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Posted: 12/21/2014 12:41:48 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Willful ignorance. There isn't even a legitimate debate. It's plain, simple, thoroughly understood, and the ability of grown men to pretend otherwise is shameful. It's a really short discussion. Are you ready? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. So, if you want to dissent or call BS, please oh please make sure you're addressing the validity of items 1 or 2. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The anti fracking derp ... Fracking harms nothing .... Willful ignorance. There isn't even a legitimate debate. It's plain, simple, thoroughly understood, and the ability of grown men to pretend otherwise is shameful. It's a really short discussion. Are you ready? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. So, if you want to dissent or call BS, please oh please make sure you're addressing the validity of items 1 or 2. You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 1:31:53 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The anti fracking derp ... Fracking harms nothing .... Willful ignorance. There isn't even a legitimate debate. It's plain, simple, thoroughly understood, and the ability of grown men to pretend otherwise is shameful. It's a really short discussion. Are you ready? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. So, if you want to dissent or call BS, please oh please make sure you're addressing the validity of items 1 or 2. You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. Once there's an agreement that the casing do indeed fail, suddenly we're having an adult conversation. The Arf-children act like fracing is incapable of causing problems with the drinking water tables, and drowns out reasonable discussion with political slander. Well casing failure is a known, studied, and persistent problem for all drilling operations. It's more of a problem for frac sites, because the hydraulic pressures that are great enough to free the gas also cause a lot of the casing failures, magnify the severity of the casing failures, and blow open paths between the well casing and the water table. Additionally, the gas molecules are smaller and will leak readily through failure sites that would only be mild seeps for a casing that contained oil. The assertion that fracing lubricates geologic structures and 'causes' earthquakes is unproven. Further, easing geologic pressure with small lubricated quakes may be far better than waiting until there is enough pressure to cleave dry rock and move abruptly. I find the quake thing to be mostly silly. Water on fire is real, although mis-stated and mis-reported for splashy effect. The well casing has a failure and enables gas (that used to be trapped under a mile of rock) to migrate into the shallow water tables. Now families with wells have gas flowing/sputtering out of their faucets, hoses, shower heads, and well vents. Colorless, odorless, flammable gas ... in your home. It's an explosion hazard and an asphyxiation hazard. The property is now uninhabitable. There's no shortage of videos online with people lighting the gas on fire at their wells, faucets, and hoses. It's not moon-bat-tery. Just simple casing failure, sleazy denials, and corrupt politicians. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:03:09 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The anti fracking derp ... Fracking harms nothing .... Willful ignorance. There isn't even a legitimate debate. It's plain, simple, thoroughly understood, and the ability of grown men to pretend otherwise is shameful. It's a really short discussion. Are you ready? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. So, if you want to dissent or call BS, please oh please make sure you're addressing the validity of items 1 or 2. You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. So now back to the question since we agree fracking can contaminate. If they are fracking close to the property dont buy it as it can be dangerous to groundwater and effect resale value. Im simply amazed at the inability of some to understand there are serious negatives to fracking. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:08:54 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So now back to the question since we agree fracking can contaminate. If they are fracking close to the property dont buy it as it can be dangerous to groundwater and effect resale value. Im simply amazed at the inability of some to understand there are serious negatives to fracking. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The anti fracking derp ... Fracking harms nothing .... Willful ignorance. There isn't even a legitimate debate. It's plain, simple, thoroughly understood, and the ability of grown men to pretend otherwise is shameful. It's a really short discussion. Are you ready? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. So, if you want to dissent or call BS, please oh please make sure you're addressing the validity of items 1 or 2. You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. So now back to the question since we agree fracking can contaminate. If they are fracking close to the property dont buy it as it can be dangerous to groundwater and effect resale value. Im simply amazed at the inability of some to understand there are serious negatives to fracking. So why does every single major credible study conducted by Geoscientists say it is safe? http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jun/21/opinion/la-oe-zierman-california-fracking-moratorium-20130621 |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:20:22 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Once there's an agreement that the casing do indeed fail, suddenly we're having an adult conversation. The Arf-children act like fracing is incapable of causing problems with the drinking water tables, and drowns out reasonable discussion with political slander. Well casing failure is a known, studied, and persistent problem for all drilling operations. It's more of a problem for frac sites, because the hydraulic pressures that are great enough to free the gas also cause a lot of the casing failures, magnify the severity of the casing failures, and blow open paths between the well casing and the water table. Additionally, the gas molecules are smaller and will leak readily through