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Posted: 11/23/2014 8:58:26 AM EDT
Maybe not a GD question, but since I am a military contractor and retired .mil, I wonder about this:
How long before most of our combat power will be unmanned, robotic, autonomous?  We are certainly moving that way quickly.

Let the machine kill that other human enemy.  I like it.






Link Posted: 11/23/2014 9:23:03 AM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Maybe not a GD question, but since I am a military contractor and retired .mil, I wonder about this:How long before most of our combat power will be unmanned, robotic, autonomous?  We are certainly moving that way quickly.
Let the machine kill that other human enemy.  I like it.


View Quote




The technological advancements our Military has made with aerial drones is amazing and we've got to be close to extending that further onto the battlefield.


Eta: Zero Military experience and I'm just guessing but find it very fascinating.
Link Posted: 11/23/2014 9:30:23 AM EDT
[#2]
We also have a huge number of unmanned Navy ships out there...
Link Posted: 11/23/2014 9:31:56 AM EDT
[#3]
Long ago.



ICBM.
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 7:40:28 PM EDT
[#4]
Assuming that we have a war about every 20-25 years, I've sometimes thought that OEF and OIF are the last wars with large numbers of humans routinely patrolling outside the wire.

I figure within 40-50 years a lot of the stuff going outside the wire might be robotic or remotely controlled.

But then of course in the 60s we thought there would be bases on Mars by now
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 7:42:53 PM EDT
[#5]
When we let women into the infantry.
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 8:01:15 PM EDT
[#6]
As others have already said, I think the writing is already on the wall for combat pilots. I think we'll see those gone before mid-century.  We'll also probably see unmanned ground combat vehicles, like tanks, artillery, and transports over the same time period.    



Infantry troops will take longer to replace.  We'll have general purpose robots long before we have general purpose military robots.   It would have to be a general purpose robotic platform which can at least replicate the agility, endurance, and durability of the human body.  Then there is the question of how we power a general purpose military robot, we'll need some breakthroughs in battery, fuel cell, or capacitor technology to make that happen.  Finally, the machine will have to be fairly intelligent.  While it won't necessarily have to be true A.I., it will have to be a fairly good "smart" system.  The last capability will be the easiest to accomplish, since I think we're well on our way with systems like IBM's Watson, and Google's Deepmind.   The platform and power are the major hurdles to overcome.  




I'd say that sometime this century for all intents and purposes humans will become....unemployable.  Automation will be used across the board.  
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 8:56:20 PM EDT
[#7]
It's coming.  Flying drones, drone trucks, potentially drone tanks (Bolos?), unmanned sensors everywhere, used to back up small elite units.

Lots of operators stateside, lots of relay satellites, an increasingly automated logistics train...

All that would be needed then would be T-800s.
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 9:22:54 PM EDT
[#8]


Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



It's coming.  Flying drones, drone trucks, potentially drone tanks (Bolos?), unmanned sensors everywhere, used to back up small elite units.





Lots of operators stateside, lots of relay satellites, an increasingly automated logistics train...





All that would be needed then would be T-800s.
View Quote





 

THIS







Think of it this way.  We'll soon replace humans as operators of machines.  That's easy.  So any machine (aircraft, truck, tank, bulldozer, forklift, etc) which is currently operated by a human, will be automated, probably before mid-century.  







Humans that are in roles not currently mechanized, or automated, will take longer to replace.    




We have to develop a good, robust and efficient general purpose robot.  While organizations are working towards this, we still have several significant technological hurdles to overcome.  With that said, given the pace of our technological advancement I think this will be achieved sometime after mid-century.  

 
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 9:25:09 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

  THIS

Think of it this way.  We'll soon replace humans as operators of machines.  That's easy.  So any machine (aircraft, truck, tank, bulldozer, forklift, etc) which is currently operated by a human, will be automated, probably before mid-century.  

Humans that are in roles not currently mechanized or automated will take longer to replace.    
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Quoted:
Quoted:
It's coming.  Flying drones, drone trucks, potentially drone tanks (Bolos?), unmanned sensors everywhere, used to back up small elite units.

Lots of operators stateside, lots of relay satellites, an increasingly automated logistics train...

All that would be needed then would be T-800s.

  THIS

Think of it this way.  We'll soon replace humans as operators of machines.  That's easy.  So any machine (aircraft, truck, tank, bulldozer, forklift, etc) which is currently operated by a human, will be automated, probably before mid-century.  

Humans that are in roles not currently mechanized or automated will take longer to replace.    


Automating the operation is pretty easy, automating the maintenance is not.  Our forward maintenance footprint for something like reaper or global hawk is no smaller than for their manned counterparts.
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 9:49:42 PM EDT
[#10]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Automating the operation is pretty easy, automating the maintenance is not.  Our forward maintenance footprint for something like reaper or global hawk is no smaller than for their manned counterparts.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



Quoted:


Quoted:

It's coming.  Flying drones, drone trucks, potentially drone tanks (Bolos?), unmanned sensors everywhere, used to back up small elite units.



