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Posted: 9/30/2014 11:50:48 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 11:53:24 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. Did you not read my post? I'm not talking about terrorists, per se. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 11:57:24 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:03:34 AM EDT
[#4]
Like Bidgette Gabriel said, the peaceful muslims are irrelevant, just like the peaceful Germans were irrelevant, just like the peaceful Soviets and peaceful Japanese and peaceful Chinese and peaceful Hutus and Tutsis.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:12:22 AM EDT
[#5]
Islam is a Satanic cult in my estimation, the true Anti-Christ religion.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:16:35 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Islam is a Satanic cult in my estimation, the true Anti-Christ religion. FYI, the muslims believe in the second coming of christ and will follow him. You folks should really study Islam a little better. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:19:27 AM EDT
[#7]
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on.
They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:22:13 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:27:08 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:33:11 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did you not read my post? I'm not talking about terrorists, per se. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. Did you not read my post? I'm not talking about terrorists, per se. Many have spoken out against ISIS. There was recently a group of about 100 imams, who condemned ISIS. Islam is also very decentralized. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:33:11 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Um yeah how about you go read the koran... Muslims follow a book that tells them to kill all non believers yet those who oppose such a belief you equate to nazi's give me a freaking break.. O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. If we're going to selectively quote unsavory bits of somebody's holy text, then the Bible had better be open season. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:34:37 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? We've had quite a few members banned for advocating such things. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:35:04 AM EDT
[#13]
There are many here who say that all they see is indifference, silence, or even implied support from all Muslims toward terrorists.
If that's true than how do you explain the thousands of Muslims who have died fighting terrorists and insurgents? How do you explain General Massoud or the entire village of Muslims that Marcus Luttrell credits with saving his life at great personal cost to themselves? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:35:28 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If we're going to selectively quote unsavory bits of somebody's holy text, then the Bible had better be open season. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. If we're going to selectively quote unsavory bits of somebody's holy text, then the Bible had better be open season. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:37:30 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? So what should happen to all muslims then? In every islam thread there is always people who insist that we are at war with islam or islam is at war with us, so just wondering what should happen to muslims or what do you think we should do with them? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:46:12 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So what should happen to all muslims then? In every islam thread there is always people who insist that we are at war with islam or islam is at war with us, so just wondering what should happen to muslims or what do you think we should do with them? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? So what should happen to all muslims then? In every islam thread there is always people who insist that we are at war with islam or islam is at war with us, so just wondering what should happen to muslims or what do you think we should do with them? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:46:33 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mohammad was the Osama Bin laden of his time, actually worse. If someone came up to you in 10 years and told you they were a follower of Bin laden You would not find that alarming at all? Would you say they are just a peaceful supporter and follower of bin laden, and anyone who scorns them is a bigot? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. I'd find it alarming. I wouldn't call them a peaceful supporter, nor would I call their critics bigots. However, the God of the Old Testament was pretty brutal, commanding his followers to commit genocide, ordering people to be stoned to death for sometimes trivial things, et cetera. When you meet a Jewish person, are you alarmed if they try to follow the Torah? Are you afraid that they'll stone you to death if your browsing history comes to light? What if you met a Jewish person, who follows the teachings of Rabbi Yosef? What if they wanted you to be a goyim slave for them? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:49:58 AM EDT
[#18]
her business, her rules and all.
I personally think if she should just shout out ALL religions. Lord knows the Christians never killed anyone. 
