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Posted: 9/22/2014 3:24:24 PM EDT
I think all of us knew that Russia is pumping money into their army, but I am totally amazed over how much they are investing.
Not only are they getting 3000 new battle tanks, they are replacing their entire nuclear arsenal with new nuclear weapons.
They are dedicating $700 billion to make sure 70% of their armed forces are “cutting edge” by 2020.
I don’t know about you but I am a little bit worried about Russia’s plans.
They are acting very aggressive in the Baltic Sea and as you know in Ukraine.
How should the west counter this newly awoken bear?

Article in English

Swedish article, google translated below

Russia has 1,800 nuclear warheads.

It is not enough, says Putin.

Now the country renews its entire arsenal - with over 3 000 new tanks, helicopters and fighter planes.

The price tag? Approximately 5 000 billion.

Russia gearing up.

By 2020, the country's entire strategic arsenal to be replaced, said Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin said in an interview with the TV channel Rossiya 24.

Approximately 5,000 billion are thought to cost the project, according to The Moscow Times.

- The development of the technology base for our strategic nuclear arsenal is quicker and we will in fact not to renew 70 percent, but 100 percent, Rogozin said in the television interview.

2300 new tanks, 1,200 new helicopters and fighter planes and hundreds of new satellites to be included in the expanded armory. The 1800 nuclear warheads that are in the country to be completely replaced.

By 2015, 30 percent of the country's strategic arsenal to be replaced to be "at the forefront" of weapons technology. By 2020, 70 percent of the weapons are classed as state of the art.

The weapons should if necessary be moved to "all potential battle scenes" and according to Rogozin, who took the opportunity to promise a simplified asylum process for Ukrainian workers who want to participate in the process, one will hire the best specialists in the world to develop weapons.

He also explained that they will not have any problem to do without the French supply of combat helicopters which were withdrawn as a result of conflicts in Ukraine, Russia Today writes. However, the country will demand my money back.

- It's not just money that France risks losing, but their status as a reliable supplier in world trade.

And with the news follows a dig at future enemies.

- Are we going to impress others, is it really necessary to show off all our weapons to them? Some things need to be kept as secret and only revealed at the proper critical moments, said Rogozin according to Russia Today.

The country has since 2008 worked to rearm its military capability. Four per cent of GDP now goes to the defense, an increase of 0.5 percent compared with the previous year.

- It has been a long-term plan for management. Russia has not invested enough in the material. Most were constructed during the Soviet era, and is now very old. Navy, for example, is 20 to 30 years old ships, says Fredrik Westerlund, security policy analyst at the Swedish Defence Research Agency, FOI.

What does it mean for Putin's relations with the West?

- The plans of Russia regeneration has been known for some time. But in light of Ukraine conflict becomes clear that Russia's military capability influences the security of other countries. You can not get away.

Why so much nuclear weapons?

- To have a strong nuclear weapons is the main security guarantee for Russia. Putin does not trust the Russian ground forces to deter a big war with countries such as China or the United States. Based on the threat they themselves feel this is a reasonable armament.
View Quote





AR15 - A thread on Russian air space violation



Putin is also trying to make it possible to cut off the western world from Russian internet. Feels like a cold war move.

Article in English

Another Swedish article. Google translated below

Putin wants to keep the Internet - but only if it is Russian.

The Security Council will discuss the possibility of isolating Russia from international web sites during crises, writes the Moscow Times.

The idea is to isolate the Russian segment of the Internet, RuNet, from the international network. The insulation must be deployed in times of crisis, such as the military threat or larger demonstrations. The proposal is said to be due to the EU's and the USA's "unpredictable behavior".

- We must consider how we can ensure our national security, said the spokesman for the Kremlin, Dmitry Peskov, on Friday, according to the Moscow Times.

According to the newspaper Vedomosti, the Security Council met Vladimir Putin to evaluate RuNets protection against external threats.
"Separate Russian online from free web"

Sources in the IT industry say that the Council deems RuNet as vulnerable facing foreign attacks, and that security must be increased. The most radical proposal to increase safety is to eliminate the Russian network from the free web. According Vedemosti restrictions can be deployed in the spring by 2015.

The proposal is one of many attempts to limit internet usage for Russian citizens and be seen as a step towards creating a controlled Internet under the total control of the authorities.

