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Large-Brained, Ape-Like Creature
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 12:56:14 PM EST
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Originally Posted By fook:
Shoot a ten round group at 100 yards and there is your answer.
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Does your challenge require suppressed rifles and/or firing subsonic ammo?

Maybe my unsuppressed AR in 7.62x39, while firing that cheapest Remington Express ammo, is a freak of nature? Seriously: I'm not a good shot and I don't tweak rifles to shoot better than ~2moa, but my AR will reliably shoot ~2moa* with cheap ammo--7.62x39 cases loaded with .308 bullets as the Remington cartridges are loaded.

* Yes, I hear the laughter.
Creepy or otherwise, I ain't no ass-cracker.
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:10:20 PM EST
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Originally Posted By injun-ear:


Straighter walls is a good thing? Doesn't a tapered pin (cartridge) fit into a tapered hole (chamber) far easier and more reliably than a straight pin into a straight hole? What am I not getting? ...Maybe straight magazines operate more reliably than curved ones?
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Originally Posted By injun-ear:
Originally Posted By Dannofree:
Straighter case walls.


Straighter walls is a good thing? Doesn't a tapered pin (cartridge) fit into a tapered hole (chamber) far easier and more reliably than a straight pin into a straight hole? What am I not getting? ...Maybe straight magazines operate more reliably than curved ones?


however more case tape also equals more bolt thrust causing more broken bolts which is also exaggerated by the extra material removed from the bolt due tote larger case head.
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:13:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2013 1:22:32 PM EST by Psychovore]
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Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim:
Can you find me some cheap 7.62x39 reloading supplies please? Thanks!


Oh wait!
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Yes. I bought several thousand rounds of brass-cases Lapua 7.62x39 at prices cheaper than Wolf steel-cased stuff. Have the primers and bullets to go along with it.

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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:15:43 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Kalahnikid:
76239 mags can be a crapshoot

300BLK use standard AR mags.
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I've never had trouble with any of my milsurp AK mags.

Do you use U.S.A. Magazines and Pro-Mags in your .300 Blackout rifle?
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:16:38 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Psychovore:


Yes. I bought several thousand rounds of brass-cases Lapua 7.62x39 at prices cheaper than Wolf steel-cases stuff. Have the primers and bullets to go along with it.

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Originally Posted By Psychovore:
Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim:
Can you find me some cheap 7.62x39 reloading supplies please? Thanks!


Oh wait!


Yes. I bought several thousand rounds of brass-cases Lapua 7.62x39 at prices cheaper than Wolf steel-cases stuff. Have the primers and bullets to go along with it.



LINK?


Just because there was a clearance sale once upon a time doesn't mean its still available or makes its cheaper for everyone else.
cat food and welfare cheese eating AK cheapskate
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:17:11 PM EST
I got a newsflash for all the 7.62x39 haters

guess what I can reload 7.62x39 with?

.308 bullets.

all you have to do is use a .308 expander ball.


220 SMKs in a 7.62x39? its doable. and 7.62x39 doesn't suffer from the shitty case shape that 5.56 and the .300 we stole JD Jones' idea.


and its $250 a case for the cheap blasting ammo. which with a bullet puller and a die set can be any load I want it to be.

If they try to light my house on fire they'll be met by gunfire so intense George Patton himself will rise from the grave to complement me on the display of firepower. - clutchsmoke
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:17:56 PM EST
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Originally Posted By wunbadweel:


Please take no offense at this, but: you DO realize a .308 diameter bullet won't fit where a .224 bullet goes, right?

Or am I missing something?


ETA: Okay, I can see where this could happen. Never considered this. Hmmmm.

ETA#2: Yeah, it could happen, but one would need to make several significant errors in a concurrent manner, and be drunk.
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Originally Posted By wunbadweel:
Originally Posted By Bullet_:
300 BLK is far superior at blowing up 5.56 rifles than 7.62x39 because 300blk will chamber into and fire in a 5.56 rifle.

Other than that, 300blk does nothing better than 7.62x39.



Please take no offense at this, but: you DO realize a .308 diameter bullet won't fit where a .224 bullet goes, right?

Or am I missing something?


ETA: Okay, I can see where this could happen. Never considered this. Hmmmm.

ETA#2: Yeah, it could happen, but one would need to make several significant errors in a concurrent manner, and be drunk.


Already been done. You must have missed the threads here.
cat food and welfare cheese eating AK cheapskate
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:19:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2013 1:36:45 PM EST by Howie_Phelterbush]
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Originally Posted By jjwheeler2:


however more case tape also equals more bolt thrust causing more broken bolts which is also exaggerated by the extra material removed from the bolt due tote larger case head.
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Originally Posted By jjwheeler2:
Originally Posted By injun-ear:
Originally Posted By Dannofree:
Straighter case walls.


Straighter walls is a good thing? Doesn't a tapered pin (cartridge) fit into a tapered hole (chamber) far easier and more reliably than a straight pin into a straight hole? What am I not getting? ...Maybe straight magazines operate more reliably than curved ones?


however more case tape also equals more bolt thrust causing more broken bolts which is also exaggerated by the extra material removed from the bolt due tote larger case head.


no it doesn't. 7.62x39 operates at lower pressures.

you see broken AR bolts in the size usually because they are being used with 6.5 grendal which operates at higher pressures.
If they try to light my house on fire they'll be met by gunfire so intense George Patton himself will rise from the grave to complement me on the display of firepower. - clutchsmoke
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:19:47 PM EST
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Originally Posted By VacaDuck:


Here is the manufacturers store:

Diamondhead V RS-T

Do a web search and you can find it cheaper.
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Originally Posted By VacaDuck:
Originally Posted By Undefined:


I like that handguard. Got a link to the product?


