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Eric_Mayer
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:39:44 AM
We had a few threads about this, but they have since been archived. The .17 Winchester Super Magnum ammunition is now shipping, as well as the new Savage B.MAG rifle.

To fill in some whom may have missed the past threads, this is a new cartridge created by Winchester that claims to shoot a 20 grain V-Max at 3000 fps and a 25 grain V-Max at 2600 fps!

Here are some photos and a link to my full report from back in January 2013, after the SHOT Show:







The ammo I just received today (the rifle will hit my FFL next week as well):



Lastly, here is a link to the full gallery of pictures I took at SHOT:
http://www.varminter.com/17-winchester-super-magnum-and-the-savage-bmag-rifle-image-gallery/
-------------
The reaction to this release seems to be big. The guns and ammo that has shown up at retailers are selling quickly. One retailer sold 88 of the Savage B.MAGs in 2.5 days!

I am heading out to shoot some Prairie Dogs with the combo once I have everything all set.

Has anyone received theirs yet?

Eric



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King_Mud
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:41:06 AM
Never heard of it but it looks kinda neat. How pricey is ammo?

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Cypher15
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:41:24 AM
i want an AR upper in that caliber
Coyote with 40 people crammed into a minivan gets into a chase with DPS, Paco over estimates his driving abilities and *whmmo!* the Astrovan of Immigration becomes a Pinata of Pain, hurling broken bodies like so many tasty pieces of cheap candy...
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:43:53 AM
Originally Posted By King_Mud:
Never heard of it but it looks kinda neat. How pricey is ammo?

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yea, how much? that'll make it or break it for me.
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FDrifting
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:46:09 AM
Originally Posted By Cypher15:
i want an AR upper in that caliber


fuckkkk yesss.


what's the price on the rifle and/or ammo? i've been dying for a .22 but might jump on this instead.
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Eric_Mayer
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:46:22 AM
If you are eventually able to get it from a large retailer, it is only $15.00 to $16.00 a box of 50. The Savage B.MAGs are at $350 MSRP, but I got mine for $300.00 before the "rush". I have a few others on pre-order as well.

It is affordable and should be a great rimfire/varmint caliber for folks who do not reload!

Eric
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staringback05
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:47:36 AM
[Last Edit: 6/29/2013 12:48:41 AM by staringback05]
who carries them
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FDrifting
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:48:27 AM
Originally Posted By Eric_Mayer:
If you are eventually able to get it from a large retailer, it is only $15.00 to $16.00 a box of 50. The Savage B.MAGs are at $350 MSRP, but I got mine for $300.00 before the "rush". I have a few others on pre-order as well.

It is affordable and should be a great rimfire/varmint caliber for folks who do not reload!

Eric


damn i think i want one.

where did you order yours?
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Armed_RN
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:49:04 AM
Sold 88 in 2.5 days? Sure it wasn't 87?

Sounds neat for yotes. Cool.
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:49:11 AM
Plans for a left-handed B-Mag?
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:50:34 AM
I would buy it but with only super and magnum it lacks description . It it possible to be special or maybe duper added so that I get the extra power of death .

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Eric_Mayer
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Posted: 6/29/2013 12:51:17 AM
All I can say is to check with your LGS. The guy I got one of mine from is in PA, but he is out. The ones on Gunbroker are going for a more than I am willing to pay. The ammo on GB is crazy, but that is to be expected with a new round.

Btw, Volquartsen is working on a rifle as well!

Eric
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Macker13
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Posted: 6/29/2013 1:13:05 AM
What brass is that necked down from? Centerfire means no varmint hunting at night here in Michigan. Looks like a pretty neat caliber, might be the ultimate tweener gun.
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Posted: 6/29/2013 1:18:24 AM
Originally Posted By Macker13:
What brass is that necked down from? Centerfire means no varmint hunting at night here in Michigan. Looks like a pretty neat caliber, might be the ultimate tweener gun.


