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Anybody know the reliability? Is the stock easy to unweld if you go SBR?
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I've handled a couple at the shows. They seem much heavier than six pounds. Bet they would be fun. At least once.
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Can you get a real stock on the neutered pistol without machining? Hot subgun loads of 7.62x25mm are one of the few pistol caliber long arms that interest me. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Those are super fun I need to SBR one......... Can you get a real stock on the neutered pistol without machining? Hot subgun loads of 7.62x25mm are one of the few pistol caliber long arms that interest me. Quoted:
Anybody know the reliability? Is the stock easy to unweld if you go SBR? After inspecting one of these at the LGS. The stock IS NOT welded. The depression pin inside is solid with no spring, maybe a replacement part and the stock is GTG. |
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Damn. I almost bought one of those before the surplus dried up. I almost wish I had.
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Love mine and have a shit ton of ammo
The stock pin is solid and I have seen where someone drilled the small welds off to make it an SBR and it just flopped around. I seem to recall that you also need to do some work on the top of the gun to make it work as it is slightly wider then the original. Almost got another at a gun show till I saw the guy made it into a illegal sbr |
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I've been to the factory in Radom, Poland where these are made. They are built from gorgeous new looking submachine guns. They look good. I suggested to them to offer them set up to take a SIG Not-A-Stock arm brace from the factory. parts kits are currently very cheap and it would be very simple to SBR one and legally install a working stock saw this on SLR Rifleworks web site http://lfodarmament.com/image/data/slr/BuildGallery/PPS%20MOD121.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Those are super fun I need to SBR one......... Can you get a real stock on the neutered pistol without machining? Hot subgun loads of 7.62x25mm are one of the few pistol caliber long arms that interest me. I've been to the factory in Radom, Poland where these are made. They are built from gorgeous new looking submachine guns. They look good. I suggested to them to offer them set up to take a SIG Not-A-Stock arm brace from the factory. parts kits are currently very cheap and it would be very simple to SBR one and legally install a working stock saw this on SLR Rifleworks web site http://lfodarmament.com/image/data/slr/BuildGallery/PPS%20MOD121.jpg Sort of want. |
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Well from what I've heard these are not century builds but made in Poland at the Random factory so I would expect them to be great but not sure never fired one. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Anybody know the reliability? Is the stock easy to unweld if you go SBR? Well from what I've heard these are not century builds but made in Poland at the Random factory so I would expect them to be great but not sure never fired one. I've seen them in production. I'd buy one. |
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Here's a video with the first half shot in Poland with the full auto variant and the second part
here in the US with the semi-auto I had a lot of fun shooting the original subgun, it is a great piece. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3JS1CQFKPc |
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Did 7.62x25 dry up because no major nation uses the caliber anymore? I thought these would be fun if surplus ammo was still out there. Not sure so much with ammo costing more than 9mm per box.
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Did 7.62x25 dry up because no major nation uses the caliber anymore? I thought these would be fun if surplus ammo was still out there. Not sure so much with ammo costing more than 9mm per box. View Quote no, there are billions of rounds of surplus.......but Chinese ammo can't be imported and the rest of the European ammo is steel core.........so its considered AP and can't be imported. I pushed hard for someone to buy the ammo and pull the steel core bullets and replace them with lead core bullets in Europe but alas I doubt it will happen....... but there is a ton of surplus steel case x25mm just sitting in warehouses wasting away I would dearly love to shoot...... its the lead core surplus which is all gone........forever...... |
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manufacturers website
http://www.pioneer-pac.com/pps43-c-pistol,prp1,7,2 available in 9mm here http://www.classicfirearms.com/pol-pps-43c9mmcaliberw2-35rdmags http://www.centerfiresystems.com/pps43-pis-9mm.aspx |
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I've had one for a while. Mine doesn't run right with any ammo,and I've tried several brands. The factory and distributor is totally non responsive.