An earlier bill, which was approved by Russia's lower house, requires mandatory registration for all users of public Wi-Fi networks and blogger with over 3000 readers per day. Bloggers must also, by law, relate to the same rules as for major media and can not be anonymous. Human Rights Watch activist Hug Williamson called the bill "draconian" and "another milestone in Russia's relentless dismantling ytrrandefriheten" writes the BBC.
Social Media and Google may suffer

Under the bill, all the sites that handle information about Russian citizens store them on servers located in Russia - which could mean that sites like Facebook, Twitter, and Google may shut down in September 2016 if they do not follow the requirements.

- They want back the Iron Curtain, with everything written on paper, as in the Soviet Union. It feels like the Duma to lock us into a cell armor to protect us, but without asking if we need it, said Vladimir Kantorovitj, vice-president of a lobbying organization for the Russian tour operators, told AFP in July.

Putin has repeatedly stressed that he is skeptical about the Internet, including by calling it "a CIA project."
View Quote

Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:25:20 PM EDT
[#1]
link?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:26:02 PM EDT
[#2]
That would buy quite a few pairs of socks.

Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:28:55 PM EDT
[#3]
Time to step up, swedes.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:29:56 PM EDT
[#4]
Aggressive hashtags?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:31:12 PM EDT
[#5]
So their doing a complete overhaul of their nuclear arsenal while we forgot how to make them for about a week a year or two ago.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:32:27 PM EDT
[#6]
I'm sure it'll be fine, everyone laughed at Romney when he said that Russia was going to be a problem in the future.

Right, guys?  Right?

Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:33:50 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'm sure it'll be fine, everyone laughed at Romney when he said that Russia was going to be a problem in the future.

Right, guys?  Right?

View Quote

Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:34:17 PM EDT
[#8]
Russia's even more corrupt than us.  Expect $200B in never-leaves-development vaporware, $100B in recycled Soviet-era crap and $400B which just disappears.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:34:47 PM EDT
[#9]
About exactly what Zero pissed away his first year in office on his union fellow travelers

Which could have built and ran new six hundred ship Navy for two decades
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:34:59 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
That would buy quite a few pairs of socks.

View Quote


Lol

All the modernization won't mean shit if their troops aren't worth a crap.

Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:36:11 PM EDT
[#11]
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:36:51 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'm sure it'll be fine, everyone laughed at Romney when he said that Russia was going to be a problem in the future.

Right, guys?  Right?

View Quote


Yeah he was Right about a lot of things.  blew Obummer out of the water till people had to do their part.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:37:09 PM EDT
[#13]
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:37:29 PM EDT
[#14]
Get your start-up weapons company on the web and draw up some crazy Russian bear killing machine and peddle it to your nearest whore of representative.

I bring you:

COLD WAR 2: Maker Bots from Hell

"Is your 3D printed prototype Russian bear murder machine worth the pork?"
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:41:19 PM EDT
[#15]

Meh, President Fuckface is more flexible now that the elections are over. I guess by that he's now able to suck cock while facing the opposite direction.

Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:43:49 PM EDT
[#16]
Russia is really spending 100 billion to modernize their military.  The other 600 billion is for graft.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:45:09 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?
View Quote


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:46:17 PM EDT
[#18]
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:47:51 PM EDT
[#19]
Wait, another sovereign nation is arming itself in order to be able to influence the nations around it?  OMFGBBQ!!!!!1!!!!!

Only all of recorded history would prepare me for such an amazing development.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:48:06 PM EDT
[#20]
Well, if they can pull it off we may be in for a show. I bet it's posturing.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:48:44 PM EDT
[#21]
2020 is 6 years away... hell almost 5 years.



5 years for an entire first world army overhaul including design, acquisitions, and training?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:49:05 PM EDT
[#22]
Goodbye America



Hello third world nation
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:53:27 PM EDT
[#23]


Quoted:





How should the west counter this newly awoken bear?
View Quote
Sweden will figure something out.  The US will "lead from behind".
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:54:36 PM EDT
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
2020 is 6 years away... hell almost 5 years.