Nail gun
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Posted: 6/29/2013 10:11:08 AM
Originally Posted By Macker13:
What brass is that necked down from? Centerfire means no varmint hunting at night here in Michigan. Looks like a pretty neat caliber, might be the ultimate tweener gun.


It's rimfire.

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Posted: 6/29/2013 10:20:45 AM


Cypher15
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Posted: 6/29/2013 3:09:06 PM
whoa
Coyote with 40 people crammed into a minivan gets into a chase with DPS, Paco over estimates his driving abilities and *whmmo!* the Astrovan of Immigration becomes a Pinata of Pain, hurling broken bodies like so many tasty pieces of cheap candy...
Stitches1974
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Posted: 7/1/2013 1:55:50 PM
Thanks again, Eric. I greatly appreciate all of your help in answering all my questions and helping me find a rifle. Now, the wait begins for it to arrive at my FFL.
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Eric_Mayer
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:11:20 PM
No problem!

Eric
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SHOOTIST
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:42:46 PM
Does the round fit in the Ruger .22 magnum rotary magazine? I have a Ruger .17 HMR lever action and it would be neat to be able to buy a barrel and use the new ammo.
shack357
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:43:46 PM
One arrived at the Mason City Walmart today. $297. Rifle looks like a mini Savage Axis.
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:46:44 PM
Is the the answer to a question nobody asked?
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BoxofRox
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:48:10 PM
Awesome, hopefully ammo won't be too wild. I'll definitely be grabbing one if I can afford to feed it.
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Stitches1974
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:50:22 PM
[Last Edit: 7/3/2013 10:52:23 PM by Stitches1974]
Originally Posted By SHOOTIST:
Does the round fit in the Ruger .22 magnum rotary magazine? I have a Ruger .17 HMR lever action and it would be neat to be able to buy a barrel and use the new ammo.


I'm going to have to say no. The 17WSM is a necked down .27 case.



I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:51:02 PM
Originally Posted By BoxofRox:
Awesome, hopefully ammo won't be too wild. I'll definitely be grabbing one if I can afford to feed it.


$15.00 a box for 50 on average.

I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:52:54 PM
[Last Edit: 7/3/2013 10:54:15 PM by KTMsx]
Sorry, I just don't get it. What is the benefit?
What does it do better than .223?

ETA: will it punch through armor? Seems a lit like the 5.7 round....
BobRoberts
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:53:51 PM
[Last Edit: 7/3/2013 10:57:10 PM by BobRoberts]
Originally Posted By Blake:
Is the the answer to a question nobody asked?


really? Why is it then anytime that something new is produced, that there is always someone who breaks out this worn out phrase. The very fact that the guns and ammo are selling indicates that for many people that it in fact fills a need of the theirs. A rimfire that combines the best attributes of the 22 mag and 17 hmr, two very popular rounds, why the fuck would anyone want that, thats just tarded.

Seriously, it should make a great varmint or target round. The velocity should put it into the realm of humanly harvesting coyotes, which a 22 mag will do, but a 17 wont. Wow that took 3 fucking seconds to think a couple of reasons for this round. And it will do it for less than low weight varmint 223 and with a lighter set-up. Explore the many horizons of shooting, you just might grow a bit.
"George said "TAX? Fuck that, I THE FUCKING MAN!" Then took a bunch of shots of the whiskey he made himself and shot King George in the goddamned face." -RustedAce
Stitches1974
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:55:46 PM
Originally Posted By KTMsx:
Sorry, I just don't get it. What is the benefit?
What does it do better than .223?



I don't think it's ment to be compaired to a .223. It looks like the best of both worlds if a 22 mag and 17 HMR had kids.

I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
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Posted: 7/3/2013 10:58:42 PM
[Last Edit: 7/3/2013 11:00:09 PM by TerryC]
Originally Posted By Stitches1974:
Originally Posted By SHOOTIST:
Does the round fit in the Ruger .22 magnum rotary magazine? I have a Ruger .17 HMR lever action and it would be neat to be able to buy a barrel and use the new ammo.


