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Posted: 7/27/2013 8:15:36 AM EST
My insurance guy sent me this calculator to help me figure out how much Obamacare is going to cost me. You can plug in the data and get a figure of how much you will have to pay and how much the government will subsidize.

There are NO savings for anyone that is actually productive and working. My premiums are going up about $2,000.00 per year because of this. We only have two months before the process begins for 2014.

People that think this is a good idea have absolutely no idea of what is about to happen. This will have a great negative impact on the average American and all Congress can do is spin it's wheels.


http://kff.org/interactive/subsidy-calculator/
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:26:02 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:36:27 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


Not funny. For big bucks, you have to become a banker. Prof. William Black wrote the book, The Best Way to Rob a Bank is to Own One. In the '90s, Black help put hundreds of S&L executives into prison. Look at the CEO of PFG Best ($125 million stolen) and John Corzine (over $1 billion stolen via MF Global).
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:42:39 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History

Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:44:01 AM EST
I was told life would be perfect and I could keep my doctor. All we needed to do was ask a few who could afford it to pay a little more. That's it. Unicorns and consequence free buttsex 4evah!

Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:45:09 AM EST
ermehgerd. Time to go find a couple new part-time jobs, everyone.

On top of raping all the taxpayers, the Dems will hold onto the White House for at least another decade or more once all the FSA's realize how much they are getting for free. Only when there is no healthcare to be had (all the experienced Doctors disappear) will they finally realize what a train wreck this is. By then, it will be too late to turn back.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:48:27 AM EST
$9139.

Yay.

Or, pay a "tax" of ~$2000
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:50:11 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 8:51:48 AM EST by Lorax]
I thought it was all free.....as in a "right" or something. Some old lady with a gavel, really big eyes and a shrieky voice was saying this and clapping for Obama. Then American Idol came on.


But it's all still free.....right?
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:51:37 AM EST
Household income in 2014:

544% of poverty level

Unsubsidized annual health insurance premium in 2014:$14,933

$1,856 of which is due to a tobacco surcharge

Maximum % of income you have to pay for the non-tobacco premium, if eligible for a subsidy:None


(before accounting for the tobacco surcharge) Amount you pay for the premium:$14,933 per year
(which equals 9.96% of your household income and covers 100% of the overall premium)

You could receive a government tax credit subsidy of up to:$0
(which covers 0% of the overall premium)

grumpycat.jpeg
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 8:57:42 AM EST
Originally Posted By 1387Delta:
My insurance guy sent me this calculator to help me figure out how much Obamacare is going to cost me. You can plug in the data and get a figure of how much you will have to pay and how much the government will subsidize.

There are NO savings for anyone that is actually productive and working. My premiums are going up about $2,000.00 per year because of this. We only have two months before the process begins for 2014.

People that think this is a good idea have absolutely no idea of what is about to happen. This will have a great negative impact on the average American and all Congress can do is spin it's wheels.


http://kff.org/interactive/subsidy-calculator/
View Quote





I shit you not. For myself and spouse. 63 and 60 years old.





results
Because your income is more than 4 times the poverty level, you would not qualify for subsidized exchange coverage. The information below is about unsubsidized exchange coverage.

Household income in 2014:484% of poverty level Unsubsidized annual health insurance premium in 2014:$21,555

$4,455 of which is due to a tobacco surcharge Maximum % of income you have to pay for the non-tobacco premium, if eligible for a subsidy:None
(before accounting for the tobacco surcharge) Amount you pay for the premium:$21,555 per year

(which equals 28.74% of your household income and covers 100% of the overall premium) You could receive a government tax credit subsidy of up to:$0
(which covers 0% of the overall
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 9:18:49 AM EST






Link Posted: 7/27/2013 9:28:27 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Rogueco:
ermehgerd. Time to go find a couple new part-time jobs, everyone.

