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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:55:04 AM EDT
[#1]
The SR15 bolt is good for 25k rounds.
So yeah, That is better than the AR and U.S. Made. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:55:20 AM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Anyone have their bolt break at 8k rounds? I have worn out a barrel, an extractor, gas rings on a bolt. But I have yet to have a bolt break or chip on me. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:55:24 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
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Realistically, there's no real innovation in the Tavor over a SteyrAUG from the 1970s From the reviews I watched on youtube they say the trigger and the ejection is better. Possible the trigger might be slightly better (not aware of any ejection problems with the AUG). My point is merely that there's nothing NEW in the design or operation of the Tavor. The only real innovation in bullpup design over the past 30 years has been the FN2000. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:55:42 AM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: "Mil-Spec" is the worst thing that has ever happened to AR15 bolt life. Mil-spec is best-spec  According to the .PPT done by socom a heavy use M4A1 bolt is good for 6,000 rounds. Yet you never hear of a AK shearing lugs, not only that but bulgarian barrels are rated for 15,000 rounds in full auto. If the bullet hardly makes contact with an oversized barrel, a Bulgarian barrel will last forever. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:56:03 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you would get out of your basement and pick up a REAL AK, not the one's made in semi for the AMERICAN market, you would not trust the damn thing not to blow up on you. They are junk. We got trolls from both side now  Que up some dueling banjos? |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:56:10 AM EDT
[#6]
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:56:14 AM EDT
[#7]
In on drama.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:56:27 AM EDT
[#8]
Thank you OP, I was not aware that my AR is almost worn out.
I was lubing it the other day and it looked fine...you may have saved my life. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:57:20 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Realistically, there's no real innovation in the Tavor over a SteyrAUG from the 1970s From the reviews I watched on youtube they say the trigger and the ejection is better. Possible the trigger might be slightly better (not aware of any ejection problems with the AUG). My point is merely that there's nothing NEW in the design or operation of the Tavor. The only real innovation in bullpup design over the past 30 years has been the FN2000. The ejection is really only an issue for lefty shooters. I can post the video if you want. Wolf .223 is not great but normal 5.56 is great for lefties. ETA 
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:57:24 AM EDT
[#10]
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SCAR? ACR? Only difference between the AK-12 and an AKM is the stocks and a rail system. Oh yea scar is so american  Depends on your definition I guess. FN may not originally be American, but FNH USA is and they're the company producing it. Guess who they designed it for? Guess where it's made? There is also a colt canada, does that mean that colt is now canadian? i see your point though. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:57:30 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
OP prepare your anus, ARF is coming in dry. LMFAO I rost 
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:59:08 AM EDT
[#12]
This IMO is a huge improvement over the AR15. If only a big company could adopt it and pump them out like a raped ape.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:59:12 AM EDT
[#13]
I carefully monitor my round count. At 9,999 I leave it with just 1 round in the middle of the hood. When that gang banger goes to shoot some baby-momma it goes BOOM.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:59:45 AM EDT
[#14]
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you would get out of your basement and pick up a REAL AK, not the one's made in semi for the AMERICAN market, you would not trust the damn thing not to blow up on you. They are junk. We got trolls from both side now Having fired REAL AK's in use in Columbia, Guatemala and Honduras, I stand by my statement. you are lucky if the magazine stays in the weapon when firing bursts. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 8:59:54 AM EDT
[#15]
i used to own an AK
and now i only own AR-15 rifle AR-22 pistol AR-22 Recce rifle and working on my next AR projector 
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:00:06 AM EDT
[#16]
The AK-12 is nothing more than an AK-74 with some 1913 rails machined into its components. Yeah, that's some real ground breaking innovation there. So much that the Russian military wouldn't adopt it and it is known to have some significant operating defects. The AK-12 is basically a Tapco fucked AK-74 done on the cheap by a Russian arms maker. I will take the AR/M16 platform any day. It is battlefield proven and has been refined by numerous private enterprises in the US.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:00:48 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
meanwhile they developed the AK-12 making it as ergonomic... That rattletrap piece of shit is less ergonomic than the garbage can in which it belongs
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:02:34 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you would get out of your basement and pick up a REAL AK, not the one's made in semi for the AMERICAN market, you would not trust the damn thing not to blow up on you. They are junk. We got trolls from both side now Que up some dueling banjos?