Lots of operators stateside, lots of relay satellites, an increasingly automated logistics train...



All that would be needed then would be T-800s.


  THIS



Think of it this way.  We'll soon replace humans as operators of machines.  That's easy.  So any machine (aircraft, truck, tank, bulldozer, forklift, etc) which is currently operated by a human, will be automated, probably before mid-century.  



Humans that are in roles not currently mechanized or automated will take longer to replace.    





Automating the operation is pretty easy, automating the maintenance is not.  Our forward maintenance footprint for something like reaper or global hawk is no smaller than for their manned counterparts.




 
Those would be the humans in roles which are not currently mechanized or automated.  




But two factors will eliminate even those jobs as well.  First, the technology will become more robust and efficient, requiring fewer and fewer people over time.  Once upon a time it took dozens of technicians to operate and maintain room sized computers that don't have the capabilities of the device on which you are accessing this forum.  Second, sometime over the next couple of decades we'll have our first general purpose robots.  Sometime later these general purpose robots will be advanced enough to replace many, if not most, roles currently preformed by humans.




Moore's law has held up since he first postulated it back in the 1960's.  If this 18 month exponential growth continues we'll replace humans this century.  The problem with technology is you go along for quite some time where nothing seems to be happening, or no real progress is being made (we don't have flying cars!).  And then just about the time you're about to give up on the idea, you're done.  




Here's a great explanation of how it works.  




"...Suppose it's 1940 and Lake Michigan has (somehow) been emptied. Your job is to fill it up using the following rule: To start off, you can add one fluid ounce of water to the lake bed. Eighteen months later, you can add two. In another 18 months, you can add four ounces. And so on. Obviously this is going to take a while.

By 1950, you have added around a gallon of water. But you keep soldiering on. By 1960, you have a bit more than 150 gallons. By 1970, you have 16,000 gallons, about as much as an average suburban swimming pool.


At this point it's been 30 years, and even though 16,000 gallons is a fair amount of water, it's nothing compared to the size of Lake Michigan. To the naked eye you've made no progress at all.


So let's skip all the way ahead to 2000. Still nothing. You have—maybe—a slight sheen on the lake floor. How about 2010? You have a few inches of water here and there. This is ridiculous. It's now been 70 years and you still don't have enough water to float a goldfish. Surely this task is futile?


But wait. Just as you're about to give up, things suddenly change. By 2020, you have about 40 feet of water. And by 2025 you're done. After 70 years you had nothing. Fifteen years later, the job was finished..."






Link Posted: 11/28/2014 9:55:15 PM EDT
[#11]
As soon as Cyberdyne systems is fully self aware!
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 10:01:02 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

  Those would be the humans in roles which are not currently mechanized or automated.  

But two factors will eliminate even those jobs as well.  First, the technology will become more robust and efficient, requiring fewer and fewer people over time.  Once upon a time it took dozens of technicians to operate and maintain room sized computers that don't have the capabilities of the device on which you are accessing this forum.  Second, sometime over the next couple of decades we'll have our first general purpose robots.  Sometime later these general purpose robots will be advanced enough to replace many, if not most, roles currently preformed by humans.

Moore's law has held up since he first postulated it back in the 1960's.  If this 18 month exponential growth continues we'll replace humans this century.  The problem with technology is you go along for quite some time where nothing seems to be happening, or no real progress is being made (we don't have flying cars!).  And then just about the time you're about to give up on the idea, you're done.  

Here's a great explanation of how it works.  

"...Suppose it's 1940 and Lake Michigan has (somehow) been emptied. Your job is to fill it up using the following rule: To start off, you can add one fluid ounce of water to the lake bed. Eighteen months later, you can add two. In another 18 months, you can add four ounces. And so on. Obviously this is going to take a while.
By 1950, you have added around a gallon of water. But you keep soldiering on. By 1960, you have a bit more than 150 gallons. By 1970, you have 16,000 gallons, about as much as an average suburban swimming pool.

At this point it's been 30 years, and even though 16,000 gallons is a fair amount of water, it's nothing compared to the size of Lake Michigan. To the naked eye you've made no progress at all.

So let's skip all the way ahead to 2000. Still nothing. You have—maybe—a slight sheen on the lake floor. How about 2010? You have a few inches of water here and there. This is ridiculous. It's now been 70 years and you still don't have enough water to float a goldfish. Surely this task is futile?