On top of raping all the taxpayers, the Dems will hold onto the White House for at least another decade or more once all the FSA's realize how much they are getting for free. Only when there is no healthcare to be had (all the experienced Doctors disappear) will they finally realize what a train wreck this is. By then, it will be too late to turn back.
View Quote

No. By then there will be a Republican in the White House and they'll blame the whole mess on some nonsense like "deregulation." Just like the whole Clinton housing bubble got blamed on W.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 9:35:47 AM EST
All Hail Lord Obama and the gifts he bestoweth upon us.


Link Posted: 7/27/2013 9:36:23 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 9:56:46 AM EST
Wtf am I doing wrong?

It won't let me add anyone to exchange because I have employer coverage. But it won't let me submit without selecting someone on exchange.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:08:28 AM EST
So I'm paying $7,200.00 year according to the calculator mine will go up to $10,100.00. Go figure more punishment for trying to be self sufficient.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:10:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 10:10:19 AM EST by Paul]
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:11:30 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:13:02 AM EST
Same as we always have $200 a pay period 26 periods a year wife's company picks up the remainder of the $21,000 bill
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:13:47 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 10:19:19 AM EST by victorgonzales]
i dropped insurance. the math no longer adds up now that high deductable limited coverage will be going away. its cheaper to pay the fine and fly to an island for cash treatment for brain surfery every few years than to pay for the insurance they want me to buy. especually all the interest and capitol gains i could be making on that money over the years. only fools or the extremely wealthy would keep buying insurance anymore. eta: just negotiated cash price for our second child. covers hospital, doctors,possibility of surgery and up to ten days of infant and mother care.5200 dollars. cash is king in the land of government healthcare.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:15:14 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Paul:
'tobacco surcharge'

So are there going to be mandatory tests?
View Quote


And 10 years in a Federal Pen for lying
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:18:24 AM EST
FBHO
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:20:31 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Chokey:
FBHO
View Quote

Hell no! He might get richer charging us
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:25:21 AM EST
All I got was not eligible for subsidies because employ offers healthcare. We will find out next year, I suppose.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:25:39 AM EST
Well invention is the mother of necessity, so will have to wait and see what ways emerge to get around this boondoggle.

Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:31:42 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Paul:
'tobacco surcharge'

So are there going to be mandatory tests?
View Quote

Probably your better off smoking dope and claiming your an addict and can't hep ur self

WTF Have the Voting Robots done MFer
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 10:50:05 AM EST
Tag for home.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:13:25 AM EST
So what happens when tens of thousands of people can't pay this?
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:23:29 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By HellifIknow:
So what happens when tens of thousands of people can't pay this?
View Quote
Probably the same as not paying your taxes since the IRS is going to enforce this...
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:32:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 11:32:29 AM EST by ns66]
Originally Posted By 1387Delta:
My insurance guy sent me this calculator to help me figure out how much Obamacare is going to cost me. You can plug in the data and get a figure of how much you will have to pay and how much the government will subsidize.

There are NO savings for anyone that is actually productive and working. My premiums are going up about $2,000.00 per year because of this. We only have two months before the process begins for 2014.

People that think this is a good idea have absolutely no idea of what is about to happen. This will have a great negative impact on the average American and all Congress can do is spin it's wheels.


http://kff.org/interactive/subsidy-calculator/
View Quote


only based on income, does saving/net play any role here?
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:33:18 AM EST
Nothing...


I have Rommeny care......
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:36:23 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 4v50:


Not funny. For big bucks, you have to become a banker. Prof. William Black wrote the book, The Best Way to Rob a Bank is to Own One. In the '90s, Black help put hundreds of S&L executives into prison. Look at the CEO of PFG Best ($125 million stolen) and John Corzine (over $1 billion stolen via MF Global).
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 4v50:


Not funny. For big bucks, you have to become a banker. Prof. William Black wrote the book, The Best Way to Rob a Bank is to Own One. In the '90s, Black help put hundreds of S&L executives into prison. Look at the CEO of PFG Best ($125 million stolen) and John Corzine (over $1 billion stolen via MF Global).