I'm going to have to say no. The 17WSM is a necked down .27 case.

http://www.huntingclub.com/Portals/0/uploadedimages/Gun%20Blog/22.22WMR.17%20HMR.17WSMs..jpg



I was just looking at a pic of the 5mm Remington, and thinking along the same lines.

Definitely looked bigger in diameter than a .22 WRFM case in the photos . . .

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Stitches1974
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:00:17 PM
Originally Posted By BobRoberts:


The velocity should put it into the realm of humanly harvesting coyotes, which a 22 mag will do, but a 17 wont.



Yep, the ammo box lists coyote and varment. My rifle should arrive next week. I just need to find some ammo for it. Both are selling like hotcakes.

I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:00:45 PM
I'm kinda wondering how loud it is. Definitely interested though.
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Stitches1974
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:02:36 PM
Originally Posted By EFB16ACRX:
I'm kinda wondering how loud it is. Definitely interested though.


PM the OP. He's fired it and has been really helpful in answering all my questions about it.

I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:04:10 PM
Originally Posted By BobRoberts:
Originally Posted By Blake:
Is the the answer to a question nobody asked?


really? Why is it then anytime that something new is produced, that there is always someone who breaks out this worn out phrase. The very fact that the guns and ammo are selling indicates that for many people that it in fact fills a need of the theirs. A rimfire that combines the best attributes of the 22 mag and 17 hmr, two very popular rounds, why the fuck would anyone want that, thats just tarded.

Seriously, it should make a great varmint or target round. The velocity should put it into the realm of humanly harvesting coyotes, which a 22 mag will do, but a 17 wont. Wow that took 3 fucking seconds to think a couple of reasons for this round. And it will do it for less than low weight varmint 223 and with a lighter set-up. Explore the many horizons of shooting, you just might grow a bit.


I am sure hunters in states that only allow rimfire after dark don't think it is worthless.
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:09:58 PM
Originally Posted By KTMsx:
Sorry, I just don't get it. What is the benefit?
What does it do better than .223?


Can you find .223 varmint loads for $15/50?

No?
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:18:24 PM
[Last Edit: 7/3/2013 11:20:43 PM by DaveS]
Originally Posted By Blake:
Is the the answer to a question nobody asked?


Plenty of paragraphs written on it... even with the graphs pictures,
I see it has you stumped.

Your avatar fits.

I want one in a Remington 597 model with 10, 20 and 30rd alloy mags.

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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:29:44 PM
First off, anyone who thinks of a .22 magnum as a coyote round, doesn't actually shoot many coyotes. I "guess" it's only saving grace is that it's a rimfire...so for those who want to hunt at night, sure, it's an option. Regardless, if it gets you guys excited, then great.
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:47:55 PM
Originally Posted By BobRoberts:
Originally Posted By Blake:
Is the the answer to a question nobody asked?


really? Why is it then anytime that something new is produced, that there is always someone who breaks out this worn out phrase. The very fact that the guns and ammo are selling indicates that for many people that it in fact fills a need of the theirs. A rimfire that combines the best attributes of the 22 mag and 17 hmr, two very popular rounds, why the fuck would anyone want that, thats just tarded.

Seriously, it should make a great varmint or target round. The velocity should put it into the realm of humanly harvesting coyotes, which a 22 mag will do, but a 17 wont. Wow that took 3 fucking seconds to think a couple of reasons for this round. And it will do it for less than low weight varmint 223 and with a lighter set-up. Explore the many horizons of shooting, you just might grow a bit.


The fact that people are buying it is not proof of anything other than good marketing.


Why would anyone use a .17 anything to hunt coyotes? If it will do the same thing a 22 mag will do what makes it better other than some graphs and stats that may not mean anything in the real world?

