Mark Larue to put himself in the same company as Ron Smith, Dick Swan, or the guys from Tactical Rifles. Simply put, if the gas port was well within spec for what a 20" rifle should have, then it was Nutn's goof for selecting a precision type upper and expecting it to operate like an AK. It's the 87 octane gas in a Porsche 911 that needs premium to perform. Mix adverse weather and environment, some low power ammo, and maybe even questional lubrication, and you are going to have an upper that doesn't meet your "operational criteria", whatever it is that Nutn' thinks his are . He bought a Subaru rallycar when he really wants a pickup. Heck, if opening the gas hole is his solution because he's in the small percent of people that want to use a Stealth in some really rough conditions, fine. But I wouldn't say that's a design or manufacturing failure on Larue's part. If Nutn' wants a precision upper that will work in ice, mud, mountains, whatever, perhaps he should have considered that in the first place and looked elsewhere. But his disparaging comments that it was a 100% QC error on Larue's side are disingenuous IMO.
Where does Nutn' live/shoot? Is the environment and altitude there not a factor when mixed with low power ammo? How about factory match rounds? Nutn goes on to say LaRue should have checked the gas port.... then goes to to say he measured it and it looked right.... Yeah. Nutn - dude, if you're reading these threads or if any of your guys are - You need to do a "mea culpa" and just swallow it, duder. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:22:21 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can't seem to find the URL for the ntf 2010 shot show video in this thread. Somebody could try to find it here https://archive.org/web/ |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:22:44 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nutn goes on to say LaRue should have checked the gas port.... then goes to to say he measured it and it looked right.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
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Did anyone happen to save the now-deleted 250 comments ? It might be wise to have your lawyers send NF a preservation letter. I'd actually be more put off by Larue suing, even if there is standing to do so. There's no need for Mark Larue to put himself in the same company as Ron Smith, Dick Swan, or the guys from Tactical Rifles. Simply put, if the gas port was well within spec for what a 20" rifle should have, then it was Nutn's goof for selecting a precision type upper and expecting it to operate like an AK. It's the 87 octane gas in a Porsche 911 that needs premium to perform. Mix adverse weather and environment, some low power ammo, and maybe even questional lubrication, and you are going to have an upper that doesn't meet your "operational criteria", whatever it is that Nutn' thinks his are . He bought a Subaru rallycar when he really wants a pickup. Heck, if opening the gas hole is his solution because he's in the small percent of people that want to use a Stealth in some really rough conditions, fine. But I wouldn't say that's a design or manufacturing failure on Larue's part. If Nutn' wants a precision upper that will work in ice, mud, mountains, whatever, perhaps he should have considered that in the first place and looked elsewhere. But his disparaging comments that it was a 100% QC error on Larue's side are disingenuous IMO.
Where does Nutn' live/shoot? Is the environment and altitude there not a factor when mixed with low power ammo? How about factory match rounds? Nutn goes on to say LaRue should have checked the gas port.... then goes to to say he measured it and it looked right.... Exactly. My point was that the gas port could be correct for most ammo in most areas/weather in the lower 48, but maybe not with the ammo he wanted to run through it, where he lived, and in that weather. The cold and altitude brings new issues into the formula, yes? If the Stealth wasn't built and tested to run steel .223 pressure ammo in the snowy mountains of "wherever Nutn' lives" (is it Alaska? Where is he?), then I fail to see how Larue "failed" to fix or address his cycling problems. Did Nutn' tell them his altitude, temperature, and what ammo he was trying to use? |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:24:06 PM EDT
[#45]
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The URL was https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiSi92ygeJQ but its not on archive.org before today as far as I could tell. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I can't seem to find the URL for the ntf 2010 shot show video in this thread. Somebody could try to find it here https://archive.org/web/ Yeah I checked after I posted the url above - my guess is, the archive just gets links, but doesn't save the videos. I found the LaRue SHOT show video link but it wouldn't play for me. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:24:48 PM EDT
[#46]
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Exactly. My point was that the gas port could be correct for most ammo in most areas/weather in the lower 48, but maybe not with the ammo he wanted to run through it, where he lived, and in that weather. The cold and altitude brings new issues into the formula, yes? If the Stealth wasn't built and tested to run steel .223 pressure ammo in the snowy mountains of "wherever Nutn' lives" (is it Alaska? Where is he?), then I fail to see how Larue "failed" to fix or address his cycling problems. Did Nutn' tell them his altitude, temperature, and what ammo he was trying to use? If I recall correctly.... the only ammo he shows it failing with is PMC bronze, wolf, and some BVAC. He shows it running fine with Federal Gold Medal Match, some federal 5.56, and even Tactical Ammunition Match 77gr. Whats funny is, he has a video is another factory SPR having the same issues with PMC bronze, in warmer conditions. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:25:43 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. This has been a wild ride. http://i.imgur.com/ruFd4wS.gif |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:30:34 PM EDT
[#48]
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. . . in the snowy mountains of "wherever Nutn' lives" (is it Alaska? Where is he?) . . . Utah |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:31:38 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's Die-trying just helping out his buddy..... Had to look up Laboob camp, never heard the phrase before. Guess what I found. www.floridashootersnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=82477&start=0 Never had any love for Larue or his fans. actually what he posted in that thread is a complete lie. i locked for a particular comment. and he was not banned. |
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Posted: 1/27/2015 3:32:20 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If I recall correctly.... the only ammo he shows it failing with is PMC bronze, wolf, and some BVAC. He shows it running fine with Federal Gold Medal Match. Whats funny is, he has a video is another factory SPR having the same issues with PMC bronze, in warmer conditions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Exactly. My point was that the gas port could be correct for most ammo in most areas/weather in the lower 48, but maybe not with the ammo he wanted to run through it, where he lived, and in that weather. The cold and altitude brings new issues into the formula, yes? If the Stealth wasn't built and tested to run steel .223 pressure ammo in the snowy mountains of "wherever Nutn' lives" (is it Alaska? Where is he?), then I fail to see how Larue "failed" to fix or address his cycling problems. Did Nutn' tell them his altitude, temperature, and what ammo he was trying to use? If I recall correctly.... the only ammo he shows it failing with is PMC bronze, wolf, and some BVAC. He shows it running fine with Federal Gold Medal Match. Whats funny is, he has a video is another factory SPR having the same issues with PMC bronze, in warmer conditions. I know he had the PRI rebuild Mk12 upper featured in a clip (he wouldn't STFU, I wanted to slap him so hard), and he has his own Sabre 18" barrel homebrew (again, wanted to slap him for contradicting himself in his "philosophy of use", 18" went away in .mil for a reason). It just makes sense to me that a precision upper like the Stealth probably isn't gassed for Wolf or cheap .223 plinking ammo, and the issue is exacerbated by altitude and weather (aparently Utah, thanks!). Honestly, with that in mind, maybe drilling the gas hole is the right move. BUT, I sure wouldn't say it was Larue's fault THEY didn't do that. It's the solution to his problems, based on what he's decided to feed his rifle, and where he shoots it. We discuss the same thing when looking at the gas port for Mk18/CQBR clones. The milspec gas port may be ~.070, but that's because they are only using M855, Mk262, Mk318, etc. Mil pressure 5.56 stuff. Most of the aftermarket manufacturers bump it up to .078" or larger because they know folks like to run cheaper ammo. Does it overgas with suppressors and Xm193? Yeah, but that's up to the END USER to decide whether a bigger gas port is what they need. |
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