So you're suggesting staying in the gov sector to steal
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:39:38 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Lorax:
I thought it was all free.....as in a "right" or something. Some old lady with a gavel, really big eyes and a shrieky voice was saying this and clapping for Obama. Then American Idol came on.


But it's all still free.....right?
View Quote


This was sold to me as being free healthcare as well.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:40:50 AM EST
I think lots of FSA types who think this is really going to be 'free' are going to be quite surprised. It's not like there isn't a deductible and a maximum out of pocket of 12,700 a year. They'll just go to the ER like they do now.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:47:13 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 11:57:40 AM EST by Atomic_Ferret]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beltfed74:


And 10 years in a Federal Pen for lying
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beltfed74:
Originally Posted By Paul:
'tobacco surcharge'

So are there going to be mandatory tests?


And 10 years in a Federal Pen for lying


It will all be something akin to tax evasion with similar risk of penalty for getting caught (anywhere from a fine with loanshark interest and payments, bank account levies, asset forfeiture and all the way up to imprisonment).

Mark my words, unless you are a vegetarian office worker with a perfect BMI and no "risky" hobbies or lifestyle choices (or FSA) you are going to be paying a surcharge for something.

Yeah, 28% of your household income going to pay insurance is sustainable.... That will work.
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't ~30% the maximum amount you should be paying for housing?
So healthcare is going to cost as much as your rent/mortgage. Umm, yeah.

I can't wait for European style, grinding, barely keeping head above water, apartment dwelling version of the "middle class" to become the new normal here. Sounds fun.

Our 'murica lifestyle of the middle class having large suburban houses, multiple vehicles, boats and other toys, vacation homes etc is in for a huge fucking adjustment. Shit is all gonna be gone and be replaced with "hanging on in quiet desperation".

ETA: IMO, I see a societal change back to pre 1950 standards of living (pre suburban explosion) where people were either rural farmers or urban apartment dwellers.
The suburbs will be set aside for the FSA (gotta get a big house for those 6 baby gimme pigs that you have squirted out). Or for the multigenerational , newly amnestied chain migrators (amnesty will let everybody who gets it import their parents, aunts, uncles, cousins, etc).
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:50:00 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beltfed74:


And 10 years in a Federal Pen for lying
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beltfed74:
Originally Posted By Paul:
'tobacco surcharge'

So are there going to be mandatory tests?


And 10 years in a Federal Pen for lying




Where the health care and food & lodging are free.










Roy
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:51:32 AM EST
Weird, it says mine will be half what I'm paying now. (no, I'm "rich" so I'm not eligible for subsidies)



Of course, I'll believe it when I see it.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:55:06 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 11:57:47 AM EST by machinegunseabee]
I think once dollars are being stripped out of peoples accounts or paychecks for this crap shit will get real... real quick.

I see lots of mom and pop businesses starting up with no employees except family. But the government will probably screw people over that way somehow.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:56:36 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 11:57:22 AM EST by 1Andy2]
What does a bronze plan mean in real terms? How much coverage?



I'll comply with the mandate if it falls in line with what I already want to do, which is catastrophic-only. If not, I'll still get catastrophic-only, and just pay the penalty.

And if they fuck the system up badly enough that I CAN'T buy catastrophic only... then I'm just going to break the law. Fuck it.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 11:59:10 AM EST
It is my understanding the IRS can't take penalty funds from you. What is to keep a person from adjusting so they break even and refuse to pay any outrageous costs?
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:04:55 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1Andy2:

And if they fuck the system up badly enough that I CAN'T buy catastrophic only... then I'm just going to break the law. Fuck it.
View Quote


I think many people will do the same, what are they going to do? Incarcerate everyone? Fine everyone? Tax us more? The system will break faster then they anticipate.

What can they do when 75% of the people just refuse to pay? Hell even just 25%?