failure sites that would only be mild seeps for a casing that contained oil. The assertion that fracing lubricates geologic structures and 'causes' earthquakes is unproven. Further, easing geologic pressure with small lubricated quakes may be far better than waiting until there is enough pressure to cleave dry rock and move abruptly. I find the quake thing to be mostly silly. Water on fire is real, although mis-stated and mis-reported for splashy effect. The well casing has a failure and enables gas (that used to be trapped under a mile of rock) to migrate into the shallow water tables. Now families with wells have gas flowing/sputtering out of their faucets, hoses, shower heads, and well vents. Colorless, odorless, flammable gas ... in your home. It's an explosion hazard and an asphyxiation hazard. The property is now uninhabitable. There's no shortage of videos online with people lighting the gas on fire at their wells, faucets, and hoses. It's not moon-bat-tery. Just simple casing failure, sleazy denials, and corrupt politicians. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The anti fracking derp ... Fracking harms nothing .... Willful ignorance. There isn't even a legitimate debate. It's plain, simple, thoroughly understood, and the ability of grown men to pretend otherwise is shameful. It's a really short discussion. Are you ready? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. So, if you want to dissent or call BS, please oh please make sure you're addressing the validity of items 1 or 2. You do understand that casing fails in all forms of underground drilling right? You also are aware that I am mainly addressing these Luddites and their fracking causes earthquakes and water to catch on fire right? Fracking does no more harm than any other type of drilling for oil/gas. Once there's an agreement that the casing do indeed fail, suddenly we're having an adult conversation. The Arf-children act like fracing is incapable of causing problems with the drinking water tables, and drowns out reasonable discussion with political slander. Well casing failure is a known, studied, and persistent problem for all drilling operations. It's more of a problem for frac sites, because the hydraulic pressures that are great enough to free the gas also cause a lot of the casing failures, magnify the severity of the casing failures, and blow open paths between the well casing and the water table. Additionally, the gas molecules are smaller and will leak readily through failure sites that would only be mild seeps for a casing that contained oil. The assertion that fracing lubricates geologic structures and 'causes' earthquakes is unproven. Further, easing geologic pressure with small lubricated quakes may be far better than waiting until there is enough pressure to cleave dry rock and move abruptly. I find the quake thing to be mostly silly. Water on fire is real, although mis-stated and mis-reported for splashy effect. The well casing has a failure and enables gas (that used to be trapped under a mile of rock) to migrate into the shallow water tables. Now families with wells have gas flowing/sputtering out of their faucets, hoses, shower heads, and well vents. Colorless, odorless, flammable gas ... in your home. It's an explosion hazard and an asphyxiation hazard. The property is now uninhabitable. There's no shortage of videos online with people lighting the gas on fire at their wells, faucets, and hoses. It's not moon-bat-tery. Just simple casing failure, sleazy denials, and corrupt politicians. I grew up in west central Indiana. There were no shortage of water wells that would light because of coal gas. There is no fracing of coal seams, especially 50 years ago. The methane gas getting into the water wells came from poor water well construction, and not from some other source. The same goes here. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:25:41 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So why does every single major credible study conducted by Geoscientists say it is safe? Why do people say the things they say or do the things they do? Who knows? 1. Contamination happens when casings fail. 2. Casings fail. If it doesn't address the points above, then it's immaterial. Are there any 'credible' studies that dispute casing failure as a systemic problem to ongoing frac operations? |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:30:15 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why do people say the things they say or do the things they do? Who knows? 1. Contamination happens when casings fail. 2. Casings fail. If it doesn't address the points above, then it's immaterial. Are there any 'credible' studies that dispute casing failure as a systemic problem to ongoing frac operations? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So why does every single major credible study conducted by Geoscientists say it is safe? Why do people say the things they say or do the things they do? Who knows? 1. Contamination happens when casings fail. 2. Casings fail. If it doesn't address the points above, then it's immaterial. Are there any 'credible' studies that dispute casing failure as a systemic problem to ongoing frac operations? No, they just show that is isn't as significant a concern as you think it is. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:30:21 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I grew up in west central Indiana. There were no shortage of water wells that would light because of coal gas. There is no fracing of coal seams, especially 50 years ago. The methane gas getting into the water wells came from poor water well construction, and not from some other source. The same goes here. Nope. Same does not go here. We agree that it's possible for gas to get into water tables on its own. What is being discussed is water tables that had no gas issues, for generations, and suddenly have gas in them after a local frac operation. Not an isolated case either. Same story; repeated in different states around the country. You can't deny that it is possible for a frac well casing failure to enable gas to migrate into shallow water tables. Not with any credibility, anyway. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:32:09 PM EDT
[#9]
It's possible for an asteroid to hit my house in the next five minutes. Just because something is possible does not make it remotely probable or in any way likely.