5 years for an entire first world army overhaul including design, acquisitions, and training?
View Quote


Hitler was appointed chancellor in 1933, by 1939 he invaded Poland. In that short time he completely rebuilt the german arms industry(something Putin doesn't need to do) and built up a massive modern military with weapons and tactics the rest of the world had to catch up to.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:55:09 PM EDT
[#25]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


2020 is 6 years away... hell almost 5 years.
5 years for an entire first world army overhaul including design, acquisitions, and training?
View Quote
Um Russian history much. They have done it before.

 
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:55:35 PM EDT
[#26]
Where are the planning to get 700 billion?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:58:51 PM EDT
[#27]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Where are the planning to get 700 billion?
View Quote




 
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:58:55 PM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
America is going broke and it's sphere of influence is collapsing.

Russia and/or China can prepare to be the next super power for the next 50+ years.
View Quote

Only because we are choosing to.  
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:58:56 PM EDT
[#29]
Has Obama started apologizing yet?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:59:18 PM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
2020 is 6 years away... hell almost 5 years.



5 years for an entire first world army overhaul including design, acquisitions, and training?
View Quote

Have you looked at the manufacturing resources that China has? Have you looked at the natural resources Russia has. This is a very doable timeframe. I'd encourage you to go look at a west coast shipping port and see how much is shipped here from China on a weekly basis.

To say China can only make crap would be absurd BTW, they're currently making 540,000 iPhones per day. And that is just one item. Haven't hear to many people bitching about how poorly their iPhones are made yet.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 3:59:35 PM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Has Obama started apologizing yet?
View Quote

He's furiously pressing the reset button.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:00:22 PM EDT
[#32]
All that spending for military could boost their economy.  Look what happened to ours in '39-'45.  

And somebody already mentioned Nazi Germany coming out of their depression in '32-'29.

Deficit spending on assets that are produced by skilled labor is very different than deficit spending on social programs where nothing is produced.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:00:44 PM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Russia's even more corrupt than us.  Expect $200B in never-leaves-development vaporware, $100B in recycled Soviet-era crap and $400B which just disappears.
View Quote


LOL...this.  And I think you're being a bit generous.  I would expect more to disappear.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:04:51 PM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


LOL...this.  And I think you're being a bit generous.  I would expect more to disappear.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Russia's even more corrupt than us.  Expect $200B in never-leaves-development vaporware, $100B in recycled Soviet-era crap and $400B which just disappears.


LOL...this.  And I think you're being a bit generous.  I would expect more to disappear.

That would all depend on who's in charge and how much it means to them. With Putin running the show, I wouldn't want to be someone skimming off of the motherland.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:05:45 PM EDT
[#35]
Nice to see a nation that understands the value of a nuclear deterrent.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:12:28 PM EDT
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

That would all depend on who's in charge and how much it means to them. With Putin running the show, I wouldn't want to be someone skimming off of the motherland.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Russia's even more corrupt than us.  Expect $200B in never-leaves-development vaporware, $100B in recycled Soviet-era crap and $400B which just disappears.


LOL...this.  And I think you're being a bit generous.  I would expect more to disappear.

That would all depend on who's in charge and how much it means to them. With Putin running the show, I wouldn't want to be someone skimming off of the motherland.


Putin's the Command In Thief.  He gets a third off the top.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:14:17 PM EDT
[#37]
Meanwhile, back in the USA.........

























Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:14:20 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:17:42 PM EDT
[#39]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

That would all depend on who's in charge and how much it means to them. With Putin running the show, I wouldn't want to be someone skimming off of the motherland.
View Quote


Yeah right.  Putin is nothing but the rich corrupt figurehead of a bunch of richer, more corrupt Russian criminals that happen to own large companies.

I can easily see about $100 billion in new military hardware and $600 billion in various pockets.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:18:29 PM EDT
[#40]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.


Not to mention Hitler created an unsustainable bubble.  The myth of of the German Army at the time is also overstated.  It still had a long way to go, and most of Hitler's early successes can be attributed to luck and malaise on the part of the Allies more than anything else.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:20:20 PM EDT
[#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

That would all depend on who's in charge and how much it means to them. With Putin running the show, I wouldn't want to be someone skimming off of the motherland.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Russia's even more corrupt than us.  Expect $200B in never-leaves-development vaporware, $100B in recycled Soviet-era crap and $400B which just disappears.


LOL...this.  And I think you're being a bit generous.  I would expect more to disappear.