They know (politicians) its a dumb idea overall, but someone's pockets are going to get lined with cash and they want to get elected again... why do you think its so important for them to get celebrities out to promote it? Useful idiots.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:07:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 12:09:30 PM EST by 1387Delta]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1Andy2:
What does a bronze plan mean in real terms? How much coverage?



I'll comply with the mandate if it falls in line with what I already want to do, which is catastrophic-only. If not, I'll still get catastrophic-only, and just pay the penalty.

And if they fuck the system up badly enough that I CAN'T buy catastrophic only... then I'm just going to break the law. Fuck it.
View Quote

Platinum Plan pays 90% you pay 10%

Gold Plan pays 80% you pay 20%

Silver Plan pays 70% and you pay 30%

Bronze Plan pays 60% and you pay 40%

Obamacare doesn't start paying until you have paid your deductible (Premium) and the percentage you owe on your plan. If you have the Bronze 60/40 plan and have a $20,000 operation. You have to pay, IIRC 40% of that ($8,000) plus your premium, which in my case is $7,800. So I would pay $15,800 out of pocket before Obamacare would kick in.

If you had some serious $200,000 surgery, then you would be paying $120,000 + $7,800 ($127,800) out of pocket.

ETA: I'm sure there are some insurance guys on the board that can correct me if I'm wrong and clarify / add to this.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:09:51 PM EST
lol according to calculator, 870% over poverty level? BS.

FBHO
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:18:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2013 12:19:19 PM EST by Tannim]
I expect no effect here in OK. There can be no penalties assessed against us because we don't have a state exchange and our AG is suing to prevent the IRS from illegally giving credits to federal exchanges.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/328523/irs-has-gone-rogue-michael-f-cannon
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:23:42 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ragedracer1977:
$9139.

Yay.

Or, pay a "tax" of ~$2000
View Quote


This

Plus I think the first two years aren't even that much

FBHO
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:24:17 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Tannim:
I expect no effect here in OK. There can be no penalties assessed against us because we don't have a state exchange and our AG is suing to prevent the IRS from illegally giving credits to federal exchanges.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/328523/irs-has-gone-rogue-michael-f-cannon
View Quote

I would like to believe that Obamacare can be held at bay, but I wouldn't bet on it. It is going to be rammed down our throats and everyone that has a job is now going to be considered "rich". We (including OK) are going to be getting a royal screwing.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:25:58 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1387Delta:

Platinum Plan pays 90% you pay 10%

Gold Plan pays 80% you pay 20%

Silver Plan pays 70% and you pay 30%

Bronze Plan pays 60% and you pay 40%

Obamacare doesn't start paying until you have paid your deductible (Premium) and the percentage you owe on your plan. If you have the Bronze 60/40 plan and have a $20,000 operation. You have to pay, IIRC 40% of that ($8,000) plus your premium, which in my case is $7,800. So I would pay $15,800 out of pocket before Obamacare would kick in.

If you had some serious $200,000 surgery, then you would be paying $120,000 + $7,800 ($127,800) out of pocket.

ETA: I'm sure there are some insurance guys on the board that can correct me if I'm wrong and clarify / add to this.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1387Delta:
Originally Posted By 1Andy2:
What does a bronze plan mean in real terms? How much coverage?



I'll comply with the mandate if it falls in line with what I already want to do, which is catastrophic-only. If not, I'll still get catastrophic-only, and just pay the penalty.

And if they fuck the system up badly enough that I CAN'T buy catastrophic only... then I'm just going to break the law. Fuck it.

Platinum Plan pays 90% you pay 10%

Gold Plan pays 80% you pay 20%

Silver Plan pays 70% and you pay 30%

Bronze Plan pays 60% and you pay 40%

Obamacare doesn't start paying until you have paid your deductible (Premium) and the percentage you owe on your plan. If you have the Bronze 60/40 plan and have a $20,000 operation. You have to pay, IIRC 40% of that ($8,000) plus your premium, which in my case is $7,800. So I would pay $15,800 out of pocket before Obamacare would kick in.

