We did a refi on our mortgage with CitiMortgage this summer. everything finalized in July (15 yr, 3.2% from 5% ARM).


In August we get a letter from Citi that the note was sold to Green Tree Servicing. Quick web search shows that they are total scum with thousands of complaints who used to only do sub-prime lending but in the last couple years got into prime notes.

they contact us and tell us that they want access to a bank account so that they can take their payment every month. We say no; we use the bank's bill pay service to automatically generate a check that they send to the payee every month on the same date.

They tell us that we should pay it online; they charge $12.95 to let you do that. We say no. They will get paid the same way Citi did. The bank will mail them a check a week before the due date.

Their first payment was due 9/15. Money removed from our account 9/8.

9/26 their lawyer sends us a letter telling us that their client has instructed them to proceed on foreclosure.

Drone at Green Tree says our account is current. And that no, we can't talk to anyone who might have initiated a foreclosure.

Passed the details along to our lawyer; he basically said "wait and see what happens."

I had GTS and they were ok other than the fact that they wanted a $12.95 fee that I didn't have to pay before to use online services.  Never called me to ask to get into my bank account.  I paid my mortgage off with them and also got their letters and releases in a rather quick fashion.


The fee plus the fact that you couldn't come pay in person like I was able to before really rubbed me the wrong way with them.


It should be illegal to transfer a mortgage to another lender who then charges FEES for paying your mortgage and has no local front like priors.


Also most lenders have a 15 day grace period... so your story doesn't add up... sounds like they fucked something up.

open a new account and close that one so they can not access it anymore.

Then file charges for illegally taking money from your account.

Then refinance with another loan originator.

On a scale of Hank Hill to The Punisher, how pissed off are you?

Attached File

And they then sell him to GTS anyways

They didn't take money from our account; the check the bank sent them cleared thru on the 8th.

Billions in banker bailouts

No one in orange jumpsuits from top to bottom

Government promised change

Consumers continue to get fucked


Good work obama

Had GT for a mortgage we recently refinanced.  I never had a problem, but I did use their auto payments system to pull my payment every month.  The few times I had to call them - increase my payment, get payoff quote, etc., they were helpful.  Hopefully the BS stops on your loan OP.

So what is the event of default that triggered their right to foreclose? They can't foreclose unless you default under the mortgage agreement.

I hate those guys.  I had a previous mortgage sold to them years ago, with the same issue.  My last loan, I just went through my bank, Pentagon Fed Credit Union.  Next mortgage will do the same, or  perhaps USAA.

I have a feeling, if none of those fees are in the original mortgage agreement, then telling them to piss up a rope is the correct thing to do.  

You are not doing business with Pauly

I played that game for years. It ultimately cost me an extra $40,000 or so. The solution was to pay it in full. No kidding, one of the old lenders filed a lien on the house as soon as it was paid for.

 

What were the payment terms and conditions in your contact you signed at closing? That's all that matters.

When my wife and I got our recent mortgage, my first question was:  "Do you sell mortgages to other lenders."  The bank replied "no" and I asked for and received that statement in writing.

Ok, I misread thinking they took it out of your account before you sent a check and before it was due.

my mistake.

I do believe this should become a scientific scale, or at the very least adopted by arfcom as the official "son of a bitch" scale.

They'll do whatever they damn well want to, the system is rigged in their favor and they don't even try to hide it anymore.

Can you elaborate?
ETA: while I dislike Chase, I have had my last two mortgages with them, and they have been FANTASTIC to deal with.  





 

Refi with a reputable bank and sue them for the expenses and your trouble.  Eject.

No it shouldn't.  The terms under which a mortgage can be transferred are defined in the agreement that you sign.  If you want the aforementioned terms included (no fees for online payment, must have local branch) then you should negotiate that with your lender AHEAD of time.

We don't need another law for something that people ought to be able to negotiate amongst themselves.

Well, not really. A mortgageholder has no right to foreclosure its interest unless the debtor defaults under an explicit provision in the mortgage agreement. This could be as simple as one late payment but I didn't see any evidence of default here. Of course, it is also likely that we are not getting the whole story.
 

Who else read the thread title and expected Bank of America?

That's what I ws expectiing.

I had Green Tree for a while.  They were a complete pain in the ass to deal with.  Good luck OP.

I expected Seterus.  They're a gangrenous pile of motherfuckers.

Best,
JBR

Good luck fighting it out in court with an outfit that buys lawyers by the ton in getting them to uphold the agreement.  They don't care.  Not even one little bit.  



 

good luck OP and tag

Doing business with banks nowadays is dealing with the devil.

Meh, skip the court date, and the potential foreclosure. Refi with someone reputable.

That's the whole story. Sorry to disappoint you.

here's the short version, in case the slightly longer version overtaxed reading skills

refi in July at good rate with existing lender

lender sells mortgage in August

new lender send foreclosure notice in in September, while acknowledging note is current and in good standing.

Not much else to add. Can't even have a missed payment with the new note holder since their first payment was due in Sept. it could be late, but it isn't.

Can't afford to refi again; about to start new business venture and need to minimize hits on personal credit score.

I was expecting SLS mortgage or Wells Fargo.

You clearly don't deal much with mortgages and definitely not enough with shady mortgage companies


I'm curious, why do you support such an idea of being to charge extra for various forms of payment and disguised under the "convenience fee" in order to circumvent the current payment laws and bank TOS's?  Charges that are unreasonable and no signing lender charged.  It would be one thing to continue with a charge from your current mortgage to the new transferee... total different thing to spring convenience charges by trading the mortgage off.


