Blood atonement owns page five!

I say do it.

A handful of examples:

1. In the 1826 trail of Joseph Smith, Krakauer incorrectly portrays the trial as coming about because of a disgruntled employer of Joseph Smith. The irony of Krakauer's mistaken claims is that in real life the employer, Josiah Stowell, not only didn't file any claim against Joseph Smith, but actually testified in favor of Joseph Smith's character. Joseph Smith was found innocent and excused in pre-trial.

2. Krakauer suggests duplicity on the part of Brigham Young in the case of the massacre at Mountain Meadows. Young had sent a letter to the church members at Cedar City telling them to leave the people in the wagon train alone, but the letter arrived too late. Krakauer suggested that the contents of the letter were in doubt and that all documentation of the matter had disappeared (suggesting that the letter didnt' exist or if it did that it contained a message different than the Church has maintained all along). To make this claim Krakauer ignored the fact that a letterpress copy of the original letter was made immediately when it was written and the letterpress copy has always showed exactly what Young had written.  

3. Krakauer suggests that Porter Rockwell attempted to assassinate former governor Boggs of Missouri, and goes on to say that none of the LDS were brought to justice for the attempt. What Krakauer deliberately ignores was the fact that Rockwell was arrested, chained, and then imprisoned for several months until he was almost wasted away, but found innocent in regards to the charges pertaining to the attempted assassination. In fact, he was held like that despite the fact that the grand jury refused to even bring an indictment against Rockwell. In short, despite being innocent, Rockwell was made to suffer considerably for a crime he never committed. History was almost the exact opposite of what Krakauer suggested in his book. It is an example of historic persecution of the LDS, not of any guilt on the part of the LDS.

4. Krakauer says that in 1831 Eli Johnson got a mob together to attack Joseph Smith for a supposedly inappropriate relationship with Eli's sister, Miranda. The problem with this claim of Krakauer's is that Miranda had no brother named Eli. So here Krakauer is making up fictitious persons to portray what he claims to be historical events.

When you say you married into a Mormon family does this mean that you aren't Mormon or are Jack Mormons just a different group from yours?

Care for a little insight into how religions like Mormonism came about?
Give you a hint it was during the Second Great Awakening.
I will gladly lend anyone my copy of this book as it provides some very interesting insight into peoples religious and spiritual thinking during this time, as told through the story of another man not at all unlike ole Joe B. Smith.

A whole lot of this in here.

Oh sure

My experience has been quite similar. I'm currently unemployed and finishing my degree. Even with that, I still pay my 10% tithing and what little fast offering I can afford. We are not without and my faith keeps growing more and more with all the blessings, both large and small, that we keep getting despite our current circumstances.

OP - I hope you find happiness down whatever path you and yours take.

Can you disprove anything they mention about Mountain Meadows, for example?  There is no denial that it happened and the explanation fits every historical fact known from the event.  It also makes complete sense considering that despite non-LDS wagon trains moving through the territory both before and after the event at Mountain Meadows, there were never any other incidents before or after.

Your ass is showing again (but I suspect you're fine with that).

I've been an avid "armchair Himalayan mountaineer" much of my 46 year life, as well as doing plenty of rock/ice climbing and peak bagging in the Continental U.S. throughout my life. I own most of the books that are accounts of the 1995 tragedy. Many of the writers (who were there), dispute Krak's account. I'll have to go with the majority on that one. But I'm sure that your blind belief in Krakauer's account must be well-warranted.

You better watch out or I'll be on my way over with fresh baked bread or chocolate chip cookies!

Just like Joseph Smith did with the angel Moroni...and here we've come full circle.

At least Krakauer never made up any gold plates.

they now say that Mohammed was like unto a prophet...  I will have none of it

That's how Jon rolls...

I already told them about the Mormon cookies.  Many have I enjoyed.

Actually that would be an assault of sorts. No gluten for me and all. We'll both have to have the root beer.

