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He destroyed your property but the cop said he couldn't arrest him because he didn't hit anyone?
You went outside, leaving him in there with your wife? You stayed outside listening as he was screaming and destroying shit, not know if he was harming your wife? He has a history of this behavior and you allow him to continue living there? You say you've never been that scared in your life, but you're not going to do anything to ensure this never happens again? I rate your story a out of . ETA: I don't feel bad for you. There is no justification for this shit. Another poster said something along the lines of "you don't know what it's like having an alchy family member." Fuck that. You've exhausted your good will and attempts to help him. Time to cut ties. I have an asshole druggy piece of shit brother that likes to steal from family(after 5 years I'm still finding my shit in local pawn shops), go in to fits of rage and brawl with friends or family, and now he's off living on his own in some shithole, probably paying rent by selling. There's only so much you can do for someone before you have to just walk away and start taking care of you and yours again. |
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Yes I'm being critical, but he had about a half dozen points in that story where descalation could have occured, doors could have been locked, police could have been called sooner, etc. I'll admit, I don't know what it's like to live with an alcoholic relative, but if it's that terrible and I've CHOSEN to live with/perpetuate that burden, then I better be prepared to stand by when people criticicize my life choices View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Wow, I think you did just about everything wrong in that scenario. I think you don't understand what it's like to have an alcoholic loved one. The OP did his best and he's trying to solve his problem. Yes I'm being critical, but he had about a half dozen points in that story where descalation could have occured, doors could have been locked, police could have been called sooner, etc. I'll admit, I don't know what it's like to live with an alcoholic relative, but if it's that terrible and I've CHOSEN to live with/perpetuate that burden, then I better be prepared to stand by when people criticicize my life choices Alcoholics are just people, they are all different. It sounds like he is the rage filled kind. I know "happy" alcoholics, if I can call them that. They can be a little coarse at work while they are sober, but that last hour of the day they are happy as shit, then they pound their customary post work 6 pack to level out. Then it's story time if you choose to hang around with them beyond that (learned my lesson about that one) they will tell you slurred speech stories, wanting you to drink with them into the evening (gives them an excuse). They eventually drink themselves right to sleep, wake up and repeat. |
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Serious question - what does the wife say about what happened? She ready to kick him out or does she consider that turning her back on family? The two of you need to have a discussion about it now, before he gets back, and make it clear you will shoot him DRT if needed.
He needs to come home to a uhaul trailer hooked to his vehicle packed full of his shit. |
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Yes I'm being critical, but he had about a half dozen points in that story where descalation could have occured, doors could have been locked, police could have been called sooner, etc. I'll admit, I don't know what it's like to live with an alcoholic relative, but if it's that terrible and I've CHOSEN to live with/perpetuate that burden, then I better be prepared to stand by when people criticicize my life choices View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Wow, I think you did just about everything wrong in that scenario. I think you don't understand what it's like to have an alcoholic loved one. The OP did his best and he's trying to solve his problem. Yes I'm being critical, but he had about a half dozen points in that story where descalation could have occured, doors could have been locked, police could have been called sooner, etc. I'll admit, I don't know what it's like to live with an alcoholic relative, but if it's that terrible and I've CHOSEN to live with/perpetuate that burden, then I better be prepared to stand by when people criticicize my life choices I'd say he understands that. Positive thought and action are needed. He'll have more than enough time for his own recriminations. |
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That is horrible. He needs to be kicked out. I would carry all the time around him if I were you. Be prepared to shoot him. I wouldn't tolerate someone getting in my wife's face and screaming. Just because he is muscled up doesn't actually mean he knows how to fight. You need to talk to him when he is sober. Don't kick him out after he's been drinking or he'll just fly into another rage. You may actually have to shoot him then. View Quote Unload on him with a good pepper spray. Zip tie him till LE arrives. Enabling an addict is worse than ignoring them. he fucked up AGAIN. OP & wife enables. The wife wants to help her brother, have her put the motel on her CC. |
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Wow, I think you did just about everything wrong in that scenario. View Quote Never mind, read your response to another thread. I agree, to a point. I would never have left my wife alone with him and I would have called the cops earlier but, that is based on my own dealings with a shitbag addict family member who I've had similar experiences with. |
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Where at in Texas OP, I might be able to help you out. I'll send my number, call me when you get a second.
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I don't think my joking response would fly with some of the mods here. Get him back into treatment. Is my serious response.
