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Posted: 10/20/2014 6:02:38 AM EDT
But a century on, the rugged reliability and brute firepower that made the Lee-Enfield rifle the standard-issue weapon for entrenched Canadian troops during the latter half of the First World War makes it an ideal choice still for a modern group of this country’s soldiers.
The Canadian Rangers — a component of the armed forces reserves — conduct sovereignty patrols and assist search and rescue missions in the Far North and in remote coastal regions across the country. Related: And the red-shirted Rangers — made up largely of aboriginal volunteers — have been using Lee-Enfield rifles little changed from the First World War version since the group was first established in 1947. “The Rangers were not issued this weapon to fight an enemy, they were given the rifle because they are operating in one of the harshest environments in the world,” says Capt. Mark Rittwage, officer commander of the 3rd Canadian Patrol Group, Northern Ontario. http://metronews.ca/news/canada/1187420/lee-enfield-rifle-phased-out-by-canadian-military-after-100-years-of-service/ |
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If I ever had to take a bolt action into battle I want an Enfield.
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Yeah they have been trying to find a new bolt gun for years, I don't think there is a replacement yet. They tried to get ruger to license the scout to colt Canada but ruger laughed at them. Basically a nice article but there is still no replacement, I think.
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Yeah they have been trying to find a new bolt gun for years, I don't think there is a replacement yet. They tried to get ruger to license the scout to colt Canada but ruger laughed at them. Basically a nice article but there is still no replacement, I think. View Quote Correct on no replacement, primarily because Diemaco doesn't manufacture a bolt action rifle (or at least not one that suits their requirements) and the rifle has to be of Canadian manufacture. |
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Looks like he is carrying spare magazines. Interesting. https://metronewsca.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/img_4939.jpg View Quote That is sort of odd when you consider the mag was not really designed to be used that way. I guess he has tweeked the feed lips to work with that particular rifle....Works for him I guess. |
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Correct on no replacement, primarily because Diemaco doesn't manufacture a bolt action rifle (or at least not one that suits their requirements) and the rifle has to be of Canadian manufacture. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Yeah they have been trying to find a new bolt gun for years, I don't think there is a replacement yet. They tried to get ruger to license the scout to colt Canada but ruger laughed at them. Basically a nice article but there is still no replacement, I think. Correct on no replacement, primarily because Diemaco doesn't manufacture a bolt action rifle (or at least not one that suits their requirements) and the rifle has to be of Canadian manufacture. I suspect from how you worded this you know this, but Diemaco has a relationship with or ownership of PGWs defense business. |
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I suspect from how you worded this you know this, but Diemaco has a relationship with or ownership of PGWs defense business. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Yeah they have been trying to find a new bolt gun for years, I don't think there is a replacement yet. They tried to get ruger to license the scout to colt Canada but ruger laughed at them. Basically a nice article but there is still no replacement, I think. Correct on no replacement, primarily because Diemaco doesn't manufacture a bolt action rifle (or at least not one that suits their requirements) and the rifle has to be of Canadian manufacture. I suspect from how you worded this you know this, but Diemaco has a relationship with or ownership of PGWs defense business. I'm familiar with that, and I would suspect that avenue has been explored. Not sure if there's a issue with volume, cost, or what. I do remember reading that other companies had been approached to license/sell their design to Diemaco, but they all ran screaming into the night. I'd imagine that if the existing relationship between PGW and Diemaco could facilitate this, they would've already done so, but... well, government contracts and all |
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We'll see how long this lasts this time. They've been trying to replace the Rangers' Enfields for awhile, along with the WWII-production Inglis 9mm pistols that are still standard Canadian issue. The issue is that the Canadian military procurement system is horribly screwed up, and whatever rifle is chosen must be manufactured by Colt Canada. As Colt Canada doesn't make a bolt-action rifle, and understandably nobody else wants to give Colt Canada their design, nothing has come of this and nothing is likely to come of it.