Who knows.  She might have been honest with him.  People repent and still go to the temple despite not being virgins, you know.

Having been in a bishopric in a college student congregation, I'm pretty familiar with the reality of what goes on.

Some of my best friends are Mormon.  They're (the ones I know) are great people and always place their family and God first.  As a Catholic, none of them have ever criticized my religion.  They've invited me to their church functions (Easter breakfast, Christmas dinners, church softball games) and we've always been welcomed with open arms.  They know I'm not interested in becoming a Mormon...and gain nothing by befriending my family other than friendship.  One even had some missionaries come and help with some labor work around the house when we were doing some landscaping.  This thread is full of idiots looking for attention who lack respect for others beliefs.  With that...I leave you this...

"Our particular principles of religion are a subject of accountability to our God alone. I inquire after no man's, and trouble none with mine; nor is it given to us in this life to know whether your or mine, our friends or our foes, are exactly the right."  -Thomas Jefferson

Killer personal insight, research,  and debate skills there.

A very evenhanded comment.  I appreciate it.

Awesome. What was the extent of YOUR personal research and/or experience on the matter? Oh yeah... anonymous GD poster displaying his emoticon wizardry.

I am the truth, the way and the life.  No one comes to The Father except through me.  John 14:6

God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.  2 Corinthians 5:21

You can follow Anatoly if you wish.  Or Pittman.  

There is no one you can ARock me to, sorry.  

Well folks, I have to head home from work for dinner.  Wife just called to tell me that she's about to start grilling.

Have a nice evening.

Went to college in Utah.  Attended a few LDS functions.  One was a dance social but with a short talk to both guys and girls in separate groups.  The bishop started off the talk by asking a question... "How to you get  Mormon girls to stop having sex?  Marry them.".

That was the exact quote, i swear.

Sherlock holmes got in on the action, too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Study_in_Scarlet

Nope,

They tried to convert me when I visited an old for/museum there in Utah :). It was free, with guide and all. They just wanted my address at the end , and talk me about their faith. It was interesting.


2 months later, back in Switzerland, 2 Mormons came to my door. I simply told them I appreciated everything, that I would gladly let them in for a drink, but that I didn't wish to be converted or having another religious talk.

They kindly declined and went...

There are other accounts as well, Sandy Pittman's is NOT an account I would give much value to.

Love the ARock reference. LAME as it's applicable to ME. But hey... if that's the best left jab you've got, then by all means throw that pitiful thing out there.

Among other things, Mormonism has got that going on for itself.

Umm... About *that*....

Krauthamer wrote it as *fiction*...

You do understand what "fiction" means, right...

Why suggest a work the author wrote as (the authors words) "fiction" as a source of information about a subject...?!?!

Come pick me up. I've been wanting to massacre my first person.

They tend to be all like PUSHY and obnoxious that way!!! Surprised they didn't try to saw your head off with a dull knife.

I'm an Athiest, but I have lived in Utah for the past 3 years, and I have nothing but nice things to say about the people.

Some of you folks seem to have strange ideas about these Mormon girls. Unfortunately when I say Mormons for the most part seem pretty damn normal to me, I mean it. Nothin special really. Maybe less obesity out here. But I put that down to the geography and popularity of outdoor recreation.

Now I think you're confusing Muslims and Mormons.

I can't recall if I've met you yet. Did you kill me too?

Islam does not recognize Jesus as anything other than a lesser prophet.

Hay-Suess is not the Gawd.  He's the son of Gawd --- just like the rest of us. We're just very low on the angelic food chain (chain of command).

Here's the God's honest truth for me.  I was raised a member of the Church, and as I grew into adolescence, where you start to think for yourself and realize the imperfections of your parents, you start to question things, and I needed to know for myself what the real deal was.