You realize that technically they could transfer mortgages within a company to another shell that charges fees.... in a lot of businesses that is very illegal.


Also, what mortgage payee would want to pay a charge after they have been paying zero to begin with?

And where does the mortgage holder's rights come in?

If you originally agree to a set of terms, ANY chnage should require approval by BOTH parties to the contract.

Try and arbitrarily chnage things on your end as a mortgage holder and see how well that goes-why should THEY be able to?

To the best of my knowledge, OP did not agree to any proposed terms by new holder-they were instead foisted on him.



Nick

Well then why don't you answer my original question: What is the supposed action or event that triggered the default? If you got a foreclosure notice, it has to allege a default. I believe in your state it also must give you 30 days to cure the default, no? Or is this a magical fucking foreclosure that goes against the law and tried to foreclose with no default?




I did read your original story, and asked a question that you have avoided answering. The fact is that they must allege a default and you are not answering this question. Therefore that is not the whole story.
 

Your original loan agreement is all that matters, they can't buy the mortgage and then change the terms of it.  Tell them to fuck off!!!!

I think the OP was accounting for that when he said payment was due on the 15th.

Op your state has a banking regulatory agency.  Find them and file a complaint.  This gets results

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

USAA originates but does not service mortgages. They sold ours to US Bank.

FWIW, the only thing they changed was the payment due date. The other payment issues are simply the way they prefer to do business. Sine we auto-pay from our bank, they really can't do anything about that; they would just prefer that they had direct access to the account.

The main issue is the no-notice foreclosure of a mortgage in good standing. If it isn't a mistake and they can actually do it, I'm tempted to just let them have the house. We had some damage recently that is covered by insurance and the 5 figure check on the way for that about equals our current equity in the property. My wife owned the house before we were married and if the foreclosure didn't affect my credit we would just let them have the house, unrepaired. It talks about 6 months to foreclose in PA if you argue about it.

My Bank of America loan (started out CountryWide) was sold to Green Tree's sister NationStar. NationStar could be worse, exact same scenario.

I did not escrow, paid my own taxes and HO Ins for years. I go online to make my mortg pmt to BoA in May 2013. It says my account doesn't exist. I call and I'm told I was sold but they weren't sure who to but it was either Green Tree, NationStar or another a third crook I forget their name. They have no more info, won't take a pmt but assure me one of those three will contact me.

Three months later I get my first contact from NationStar. It's a letter stating I'm 3 mos behind and they're foreclosing. I have a $430k house I owed $162k on at the time so I guess they thought a fire sale flip would get them easy money. I get a lawyer (a shame that I had to) and had my 3 mos set aside to get current and attorney threatened that if they reported me late and ruined an 830 credit score we'd sue. That was Aug or Sep of 2013.

In January 2014 I get another letter of foreclosure saying I'm 4 mos behind. I go online to my bank and see where my pmt plus their M$%@^@F'ing $12.95 came out 2-3 days before the due date every time. I call and they claim they've paid all of my taxes and HO Ins in advance and now I have escrow. Since I wasn't making escrow with my monthly pmt, my payment was going into a suspense account instead of applying toward my mortg. They had my 4 mos in suspense using it for whatever and I was 4 mos behind.

I had to get an attorney, we had to get with the Dept of Financial Institutions and go scorched earth. They sent me my 2013 1098 and it showed them paying 2 years of prop tax and one year of HO Ins. I PAID THOSE!! out of my pocket. PLUS those people had NO RECORD of NationStar paying them a dime. They were charging me escrow for things they NEVER paid!

They reported me late for 3 mos on my credit as well. We got it situated to some degree. They gave me a new mortgage with a new rate saving me about $200/mo. Cost me almost $5k in attorney fees. I sign their new mortg agreement. Go online to make my first pmt under the new agreement for $200/mo less. I no longer have to pay the $12.95 but instead of being $200/mo lower, it went up $397!

I'm back with an attorney now. NationStar claims I got a HAMP, which I did not and did not need, so I'm stuck for 3 years. We're fighting. One thing I've learned thru all of this is BoA somehow backdoor owns NationStar and probably Green Tree too. They are a servicer/debt collector that takes some of the bad guy heat off of BoA.

Yup, my loan got sold to them, fucking scum of the earth.

If that is the case then technically he was already 8 days late into his grace period.  Usually when you run late into your grace period you will start getting calls.

And the plot thickens





 

Payment is due on the first. By law they have to accept payment up to 15 days late to account for weather delay in delivery of the payment.

Nick, you're missing Woodsie's point.

I would bet the original mortgage did not specify free on-line payments and local offices; they were provided by the original lender but not required.  The new lender is not required to do free on-line payments nor have local offices.

They have not identified a triggering act.

As I said, they wouldn't let me talk to the person who initiated the default.  Their law firm said talk to them; when I called all they would tell me was that the account was currently in good standing. Law firm sent two letters; one says you have 30 days to dispute the debt (of which there is no dispute; that letter outlined the current debt and shows no  late payments or associated fees), and a second letter stating that at the request of their client they were initiating foreclosure action. That letter does not state a reason for the action.

Then why the mortgage?

I assume foreclosures have to go to a preliminary hearing, right?  

So what are they going to show the judge?