Honestly, they should just put a modified No. 4 back into production; use a synthetic stock and chamber it in 7.62 NATO. The Rangers like their Enfields and they work under the conditions they need them to work in. |
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If I ever had to take a bolt action into battle I want an Enfield. +1 I don't understand why they would need to change, considering the application and climate. ETA That picture is what a real rifleman looks like. |
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+1 I don't understand why they would need to change, considering the application and climate. ETA That picture is what a real rifleman looks like. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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If I ever had to take a bolt action into battle I want an Enfield. +1 I don't understand why they would need to change, considering the application and climate. ETA That picture is what a real rifleman looks like. This is what I was going to ask. What do they hope to gain by switching rifles ? I guess I could actually read the article and maybe they say, but I really don't think that simply changing to another bolt action rifle would make it a better rifle. If you have to use a bolt action rifle, the Enfield is certainly one of the best if not THE best. I don't even understand what making a new Enfield would accomplish or what adding a synthetic stock would do for them ? The stocks they have hold up fine. Why change to a different cartridge: again, the one they are using seems to get the job done and has for 100 years ? Is this change for the sake of change ? I also like in that picture that the guy is using a hasty sling. It looks like he really knows what he is doing. |
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Honestly, they should just put a modified No. 4 back into production; use a synthetic stock and chamber it in 7.62 NATO. The Rangers like their Enfields and they work under the conditions they need them to work in. View Quote This. If they can't figure out how to make a new No.4Mk1 magazine fed bolt action rifle they have some serious problems. |
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This. If they can't figure out how to make a new No.4Mk1 magazine fed bolt action rifle they have some serious problems. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Honestly, they should just put a modified No. 4 back into production; use a synthetic stock and chamber it in 7.62 NATO. The Rangers like their Enfields and they work under the conditions they need them to work in. This. If they can't figure out how to make a new No.4Mk1 magazine fed bolt action rifle they have some serious problems. It's a lot of work for so few rifles. |
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You could read the article and find out. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I wonder what a "sovereignty patrol" is ? You could read the article and find out. I did read the article. Don't see where it says what one is. I have also now done the Wikipeadia thing "The Canadian Rangers (often mistakenly called the Arctic Rangers) are a sub-component of the Canadian Forces reserve that provide a military presence in Canada's sparsely settled northern, coastal, and isolated areas. Formally established on May 23, 1947, a primary role of this part-time force is to conduct surveillance or sovereignty patrols (SOV PATS) as required. Some Canadian Rangers also conduct inspections of the North Warning System (NWS) sites and act as guides, scouts, and subject matter experts in such disciplines as wilderness survival when other forces (such as Army units of the Regular Force or Primary Reserve) are in their area of operations." |
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The change is a waste of time. The Enfield is perfectly suitable for what they need. New semis like C8s or other are useless. They need something robust which the Enfield is.
