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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:22:05 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Can anyone explain this to me? Seems more than reasonable to pass something like this? Nanny state? Stolen valor is a shitty thing to do, but do we really need another law on the books because some douchebag wants to parade around as a war hero? |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:24:01 PM EDT
[#2]
1st amendment.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:26:27 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
Can anyone explain this to me? Seems more than reasonable to pass something like this? When you take away free speech in any capacity you are opening pandora's box what next if you can outlaw one thing? Who cares if someone wants to lie let them social justice is better IMO |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:27:07 PM EDT
[#4]
Because Freedom of Speech is a linchpin of our political system. And anything which approaches damaging that linchpin should be approached extremely carefully.
It's a pathetic thing to do. However, it's easy enough to enact laws which penalize the material gain of such an act, without potentially damaging free speech by outlawing the act itself. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:27:15 PM EDT
[#5]
Its a freedom of speech issue I suppose.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:27:43 PM EDT
[#6]
Because freedom is messy?
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:28:04 PM EDT
[#7]
Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud.
Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:28:25 PM EDT
[#8]
Perhaps a better question would be why we need yet another law, especially considering the fact that any potential damage or fraud one might perpetuate by ''stealing valor' is already covered under laws already on the books.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:29:07 PM EDT
[#9]
Do you even freedom bro?
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:30:11 PM EDT
[#10]
Because it'll open the door to randomly arresting LARPers and airsofters running around in the woods with camo fatigues for stolen valor.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:31:50 PM EDT
[#11]
Passing the law isn't the hard part, it's defining stolen valor in a way that's effective and not an unreasonable limit on speech.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:33:17 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1st amendment. Instead of making more laws we should just decriminalize confronting and outing the shitbags. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:34:52 PM EDT
[#13]
3rd post nailed it...........
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1st amendment. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:35:37 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because freedom is messy? this we already have enough bullshit laws, no need to add any more. We have fraud laws when someone uses false claims of military service for monetary gain. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:36:41 PM EDT
[#15]
Maybe because it's still a free country?
For now.. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:36:48 PM EDT
[#16]
Oh yeah well dress like a JBT and they'll lock your fucking ass up! Protected damn class of JBT's!
 lol, I'm just joking. But, seriously in court we had a soup sandwich dressed as a USAF MSgt, yup 
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:38:24 PM EDT
[#17]
Which is more important? The right to free expression or throwing some guy who wears a medal he didn't earn in jail?
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:38:29 PM EDT
[#18]
The government paid out something like 100 billion in tax claims last year that were fraudulent. If they can't handle that, how do you expect them to figure anything else out? I really don't give a damn about most of the stolen valor weenies unless they are receiving funds or benefits they aren't entitled to.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:39:22 PM EDT
[#19]
People keep bitching about this "bill of rights" garbage.
Seems like every once in a while the legislature passes a law making it a crime, courts say no. Repeat. I believe currently stolen valor is punishable by a small fine and the courts seem to have better things to do than address the issue. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:39:40 PM EDT
[#20]
1st Amendment . We don't need to worry about that shit anyway.
I don't think I have ever got angry over one of those fake Ranger Recon Delta kooks. It's always a sad individual doing it, I usually feel pity towards them. But then again maybe I am biased, I have never seen anyone pretend to be a boring grunt with 1 combat deployment.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:43:33 PM EDT
[#21]
As long as one isn't committing actual fraud, lying, no matter the subject, is protected speech. As despicable as stolen valor is, it should not be a crime.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:43:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud. Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. Well put. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:46:22 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well put. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud. Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. Well put. Makes me wonder, where is the line drawn on that? Is lying about work history on your resume to get a job you wouldn't get otherwise considered fraud? |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:49:35 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1st amendment. Reasonable restrictions. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:51:43 PM EDT
[#25]
The cynic in me thinks that it's to keep libtards from suing actual war heroes from using their service history to run for office by pedantic discrepancies in their service.