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:50:07 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Um yeah how about you go read the koran... Muslims follow a book that tells them to kill all non believers yet those who oppose such a belief you equate to nazi's give me a freaking break.. O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure, in the Koran a nonbeliever is someone without faith, the term infidel does not refer to a christian or jew as "infidels" but to an atheist or one without religion. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:08:25 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'd find it alarming. I wouldn't call them a peaceful supporter, nor would I call their critics bigots. However, the God of the Old Testament was pretty brutal, commanding his followers to commit genocide, ordering people to be stoned to death for sometimes trivial things, et cetera. When you meet a Jewish person, are you alarmed if they try to follow the Torah? Are you afraid that they'll stone you to death if your browsing history comes to light? What if you met a Jewish person, who follows the teachings of Rabbi Yosef? What if they wanted you to be a goyim slave for them? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. I'd find it alarming. I wouldn't call them a peaceful supporter, nor would I call their critics bigots. However, the God of the Old Testament was pretty brutal, commanding his followers to commit genocide, ordering people to be stoned to death for sometimes trivial things, et cetera. When you meet a Jewish person, are you alarmed if they try to follow the Torah? Are you afraid that they'll stone you to death if your browsing history comes to light? What if you met a Jewish person, who follows the teachings of Rabbi Yosef? What if they wanted you to be a goyim slave for them? The Bible never instructed Christians, specifically, to commit acts of violence. There's a big difference. The Old Testament passages you mention were directed at Israelites and had nothing to do with Christians. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:09:00 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure, in the Koran a nonbeliever is someone without faith, the term infidel does not refer to a christian or jew as "infidels" but to an atheist or one without religion. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73 Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98 On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161 Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39 Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216 (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure, in the Koran a nonbeliever is someone without faith, the term infidel does not refer to a christian or jew as "infidels" but to an atheist or one without religion. Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!" The 9th Surrah abrogates all other surras before it and permits muslims to kill jews and christians.There is only one surrah written chronologically after the 9th and it does not abrogate anything from the 9th. If you think mohamad did not go for killing jews read about banu qurayza. Mohammed had fun beheading jews who did not accept islam.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:12:01 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So what should happen to all muslims then? In every islam thread there is always people who insist that we are at war with islam or islam is at war with us, so just wondering what should happen to muslims or what do you think we should do with them? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The "kill all muslims" crowd give fuel to the rest of the world to believe that the nazis live on. They do. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile How do you trolls come up with some of these absurd strawman arguments? Kill all muslims? Seriously? So what should happen to all muslims then? In every islam thread there is always people who insist that we are at war with islam or islam is at war with us, so just wondering what should happen to muslims or what do you think we should do with them? We could stop importing them here by the millions, for one thing. We could also secure our border. Once they're here, sure, they should have the same rights as other American citizens. But we have no obligation to take them in in the first place. They have absolutely nothing to offer us. Just like illegal immigration and amnesty, it's a spineless PC move by liberal hippies looking to shed some of their white guilt and "diversify" America. I'm not aware of any significant achievements that America owes to Muslim immigrants, only lots of dead victims of homegrown terrorism. The risks in this case greatly outweigh any possible benefits (are there any?). You know there's something wrong with our immigration and anti-terrorism policy when the high profile ISIS members popping up in these beheading videos are British or American citizens. Not to mention scum like the Boston bombers, Anwar al-Awlaki, Nidal Hasan, etc. Absolutely shameful. People are dying and we're more concerned about possibly hurting someone's feelings. And does anyone actually think this is going to be a good thing? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:12:49 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Bible never instructed Christians, specifically, to commit acts of violence. There's a big difference. The Old Testament passages you mention were directed at Israelites and had nothing to do with Christians. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I'd find it alarming. I wouldn't call them a peaceful supporter, nor would I call their critics bigots. However, the God of the Old Testament was pretty brutal, commanding his followers to commit genocide, ordering people to be stoned to death for sometimes trivial things, et cetera. When you meet a Jewish person, are you alarmed if they try to follow the Torah? Are you afraid that they'll stone you to death if your browsing history comes to light? What if you met a Jewish person, who follows the teachings of Rabbi Yosef? What if they wanted you to be a goyim slave for them? The Bible never instructed Christians, specifically, to commit acts of violence. There's a big difference. The Old Testament passages you mention were directed at Israelites and had nothing to do with Christians. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:13:34 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Bible never instructed Christians, specifically, to commit acts of violence. There's a big difference. The Old Testament passages you mention were directed at Israelites and had nothing to do with Christians. Know something funny? Muslims have the same nuanced interpretations about their own book. You should ask the non-jihadists to explain it. They're usually more than happy. It happens when you study the text over many years, instead of just reading it cover to cover. Same as the Bible. 
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:20:52 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have read the entire koran and the entire bible have you? If not then you have no room to speak. The bible does not ever say to kill ALL non believers. Even an idiot knows that. This is like that guy who says "Hey, I've got a black friend too!". Look, sane Muslims here in America have a more nuanced view of their book than you do. I'm not a Christian (or even a theist  ) anymore, but I usually ask Christians what they actually believe and why before I go blindly cherry picking scriptures that sound awful. I'm a nice guy like that.