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I'd say he understands that. Positive thought and action are needed. He'll have more than enough time for his own recriminations. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Wow, I think you did just about everything wrong in that scenario. I think you don't understand what it's like to have an alcoholic loved one. The OP did his best and he's trying to solve his problem. Yes I'm being critical, but he had about a half dozen points in that story where descalation could have occured, doors could have been locked, police could have been called sooner, etc. I'll admit, I don't know what it's like to live with an alcoholic relative, but if it's that terrible and I've CHOSEN to live with/perpetuate that burden, then I better be prepared to stand by when people criticicize my life choices I'd say he understands that. Positive thought and action are needed. He'll have more than enough time for his own recriminations. I accept to your conclusion, and I'll leave it at that. |
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What is your wife's position on her brother and his living in your home at this point?
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Look up eviction procedure from your state and start them now.
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What would you have done differently? Not trying to be confrontational, just curious. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Wow, I think you did just about everything wrong in that scenario. What would you have done differently? Not trying to be confrontational, just curious. He would have knocked him unconscious with his 18 inch dick, then pissed on him to establish dominance. Maybe a good dry-humping to drive the point home. |
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Do you have dogs OP?
I am fairly certain if that if something like that started happening in my house my dogs would have no part of it, it might get scary actually, especially if the hound thought one of us was in danger. |
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Could not press charges for him breaking your stuff? That's criminal trespass all day long.
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Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. Start legal eviction proceedings if you have to, just get him the fuck out. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I know I probably sound like a total coward here, but let me lay it out a bit clearer. I'm 6' 1" 150#. He's 6' 2" and probably 200# of solid muscle. I have never been in a physical fight in my 30 years, and this wasn't going to be my first. I also REALLY did NOT want to have to shoot my wife's brother... Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. Start legal eviction proceedings if you have to, just get him the fuck out. Honestly, given the situation I think you took the best route possible. Now take the next best action and get him out of there. |
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You guys recommending hitting him with pepper spray or a baseball bat have clearly never dealt with a drunk like this.
At that level of intoxication, particularly the blackout state, your body and what's left of your mind is running on autopilot. The higher functions have shut down. You don't feel much. Pepper spray would just trigger a rage reaction, and hitting someone would do the same unless the blow is so hard that it turns off the lights for real. If it doesn't, drunk blackout guy in very good condition is likely to take that bat from him and beat him with it. I don't think OP wants to do that. OP does need to get him out of their house ASAP. You aren't going to win in this situation or get anything positive out of it. Your BIL is going to continue what he's doing - make excuses, then a bunch of promises, then clean up his act for a couple of days MAX......then do it again. No need to make you or your wife suffer with it and no sense to do it either. You subject yourself to the crap, and it simply prolongs the inevitable for him. Stupid. |
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Unless he helps himself no one else can. Tell him he needs to be in rehab or you'll throw him out. Your in a no win situation op. God bless.
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This will be a somewhat short reply as I'm on my phone back at the hospital. Had to leave at 6 to feed critters at home.
To address the most common question, no he will not be allowed back in our house aside from picking up his shit. Wife and I are unanimous on that. We're hoping he'll self admit to psych once he wakes up, he's still passed out. His only option today is to stay in the hospital. He has no transportation here and I will not take him back to our place. Period. We will go from there, but he will NOT be living with us. As of 7 AM his BAC was still 0.177. Keep in mind his 0.27 last night was taken almost 4 hours after his last drink... I can't respond to the individual posts that I'd like to on my phone, but for those that are critical of my actions, in many ways I agree with you. I can't justify some of my actions. I feel in most ways like I did the best I could given that I have NEVER dealt with someone behaving in that manner. It was truly terrifying. Thank you everyone for your thoughts, prayers and support. We greatly appreciate it. |
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OP, you need to start researching Texas law. Yesterday. Probably wouldn't be a bad idea to talk to an attorney as well. In South Dakota that would have went the same way. Since you have allowed him to live there since February (first and biggest mistake), he is legally considered a tenant and you cannot immediately kick him out. The stuff he broke is his since it's his residence. Change the locks and he can break in. His residence. Anyone suggesting getting violent with him is a moron and there's a good chance you'd be facing domestic charges. Whoever said never let relatives live with you is 100% spot-on. Trick him into moving out and start eviction proceedings immediately.
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For those worrying about eviction laws and such, acting on them requires the wherewithal to file stuff with a court and follow through on it. I don't see that as a threat in this case.
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"...my wife's 21 year old brother has been living with us since last February...if anything is unclear, just ask and I can clarify."