If some faggot wants to dress as a Marine and act the fool in bars, things will sort themselves out. I don't want some asshole Democrat suing a real war hero for stolen valor because of a technicality. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:52:54 PM EDT
[#26]
Liberty.
n. noun The condition of being free from restriction or control. The right and power to act, believe, or express oneself in a manner of one's own choosing. The condition of being physically and legally free from confinement, servitude, or forced labor. That also includes your right to be something you're not nor ever "earned." |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:53:17 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Reasonable restrictions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
1st amendment. Reasonable restrictions. It comes back to intent. Do we monitor actors in costume? Military re-enactors? If they're not claiming actual status to benefit from it, there's no injury. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:54:14 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud. Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:55:24 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It comes back to intent. Do we monitor actors in costume? Military re-enactors? If they're not claiming actual status to benefit from it, there's no injury. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
1st amendment. Reasonable restrictions. It comes back to intent. Do we monitor actors in costume? Military re-enactors? If they're not claiming actual status to benefit from it, there's no injury. Yup. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 1:56:27 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Reasonable restrictions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
1st amendment. Reasonable restrictions. You consider it reasonable to make low self esteem a crime? |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 2:04:54 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As long as one isn't committing actual fraud, lying, no matter the subject, is protected speech. As despicable as stolen valor is, it should not be a crime. This. Personally I would enjoy outing one. But the closest I have ever encountered is talking to their kids. Conversation usually goes something like this... Student- Mr Currahee were you in the Army? Me- Yes I was, long time ago. Student- What did you do? Me- I was an infantryman, I served in Korea, no not the Korean War blah blah blah Student- My Dad was a Navy SEAL Me- OK that's cool, lets get back to the lesson (I would feel horrible calling out a parent on a lie they told their kids) |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 2:06:27 PM EDT
[#32]
Stolen valor dickheads are usually easily shamed into oblivion. I don't think we need a national law that will likely just cause different abuses of power etc by zero-tolerance idiots. I.e. arresting people on halloween and other stupid shit.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 2:07:34 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud. Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. Exactly. Some dick claiming to be a DeltaSEALRangerPJ trying to impress a 4 at closing time... Meh, not worth it. Going on a "motivational" speaking tour for profit with stolen valor? Fuck that.
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Posted: 7/22/2014 2:19:39 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:......... Seems more than reasonable to pass something like this? How about NO! Learn your First Amendment, preferable not off YouTube when you look for your next round of videos to post. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 2:35:33 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You consider it reasonable to make low self esteem a crime? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
1st amendment. Reasonable restrictions. You consider it reasonable to make low self esteem a crime? Actually, my post was saying that there are reasonable restrictions placed on the 1st A against his blanket 1st A post. Take that what you will. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 2:36:58 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This. Personally I would enjoy outing one. But the closest I have ever encountered is talking to their kids. Conversation usually goes something like this... Student- Mr Currahee were you in the Army? Me- Yes I was, long time ago. Student- What did you do? Me- I was an infantryman, I served in Korea, no not the Korean War blah blah blah Student- My Dad was a Navy SEAL Me- OK that's cool, lets get back to the lesson (I would feel horrible calling out a parent on a lie they told their kids) Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
As long as one isn't committing actual fraud, lying, no matter the subject, is protected speech. As despicable as stolen valor is, it should not be a crime. This. Personally I would enjoy outing one. But the closest I have ever encountered is talking to their kids. Conversation usually goes something like this... Student- Mr Currahee were you in the Army? Me- Yes I was, long time ago. Student- What did you do? Me- I was an infantryman, I served in Korea, no not the Korean War blah blah blah Student- My Dad was a Navy SEAL Me- OK that's cool, lets get back to the lesson (I would feel horrible calling out a parent on a lie they told their kids) 
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:07:48 PM EDT
[#37]
I support the 1st Amendment BUT . . . . we need common sense laws to protect the children.
Something like that? |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:09:22 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1st amendment. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:09:49 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Actually, my post was saying that there are reasonable restrictions placed on the 1st A against his blanket 1st A post. Take that what you will. Sorry, I misunderstood. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:10:53 PM EDT
[#40]
Freedom of speech/expression.