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:48:21 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, the fluid is a mix of hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide, both of which are toxic. Vapors of these chemicals burn exposed skin rapidly. The other chemicals added to it are so dilute they don't really matter. Sure, a few points of hydrochloric acid but nothing like what you have in your stomach. And sodium chloride which is somewhat toxic, if you have high blood pressure. Guar gum is a natural product from a certain bean. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. The other chemicals added to it are so dilute they don't really matter. Sure, a few points of hydrochloric acid but nothing like what you have in your stomach. And sodium chloride which is somewhat toxic, if you have high blood pressure. Guar gum is a natural product from a certain bean. 
H2O |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:50:09 PM EDT
[#11]
I wouldn't want a wellhead or compressor station in my backyard but otherwise I wouldn't worry.
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:53:38 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't want a wellhead or compressor station in my backyard but otherwise I wouldn't worry. I would if I had mineral rights. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:56:00 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, the fluid is a mix of hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide, both of which are toxic. Vapors of these chemicals burn exposed skin rapidly. The other chemicals added to it are so dilute they don't really matter. Sure, a few points of hydrochloric acid but nothing like what you have in your stomach. And sodium chloride which is somewhat toxic, if you have high blood pressure. Guar gum is a natural product from a certain bean. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. The other chemicals added to it are so dilute they don't really matter. Sure, a few points of hydrochloric acid but nothing like what you have in your stomach. And sodium chloride which is somewhat toxic, if you have high blood pressure. Guar gum is a natural product from a certain bean. I don't drink that shit because fish fuck in it. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 2:58:46 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The simple place to get a start is to watch the Gasland videos. 1 and 2 are very redundant, so just watch 2. You'll see explanations about well encasement failure, square families having their lives ruined by water contamination, EPA declaring unsafe water fit to drink to protect industry, actual scientific data collected before and after fracking that finds all of the fracking chemicals in the drinking water; in concentrations that form a concentric ring around the fracking site. But it's all bullshit, because Arf said so. GD knows everything, and the asshole that made that film is a lefty. Watch it and decide how credible it is for yourself. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So, based on arf-wisdom you're probably going to go ahead and do it. The property's water is very likely to become contaminated. The EPA will declare everything safe and fine. You won't be able to drink the water or bathe in it. You won't be able to sell, because the water won't pass inspection. You'll be the proud owner of a worthless shit heap that you can't get out from under. All of the boisterous arf-geniuses will resurface to tell you that whatever it is, it definitely had nothing to do with the fracking. If it isn't clear, I wouldn't have anything to do with it. Care to substantiate that at all genuinely curious The simple place to get a start is to watch the Gasland videos. 1 and 2 are very redundant, so just watch 2. You'll see explanations about well encasement failure, square families having their lives ruined by water contamination, EPA declaring unsafe water fit to drink to protect industry, actual scientific data collected before and after fracking that finds all of the fracking chemicals in the drinking water; in concentrations that form a concentric ring around the fracking site. But it's all bullshit, because Arf said so. GD knows everything, and the asshole that made that film is a lefty. Watch it and decide how credible it is for yourself. Watch Frack Nation and get back to us. It's on netflix. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 3:02:45 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't want a wellhead or compressor station in my backyard but otherwise I wouldn't worry. Pretty much this. Too bad we had one poster go off the deep end, when this is basically the sentiment backed by a real track record since the 1940s. The EPA does not allow the contamination of drinking water. The APPROVED projects are done so that the probability of public and environmental health risks are almost nonexistent. There have been 2 mishaps that occurred from fracking....lessons learned and the industry has gotten better. The Gasland source was largely funded by OPEC and welfare mooching hippies that never could contribute to an industry....it's not environmental, it's economic and an attack on America. Cyber wedgies to anyone citing Gasland again! |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 3:11:16 PM EDT
[#16]
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Oh, chemtrails also are made up of hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide. Don't joke about that shit! A couple tablespoonsful in your lungs can kill you. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 3:19:33 PM EDT
[#17]
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Don't joke about that shit! A couple tablespoonsful in your lungs can kill you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Oh, chemtrails also are made up of hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide. Don't joke about that shit! A couple tablespoonsful in your lungs can kill you. Drink too much: you die. Drink too little: you die. Scary shit. 