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BobRoberts
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Posted: 7/3/2013 11:59:24 PM
Originally Posted By macpherson:
Originally Posted By BobRoberts:
Originally Posted By Blake:
Is the the answer to a question nobody asked?


really? Why is it then anytime that something new is produced, that there is always someone who breaks out this worn out phrase. The very fact that the guns and ammo are selling indicates that for many people that it in fact fills a need of the theirs. A rimfire that combines the best attributes of the 22 mag and 17 hmr, two very popular rounds, why the fuck would anyone want that, thats just tarded.

Seriously, it should make a great varmint or target round. The velocity should put it into the realm of humanly harvesting coyotes, which a 22 mag will do, but a 17 wont. Wow that took 3 fucking seconds to think a couple of reasons for this round. And it will do it for less than low weight varmint 223 and with a lighter set-up. Explore the many horizons of shooting, you just might grow a bit.


The fact that people are buying it is not proof of anything other than good marketing.


Why would anyone use a .17 anything to hunt coyotes? If it will do the same thing a 22 mag will do what makes it better other than some graphs and stats that may not mean anything in the real world?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


A round that has better markedly better BC, muzzle velocity and energy retention than 22 mag is somehow good marketing? It should do everything the 22 mag does with the excellent accuracy of the 17 hmr. How is this a bad thing? It should prove plenty capable of taking coyotes, or a myriad of other small game.
"George said "TAX? Fuck that, I THE FUCKING MAN!" Then took a bunch of shots of the whiskey he made himself and shot King George in the goddamned face." -RustedAce
Eric_Mayer
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Posted: 7/4/2013 12:16:36 AM
I have killed 100's of coyotes with a .17 Remington. If you want to save fur, the 17 caliber is the way to go. We will see if the 25 grain V-Max offering at 2600 feet per second will be good for coyote sized animals. There are lots of areas in the US that you cannot hunt with centerfires at night or during the deer season (without a tag for the area), so those folks are going to pick these rifles up.

I am going to use this round mainly on Prairie Dogs, California Ground Squirrels and Jack Rabbits. Do I need another rimfire? No. But no one really needs more than a few guns, so that is a silly argument.

The cartridge itself is running about 33,000 pounds of pressure, so it cannot be used in every 17HMR or 22 Magnum rifle with a barrel change. Ironically, this is the same issue the 5mm Remington Rimfire Magnum had when it was released. Savage built this B.MAG rifle specifically for this round. They stated to me at SHOT that they will be chambering other calibers in the same gun, so we will see what happens.

Ammo is $14 to $16 a box. I just got some from a major retailer and they were $15.00 a box of #50.

I hope that answers some questions!

Eric
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9mmRandy
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Posted: 7/4/2013 12:29:07 AM

$1.50 a round on GB
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Posted: 7/4/2013 12:31:45 AM
Looks great if the following apply:
-you don't want to reload
- want near centerfire power at lower cost than factory centerfire and/or lower hassle than reloaded centerfire
-you want to hunt varmints, but can't use a centerfire for legal reasons

If they can keep prices consistent with .17HMR ammo, it could do well.
For non-reloaders, there's not a lot available in good bullet varmint ammo between $15 per 50 for 17 WSM, and about $40 per 50 for centerfire varmint ammo.


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Posted: 7/4/2013 12:39:36 AM
Originally Posted By Eric_Mayer:
I have killed 100's of coyotes with a .17 Remington. If you want to save fur, the 17 caliber is the way to go. We will see if the 25 grain V-Max offering at 2600 feet per second will be good for coyote sized animals. There are lots of areas in the US that you cannot hunt with centerfires at night or during the deer season (without a tag for the area), so those folks are going to pick these rifles up.

I am going to use this round mainly on Prairie Dogs, California Ground Squirrels and Jack Rabbits. Do I need another rimfire? No. But no one really needs more than a few guns, so that is a silly argument.