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:02:47 AM EDT
[#19]
The AR is the best weapon available. Period.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:02:51 AM EDT
[#20]
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meanwhile they developed the AK-12 making it as ergonomic... That rattletrap piece of shit is less ergonomic than the garbage can in which it belongsThis reminds of of RustedAce's thread about a fair discussion of ar vs ak.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:03:32 AM EDT
[#21]
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SCAR? ACR? Only difference between the AK-12 and an AKM is the stocks and a rail system. Oh yea scar is so american Depends on your definition I guess. FN may not originally be American, but FNH USA is and they're the company producing it. Guess who they designed it for? Guess where it's made? There is also a colt canada, does that mean that colt is now canadian? i see your point though. Maybe, it is pronounced Eh Ar 15, right?  Line's start to blur.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:04:13 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
The AK-12 is nothing more than an AK-74 with some 1913 rails machined into its components. Yeah, that's some real ground breaking innovation there. So much that the Russian military wouldn't adopt it and it is known to have some significant operating defects. The AK-12 is basically a Tapco fucked AK-74 done on the cheap by a Russian arms maker. I will take the AR/M16 platform any day. It is battlefield proven and has been refined by numerous private enterprises in the US. So youll take a weapon requirin overhaul every 6,000 rounds accordin to SOCOM and heavy amounts of lubricant over a 5.56 AK with 25,000+ parts life requiring little lubricant? |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:04:14 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you would get out of your basement and pick up a REAL AK, not the one's made in semi for the AMERICAN market, you would not trust the damn thing not to blow up on you. They are junk. We got trolls from both side now Having fired REAL AK's in use in Columbia, Guatemala and Honduras, I stand by my statement. you are lucky if the magazine stays in the weapon when firing bursts. I take back my troll comment. My experience with real full auto AK' s was quite pleasant, but I was in eastern europe. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:07:49 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The AK-12 is nothing more than an AK-74 with some 1913 rails machined into its components. Yeah, that's some real ground breaking innovation there. So much that the Russian military wouldn't adopt it and it is known to have some significant operating defects. The AK-12 is basically a Tapco fucked AK-74 done on the cheap by a Russian arms maker. I will take the AR/M16 platform any day. It is battlefield proven and has been refined by numerous private enterprises in the US. So youll take a weapon requirin overhaul every 6,000 rounds accordin to SOCOM and heavy amounts of lubricant over a 5.56 AK with 25,000+ parts life requiring little lubricant? Yes |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:07:51 AM EDT
[#25]
Nope, we also have the AR-10
When you really feel the need to reach out and touch someone. TXL |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:09:23 AM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
The SR15 bolt is good for 25k rounds. So yeah, That is better than the AR and U.S. Made. Isnt 25k just the factory warranty even? I've yet to ever hear of a case where an e3 bolt was broken |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:11:22 AM EDT
[#27]
Pretty sure I've passed 6k on one of my ARs and no sign of a bolt issue. I've never even heard of this BS before.
I believe the comment on Mil-Spec being the worst thing to happen to the AR is directed at .gov not allowing improvements in the design and people believing if it isn't exactly mil-spec (a minimum spec), its junk. Things like advanced coatings on the BCGs, or better triggers, stocks, flash hiders, ect. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:11:32 AM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
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The SR15 bolt is good for 25k rounds. So yeah, That is better than the AR and U.S. Made. Isnt 25k just the factory warranty even? I've yet to ever hear of a case where an e3 bolt was broken And how many are out there? 10 or so? Vs the #1 weapon in the world? Yet you never hear of AK bolts breaking even 60yr old ones. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:12:20 AM EDT
[#29]
oh so in for this one. this should be good.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:13:08 AM EDT
[#30]
I did a long-term test on my Bushmaster AR15 a few years ago. It went about two years and 3,000 rounds of ammunition before there were any stoppages of any kind.