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Posted: 12/21/2014 3:27:36 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't want a wellhead or compressor station in my backyard but otherwise I wouldn't worry. lol If I had a lease, I'd let them put a fucking pad on my land. That's some serious $$$ in addition to the lease. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 3:53:42 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cute, and also tangent. Which assertion would you care to refute? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Industrial strength derp has entered this thread. First of all, chemicals used in hydraulic formation fracturing are mostly hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide. Both are very dangerous if inhaled or if concentrated vapors contact any body part. I don't know why they inject these toxic chemicals other than the fact they are non flammable. Cute, and also tangent. Which assertion would you care to refute? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. You keep using this as proof yet you do not know how these items function.
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Posted: 12/21/2014 4:43:23 PM EDT
[#20]
There is so much anti fracking bullshit! It is usually spewed out with near religious zeal! Don't try to have a conversation with these folks,I have tried and they don't want to hear the truth. OP do you relies we have been fracking in this country for over 80 years? I have been in the energy business for over 32 years. I have been on many fracking jobs. The crap posted by a bunch of college kids who want all fracking stoped or by folks who want all fossil fuel energy stopped is laughable. Fracking is almost all water and sand. Most people just don't know what the fug they are talking about. The water is forced into cracks in either shale or sandstone formations along with sand (to keep these cracks open) to increase the surface area and allow more gas/water/oil into the well bore. The small amount of chemicals used are either to keep the sand from bridging off and to keep things "slicked up" to keep the rate of water delivery up. Fracking of the Marcellus or Utica shales is usually done over 7 thousand feet deep. OP ,I would worry about the traffic and drilling/fracking noise more than fracking draining your lake. So much of what is touted in the media today is just plain false and carried forward by rubes who would keep us dependent on foreign oil. To all you hopleless nijits who rail against fracking ,I say this; Please throw away your car keys, all components of any product which are plastic. Amost every thing in your daily life contains petro products or is made possible by them! You TARDS should be barred from using any form of those EVIL hydrocarbons. Go home and turn off your power COMPLETELY unless your place is running on solar or hydro,we don't want you using any coal! I get a good laugh at these folks,the ones I have met who yell "No fracking or No mining! " are the very folks who would wither on the vine the quickest is anything disrupted the flow of energy! Most are a bunch of aging hippies who drive their Subaru's to the protest, act like a bunch of destructive teenagers and drive home (using gasoline) to a place heated by gas or coal generated electric! HYPOCRITES |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 4:52:51 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. Not a problem. Wells have multiple casing strings of increasingly smaller diameter casing which are each cemented in place.  |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 4:54:18 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 4:57:10 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The simple place to get a start is to watch the Gasland videos. 1 and 2 are very redundant, so just watch 2. You'll see explanations about well encasement failure, square families having their lives ruined by water contamination, EPA declaring unsafe water fit to drink to protect industry, actual scientific data collected before and after fracking that finds all of the fracking chemicals in the drinking water; in concentrations that form a concentric ring around the fracking site. But it's all bullshit, because Arf said so. GD knows everything, and the asshole that made that film is a lefty. Watch it and decide how credible it is for yourself. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: So, based on arf-wisdom you're probably going to go ahead and do it. The property's water is very likely to become contaminated. The EPA will declare everything safe and fine. You won't be able to drink the water or bathe in it. You won't be able to sell, because the water won't pass inspection. You'll be the proud owner of a worthless shit heap that you can't get out from under. All of the boisterous arf-geniuses will resurface to tell you that whatever it is, it definitely had nothing to do with the fracking. If it isn't clear, I wouldn't have anything to do with it. Care to substantiate that at all genuinely curious The simple place to get a start is to watch the Gasland videos. 1 and 2 are very redundant, so just watch 2. You'll see explanations about well encasement failure, square families having their lives ruined by water contamination, EPA declaring unsafe water fit to drink to protect industry, actual scientific data collected before and after fracking that finds all of the fracking chemicals in the drinking water; in concentrations that form a concentric ring around the fracking site. But it's all bullshit, because Arf said so. GD knows everything, and the asshole that made that film is a lefty. Watch it and decide how credible it is for yourself. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 4:59:38 PM EDT
[#24]