The cartridge itself is running about 33,000 pounds of pressure, so it cannot be used in every 17HMR or 22 Magnum rifle with a barrel change. Ironically, this is the same issue the 5mm Remington Rimfire Magnum had when it was released. Savage built this B.MAG rifle specifically for this round. They stated to me at SHOT that they will be chambering other calibers in the same gun, so we will see what happens.

Ammo is $14 to $16 a box. I just got some from a major retailer and they were $15.00 a box of #50.

I hope that answers some questions!

Eric


I was just on the Ruger website, looking at the 77/22 Hornet and wondering if it would be a candidate for the new round. It's a pretty stout action, not sure if it's that strong.



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Posted: 7/4/2013 12:53:35 AM
Originally Posted By Blake:
First off, anyone who thinks of a .22 magnum as a coyote round, doesn't actually shoot many coyotes. I "guess" it's only saving grace is that it's a rimfire...so for those who want to hunt at night, sure, it's an option. Regardless, if it gets you guys excited, then great.


Nobody has BEEFED- UP the 22mag yet. It will come. Hmmm, 45gr.@ 3000+ BUT it still won't kill the 223 Rem.
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Posted: 7/4/2013 1:08:11 AM
Using the big nail gun blank as a parent case was damn smart. They already make those by the gazillion.
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Posted: 7/4/2013 8:48:06 AM
[Last Edit: 7/4/2013 8:49:33 AM by Stitches1974]
Originally Posted By TerryC:

I was just on the Ruger website, looking at the 77/22 Hornet and wondering if it would be a candidate for the new round. It's a pretty stout action, not sure if it's that strong.






Skip to 2:48. He touches on the topic a little bit.





I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
Stitches1974
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Posted: 7/4/2013 8:56:50 AM
Originally Posted By 9mmRandy:

$1.50 a round on GB


What do you expect from GunJoker.

I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
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Posted: 7/4/2013 8:59:08 AM
I will be getting one for sure .....Im exited about the caliber and its varmint possibilities
Very impressive stats , thanks for those charts .

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Posted: 7/4/2013 9:11:58 AM
Originally Posted By ultramagbrion:
I will be getting one for sure .....Im exited about the caliber and its varmint possibilities
Very impressive stats , thanks for those charts .



If you want 1 now, there's a guy on GB that has 5 reserves left for $349.No bidding, just a flat price. The rifles are supposed to be delivered tomorrow. That's where the OP and myself ordered from.

I thought I knew how scary the US .mil was, then I saw the tank-icon dogpiles in the pit.

Scarier than fucking nuclear weapons. 36_gauge
rojotx
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Posted: 7/4/2013 9:15:31 AM
Originally Posted By KTMsx:
Sorry, I just don't get it. What is the benefit?
What does it do better than .223?

ETA: will it punch through armor? Seems a lit like the 5.7 round....


Around here....the 17 HMR is perfect for prairie dog hunting. The 17 can be fired all day long, and prairie dogs didn't get scared off. (not a loud round)
1 shot from a centerfire rifle, prairie dogs stay in the holes for the rest of the day.

17 HMR until the wind blows, then 1 shot with a 204 Ruger...the day is done.
CarbineDad
Rust Never Sleeps - ARFName 'Sack'
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Posted: 7/4/2013 9:18:23 AM
That looks like a caliber that would actually be in stock at my local Walmart
Remember, never take no cutoffs and hurry along as fast as you can. - Virginia Reed

Laphroaig and Rocky Patels "The ARFCOM booze fairy drops it off. Picture Ron Jeremy in a tutu. " -- capnrob97
Eric802
It's not the years, it's the miles...
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Posted: 7/4/2013 9:22:43 AM
What's the difference between this and all the other .17's out there? Just the muzzle velocity?
I have to return some videos.

The 2nd Amendment doesn't say "...unless some guy with spiders in his brain shoots up a school."
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