Give a friendly Muslim the same courtesy I give Christians. It might be informative. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:23:38 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Know something funny? Muslims have the same nuanced interpretations about their own book. You should ask the non-jihadists to explain it. They're usually more than happy. It happens when you study the text over many years, instead of just reading it cover to cover. Same as the Bible. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The Bible never instructed Christians, specifically, to commit acts of violence. There's a big difference. The Old Testament passages you mention were directed at Israelites and had nothing to do with Christians. Know something funny? Muslims have the same nuanced interpretations about their own book. You should ask the non-jihadists to explain it. They're usually more than happy. It happens when you study the text over many years, instead of just reading it cover to cover. Same as the Bible. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:33:34 AM EDT
[#27]
I respect you Subnet for defending your beliefs even when they're very unpopular here. Maybe you're not defending your beliefs and just challenging others, all the same.
While in the military I worked with a lot of Muslims who were committed to defeating Al Qaeda and insurgents in Iraq. Without them, many of our intelligence missions wouldn't be possible. Their support leads directly to helping find the people you see on the news. The fact that in the country they served (some can't return home) they'd be discriminated against only because of their religion is sickening. She can do whatever she wants with her property, but her policy is simpleminded and un-American. I wouldn't spend a dime in her store. ETA: OP signature... "Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And when you look into the abyss, the abyss also looks into you." - Nietzsche |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:37:00 AM EDT
[#28]
The old "but 1.6 billion muslims aren't terrorist" argument.
Did anyone in this thread claim that no hypocrites exist in Islam? Are there muslims who do not take their religion seriously? Yes, there are Islamic hypocrites. For example, if I make the claim that Jesus taught Christians to "love their neighbor," then someone says "IMPOSSIBLE. Every Christian I know does not love their neighbor!" This is not an argument that about the theological implications of the Christian texts and teachings, but an argument that hypocrites exist. Hypocrites exist. No one in this thread (from what I saw) claimed "No muslim hypocrites exist, therefore all 1.6 billion muslims follow their Islamic texts and teachings with pious fervor and slay the infidels wherever they find them" What people are exposing is the FACT that islamic texts and teachings advocate warfare, violence, and subjugation of non-muslims worldwide until judgement day. People in the west who have not studied Islamic texts and teachings are naive because they do not understand a few key points about islam: 1) Islamic texts and teachings advocate warfare against non-muslims indefinitely. 2) Islam is not a religion, but a cultural, legal, and political system. 3) In islamic texts and teachings, violence and lying are pious and virtuous activities. 4) Islam is concerned with winning the empire of the world, not individuals' spirits. (Bertrand Russell and Jules Monnerot both noted extensively that bolshevism [communism] was the 20th century Islam) 5) Islam is very legalistic and not open to individual interpretation. Schools of fiqh (law) dictate what Islam is. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:37:41 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'd find it alarming. I wouldn't call them a peaceful supporter, nor would I call their critics bigots. However, the God of the Old Testament was pretty brutal, commanding his followers to commit genocide, ordering people to be stoned to death for sometimes trivial things, et cetera. When you meet a Jewish person, are you alarmed if they try to follow the Torah? Are you afraid that they'll stone you to death if your browsing history comes to light? What if you met a Jewish person, who follows the teachings of Rabbi Yosef? What if they wanted you to be a goyim slave for them? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Where? If you honestly believe that all of the 1.6 billion people in the world who claim to be Muslim, perpetrate terrorist acts, support terrorism, openly condone terrorism or secretly wish for terrorist attacks, then lol @ you. Good luck with your paranoia goals of 2014. The "peaceful Muslims" get blamed for terrorism because a whole lot of them are incredibly tolerant of it, either by vocally supporting it, or not condemning it. Call it paranoia, but you know it's true. They get lumped in with the others by their own choice. Any gun owner (or Christian, for that matter) will gladly condemn a mass shooting, and if anything, gun owners and Christians are one of the most vocal segments of society when it comes to condemning murderers and violence. Sorry, your