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Well, the fluid is a mix of hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide, both of which are toxic. Vapors of these chemicals burn exposed skin rapidly. The other chemicals added to it are so dilute they don't really matter. Sure, a few points of hydrochloric acid but nothing like what you have in your stomach. And sodium chloride which is somewhat toxic, if you have high blood pressure. Guar gum is a natural product from a certain bean. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. The other chemicals added to it are so dilute they don't really matter. Sure, a few points of hydrochloric acid but nothing like what you have in your stomach. And sodium chloride which is somewhat toxic, if you have high blood pressure. Guar gum is a natural product from a certain bean. Don't forget the hydroxyl acid. It is a main component of fracing fluid. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:00:41 PM EDT
[#25]
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We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. The "new" fracking is because of the developments in horizontal drilling. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:00:42 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Industrial strength derp has entered this thread. First of all, chemicals used in hydraulic formation fracturing are mostly hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide. Both are very dangerous if inhaled or if concentrated vapors contact any body part. I don't know why they inject these toxic chemicals other than the fact they are non flammable. I read that those two chemicals are also involved in the formation of tornadoes. I think the OP should be mindful that his house may get sucked up before it explodes. If it gets sucked up while it explodes, he should post a thread about it on Arfcom along with a video. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:01:08 PM EDT
[#27]
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So, based on arf-wisdom you're probably going to go ahead and do it. The property's water is very likely to become contaminated. The EPA will declare everything safe and fine. You won't be able to drink the water or bathe in it. You won't be able to sell, because the water won't pass inspection. You'll be the proud owner of a worthless shit heap that you can't get out from under. All of the boisterous arf-geniuses will resurface to tell you that whatever it is, it definitely had nothing to do with the fracking. If it isn't clear, I wouldn't have anything to do with it. So what is your background in this industry? |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:05:36 PM EDT
[#28]
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The simple place to get a start is to watch the Gasland videos. 1 and 2 are very redundant, so just watch 2. You'll see explanations about well encasement failure, square families having their lives ruined by water contamination, EPA declaring unsafe water fit to drink to protect industry, actual scientific data collected before and after fracking that finds all of the fracking chemicals in the drinking water; in concentrations that form a concentric ring around the fracking site. But it's all bullshit, because Arf said so. GD knows everything, and the asshole that made that film is a lefty. Watch it and decide how credible it is for yourself. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So, based on arf-wisdom you're probably going to go ahead and do it. The property's water is very likely to become contaminated. The EPA will declare everything safe and fine. You won't be able to drink the water or bathe in it. You won't be able to sell, because the water won't pass inspection. You'll be the proud owner of a worthless shit heap that you can't get out from under. All of the boisterous arf-geniuses will resurface to tell you that whatever it is, it definitely had nothing to do with the fracking. If it isn't clear, I wouldn't have anything to do with it. Care to substantiate that at all genuinely curious The simple place to get a start is to watch the Gasland videos. 1 and 2 are very redundant, so just watch 2. You'll see explanations about well encasement failure, square families having their lives ruined by water contamination, EPA declaring unsafe water fit to drink to protect industry, actual scientific data collected before and after fracking that finds all of the fracking chemicals in the drinking water; in concentrations that form a concentric ring around the fracking site. But it's all bullshit, because Arf said so. GD knows everything, and the asshole that made that film is a lefty. Watch it and decide how credible it is for yourself. So you watched a movie and now are an expert. What do you think the main purpose of that movie was? A. Inform the public of the dangers of fracing B. Make money I've watched that movie too and it is full of lies and misrepresentations. The water that you could light on fire has been documented before the first oil well was ever drilled, much less before we invented pumps capable of fracturing geologic formations. That is all you really need to know about that movie. That tell you the producers had an agenda when they left that tidbit of info out. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:11:38 PM EDT
[#29]
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The "new" fracking is because of the developments in horizontal drilling. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. The "new" fracking is because of the developments in horizontal drilling. That isn't new either. It is all new for oil. Horizontal drilling and fracing have been used for decades for natural gas. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:12:42 PM EDT
[#30]
I would have no problem living near a fracking site but will you get the mineral rights from any oil/gas that is under your land? If not, you will get boned out of potential money.