Sometimes it means you have to deal with shit you don't like. Suck it up. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:12:46 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1st Amendment . We don't need to worry about that shit anyway. I don't think I have ever got angry over one of those fake Ranger Recon Delta kooks. It's always a sad individual doing it, I usually feel pity towards them. But then again maybe I am biased, I have never seen anyone pretend to be a boring grunt with 1 combat deployment. why no tank? |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:13:41 PM EDT
[#42]
Fraud is already illegal. Being a douchebag in a Halloween costume shouldn't be.
As with everything else, the cure would be worse than the disease; combat vets would be getting citations for having their ribbons in the wrong precedence while some assclown struts around with a Ranger tab and a USN "scrambed eggs" cover 
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:14:28 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nanny state? Stolen valor is a shitty thing to do, but do we really need another law on the books because some douchebag wants to parade around as a war hero? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Can anyone explain this to me? Seems more than reasonable to pass something like this? Nanny state? Stolen valor is a shitty thing to do, but do we really need another law on the books because some douchebag wants to parade around as a war hero? Impersonating a doctor, lawyer, or cop gets you arrested but you can play US Army general all day long. Another law - no but if caught playing dress-up by a real member of the military they get to stomp your ass three ways to Sunday and if you survive its only by luck or their kindness. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:15:35 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud. Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. Unless you choose to bullshit as a cop, lawyer, or doctor. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:16:19 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Passing the law isn't the hard part, it's defining stolen valor in a way that's effective and not an unreasonable limit on speech. You're not allowed to wear the nation's honors unless you earned them. - 12 words. Done. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:16:31 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unless you choose to bullshit as a cop, lawyer, or doctor. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Bullshitting for gain is already a crime called fraud. Bullshitting for fun is protected speech. Unless you choose to bullshit as a cop, lawyer, or doctor. Then there are a lot of male strippers out there dodging jail time. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:17:20 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're not allowed to wear the nation's honors unless you earned them. - 12 words. Done. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Passing the law isn't the hard part, it's defining stolen valor in a way that's effective and not an unreasonable limit on speech. You're not allowed to wear the nation's honors unless you earned them. - 12 words. Done. Yet those that earned them, earned them by taking the oath to defend someone's right to that free speech. Bakes your noodle, eh? |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:18:03 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Impersonating a doctor, lawyer, or cop gets you arrested but you can play US Army general all day long. Another law - no but if caught playing dress-up by a real member of the military they get to stomp your ass three ways to Sunday and if you survive its only by luck or their kindness. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Can anyone explain this to me? Seems more than reasonable to pass something like this? Nanny state? Stolen valor is a shitty thing to do, but do we really need another law on the books because some douchebag wants to parade around as a war hero? Impersonating a doctor, lawyer, or cop gets you arrested but you can play US Army general all day long. Another law - no but if caught playing dress-up by a real member of the military they get to stomp your ass three ways to Sunday and if you survive its only by luck or their kindness. Ok let's be precise here in our meaning, if you impersonate a doctor, lawyer, or officer, and then attempt to actually do their job while falsely representing yourself as one of them, you will be arrested. I am guessing if someone dressed up like a Marine and tried to sneak his way onto a base and start doing Marine things he would also be arrested. I don't know why anyone would do that, because most of those things are really shitty anyway. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:19:09 PM EDT
[#49]
Pity the pathetic ass who needs to do such things to make them feel as though they exist.
Not worth getting upset over. |
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Posted: 7/22/2014 3:20:03 PM EDT
[#50]
Amazingly the law existed not too long ago. Local biker was wearing a MOH that he didn't earn. Guy at work, a Viet Nam vet himself, called him on it - asked if he knew him by his real name. Yes. Dude goes home and looks up the Medal of Honor rolls and faker isn't on it. Dude warns faker again. Faker continues, dude calls and finds it's the FBI that investigates. They knock on the fakers door and tell him to remove the MOH from his vest less he get charged.
Thankfully we now tolerate such bullshit. |
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