But wait. Just as you're about to give up, things suddenly change. By 2020, you have about 40 feet of water. And by 2025 you're done. After 70 years you had nothing. Fifteen years later, the job was finished..."


http://assets.motherjones.com/media/2013/05/LakeMichigan-Final3.gif

View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
It's coming.  Flying drones, drone trucks, potentially drone tanks (Bolos?), unmanned sensors everywhere, used to back up small elite units.

Lots of operators stateside, lots of relay satellites, an increasingly automated logistics train...

All that would be needed then would be T-800s.

  THIS

Think of it this way.  We'll soon replace humans as operators of machines.  That's easy.  So any machine (aircraft, truck, tank, bulldozer, forklift, etc) which is currently operated by a human, will be automated, probably before mid-century.  

Humans that are in roles not currently mechanized or automated will take longer to replace.    


Automating the operation is pretty easy, automating the maintenance is not.  Our forward maintenance footprint for something like reaper or global hawk is no smaller than for their manned counterparts.

  Those would be the humans in roles which are not currently mechanized or automated.  

But two factors will eliminate even those jobs as well.  First, the technology will become more robust and efficient, requiring fewer and fewer people over time.  Once upon a time it took dozens of technicians to operate and maintain room sized computers that don't have the capabilities of the device on which you are accessing this forum.  Second, sometime over the next couple of decades we'll have our first general purpose robots.  Sometime later these general purpose robots will be advanced enough to replace many, if not most, roles currently preformed by humans.

Moore's law has held up since he first postulated it back in the 1960's.  If this 18 month exponential growth continues we'll replace humans this century.  The problem with technology is you go along for quite some time where nothing seems to be happening, or no real progress is being made (we don't have flying cars!).  And then just about the time you're about to give up on the idea, you're done.  

Here's a great explanation of how it works.  

"...Suppose it's 1940 and Lake Michigan has (somehow) been emptied. Your job is to fill it up using the following rule: To start off, you can add one fluid ounce of water to the lake bed. Eighteen months later, you can add two. In another 18 months, you can add four ounces. And so on. Obviously this is going to take a while.
By 1950, you have added around a gallon of water. But you keep soldiering on. By 1960, you have a bit more than 150 gallons. By 1970, you have 16,000 gallons, about as much as an average suburban swimming pool.

At this point it's been 30 years, and even though 16,000 gallons is a fair amount of water, it's nothing compared to the size of Lake Michigan. To the naked eye you've made no progress at all.

So let's skip all the way ahead to 2000. Still nothing. You have—maybe—a slight sheen on the lake floor. How about 2010? You have a few inches of water here and there. This is ridiculous. It's now been 70 years and you still don't have enough water to float a goldfish. Surely this task is futile?

But wait. Just as you're about to give up, things suddenly change. By 2020, you have about 40 feet of water. And by 2025 you're done. After 70 years you had nothing. Fifteen years later, the job was finished..."


http://assets.motherjones.com/media/2013/05/LakeMichigan-Final3.gif



Moore's law fell flat on its face a few years ago when we reached the physical limit of silicon circuit etching at around 13 microns.  Now we just make multi core processors, but that's like putting eight engines in a car and saying you have increased your hp/liter.  It's just not true.  With quantum computers or optical processors, we may be able to get back on track, but not anytime soon.
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 10:24:14 PM EDT
[#13]
Obama says by 2016.
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 10:26:41 PM EDT
[#14]
As soon as the left replaces all the dudes with chicks and trannies, and makes the ROEs as  restricted as humanly possible, then our combat power will be "unmanned".
Link Posted: 11/28/2014 10:41:03 PM EDT
[#15]
It will be an element, but the inherent limitations of IP networked systems will present a significant challenge to the fully autonomous future.

Link Posted: 11/29/2014 12:19:13 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
Maybe not a GD question, but since I am a military contractor and retired .mil, I wonder about this:How long before most of our combat power will be unmanned, robotic, autonomous?  We are certainly moving that way quickly.
Let the machine kill that other human enemy.  I like it.


View Quote


20 years & there will be little manned armor, & probably no manned aircraft.
Huge focus on ECM & enemy asset takeover will be the future (non-nuclear) arms race.
I doubt there will be fully autonomous systems allowed for a long while.
Link Posted: 11/29/2014 12:21:27 PM EDT
[#17]
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Quoted:
When we let women into the infantry.
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Well played.
Link Posted: 11/29/2014 12:27:03 PM EDT
[#18]
maybe soon wars will be fought like a video game and no one will have to die.
Link Posted: 11/29/2014 12:28:37 PM EDT
[#19]
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Quoted:
maybe soon wars will be fought like a video game and no one will have to die.
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The enemy will target our remote control centers and the people manning them
Link Posted: 11/29/2014 3:15:51 PM EDT
[#20]
Or interdict, suborn,  and  use them against us,  as for example: asset returns to base as Trojan horse.
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