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:18:41 PM EDT
[#31]
The people who made that movie admitted that the water from that well would ignite BEFORE ANY FRACING WAS DONE IN THE AREA!
The man responsible admitted it, said it was for our own good. LIARS |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:28:30 PM EDT
[#32]
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So what is your background in this industry? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So, based on arf-wisdom you're probably going to go ahead and do it. The property's water is very likely to become contaminated. The EPA will declare everything safe and fine. You won't be able to drink the water or bathe in it. You won't be able to sell, because the water won't pass inspection. You'll be the proud owner of a worthless shit heap that you can't get out from under. All of the boisterous arf-geniuses will resurface to tell you that whatever it is, it definitely had nothing to do with the fracking. If it isn't clear, I wouldn't have anything to do with it. So what is your background in this industry? he is an expert from the internet who watched a few documentries . he is here to save us |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:46:53 PM EDT
[#33]
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:50:26 PM EDT
[#34]
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No, they just show that is isn't as significant a concern as you think it is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So why does every single major credible study conducted by Geoscientists say it is safe? Why do people say the things they say or do the things they do? Who knows? 1. Contamination happens when casings fail. 2. Casings fail. If it doesn't address the points above, then it's immaterial. Are there any 'credible' studies that dispute casing failure as a systemic problem to ongoing frac operations? No, they just show that is isn't as significant a concern as you think it is. So the assertions stand; un-refuted and unchallenged. Now we're shifting to, "it doesn't matter that casings fail and contamination occurs;" based on an LA-Times article. The discussion is already over. Concern over water table contamination due to frac-ops is warranted. Now it's just a bickering match over how much concern is too much. Hey OP, how much 'produced water' would you like your children to drink and bathe in? Let that be your guide for how much concern to levy. Also, take note of all the 'it's totally safe' proclamations in this thread, and how none of them can even make an attempt to refute the simple assertions I keep pushing. Do not buy. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:52:13 PM EDT
[#35]
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They've been fracking around here for years. Some wells within 1/2 mile of my house have been fracked. No damage, tremors, water contamination, well failures, environmental impact, or lost sleep. Not an issue. How do you know if the water in Hobbs is contaminated? Does it taste like sulfur instead of chalk? 
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:56:12 PM EDT
[#36]
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Casing failure? When did you last complete a well, either natural gas or petroleum? When did you last fracture a formation? You keep using this as proof yet you do not know how these items function. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Industrial strength derp has entered this thread. First of all, chemicals used in hydraulic formation fracturing are mostly hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide. Both are very dangerous if inhaled or if concentrated vapors contact any body part. I don't know why they inject these toxic chemicals other than the fact they are non flammable. Cute, and also tangent. Which assertion would you care to refute? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. You keep using this as proof yet you do not know how these items function. He's in a nuke thread, too, throwing around some cute opinions. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:00:56 PM EDT
[#37]
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He's in a nuke thread, too, throwing around some cute opinions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Industrial strength derp has entered this thread. First of all, chemicals used in hydraulic formation fracturing are mostly hydrogen hydroxide and dihydrogen monoxide. Both are very dangerous if inhaled or if concentrated vapors contact any body part. I don't know why they inject these toxic chemicals other than the fact they are non flammable. Cute, and also tangent. Which assertion would you care to refute? 1. If the well casing fails, fracing fluid and gas can both contaminate at the failure site. 2. Well casings fail. You keep using this as proof yet you do not know how these items function. He's in a nuke thread, too, throwing around some cute opinions. link? |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:01:22 PM EDT
[#38]
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That isn't new either. It is all new for oil. Horizontal drilling and fracing have been used for decades for natural gas. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. The "new" fracking is because of the developments in horizontal drilling. That isn't new either. It is all new for oil. Horizontal drilling and fracing have been used for decades for natural gas. I didn't know horizontal was old. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:07:03 PM EDT
[#39]
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:32:21 PM EDT
[#40]
Well, around here you won't be able to buy anything if you don't want to live around a well site. There is a well about 1k yards from my house.