argument is horrible. In 2012, there were an estimated 184,000 terrorists... That's a hair over a hundredth of a percent. How often do you hear Muslims speak? Do you talk to them in person? Or do you hear them primarily through the media? Let's say the number of terrorists is at 1 million now, that's 6 hundredths of percent. It's a trivial amount. I'd find it alarming. I wouldn't call them a peaceful supporter, nor would I call their critics bigots. However, the God of the Old Testament was pretty brutal, commanding his followers to commit genocide, ordering people to be stoned to death for sometimes trivial things, et cetera. When you meet a Jewish person, are you alarmed if they try to follow the Torah? Are you afraid that they'll stone you to death if your browsing history comes to light? What if you met a Jewish person, who follows the teachings of Rabbi Yosef? What if they wanted you to be a goyim slave for them? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:46:39 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The old "but 1.6 billion muslims aren't terrorist" argument. Did anyone in this thread claim that no hypocrites exist in Islam? Are there muslims who do not take their religion seriously? Yes, there are Islamic hypocrites. For example, if I make the claim that Jesus taught Christians to "love their neighbor," then someone says "IMPOSSIBLE. Every Christian I know does not love their neighbor!" This is not an argument that about the theological implications of the Christian texts and teachings, but an argument that hypocrites exist. Hypocrites exist. No one in this thread (from what I saw) claimed "No muslim hypocrites exist, therefore all 1.6 billion muslims follow their Islamic texts and teachings with pious fervor and slay the infidels wherever they find them" What people are exposing is the FACT that islamic texts and teachings advocate warfare, violence, and subjugation of non-muslims worldwide until judgement day. People in the west who have not studied Islamic texts and teachings are naive because they do not understand a few key points about islam: 1) Islamic texts and teachings advocate warfare against non-muslims indefinitely. 2) Islam is not a religion, but a cultural, legal, and political system. 3) In islamic texts and teachings, violence and lying are pious and virtuous activities. 4) Islam is concerned with winning the empire of the world, not individuals' spirits. (Bertrand Russell and Jules Monnerot both noted extensively that bolshevism [communism] was the 20th century Islam) 5) Islam is very legalistic and not open to individual interpretation. Schools of fiqh (law) dictate what Islam is. Every time I see someone beheaded Not only do I blame the terrorists but I blame the apologists who refuse to admit the reality of what is going on here. The blood of all these innocent people are directly tied to these apologists who wallow in their own ignorance. Our future and our children's future is at risk yet they want to shift blame and project their misguided view of reality. The inheritance of their ignorance on future generations is only steeped in blood and misery. GOD help us all.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:55:21 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, you did. I said Muslims should be expected to condemn terrorist attacks on innocent Americans. You responded by saying you don't make condemnations when a gangbanger in Chicago gets shot. In other words, you equated the death of a gangbanger to a terrorist attack, and implied that since one doesn't deserve condemnation, the other doesn't either. But you're evidently so bad at making analogies you may not have even realized what you were implying. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Yes, I equated the death of a gangbanger to a terrorist attack... Strong phony outrage on your part.
Yes, you did. I said Muslims should be expected to condemn terrorist attacks on innocent Americans. You responded by saying you don't make condemnations when a gangbanger in Chicago gets shot. In other words, you equated the death of a gangbanger to a terrorist attack, and implied that since one doesn't deserve condemnation, the other doesn't either. But you're evidently so bad at making analogies you may not have even realized what you were implying. <more righteous indignation> I don't go up on a pulpit and condemn mass shootings every time they occur. If it's brought up in a conversation, sure. There, did that analogy ease your phony outrage? You can caterwaul all day long about how Muslims are silent. In reality, plenty of Muslims speak out against terrorism. As I mentioned in the portion of my post that you chose to remove, why don't you go up to a Muslim and ask them what their views on terrorism are instead of expecting them to proclaim from the mountain tops that they don't support terrorism. As for the Muslim community, there are plenty of Muslim leaders denouncing Terrorism. Hmm, now that I think of it, I don't think I've ever seen you condemn the IRA. Sure, you may have, but I haven't seen it, therefore you must have secretly supported car bombings. 