If you had some serious $200,000 surgery, then you would be paying $120,000 + $7,800 ($127,800) out of pocket.

ETA: I'm sure there are some insurance guys on the board that can correct me if I'm wrong and clarify / add to this.


I think, for clarification, you should just say you have to pay the percentage you own on your plan, in addition to your monthly premiums (because a presumption could be made by others that you would have to pay the premium amount as a deductibel for every claim. "Deductible" =/= "premium" normally (unless they redefined it in the ACA...I don't know the answer to that, BTW), but the 40% does = deductible = copay

But I have some questions, and that I am not 100% sure of the answers to:

- Are the insurers in the exchanges not private insurance companies?

- If a person goes through the exchange to purchase insurance from one of these private companies, will there be no variation in the insurance policies (i.e. covered claims, deductible amounts, etc.) you can choose from? I can't find the answer anywhere, and all I ever read about is the bronze, silver, gold, platinum plans. Well, if all the insurance companies are offering the same 4 plans, what the hell is the purpose of having an exchange?
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:27:14 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1387Delta:

I would like to believe that Obamacare can be held at bay, but I wouldn't bet on it. It is going to be rammed down our throats and everyone that has a job is now going to be considered "rich". We (including OK) are going to be getting a royal screwing.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 1387Delta:
Originally Posted By Tannim:
I expect no effect here in OK. There can be no penalties assessed against us because we don't have a state exchange and our AG is suing to prevent the IRS from illegally giving credits to federal exchanges.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/328523/irs-has-gone-rogue-michael-f-cannon

I would like to believe that Obamacare can be held at bay, but I wouldn't bet on it. It is going to be rammed down our throats and everyone that has a job is now going to be considered "rich". We (including OK) are going to be getting a royal screwing.
As the law is written now, we can't. Read that article. Not only are Federal exchanges not allowed credits, there is plenty of evidence that was intended all along as a political maneuver. If you're not elegible for a credit, your employer can't be penalized. Therefore Obamacare really doesn't exist in OK and 30 other states without STATE exchanges.

Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:28:31 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DDalton:

<snip>

Well, if all the insurance companies are offering the same 4 plans, what the hell is the purpose of having an exchange?
View Quote


To ease the single payer system up America's ass.
Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:29:09 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By HellifIknow:
So what happens when tens of thousands millions of people can't pay this?
View Quote


Single Payer - Think Medicare for everyone. That has always been the goal.

The goal has never been about healthcare. It is and always has been a .gov power grab.

The bill/law was never meant to work from a healthcare standpoint. That was whole point.

Redistribution of health and wealth must first begin with the "Fundamental transformation destruction of America".

Marxism 101.

Link Posted: 7/27/2013 12:32:39 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By victorgonzales:
i dropped insurance. the math no longer adds up now that high deductable limited coverage will be going away. its cheaper to pay the fine and fly to an island for cash treatment for brain surfery every few years than to pay for the insurance they want me to buy. especually all the interest and capitol gains i could be making on that money over the years. only fools or the extremely wealthy would keep buying insurance anymore. eta: just negotiated cash price for our second child. covers hospital, doctors,possibility of surgery and up to ten days of infant and mother care.5200 dollars. cash is king in the land of government healthcare.
View Quote


Thats pretty cheap to have a new baby.

I couldnt afford my premiums anymore and had to drop my insurance, $700 a month for a BCBS policy. I reapplied and was told Im not insurable because of a rotator cuff injury, they asked if I had recent injury so I said yes a year ago but they didnt state what time frame they were looking for and Im not sure when it falls off - where they cant call it preexisting 6 months or a year. Sure I got some use from it but not $700 a month use. Better for it now. Havent had insurance since Feb '13 also havent been strung to the wire with almost no money to spend.
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