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Basically its having a small force in remote areas, reaffirms Canadian territory in areas subject to dispute that nobody ever goes to mostly. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I wonder what a "sovereignty patrol" is ? Basically its having a small force in remote areas, reaffirms Canadian territory in areas subject to dispute that nobody ever goes to mostly. Ok, thanks. That is interesting. It would be interesting to know what parts they are needing to replace ? |
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I wonder what a "sovereignty patrol" is ? View Quote I don't go into my attic much. It's a pain in the ass to get up there; I've got to move my washer & dryer, maneuver a ladder in there, and squeeze myself through this tiny hatch. I don't even store anything up there, so I don't have much reason to ever go through all that bullshit. Still I go up there at least once a year to check the place out. Mostly looking for rodents chewing shit up and making nests. Sovereignty patrols are pretty much the same thing, except instead of my attic it's the Arctic, and instead of rodents it's Russians. |
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This. If they can't figure out how to make a new No.4Mk1 magazine fed bolt action rifle they have some serious problems. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Honestly, they should just put a modified No. 4 back into production; use a synthetic stock and chamber it in 7.62 NATO. The Rangers like their Enfields and they work under the conditions they need them to work in. This. If they can't figure out how to make a new No.4Mk1 magazine fed bolt action rifle they have some serious problems. India figured out the 7.62mm magazine for their 2A1 rifles. |
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Honestly, they should just put a modified No. 4 back into production; use a synthetic stock and chamber it in 7.62 NATO. The Rangers like their Enfields and they work under the conditions they need them to work in. I would buy a new production No4. Contract with Pah-kee-stahn. They got the whole Fazakerley rifle factory after WW2. |
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The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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If I ever had to take a bolt action into battle I want an Enfield. +1 I don't understand why they would need to change, considering the application and climate. ETA That picture is what a real rifleman looks like. This is what I was going to ask. What do they hope to gain by switching rifles ? I guess I could actually read the article and maybe they say, but I really don't think that simply changing to another bolt action rifle would make it a better rifle. If you have to use a bolt action rifle, the Enfield is certainly one of the best if not THE best. I don't even understand what making a new Enfield would accomplish or what adding a synthetic stock would do for them ? The stocks they have hold up fine. Why change to a different cartridge: again, the one they are using seems to get the job done and has for 100 years ? Is this change for the sake of change ? I also like in that picture that the guy is using a hasty sling. It looks like he really knows what he is doing. The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg Little more than vaporware from what I gather, although there were SOME production rifles in 7.62x39. |
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I would buy the hell out of a Colt produced brand new No.4 in 7.62x51 that uses Pmags!
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I don't go into my attic much. It's a pain in the ass to get up there; I've got to move my washer & dryer, maneuver a ladder in there, and squeeze myself through this tiny hatch. I don't even store anything up there, so I don't have much reason to ever go through all that bullshit. Still I go up there at least once a year to check the place out. Mostly looking for rodents chewing shit up and making nests. Sovereignty patrols are pretty much the same thing, except instead of my attic it's the Arctic, and instead of rodents it's Russians. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I wonder what a "sovereignty patrol" is ? I don't go into my attic much. It's a pain in the ass to get up there; I've got to move my washer & dryer, maneuver a ladder in there, and squeeze myself through this tiny hatch. I don't even store anything up there, so I don't have much reason to ever go through all that bullshit. Still I go up there at least once a year to check the place out. Mostly looking for rodents chewing shit up and making nests. Sovereignty patrols are pretty much the same thing, except instead of my attic it's the Arctic, and instead of rodents it's Russians. And filthy Danes. |
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Since Canada is looking to manufacture the new rifle at Colt Canada or Diemarco, or whatever it's called, why bother trying to license a design for a current bolt gun? Why not just make new Lee Enfields or Mausers? There can't be any standing patents on those designs. I guess maybe current manufacture might be prohibitive whereas obviously a Ruger or Remington is designed for use with current manufacturing methods?
Does Canada have any other native gun manufacturers? I guess Para ordinance?? is in Canada?