Why is he there? You need to take control of your own household, if you can. And frankly, I think you need to take a good long look at your marriage. |
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This will be a somewhat short reply as I'm on my phone back at the hospital. Had to leave at 6 to feed critters at home. To address the most common question, no he will not be allowed back in our house aside from picking up his shit. Wife and I are unanimous on that. We're hoping he'll self admit to psych once he wakes up, he's still passed out. His only option today is to stay in the hospital. He has no transportation here and I will not take him back to our place. Period. We will go from there, but he will NOT be living with us. As of 7 AM his BAC was still 0.177. Keep in mind his 0.27 last night was taken almost 4 hours after his last drink... I can't respond to the individual posts that I'd like to on my phone, but for those that are critical of my actions, in many ways I agree with you. I can't justify some of my actions. I feel in most ways like I did the best I could given that I have NEVER dealt with someone behaving in that manner. It was truly terrifying. Thank you everyone for your thoughts, prayers and support. We greatly appreciate it. View Quote You pack his shit and deliver it. Him coming back to pack it is another powder keg waiting for a spark. |
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Quoted: Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. It didn't get to that point, thankfully. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: I know I probably sound like a total coward here, but let me lay it out a bit clearer. I'm 6' 1" 150#. He's 6' 2" and probably 200# of solid muscle. I have never been in a physical fight in my 30 years, and this wasn't going to be my first. I also REALLY did NOT want to have to shoot my wife's brother... Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. It didn't get to that point, thankfully. |
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This. Anyone who carries a gun and is a mature responsible adult has probably done something similar. Hurts the ego a lot but it avoided physical violence. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I know I probably sound like a total coward here, but let me lay it out a bit clearer. I'm 6' 1" 150#. He's 6' 2" and probably 200# of solid muscle. I have never been in a physical fight in my 30 years, and this wasn't going to be my first. I also REALLY did NOT want to have to shoot my wife's brother... Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. It didn't get to that point, thankfully. To both of you, truly thank you. It means a lot right now. I'm a train wreck. Horrible emotional, adrenaline filled night, and I'm now on hour 28 with no sleep. I think I'm still trying to process through everything that happened. While no one was hurt, this really shook up both of us. |
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Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. It didn't get to that point, thankfully. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I know I probably sound like a total coward here, but let me lay it out a bit clearer. I'm 6' 1" 150#. He's 6' 2" and probably 200# of solid muscle. I have never been in a physical fight in my 30 years, and this wasn't going to be my first. I also REALLY did NOT want to have to shoot my wife's brother... Don't fucking sweat this. What you did was understandable, and I'm sure that at some point, if you had to, you would have responded. It didn't get to that point, thankfully. ^ That. You and your wife are OK, and you really don't need all the hassle and bullshit involved in shooting anyone, let alone a relative. |
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In before alcoholic bil takes your gun and shoots op with it?
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Bear spray or pepper spray could have helped your situation. Maybe it's a gray solution to a black or white problem. Sorry to hear your family issues, hopefully you can just kick him out.
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FPNI for sure
You grabbed a gun because a family member was pissed? I can't say I'd even consider that, not even remotely. You must've been pissing yourself to do that. That is in no way a hit on you. What I do mean is that if you thought you needed a gun is that maybe you need to work on something based on the fact that you felt you needed a gun. Imagine that amount of shit that would've followed had you shot someone for what? I'm just playing devil's advocate here. I don't know how many brawls I've been in because of drunken friends in and out of the army. I wasn't there though so that call was yours to make. You know better than anyone your BIL has major problems. He'd be out after that. He's 21 and wants to play pro baseball? Did he play baseball in college or even high school? The only reason I'm mentioning this is to point out what you probably already know. That kid has his priorities all f'd up and needs to get himself straightened out. Do you and your wife a favor and get him out asap. I almost forgot about the testosterone. If you believe that he actually got prescribed that....I'm not sure what to tell you. Outside of rare circumstances, a 21 year old does not get prescribed testosterone. Either way, that crap doesn't make people rage. The only people that think that are people that don't know anything about steroids. Now, if you are already prone to raging then yes it could do that. Normally however, if you are a calm person, you will remain that kind of person with a calm demeanour. |
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Not when he lives there... its not illegal to break your own shit and its not the cops job to discern what property belongs to who. Civil matter for a civil court View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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You couldn't have him charged with property damage? Not when he lives there... its not illegal to break your own shit and its not the cops job to discern what property belongs to who. Civil matter for a civil court I find it strange he didn't get arrested on a DV charge as well. In most states, breaking shit in the house while you're enraged or even just yelling in front of kids will get your arrested. It sounds more like someone used some discretion. |
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Cop didn't do his job. Should have hauled him off for disorderly conduct, property damage, and if he made any threats towards you or your wife assault. He should have spent the night in detox at least. View Quote Disorderly conduct in his own home? A civil matter for the damage to the property... in his own home... the threats, if you have any proof of the crime that wasnt comitted in the officers presence then that could possibly fly. Alot of people dont realize the situation they are putting themselves in when they allow someone to stay with them, be it a relative or a crazy significant other... dont allow people you cant trust to stay in your home. |