Now I understand why the GOP has lost the Muslim vote even though most Muslims are social conservatives. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 1:59:34 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sadly you are speaking to a consortium of fools. They have no intent to actually learn about islam or it's history. They will try to point out any acts of war in the bible or other religious texts and try to say see islam is no worse than these religions. Every time I see someone beheaded Not only do I blame the terrorists but I blame the apologists who refuse to admit the reality of what is going on here. The blood of all these innocent people are directly tied to these apologists who wallow in their own ignorance. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: <snip> Every time I see someone beheaded Not only do I blame the terrorists but I blame the apologists who refuse to admit the reality of what is going on here. The blood of all these innocent people are directly tied to these apologists who wallow in their own ignorance. Our future and our children's future is at risk yet they want to shift blame and project their misguided view of reality. The inheritance of their ignorance on future generations is only steeped in blood and misery. GOD help us all. JD, you are right. They love the tu quo fallacy. "Christians are just as bad" or "The bible is worse!" arguments. Ironic that honest atheist such as Bertrand Russell (who wrote an entire book entitled WHY I AM NOT A CHRISTIAN) even noted the difference between Christianity and Islam when he was writing a book on communism in 1920. "Bolshevism combines the characteristics of the French Revolution with those of the rise of Islam… Those who accept Bolshevism become impervious to scientific evidence, and commit intellectual suicide. Even if all the doctrines of Bolshevism were true, this would still be the case, since no unbiased examination of them is tolerated…Among religions, Bolshevism is to be reckoned with Mohammedanism (Islam) rather than with Christianity and Buddhism. Christianity and Buddhism are primarily personal religions, with mystical doctrines and a love of contemplation. Mohammedanism and Bolshevism are practical, social, unspiritual, concerned to win the empire of this world.” -Bertrand Russell _The Practice and Theory of Bolshevism_ (London, 1920, pp. 5, 114-115) |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:22:05 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: <more righteous indignation> I don't go up on a pulpit and condemn mass shootings every time they occur. If it's brought up in a conversation, sure. There, did that analogy ease your phony outrage? You can caterwaul all day long about how Muslims are silent. In reality, plenty of Muslims speak out against terrorism. As I mentioned in the portion of my post that you chose to remove, why don't you go up to a Muslim and ask them what their views on terrorism are instead of expecting them to proclaim from the mountain tops that they don't support terrorism. As for the Muslim community, there are plenty of Muslim leaders denouncing Terrorism. Hmm, now that I think of it, I don't think I've ever seen you condemn the IRA. Sure, you may have, but I haven't seen it, therefore you must have secretly supported car bombings. Now I understand why the GOP has lost the Muslim vote even though most Muslims are social conservatives. Quote HistoryQuoted: <more righteous indignation> I don't go up on a pulpit and condemn mass shootings every time they occur. If it's brought up in a conversation, sure. There, did that analogy ease your phony outrage? You can caterwaul all day long about how Muslims are silent. In reality, plenty of Muslims speak out against terrorism. As I mentioned in the portion of my post that you chose to remove, why don't you go up to a Muslim and ask them what their views on terrorism are instead of expecting them to proclaim from the mountain tops that they don't support terrorism. As for the Muslim community, there are plenty of Muslim leaders denouncing Terrorism. Hmm, now that I think of it, I don't think I've ever seen you condemn the IRA. Sure, you may have, but I haven't seen it, therefore you must have secretly supported car bombings. Now I understand why the GOP has lost the Muslim vote even though most Muslims are social conservatives. Once again someone who does not consider the fact that islam promotes lying and deception as virtuous activities for the Islamic cause. Ibn Kathir wrote volume upon volume on the quran and wrote the best tasfir (commentary and context of the quran) stated in his commentary on quran 3:28 Allah said next, (unless you indeed fear a danger from them) meaning, except those believers who in some areas or times fear for their safety from the disbelievers. In this case, such believers are allowed to show friendship to the disbelievers outwardly, but never inwardly. For instance, Al-Bukhari recorded that Abu Ad-Darda' said, "We smile in the face of some people although our hearts curse them.'' Al-Bukhari said that Al-Hasan said, "The Tuqyah (deception and lying) is allowed until the Day of Resurrection.'' Kathir was commenting on Quran 3:28 "Let not the believers take disbelievers for their friends in preference to believers. Whoso doeth that hath no connection with Allah unless (it be) that ye but guard yourselves against them, taking (as it were) security. Allah biddeth you beware (only) of Himself. Unto Allah is the journeying." or the Yusuf Ali translation that i prefer: "Let not the Believers take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from God: except by way of precaution, that ye may Guard yourselves from them. But God cautions you (To remember) Himself; for the final goal is to God." |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:23:12 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She owns a gun store and a range? She is a 10+ |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:32:50 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You can caterwaul all day long about how Muslims are silent... And you can caterwaul all day long about how Muslims aren't tolerant of terrorism, but the truth is, an awful lot of them are. And their holy book explicitly instructs them to behave like that. When are you packing your bags? If you think these "peaceful Muslims" are so great, why don't you go live with them in an Islamic country? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:33:31 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I respect you Subnet for defending your beliefs even when they're very unpopular here. Maybe you're not defending your beliefs and just challenging others, all the same. While in the military I worked with a lot of Muslims who were committed to defeating Al Qaeda and insurgents in Iraq. Without them, many of our intelligence missions wouldn't be possible. Their support leads directly to helping find the people you see on the news. The fact that in the country they served (some can't return home) they'd be discriminated against only because of their religion is sickening. She can do whatever she wants with her property, but her policy is simpleminded and un-American. I wouldn't spend a dime in her store. ETA: OP signature... "Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And when you look into the abyss, the abyss also looks into you." - Nietzsche edit: forgot to mention right around the time we fired that first guy a Muslim interpreter working for some reasons who lived near us and played cards with us sometimes slit one of the Marines throats. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:38:35 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is like that guy who says "Hey, I've got a black friend too!". Look, sane Muslims here in America have a more nuanced view of their book than you do. I'm not a Christian (or even a theist ) anymore, but I usually ask Christians what they actually believe and why before I go blindly cherry picking scriptures that sound awful. I'm a nice guy like that.