Here is the manufacturers store:

Diamondhead V RS-T

Do a web search and you can find it cheaper.


Thanks for the link. I was going to ask that as well. Very nice looking rifle.
MN HTF Mod. / Masonic Mod.
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Link Posted: 7/20/2013 1:41:05 PM EST
Spes mea in Deo est.
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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 7:09:42 AM EST
I had a Saiga 7.62x39mm, but decided to go with AR because of 300 BLK.

Reasons:

The modularity of the AR and the availability of parts due to numerous AR mfg and suppliers.

Except for the stripped lower, which can be easily removed and isolated, all other parts of the AR are not regulated and can be easily bought, sold and traded without regulation (at least in the free states of the U.S.)

AR have feeding issues with 7.62x39mm.

I want to hand load a majority of my ammo and not be dependent on ammo supplies.

Wider range of loading supplies available for 300 BLK.

300 BLK use commonly available .308 bullets. (7.62x39mm uses less common .311 bullets.)

Supplies of brass for 300 BLK are virtually endless (made from .223 and 5.56 brass).

Supplies of 7.62x39mm brass are almost non-existent.

Imported (i.e. cheap) 7.62x39mm could get regulated out of existence.
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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 7:38:44 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2013 7:42:44 AM EST by peligro113]
These 7.62x39 cost me a whopping $7.40 per 20 rounds to load. I could even reload steel cases if I wanted but I haven't had a need to.




I can load the equivalent for 300 blackout for about the same or a little more depending on what the bullets cost me, so it's a wash.

Just do what I did and get both.
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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 7:41:09 AM EST
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Originally Posted By tc2k11:
Everything the same as for 5.56x45 except the barrel.

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Cross-platform gun database/electronic bound book (v1.3.2) (and the original thread).
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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 8:01:28 AM EST

Our 7.62 load out suits us just fine. Sgl-21. Add 6x optic to the party and it shoots like that with golden tiger ammo.




By the way. My wife shot this group. She is a much better rest shooter then I am.



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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 8:05:44 AM EST
I already had an .223 SBR that I wasn't shooting much, so I bought a 300 BLK upper, and now I shoot that all the time.

110gr V-max is awesome on varments, even out of an 8" barrel.

Never had an interest in 762x39.
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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 8:06:01 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Howie_Phelterbush:


no it doesn't. 7.62x39 operates at lower pressures.

you see broken AR bolts in the size usually because they are being used with 6.5 grendal which operates at higher pressures.
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Originally Posted By Howie_Phelterbush:
Originally Posted By jjwheeler2:
Originally Posted By injun-ear:
Originally Posted By Dannofree:
Straighter case walls.


Straighter walls is a good thing? Doesn't a tapered pin (cartridge) fit into a tapered hole (chamber) far easier and more reliably than a straight pin into a straight hole? What am I not getting? ...Maybe straight magazines operate more reliably than curved ones?


however more case tape also equals more bolt thrust causing more broken bolts which is also exaggerated by the extra material removed from the bolt due tote larger case head.


no it doesn't. 7.62x39 operates at lower pressures.

you see broken AR bolts in the size usually because they are being used with 6.5 grendal which operates at higher pressures.


None of this is a challenge to either of you. I'm trying to wrap my head around the "higher thrust" point that until now I haven't considered in design.

One way or another, it isn't taper that causes higher thrust (actually an impulse load isn't it?), but the maximum OD of the case...right? The point he makes is that to have taper, the OD of the case has to be bigger at the head, and this bigger OD is a bigger piston--more area for the pressure to push against....right?

P.S.

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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 3:45:17 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Bullet_:


Found it.

http://youtu.be/Dq2TjenPWmQ
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Originally Posted By Bullet_:
Originally Posted By wunbadweel:
Originally Posted By Bullet_:

Yup.
The bullet will get shoved in the case if the crimp isn't tight.
I'll dig up the youtube vid that shows how easy it is to do and post it here.


Loose crimp and very short loaded case length with short, light projectiles, gorilla punch on the forward assist....yeah, it could happen.
Much as a .40 S&W can fire out of a .45 ACP barrel, but with much less tragic results.

Originally Posted By molardog:
[>:/P
Originally Posted By Bullet_:
300 BLK is far superior at blowing up 5.56 rifles than 7.62x39 because 300blk will chamber into and fire in a 5.56 rifle.

Other than that, 300blk does nothing better than 7.62x39.




Found it.

http://youtu.be/Dq2TjenPWmQ



Who would Not crimp a hand-load rifle bullet?

Additionally for situational awareness purposes I use a separate color/type of mag for the 300 vs the 223.


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Link Posted: 7/21/2013 6:36:49 PM EST
Straight wall cases last longer. I load for single shots. Not auto. Pressure and bolt thrust are not equal. More taper, more thrust. More thrust = more pounding to platform. I load for both but prefer 300blk.
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