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FPNI for sure You grabbed a gun because a family member was pissed? I can't say I'd even consider that, not even remotely. You must've been pissing yourself to do that. That is in no way a hit on you. What I do mean is that if you thought you needed a gun is that maybe you need to work on something based on the fact that you felt you needed a gun. Imagine that amount of shit that would've followed had you shot someone for what? I'm just playing devil's advocate here. I don't know how many brawls I've been in because of drunken friends in and out of the army. I wasn't there though so that call was yours to make. You know better than anyone your BIL has major problems. He'd be out after that. He's 21 and wants to play pro baseball? Did he play baseball in college or even high school? The only reason I'm mentioning this is to point out what you probably already know. That kid has his priorities all f'd up and needs to get himself straightened out. Do you and your wife a favor and get him out asap. I almost forgot about the testosterone. If you believe that he actually got prescribed that....I'm not sure what to tell you. Outside of rare circumstances, a 21 year old does not get prescribed testosterone. Either way, that crap doesn't make people rage. The only people that think that are people that don't know anything about steroids. Now, if you are already prone to raging then yes it could do that. Normally however, if you are a calm person, you will remain that kind of person with a calm demeanour. View Quote To say he was pissed would be to call Niagara Falls a quiet little stream. This was blind black out rage. I've never experienced anything like it before. I have never before, in my 30 years, feared for my life at the hands of another person. I did last night. As to the testosterone, would you like a picture of the shit sitting on his bathroom counter with the pharmacy info on it? He was prescribed 460mg/week transdermal. If you don't believe that, well, sorry, its a fact. I never said it made him rage, I simply included it to give the full picture. |
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The most important thing from this is that you did not inflict harm on your BIL. Had you done so - even in defense of your wife, you would be living with that between you for the rest of your union.
The next most important thing here is - he did not harm anyone, only property. Most people have no experience with dealing with stressful situations. Even more people have no idea of how blood flow is re-routed in the brain, skin, extremities and torso when we get all aroused and ready to rock, roll, or run. You ever read about folks fighting/etc and wonder why they didn't do the logical thing? Because when you are massively stressed out your logical brain has little fuel being supplied. Aint nothing under the sun that needs fuel to run that runs without it - so considering the circumstances, you did ok. Don't beat yourself up about it. My questions: Where does he get $ from for a car? Parents, you guys, a boy/girlfriend, rich grandparents or does he have a job? What ground rules did you lay down when you agreed to have him move him, with you both knowing his history? What are his parents saying? Even though he is 21, (if) they raised him, surely they have an inkling or insight on the person they raised. Is is your house, her house, or both of you'se house? If you insert a gun in the equation, it becomes very hard to remove it from the equation - it is kinda like removing ink from milk, or pee from pool water. You can reverse the process, but it is not easy. Smart for you not getting the gun up in the mix. If you can, get him to agree to leave, now. If you can't, draft up paper and have him sign where you are "renewing/extending" his lease/stay. Put whatever conditions on paper you are comfortable with that voids his lease, and stick to it. Of course check with your state to make sure all of this is legal. |
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He got his chance. Everybody should get one chance to do something stupid. We've all done stupid stuff, some more than others. But that doesn't mean you should give him another chance op. Kick him to the curb as smooth and efficiently as possible. But make it clear that anymore mistakes will be met with swift and brutal justice. He's a man, time to start acting like one.
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Throw his shit on the lawn, break contact and never let him back. No exceptions. Ever.
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Had a brother in law as tenant, got depressed, started waving his 45 around. Had cops meet him later at work, took his pistol. Evicted him.
You need to kick your bro in law to the curb.
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I find it strange he didn't get arrested on a DV charge as well. In most states, breaking shit in the house while you're enraged or even just yelling in front of kids will get your arrested. It sounds more like someone used some discretion. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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You couldn't have him charged with property damage? Not when he lives there... its not illegal to break your own shit and its not the cops job to discern what property belongs to who. Civil matter for a civil court I find it strange he didn't get arrested on a DV charge as well. In most states, breaking shit in the house while you're enraged or even just yelling in front of kids will get your arrested. It sounds more like someone used some discretion. It can happen, but it would have to be the intimidation angle. Which would have had to be expressed by the victims here and it doesnt sound like that was lresented to the officer. DV can be charged without physical contact but its a hard push and usually reserved for cases where there is a history between that particular suspect and victim. But then again down here DV specifically applies to sexual relationships. Violence between family members is the same as any other assault. Zo the laws clearly differ. That being said, OP, dont sweat it. You got yoir wife out and nobody was hurt. I cant say one way or another what the correct response would be to your BIL yelling and screaming at your wife. Out of the two of you he is much more likely to react violently towards you so I tend to agree that not confronting him was a wise move. What I will say is that now that its done and over, it IS your job to make sure that yoir wife doesnt end up in the situation again. Get the eviction going now |
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It was a cry for help, "Taze me Bro!" You should have helped him out. How often do you get the chance. It would have been good negative reinforcement. From then on, if he gets out of line, just spark the tazer a few times.
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