The AR15 is plenty good enough for me. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:13:13 AM EDT
[#31]
I'm to the point where I'd rather see an 88 thread as opposed to a 13 thread.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:14:51 AM EDT
[#32]
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"Mil-Spec" is the worst thing that has ever happened to AR15 bolt life. Would love some elaboration on this. Not going to defend the existing state of things but would like to understand. Mil-spec is nothing more the the minimum amount nessicary to meet military specifications. Contracts go to the lowest bidder (usually). The lowest bidder makes the lowest bid by making something .001% above the failure rate that's acceptable. Mil-spec basially means make it as shitty as possible but still just above a certian standard. There are TONS of parts that are not "mil-spec" due to the testing required, but those parts outlive and out perform mil-spec parts. Yet at least 90% of AR owners/shooter/enthusists think anything that's not mil-spec is crap, when in reality it's often the other way around. Now get your ass over to the SP shack and get me some MIL-SPEC K-9-P !! |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:17:18 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
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"Mil-Spec" is the worst thing that has ever happened to AR15 bolt life. Would love some elaboration on this. Not going to defend the existing state of things but would like to understand. Mil-spec is nothing more the the minimum amount nessicary to meet military specifications. Contracts go to the lowest bidder (usually). The lowest bidder makes the lowest bid by making something .001% above the failure rate that's acceptable. Mil-spec basially means make it as shitty as possible but still just above a certian standard. There are TONS of parts that are not "mil-spec" due to the testing required, but those parts outlive and out perform mil-spec parts. Yet at least 90% of AR owners/shooter/enthusists think anything that's not mil-spec is crap, when in reality it's often the other way around. Now get your ass over to the SP shack and get me some MIL-SPEC K-9-P !! And milslec calls for 800MRBS and 3000MRBEFF, yep milspec is great. Ill stick to proven systems that outlast most people vs one that craps out every 3 months to a heavy shooter. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:19:02 AM EDT
[#34]
Settled. Once and for all.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:20:10 AM EDT
[#35]
Milspec needs to be at a minimum 6,000 MRBS and 20,000 MRBEFF maybe the. We would get some true innovation in guns not just lets make more and more M4 clones.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:20:13 AM EDT
[#36]
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The SR15 bolt is good for 25k rounds. So yeah, That is better than the AR and U.S. Made. Isnt 25k just the factory warranty even? I've yet to ever hear of a case where an e3 bolt was broken And how many are out there? 10 or so? Vs the #1 weapon in the world? Yet you never hear of AK bolts breaking even 60yr old ones. I'd say there are significantly more sr15 &sr16s than ak12s in the world |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:20:13 AM EDT
[#37]
10000 rounds...hahahaha
OP, i guess you never heard of the Filthy 14. 
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:21:38 AM EDT
[#38]
The irony of the AK-12 is that US made slap on attachments for the ak74 are more usable and truer to the base design then the ak12
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:23:47 AM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The AK-12 is nothing more than an AK-74 with some 1913 rails machined into its components. Yeah, that's some real ground breaking innovation there. So much that the Russian military wouldn't adopt it and it is known to have some significant operating defects. The AK-12 is basically a Tapco fucked AK-74 done on the cheap by a Russian arms maker. I will take the AR/M16 platform any day. It is battlefield proven and has been refined by numerous private enterprises in the US. So youll take a weapon requirin overhaul every 6,000 rounds accordin to SOCOM and heavy amounts of lubricant over a 5.56 AK with 25,000+ parts life requiring little lubricant? How exactly does a recommendation for replacing parts after a certain round count make it inferior? If Ferrari says to change the oil in a car every 3,000 miles but my Toyota says 5,000 miles does that make it better? The round count in a barrel will begin to effect accuracy over time, its just a matter of physics. So if SOCOM recommends a barrel change its because they want to keep the gun accurate, not that they aren't capable of going more. The AK never was accurate, so who cares about a barrel change there. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:24:28 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
"Mil-Spec" is the worst thing that has ever happened to AR15 bolt life. Would love some elaboration on this. Not going to defend the existing state of things but would like to understand. Mil-spec is nothing more the the minimum amount nessicary to meet military specifications. Contracts go to the lowest bidder (usually). The lowest bidder makes the lowest bid by making something .001% above the failure rate that's acceptable. Mil-spec basially means make it as shitty as possible but still just above a certian standard. There are TONS of parts that are not "mil-spec" due to the testing required, but those parts outlive and out perform mil-spec parts. Yet at least 90% of AR owners/shooter/enthusists think anything that's not mil-spec is crap, when in reality it's often the other way around. Now get your ass over to the SP shack and get me some MIL-SPEC K-9-P !! That's about what I suspected. After learning of the EAG/BCM Filthy Fourteen I started to wonder what all the hubub was about. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:25:24 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
This IMO is a huge improvement over the AR15. If only a big company could adopt it and pump them out like a raped ape. http://emptormaven.com/img/Robinson_XCR-L_11inch_SBR.jpg This |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:25:30 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
10000 rounds...hahahaha OP, i guess you never heard of the Filthy 14. Sure have, it broke its first bolt at 16,000 rounds under perfect range conditions and only semi auto fire at a rate of 500 rounds a day....phew thats some tough firin schedule. The barrel made it to 34,000 rounds but was getting 2MOA at 50yrds lol. Again the AK will last practically forever on weak firing schedules and is good for 15,000 rounds of full auto fire. The M4 breaks at 6,000 when subjected to harsh firig schedules. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:25:42 AM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
"Mil-Spec" is the worst thing that has ever happened to AR15 bolt life. Mil-spec is best-spec According to the .PPT done by socom a heavy use M4A1 bolt is good for 6,000 rounds. Yet you never hear of a AK shearing lugs, not only that but bulgarian barrels are rated for 15,000 rounds in full auto.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:26:10 AM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
Realistically, there's no real innovation in the Tavor over a SteyrAUG from the 1970s But the Israelis use it, so it must be the best rifle in existence.