Give a friendly Muslim the same courtesy I give Christians. It might be informative. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I have read the entire koran and the entire bible have you? If not then you have no room to speak. The bible does not ever say to kill ALL non believers. Even an idiot knows that. This is like that guy who says "Hey, I've got a black friend too!". Look, sane Muslims here in America have a more nuanced view of their book than you do. I'm not a Christian (or even a theist ) anymore, but I usually ask Christians what they actually believe and why before I go blindly cherry picking scriptures that sound awful. I'm a nice guy like that.
Give a friendly Muslim the same courtesy I give Christians. It might be informative. There are people who claim to be Christians, while also refusing to be classified as theists and denying the existence of the supernatural. They claim it is solely a metaphor and some pleasant truisms to live by. That does not make Christianity an atheistic "religion" solely dedicated to personal improvement, merely that some people who self describe in that way do not actually believe their doctrine. Muslims are no different, but individuals and their own heterodox interpretations do not change the basic tenents of the actual religion. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:43:02 AM EDT
[#38]
I'd hammer her senseless. 
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Posted: 10/1/2014 3:16:03 AM EDT
[#39]
Violation of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Dumb idea.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 3:52:01 AM EDT
[#40]
I identify myself as Christian. I was saved in September 2012, and baptized the month following.
With that said, I have spent over five years of my life between Afghanistan and Iraq. I have traveled to 30 countries in all, multiple of those with high muslim populations. There are good people out there, a majority in fact, that stand for peace and have not a yearning in their heart for muslim caliphate. What you see perceived through various sources of media is designed to get you riled up. Do problems exist in the world? Yes. But believe it or not, we have much bigger problems that exist right here in our country that are far more threatening than muslim extremists. The ignorance is strong in this thread, and the majority of internet commandos are drinking the Kool-Aid real hard. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 3:57:05 AM EDT
[#41]
She explained her position well.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 3:59:31 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You think it's smart to publicly announce (and document) how your business is willfully violating federal law (specifically the Civil Rights Act)? Your definition of "smart" must be different from mine. Her "argument" is NO DIFFERENT from putting up a "no blacks" sign on her business, and trying to justify it by saying FBI crime statistics show that blacks are more likely to commit violent crimes and murder than whites. She is not smart, she is an attention whoring imbecile. If she actually does this, I predict that she will either be taken to court by the DoJ and will lose, or the ATF will pull her FFL. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Well said. She seems like a smart, well spoken person. You think it's smart to publicly announce (and document) how your business is willfully violating federal law (specifically the Civil Rights Act)? Your definition of "smart" must be different from mine. Her "argument" is NO DIFFERENT from putting up a "no blacks" sign on her business, and trying to justify it by saying FBI crime statistics show that blacks are more likely to commit violent crimes and murder than whites. She is not smart, she is an attention whoring imbecile. If she actually does this, I predict that she will either be taken to court by the DoJ and will lose, or the ATF will pull her FFL. Islam is not a religion. CRA does not apply... |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 3:59:50 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I identify myself as Christian. I was saved in September 2012, and baptized the month following. With that said, I have spent over five years of my life between Afghanistan and Iraq. I have traveled to 30 countries in all, multiple of those with high muslim populations. There are good people out there, a majority in fact, that stand for peace and have not a yearning in their heart for muslim caliphate. What you see perceived through various sources of media is designed to get you riled up. Do problems exist in the world? Yes. But believe it or not, we have much bigger problems that exist right here in our country that are far more threatening than muslim extremists. The ignorance is strong in this thread, and the majority of internet commandos are drinking the Kool-Aid real hard. Understood but like a wise American Muslim woman said............"although there are decent Muslims, they are irrelevant because it is the violent radical Jihadists that are carrying the day and committing mass murder". So, it's nice that there are nice Muslims but until they do something about the radical element in their midst and wipe them OFF THE FUCKING earth..........they are irrelevant. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:01:04 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She did no such thing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Well said. She seems like a smart, well spoken person. You think it's smart to publicly announce (and document) how your business is willfully violating federal law (specifically the Civil Rights Act)? Your definition of "smart" must be different from mine. Her "argument" is NO DIFFERENT from putting up a "no blacks" sign on her business, and trying to justify it by saying FBI crime statistics show that blacks are more likely to commit violent crimes and murder than whites. She is not smart, she is an attention whoring imbecile. If she actually does this, I predict that she will either be taken to court by the DoJ and will lose, or the ATF will pull her FFL. I think she made it pretty clear why it is completely different. Race and religion are included in the Civil Rights Act. She made a decent argument why Islam is not a religion. She did no such thing. She doesn't actually have to. It's a fact. It's been a fact since its inception. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:08:50 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I identify myself as Christian. I was saved in September 2012, and baptized the month following. With that said, I have spent over five years of my life between Afghanistan and Iraq. I have traveled to 30 countries in all, multiple of those with high muslim populations. There are good people out there, a majority in fact, that stand for peace and have not a yearning in their heart for muslim caliphate. What you see perceived through various sources of media is designed to get you riled up. Do problems exist in the world? Yes. But believe it or not, we have much bigger problems that exist right here in our country that are far more threatening than muslim extremists. The ignorance is strong in this thread, and the majority of internet commandos are drinking the Kool-Aid real hard. I've been there too my friend, and you're completely full of shit. the only people in the socioeconomic construct we call "Islam" who are making any noise are the ones who want us dead. You can argue about what a tiny percentage of them you think that really is, but it's not really relevant to the discussion. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:16:21 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
....................... the only people in the socioeconomic construct we call "Islam" who are making any noise are the ones who want us dead. You can argue about what a tiny percentage of them you think that really is, but it's not really relevant to the discussion. It would be VERY nice if it was relevant but, sadly, it isn't. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:17:07 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I identify myself as Christian. I was saved in September 2012, and baptized the month following. With that said, I have spent over five years of my life between Afghanistan and Iraq. I have traveled to 30 countries in all, multiple of those with high muslim populations. There are good people out there, a majority in fact, that stand for peace and have not a yearning in their heart for muslim caliphate. What you see perceived through various sources of media is designed to get you riled up. Do problems exist in the world? Yes. But believe it or not, we have much bigger problems that exist right here in our country that are far more threatening than muslim extremists. The ignorance is strong in this thread, and the majority of internet commandos are drinking the Kool-Aid real hard. No one claimed America has no problems except Islamic imperialism. Secondly, the media and government are the ones preaching "Islam is a religion of peace" narrative, so you are the on towing the line of the media and government narrative. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:20:39 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Her business, her rules. That being said, how does she plan on enforcing her policy? Muslims come in all shapes and colors, and many middle-eastern looking people are not muslim. must eat a pork rind to enter? |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:22:56 AM EDT
[#49]
her business her rules . . . . or at least it should be .
FBHO's minions will think otherwise , and she will be crucified for her beliefs , but I'd support her business if she was local to me. Hate me for it , I dont care .  |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:39:00 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
e. Her "argument" is NO DIFFERENT from putting up a "no blacks" sign on her business, and trying to justify it by saying FBI crime statistics show that blacks are more likely to commit violent crimes and murder than whites. DK, you know I love you... BUT. One can not choose the color of their skin, their ethnicity, their sex etc. One does indeed choose their religion. Apples =<Oranges. ETA: If she had a sign that read: "I will not sell to Nazi's, Skinheads or racists" that would be her right. They weren't born that way, they chose it. Same with religion. |
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