The most important, ominous task I have ever done in my life was ask God if He was really there, in the most sincere prayer I have ever offered up.  This was when I was 13, after I finished reading The Book of Mormon.  I literally realized that I was about to test everything, and I made myself as prepared as I could by studying the specific teachings of my Church for well over a year, reading at least one chapter every night.

In my mind, I saw a figurative cliff before me, and I was determined to walk off of it, even if that meant some other path.  I didn't care what the truth was, as long as I could find it.  I was very determined to go to the earth's ends to find it if I had to.

So when I knelt down to ask God if he was there, believe me when I say that there was a weight on my shoulders that felt heavier than anything man could impose on me.  I really, really needed to know what was going on, and knew that there was a very big possibility that I would not get an answer at all.  I didn't care. If so, then what can I do, right?

So I paused for a very long time, then began my prayer.

"Dear Heavenly Father, I've grown up always taking for granted you were there, and I still believe you are there....

...but I really need to know now for myself.  I've prayed to you practically every day of my short life, was taught that you are real, have studied the scriptures, gone to seminary, attended Sunday school, but I really need to know now for myself what the truth is.

So...are you there....."

What happened next literally changed my life.  I felt a distinct person, who is our God, our Father, my Father in Heaven, burn an impression of His Love so deeply on me that it seared my soul eternally, and that I will never deny.  I felt a literal re-birth that I can only describe as a renewal of life and burning in my entire being that made it so I could not even feel what was going on around me, and I dared not open my eyes.  I can only explain the level of communication that happened as pure, Heavenly, perfect, and more real than anything I have experienced before or since.

That day changed my life forever.  I swear it and bear witness of it, no matter what anyone else has to say.  I thanked Him profusely, and couldn't tell Him enough how grateful I was for this answer to my prayer.  I then felt a deep sorrow for the mistakes I had made in life, and begged for forgiveness. I asked if Jesus Christ was His Son, and if His Gospel was true, and received another dose of overwhelming Heavenly affirmation.  I asked if The Book of Mormon was a true book, and got another dose of the same, to the point where I was exhausted.  I don't know how much time went by during this whole two-way prayer, but it was all I could take, and had to close with the most sincere thanks to a loving Father in Heaven.

I then burst from my room and couldn't contain my excitement while telling my family, who looked at me apprehensively, and then my friends at school, who did more of the same. I thought if everyone knew Heavenly Father and His Son, Jesus Christ like I did, the world would be an awesome place.  Nobody really wanted to hear what I was saying, and they kindly made subtle moves to distance themselves from me.  It was an interesting time, to say the least.

If there is one thing I hold onto in life, one thing I would tell a stranger on my deathbed, one last sentence of breath I could expel, it would be that God lives, and His Son Jesus Christ is the way home.

Except for the cooking part. I had to teach my wife that, but the rest is accurate, at least in my case.

I think the word you're looking for is "cult".

 

Its a "Win Win" journey!

You'll get the best dental care possible, and a strong affinity for canned chili!

You might experience strange sudden urge's to mow your neighbors lawn!

The only thing you need to invest is 15% of your income, and three days a week at the stake!

Your tithe will go down to 10% if you save a stripper, or have more than four kids!


And down to 5% if you do both!

Enjoy!

Maybe you ought to read some of the things besides what is purposefully degrading and generally not true.
Emphasis on the 13th.


LDS 13 Articles of Faith

I was born into a Mormon/LDS family and grew up with it. Since the age of about 22 I've drifted away from the act of showing up to the building for Sunday meetings, but then again I am pretty introverted and avoid crowds in any event. For every person out there saying "Research! they're looney" there are 2 or 3 who will testify to the opposite. To this day if I were to jump into organized religion more zealously, LDS is where I would be, and not just due to conditioning of growing up in an LDS family, I've spent a lot of time in a lot of different congregations of many different Christian denominations.

That shit was pretty funny.

Yes you did....



 

lol been inactive LDS for a number of years but I've been attending meetings regularly for a few months now. Hi guys