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View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg Daddy like! http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb162/manuel5000/DancingBanana.gif seriously, I'd buy one of each |
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The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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If I ever had to take a bolt action into battle I want an Enfield. +1 I don't understand why they would need to change, considering the application and climate. ETA That picture is what a real rifleman looks like. This is what I was going to ask. What do they hope to gain by switching rifles ? I guess I could actually read the article and maybe they say, but I really don't think that simply changing to another bolt action rifle would make it a better rifle. If you have to use a bolt action rifle, the Enfield is certainly one of the best if not THE best. I don't even understand what making a new Enfield would accomplish or what adding a synthetic stock would do for them ? The stocks they have hold up fine. Why change to a different cartridge: again, the one they are using seems to get the job done and has for 100 years ? Is this change for the sake of change ? I also like in that picture that the guy is using a hasty sling. It looks like he really knows what he is doing. The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg AIA is some mysterious kind of odd. I still want one of their 7.62x39 carbines though. |
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Quoted: Correct on no replacement, primarily because Diemaco doesn't manufacture a bolt action rifle (or at least not one that suits their requirements) and the rifle has to be of Canadian manufacture. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Yeah they have been trying to find a new bolt gun for years, I don't think there is a replacement yet. They tried to get ruger to license the scout to colt Canada but ruger laughed at them. Basically a nice article but there is still no replacement, I think. Correct on no replacement, primarily because Diemaco doesn't manufacture a bolt action rifle (or at least not one that suits their requirements) and the rifle has to be of Canadian manufacture. But do the Canadians not realize that IP is a huge deal? Nobody wants to give away money for free, which is essentially what they want manufacturers to do. They're going to have to drop that requirement, or get UAW-USA---erm, I mean Colt USA--to license their stupidly-expensive bolt actions to do the job of a $400 milsurp. |
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Since Canada is looking to manufacture the new rifle at Colt Canada or Diemarco, or whatever it's called, why bother trying to license a design for a current bolt gun? Why not just make new Lee Enfields or Mausers? There can't be any standing patents on those designs. I guess maybe current manufacture might be prohibitive whereas obviously a Ruger or Remington is designed for use with current manufacturing methods? Does Canada have any other native gun manufacturers? I guess Para ordinance?? is in Canada? View Quote Savage has a plant up there for .22's. Does it have to be a Canadian company or simply made in Canada? |
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Canada has plenty of experience converting the No. 4 to 7.62 NATO; they did so with the DCRA rifles. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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India figured out the 7.62mm magazine for their 2A1 rifles. Canada has plenty of experience converting the No. 4 to 7.62 NATO; they did so with the DCRA rifles. Then it should be no problem, unless the old No4 receiver is stretching. |
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Sucks for the Canadian Rangers. I know the bullshit issue is that the replacement rifle must be made in Canada and that is what is holding up the replacement of the Enfields. Hope the Red Shirts get squared away soon and get a good rifle.
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For everyone asking why replace the Enfield. The issue is no spare parts and no machinery to produce new rifles or parts. They want to do a COTS purchase that is licensed to Colt Canada.
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Quoted: The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: If I ever had to take a bolt action into battle I want an Enfield. +1 I don't understand why they would need to change, considering the application and climate. ETA That picture is what a real rifleman looks like. This is what I was going to ask. What do they hope to gain by switching rifles ? I guess I could actually read the article and maybe they say, but I really don't think that simply changing to another bolt action rifle would make it a better rifle. If you have to use a bolt action rifle, the Enfield is certainly one of the best if not THE best. I don't even understand what making a new Enfield would accomplish or what adding a synthetic stock would do for them ? The stocks they have hold up fine. Why change to a different cartridge: again, the one they are using seems to get the job done and has for 100 years ? Is this change for the sake of change ? I also like in that picture that the guy is using a hasty sling. It looks like he really knows what he is doing. The article says parts availability....That is why I wonder why they surplused off basically new Longbranch #4s. Looks like they could contract with the Australian firm AIA (AUSTRALIAN INTERNATIONAL ARMS PTY LTD) that makes modern Enfields. At least they could keep it within the Commonwealth. http://www.firearmsworld.net/britain/enfield/lee/aia-ad.jpg Made in Vietnam... hence why no legal importation into the USA.
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"Made in Vietnam... hence why no legal importation into the USA."
Yet, Nike sneakers..made by the millions are OK? Thats screwed up/ |
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Quoted: "Made in Vietnam... hence why no legal importation into the USA." Yet, Nike sneakers..made by the millions are OK? Thats screwed up/ View Quote Nike doesn't make firearms. For some reason Blackhawk can have everything made in Vietnam and import it to the Country but if a rifle or its components are made in Vietnam it ie a no go. If I recall the wood is from Vietnam and a lot of the components are too.
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Is there anyone actually making and selling new Enfields these days? I know IIRC Gibbs and AIA are both defunct. Has anyone else picked up the torch?
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