If I had the option, I wouldn't live anywhere near one. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:36:23 PM EDT
[#41]
The tracking takes place miles beneath the surface. How deep do you think the lake is?
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:48:59 PM EDT
[#42]
YES - huge concern too
will I have enough land for them to frack also? if not it would really suck to be missing out |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:59:25 PM EDT
[#43]
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Not a problem. Wells have multiple casing strings of increasingly smaller diameter casing which are each cemented in place. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. And they still fail ..... |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:01:54 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And they still fail ..... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the interweb is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. And they still fail ..... |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:02:33 PM EDT
[#45]
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We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. It's not your grandfather's fracking. Just because the concept had been instantiated, doesn't mean that every follow on process is safe. "There is no way the chemicals can contaminate ...." Straight BS. 1. If the well casing fails the fracing fluid and gas will contaminate. 2. Casings fail. All of this, "there's no way," talk is ridiculous. The well bore is the path. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:07:19 PM EDT
[#46]
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And they still fail ..... That is such a misnomer. If the casing fails during the fracing process ( which is during the time of the most pressure the well will see), the well fails and will likely collapse in on itself and shut itself out. If it fails 20 years later those chemicals have already been pushed out either during production or during any workover. So your argument is bullshit and you are proving you have no idea what you are talking about. You clearly do not understand the process. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:07:57 PM EDT
[#47]
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It's not your grandfather's fracking. Just because the concept had been instantiated, doesn't mean that every follow on process is safe. "There is no way the chemicals can contaminate ...." Straight BS. 1. If the well casing fails the fracing fluid and gas will contaminate. 2. Casings fail. All of this, "there's no way," talk is ridiculous. The well bore is the path. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There is no risk. If on a lake, the water table is shallow, the shale that contains the gas is far deeper, on the order of 4000+feet under the surface. At that depth, water pressure is around 1700 PSI. It looks like 6000-8000' in that particular area. So the fracking fluid contamination is not a concern either? Again, serious question. It seems like everything on the inter web is either, "fracking is great, absolutely no downsides" which has to be bullshit, or "fracking is the devil and will kill you", which is also bullshit. We have been fracing a long ass time. We used in NG production for decades. The so called new technology is fracing shale for oil production. Nothing is new. There is no way the chemicals can contaminate anything at those depths. The only way to the surface is through the hole that was drilled and that is sealed through multiple steps. All of this fracing BS is just people with nothing to do in real life looking for something to do with their time. It's not your grandfather's fracking. Just because the concept had been instantiated, doesn't mean that every follow on process is safe. "There is no way the chemicals can contaminate ...." Straight BS. 1. If the well casing fails the fracing fluid and gas will contaminate. 2. Casings fail. All of this, "there's no way," talk is ridiculous. The well bore is the path. 
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:10:39 PM EDT
[#48]
How do casings fail? Come on now, EXPERT.
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:10:42 PM EDT
[#49]
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he is an expert from the internet who watched a few documentries . he is here to save us Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So, based on arf-wisdom you're probably going to go ahead and do it. The property's water is very likely to become contaminated. The EPA will declare everything safe and fine. You won't be able to drink the water or bathe in it. You won't be able to sell, because the water won't pass inspection. You'll be the proud owner of a worthless shit heap that you can't get out from under. All of the boisterous arf-geniuses will resurface to tell you that whatever it is, it definitely had nothing to do with the fracking. If it isn't clear, I wouldn't have anything to do with it. So what is your background in this industry? he is an expert from the internet who watched a few documentries . he is here to save us The movie's bullshit. They had an agenda. Everybody lied. I'm a know-nothing loser. It's an arf-children temper tantrum spewing ad hominem attack, and nobody addressing the point. The assertions still stand unchallenged. 1. If the casing fails the fracing fluid and gas will contaminate. 2. Casings fail. Arf always has subject matter experts floating through GD, yet there's no response. It's not even that the response is poor. There's nobody stupid enough to come out and say that either one of those assertions is incorrect. But nothing will change. Willful ignorance. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:13:16 PM EDT
[#50]
Why would it be a concern? It'd be awesome to get free natural gas right out of the tap. Also, the fracking company will generously add dissolved organic compounds to your water. Don't forget that you'll be able to sell your hair once it falls out!
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