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Sold mine with 1300 rounds of ammo a couple years back. It was an impulse buy and was not as fun as it looks honestly.
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Mine is a good one. For years I wanted a carbine type gun in 762x25 when it was dirt cheap. When these came out I jumped on it and ordered a case, two 700 something round cans, and little did I know it was the end of the ammo. I think the guys with the ar uppers went through the supply pretty fast. Looking back thats what I should have done because it's a fun round. Mine clearly was factory new, great bluing for a sheet metal gun. I've only shot 2-3 hundred rounds in the last 3 years just because I only have a can and a half left. Hope for some more surplus.
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Here's a video with the first half shot in Poland with the full auto variant and the second part here in the US with the semi-auto I had a lot of fun shooting the original subgun, it is a great piece. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3JS1CQFKPc View Quote I've shot them in Poland. Much more interesting as they were intended to be then neutered. |
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Didn't you do a write-up on SGN with one of those uppers? Anyway... http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762a.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762b.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762c.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762d.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762h.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Did 7.62x25 dry up because no major nation uses the caliber anymore? I thought these would be fun if surplus ammo was still out there. Not sure so much with ammo costing more than 9mm per box. no, there are billions of rounds of surplus.......but Chinese ammo can't be imported and the rest of the European ammo is steel core.........so its considered AP and can't be imported. I pushed hard for someone to buy the ammo and pull the steel core bullets and replace them with lead core bullets in Europe but alas I doubt it will happen....... but there is a ton of surplus steel case x25mm just sitting in warehouses wasting away I would dearly love to shoot...... its the lead core surplus which is all gone........forever...... Didn't you do a write-up on SGN with one of those uppers? Anyway... http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762a.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762b.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762c.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762d.jpg http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u88/StevesZZ5/762h.jpg Yes........love my x25mm AR.....really bummed about the ammo situation....... |
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I need to get some of those magazines before they dry up. 10mm stacks up in them quite nicely and I've a hankering to build a 10mm carbine.
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no, there are billions of rounds of surplus.......but Chinese ammo can't be imported and the rest of the European ammo is steel core.........so its considered AP and can't be imported. I pushed hard for someone to buy the ammo and pull the steel core bullets and replace them with lead core bullets in Europe but alas I doubt it will happen....... but there is a ton of surplus steel case x25mm just sitting in warehouses wasting away I would dearly love to shoot...... its the lead core surplus which is all gone........forever...... View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Did 7.62x25 dry up because no major nation uses the caliber anymore? I thought these would be fun if surplus ammo was still out there. Not sure so much with ammo costing more than 9mm per box. no, there are billions of rounds of surplus.......but Chinese ammo can't be imported and the rest of the European ammo is steel core.........so its considered AP and can't be imported. I pushed hard for someone to buy the ammo and pull the steel core bullets and replace them with lead core bullets in Europe but alas I doubt it will happen....... but there is a ton of surplus steel case x25mm just sitting in warehouses wasting away I would dearly love to shoot...... its the lead core surplus which is all gone........forever...... We can still get it here, along with a pistol. Seems a bit pricey but it's available. https://www.canadaammo.com/product/detail/da-p762-tokarev-pistol-1000rds-in-ammo-cans-combo/ |
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Well from what I've heard these are not century builds but made in Poland at the Random factory so I would expect them to be great but not sure never fired one. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Anybody know the reliability? Is the stock easy to unweld if you go SBR? Well from what I've heard these are not century builds but made in Poland at the Random factory so I would expect them to be great but not sure never fired one. Got one a few years ago. Solid. Reliable. No jams. Radom took surplus, unused weapons, figured out how to make them ATF compliant and did a quality job. Only problem was that the front site post broke. IO sent me another one. The leather buffer pad fell apart after a long range session (it was original issue, maybe 1960's vintage) but the box came with a new synthetic one which was easy to install. I have read that to SBR it, you need to get an un-welded folding stock. |
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They are this cheap because they are worthless. These used to sell for like $800+, a gun doesn't go from $800 to $200 without a reason, take a hint.