That would all depend on who's in charge and how much it means to them. With Putin running the show, I wouldn't want to be someone skimming off of the motherland.


Putin and his cronies have been robbing Russia blind for years. It is one big racket.  Where did all that Olympic games money go?
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:20:27 PM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.


Yeah the german economy was so great pre hitler people were literally carrying their cash in wheel barrows.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:22:12 PM EDT
[#43]
You also need to consider military purchasing power.

In the US, DoD has a lot of pull with contractors, obviously, but it's nothing like Putin has within his military/industrial industry.  The Russian cost of acquisition for an identical item would be significantly lower than ours for that reason, among many others.  China's acquisition costs compared to our own is incredibly low.  Something to keep in mind when people say, "But we spent twice that."
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:26:24 PM EDT
[#44]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Not to mention Hitler created an unsustainable bubble.  The myth of of the German Army at the time is also overstated.  It still had a long way to go, and most of Hitler's early successes can be attributed to luck and malaise on the part of the Allies more than anything else.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.


Not to mention Hitler created an unsustainable bubble.  The myth of of the German Army at the time is also overstated.  It still had a long way to go, and most of Hitler's early successes can be attributed to luck and malaise on the part of the Allies more than anything else.

I agree but the point I was trying to drive across is Russia's social and economic situation makes a massive military expansion on their part an almost impossible task.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:27:17 PM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
America is going broke and it's sphere of influence is collapsing.

Russia and/or China can prepare to be the next super power for the next 50+ years.
View Quote



I doubt it.   China is more fucked up with command economics than we are and Russia is in a "demographic death spiral."

I'd be more inclined to put money on there being no "superpower" at all in that time frame.  Just "great powers" with regional influence.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:28:34 PM EDT
[#46]
Propaganda. Future tense bullshit.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:29:44 PM EDT
[#47]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Yeah the german economy was so great pre hitler people were literally carrying their cash in wheel barrows.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
lol over how many more decades?  No way by 2020.

Their economy has a hard time spending 88 billion every year let alone 700 billion.  Remember that 88 billion is going to maintenance, salary, weapon development and other up keep.  Only a very small slice can go to new acquisitions.  Are they going to grow their economy 8 times over night?


People laugh but look what hitler did in a very short time. He even uses the same rhetoric just instead of "german speaking people" Putin says "Russian speaking people"

Hitler didn't have a negative population growth rate, an economy solely dependent on oil/natural gas exports to it's enemies, and a non homogeneous group of people.


Yeah the german economy was so great pre hitler people were literally carrying their cash in wheel barrows.

Their economy had rebounded very nicely by the 30's.  In the decade in a half from WW1 they were able to drag themselves out nicely by what at the times standards was precision manufacturing.  I'd venture to say they were in the running for worlds leader in engineering and meteorological processes.

No way you can say the same for Russia today.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:30:38 PM EDT
[#48]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I doubt it.   China is more fucked up with command economics than we are and Russia is in a "demographic death spiral."

I'd be more inclined to put money on there being no "superpower" at all in that time frame.  Just "great powers" with regional influence.
View Quote


The thing that scares me the most about China isn't so much their capabilities but the fact that they  might very well come to the conclusion in the next 10-20 years that a big war that killed off a few hundred million Chinese might actually be a benefit for China as long as they won in the end.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:32:48 PM EDT
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'm sure it'll be fine, everyone laughed at Romney when he said that Russia was going to be a problem in the future.

Right, guys?  Right?

View Quote

They sure are acting like they're preparing for war.
Link Posted: 9/22/2014 4:33:17 PM EDT
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


The thing that scares me the most about China isn't so much their capabilities but the fact that they  might very well come to the conclusion in the next 10-20 years that a big war that killed off a few hundred million Chinese might actually be a benefit for China as long as they won in the end.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

I doubt it.   China is more fucked up with command economics than we are and Russia is in a "demographic death spiral."

I'd be more inclined to put money on there being no "superpower" at all in that time frame.  Just "great powers" with regional influence.


The thing that scares me the most about China isn't so much their capabilities but the fact that they  might very well come to the conclusion in the next 10-20 years that a big war that killed off a few hundred million Chinese might actually be a benefit for China as long as they won in the end.



I suspect any war the killed off a few hundred million people just on one side would not have a clear "winner."
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