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:26:36 AM EDT
[#45]
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Quoted:
Off we go, into the wild newb yonder.....
Join Date + Post Count + Silly Statement = Blunder of Significant Magnitude |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:26:44 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The AK-12 is nothing more than an AK-74 with some 1913 rails machined into its components. Yeah, that's some real ground breaking innovation there. So much that the Russian military wouldn't adopt it and it is known to have some significant operating defects. The AK-12 is basically a Tapco fucked AK-74 done on the cheap by a Russian arms maker. I will take the AR/M16 platform any day. It is battlefield proven and has been refined by numerous private enterprises in the US. So youll take a weapon requirin overhaul every 6,000 rounds accordin to SOCOM and heavy amounts of lubricant over a 5.56 AK with 25,000+ parts life requiring little lubricant? How exactly does a recommendation for replacing parts after a certain round count make it inferior? If Ferrari says to change the oil in a car every 3,000 miles but my Toyota says 5,000 miles does that make it better? The round count in a barrel will begin to effect accuracy over time, its just a matter of physics. So if SOCOM recommends a barrel change its because they want to keep the gun accurate, not that they aren't capable of going more. The AK never was accurate, so who cares about a barrel change there. According to SOCOM the bolt begins cracking at 3,000-6,000 and will break soon after |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:26:44 AM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
Quoted:
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The SR15 bolt is good for 25k rounds. So yeah, That is better than the AR and U.S. Made. Isnt 25k just the factory warranty even? I've yet to ever hear of a case where an e3 bolt was broken And how many are out there? 10 or so? Vs the #1 weapon in the world? Yet you never hear of AK bolts breaking even 60yr old ones. I worked at an importer for quite some time. Yep, I've seen sheared lugs on factory new AKs. Broken barrel trunnions after a box pf ammo. Gas pistons separated from the carrier. Carrier twisted in the receiver. Sheared lugs were about the worse. Happened on Bulgarian, Hungarian and Russian. |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:29:38 AM EDT
[#48]
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If you would get out of your basement and pick up a REAL AK, not the one's made in semi for the AMERICAN market, you would not trust the damn thing not to blow up on you. They are junk. We got trolls from both side now Having fired REAL AK's in use in Columbia, Guatemala and Honduras, I stand by my statement. you are lucky if the magazine stays in the weapon when firing bursts. So you shot some shit that's been hanging around since the bay of pigs and have probably been finger fucked by half of central and south america so now all AK's are bad juju ?? Riiiiiiiiggght.... |
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:30:13 AM EDT
[#49]
I'm confused, is this thread about parts life of recent improvements upon the ar15/m4/m16 platform or just another ak vs ar thread?
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Posted: 3/5/2013 9:30:51 AM EDT
[#50]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The AK-12 is nothing more than an AK-74 with some 1913 rails machined into its components. Yeah, that's some real ground breaking innovation there. So much that the Russian military wouldn't adopt it and it is known to have some significant operating defects. The AK-12 is basically a Tapco fucked AK-74 done on the cheap by a Russian arms maker. I will take the AR/M16 platform any day. It is battlefield proven and has been refined by numerous private enterprises in the US. So youll take a weapon requirin overhaul every 6,000 rounds accordin to SOCOM and heavy amounts of lubricant over a 5.56 AK with 25,000+ parts life requiring little lubricant? If you're using heavy amounts of lube on your AR, you're doing it wrong. 6-8 drops every 500+ rounds is about all you need. |
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