ANY open bolt FA weapon converted to closed bolt SEMI is going to have problems. Completely different operating principles. Lots of new parts that have to be made (a FA open bolt is a whole heck of alot simpler than a closed bolt SA). Its heavy and bulky and fires a (no longer cheap or readily available) pistol cartridge in semi auto. A GLOCK17 or SUB2000 or AR-15 in 9mm with 30+rd mags and stock gets you the same firepower with a lot less bulk and probably more reliability (and accuracy, good luck putting an optic on this contraption). And dont tell me its cool because its milsurp/surplus/a piece of history. After all the conversion work is done, this is NOT even remotely a "genuine" PPS-43. |
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Quoted: I've been to the factory in Radom, Poland where these are made. They are built from gorgeous new looking submachine guns. They look good. I suggested to them to offer them set up to take a SIG Not-A-Stock arm brace from the factory. parts kits are currently very cheap and it would be very simple to SBR one and legally install a working stock saw this on SLR Rifleworks web site http://lfodarmament.com/image/data/slr/BuildGallery/PPS%20MOD121.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Those are super fun I need to SBR one......... Can you get a real stock on the neutered pistol without machining? Hot subgun loads of 7.62x25mm are one of the few pistol caliber long arms that interest me. I've been to the factory in Radom, Poland where these are made. They are built from gorgeous new looking submachine guns. They look good. I suggested to them to offer them set up to take a SIG Not-A-Stock arm brace from the factory. parts kits are currently very cheap and it would be very simple to SBR one and legally install a working stock saw this on SLR Rifleworks web site http://lfodarmament.com/image/data/slr/BuildGallery/PPS%20MOD121.jpg Yup, Gardner works for SLR I suppose |
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They are this cheap because they are worthless. These used to sell for like $800+, a gun doesn't go from $800 to $200 without a reason, take a hint. ANY open bolt FA weapon converted to closed bolt SEMI is going to have problems. Completely different operating principles. Lots of new parts that have to be made (a FA open bolt is a whole heck of alot simpler than a closed bolt SA). Its heavy and bulky and fires a (no longer cheap or readily available) pistol cartridge in semi auto. A GLOCK17 or SUB2000 or AR-15 in 9mm with 30+rd mags and stock gets you the same firepower with a lot less bulk and probably more reliability (and accuracy, good luck putting an optic on this contraption). And dont tell me its cool because its milsurp/surplus/a piece of history. After all the conversion work is done, this is NOT even remotely a "genuine" PPS-43. View Quote Buzz Killington |
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no, there are billions of rounds of surplus.......but Chinese ammo can't be imported and the rest of the European ammo is steel core.........so its considered AP and can't be imported. I pushed hard for someone to buy the ammo and pull the steel core bullets and replace them with lead core bullets in Europe but alas I doubt it will happen....... but there is a ton of surplus steel case x25mm just sitting in warehouses wasting away I would dearly love to shoot...... its the lead core surplus which is all gone........forever...... View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Did 7.62x25 dry up because no major nation uses the caliber anymore? I thought these would be fun if surplus ammo was still out there. Not sure so much with ammo costing more than 9mm per box. no, there are billions of rounds of surplus.......but Chinese ammo can't be imported and the rest of the European ammo is steel core.........so its considered AP and can't be imported. I pushed hard for someone to buy the ammo and pull the steel core bullets and replace them with lead core bullets in Europe but alas I doubt it will happen....... but there is a ton of surplus steel case x25mm just sitting in warehouses wasting away I would dearly love to shoot...... its the lead core surplus which is all gone........forever...... Wow. |
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Sooo glad I bought cheap and stocked deep. However, I can see four possible outcomes:
- There will be enough demand that someone in eastern Europe will take the surplus stocks and replace the steel cored projectiles with lead cored projectiles. - Wolf or Tula will market Tokarev ammo at about 60% of the price of AK ammo. - kits will be marketed to replace the AR upper and PPS-43 barrels with 9mm barrels. - A company or individuals will return to the 1990s practice of cutting down inexpensive surplus .223/5.56 cartridge cases to resize them into Tokarev ammo cases for reloading. Edited to add: Has anyone actually SBR'd theirs and how did they do it? Has anyone come up with a fix for what has to be the most un-ergonomic fore end of all 20th century subguns? |
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Quoted: Awesome. I need another one for the other end table http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j88/threewood/gun%20pics/CAM00119_zpse8dda9a7.jpg View Quote Pure awesome!!!! |
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Sooo glad I bought cheap and stocked deep. However, I can see four possible outcomes: - There will be enough demand that someone in eastern Europe will take the surplus stocks and replace the steel cored projectiles with lead cored projectiles. - Wolf or Tula will market Tokarev ammo at about 60% of the price of AK ammo. - kits will be marketed to replace the AR upper and PPS-43 barrels with 9mm barrels. - A company or individuals will return to the 1990s practice of cutting down inexpensive surplus .223/5.56 cartridge cases to resize them into Tokarev ammo cases for reloading. Edited to add: Has anyone actually SBR'd theirs and how did they do it? Has anyone come up with a fix for what has to be the most un-ergonomic fore end of all 20th century subguns? View Quote The ammo could be imported to a foreign trade zone and pulled down to be sold as components. |
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Sooo glad I bought cheap and stocked deep. However, I can see four possible outcomes: - There will be enough demand that someone in eastern Europe will take the surplus stocks and replace the steel cored projectiles with lead cored projectiles. that would be ideal..... - Wolf or Tula will market Tokarev ammo at about 60% of the price of AK ammo. 7.62x25mm ammo can not be exported from Russia to the US.....it, like the SVD, is prohibited by agreement........which blows..... - kits will be marketed to replace the AR upper and PPS-43 barrels with 9mm barrels. a 9mm version is already available.......I got them to do that........ - A company or individuals will return to the 1990s practice of cutting down inexpensive surplus .223/5.56 cartridge cases to resize them into Tokarev ammo cases for reloading. Edited to add: Has anyone actually SBR'd theirs and how did they do it? Has anyone come up with a fix for what has to be the most un-ergonomic fore end of all 20th century subguns? View Quote |
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They are this cheap because they are worthless. These used to sell for like $800+, a gun doesn't go from $800 to $200 without a reason, take a hint. ANY open bolt FA weapon converted to closed bolt SEMI is going to have problems. Completely different operating principles. Lots of new parts that have to be made (a FA open bolt is a whole heck of alot simpler than a closed bolt SA). Its heavy and bulky and fires a (no longer cheap or readily available) pistol cartridge in semi auto. A GLOCK17 or SUB2000 or AR-15 in 9mm with 30+rd mags and stock gets you the same firepower with a lot less bulk and probably more reliability (and accuracy, good luck putting an optic on this contraption). And dont tell me its cool because its milsurp/surplus/a piece of history. After all the conversion work is done, this is NOT even remotely a "genuine" PPS-43. View Quote blah blah blah blah....... these are very cool guns made mostly from original parts. I've watched them being produced....... it's hardly heavy at 6.6 pounds....its not like a Thompson. It was actually one of the lightest of the WWI subguns and probably the best of the war. The subguns are a hoot to fire. The semi-auto as a pistol is fun, but would be strictly a range toy. SBR'd with the stock and it would be a very very cool and fun toy. They are only 25 inches long with the stock folded and 35 with it extended. It would be stupid simple to put a rail section on for mounting a red dot sight too..... and yes......it IS almost all original parts..... but to each his own........ |
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Yup, Gardner works for SLR I suppose http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3VfWKE1gHg&feature=youtu.be View Quote No....Todd Gardner owns SLR Rifleworks...... |
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