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Mach
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Posted: 2/16/2013 12:53:11 PM
[Last Edit: 2/19/2013 5:53:58 PM by Mach]
How many feet per second do I need.

I shot him with a single pump .17 pellet pistol and it bounced off him. He was running, it was a great 5 foot shot.

So how many feet per second do I need for a kill?

I don't want to buy one underpowered.
Mach

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BURN
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Posted: 2/16/2013 12:54:48 PM
550 FPS is my minimum for tiny rodent
1Andy2: it's just a question of if we decide to stop throwing coal in the furnace and lean on the brakes or if we're going to blow the boiler up getting to Full Retard'sville.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 12:55:16 PM
600 ft/sec, minimum for a pellet to nail a rat. Larger rats need more energy.
What is wrong? We tolerate mediocrity and call it diversity.
No wonder we are headed to hell on a fast pony.
Mach
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Posted: 2/16/2013 12:56:41 PM
Ok thanks. Off to get one.
Mach

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Posted: 2/16/2013 12:58:35 PM
This is a great excuse to get a suppressed .22
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:00:26 PM
Shot placement. We had angry NYC sewer rat trapped in a room and it took 3 shots from a Beeman P1 magnum to put it down. 3rd shot to the head to keep it from running.
They are tough.
failure at bullet catching
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:00:35 PM
Go to any store that sells pellet rifles and pick out one that advertizes " 1200 " or "1000 " feet per second velocity.

Why?? Because in reality they deliver much less FPS than promised. Generally about 800 fps is what you can expect. This fps will take rats and squirrels consistently.

But a tin ov Crosman hollowpoint pellets . They work the best for rodents. IMO.


Good Hunting.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:02:21 PM
Originally Posted By IFBBjuicemonkey:
This is a great excuse to get a suppressed .22


Yea, except no surpressors in the commie state I live.

I have some .22 shot shell, I just thing the legal fees might be cheaper with a pellet gun.
Mach

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:02:56 PM
Originally Posted By IFBBjuicemonkey:
This is a great excuse to get a suppressed .22


I saw an integrally suppressed pellet rifle at walmart the other day for $100 and claimed1000-1200FPS but was not the Gamo Whisper...

I need to do the research and find out more about it for inner city pigeon control
1Andy2: it's just a question of if we decide to stop throwing coal in the furnace and lean on the brakes or if we're going to blow the boiler up getting to Full Retard'sville.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:03:47 PM
500 fps, quieter than an air gun, and cheaper than buying an air rifle.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:04:53 PM
[Last Edit: 2/19/2013 11:00:49 AM by BURN]
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By IFBBjuicemonkey:
This is a great excuse to get a suppressed .22


Yea, except no surpressors in the commie state I live.

I have some .22 shot shell, I just thing the legal fees might be cheaper with a pellet gun.


small 16" 22lr rifle with Aguila .22 primer only rounds are about550-600 fps and quiet enough for indoor shooting
1Andy2: it's just a question of if we decide to stop throwing coal in the furnace and lean on the brakes or if we're going to blow the boiler up getting to Full Retard'sville.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:08:30 PM
Set it up like this one, get slo mo kill shot and post.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Rp-2_dAJ0k
Mach
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:12:45 PM
Local shop has an Older Crosman 1377 Pistol.


Rated at 600 fps, for $40

Would that work?
Mach

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:23:30 PM
a basic crosman 760 is about 25 bucks new. I've several growing up, and have one now. It is smooth bore, but bb's fly straight enough to hit a coke can at 15 yards. Powerful enough to go through a tin roof with 10 pumps.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:24:35 PM
Originally Posted By ramikin:
500 fps, quieter than an air gun, and cheaper than buying an air rifle.http://www.eabco.com/CartImages/Aguila/SuperColibri.gif


Hmmm.

Quiet enough the neighbors across the street won't think anything?
Mach

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:25:06 PM
You might want to try BB or CB caps out of a rifle. They are virtually noiseless, but pretty potent even with just a primer for propellant. Just be aware they may not be legal for your situation and do have a lot longer range than a pellet.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:26:43 PM
Originally Posted By ramikin:
500 fps, quieter than an air gun, and cheaper than buying an air rifle.http://www.eabco.com/CartImages/Aguila/SuperColibri.gif


Came here to post this... Works for little critters. Birds, mice, rats.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:27:35 PM
Originally Posted By Mach:
How many feet per second do I need.

I shot him with a single pump .17 pellet pistol and it bounced off him. He was running, it was a great 5 foot shot.

So how many feet per second do I need for a kill?

I don't want to buy one underpowered.


No good for rats. Any decent multi-pump will do. I've killed a lot of them with my Daisy 880 at distances from 5 feet to across the yard. It's not as powerful as a break-barrel, but it's powerful enough for the job, accurate, and costs a lot less. And you have a larger selection of scopes to choose from since it doesn't require an air gun scope. All of mine have been one-shot kills.

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:27:48 PM
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By ramikin:
500 fps, quieter than an air gun, and cheaper than buying an air rifle.http://www.eabco.com/CartImages/Aguila/SuperColibri.gif


Hmmm.

Quiet enough the neighbors across the street won't think anything?


Absolutely... they are about pellet gun loud... if the neighbors ask... it's a pellet gun.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:28:10 PM
They really do make less noise than a pellet gun. The person upstairs wouldn't notice.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:28:58 PM
Originally Posted By JM2:
a basic crosman 760 is about 25 bucks new. I've several growing up, and have one now. It is smooth bore, but bb's fly straight enough to hit a coke can at 15 yards. Powerful enough to go through a tin roof with 10 pumps.


Thanks.
Mach

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:30:54 PM
It comes diwn to the legalities.

I am going to get both just in case.

The primer only .22 and a crossman 760
Mach

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:32:55 PM
Originally Posted By YZ250Rider:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By ramikin:
500 fps, quieter than an air gun, and cheaper than buying an air rifle.http://www.eabco.com/CartImages/Aguila/SuperColibri.gif


Hmmm.

Quiet enough the neighbors across the street won't think anything?


Absolutely... they are about pellet gun loud... if the neighbors ask... it's a pellet gun.


Turn on a TV to a shoot-em-up show. They'll never know the difference.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:35:22 PM
[Last Edit: 2/16/2013 1:36:18 PM by Smashy]
If you want to kill rats, I'd avoid a Crosman 760. I've used them and accuracy from the smoothbore barrel isn't that great. A coke can is one thing, a rat is something else. Get a rifled gun and use pellets. Better accuracy and killing power.

ETA: The short pump handle isn't very easy, either.

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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:39:15 PM

Originally Posted By ramikin:
500 fps, quieter than an air gun, and cheaper than buying an air rifle.http://www.eabco.com/CartImages/Aguila/SuperColibri.gif

do you have a supplier?


I have emailed Skelos a Monster.com ad for job listings
no reply yet
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:39:48 PM

Grab the Crossman 1377, fantastic guns, $40 new. On 10 pumps it will put a pellet through a rat. They also make a nice 22 cal version and a 22 cal carbine version.


Skip the single pump and CO2 pistols.


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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:41:19 PM
You may want to just build a rat/mouse trap. [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OijRH-lduq4&hd=1[/youtube]
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:43:12 PM


22 Carbine, with pellets and stock. $87, its a sign! Used to be $67 at walmart.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Crosman-Doomsday-Bug-Out-Survival-Kit/21311833
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:44:53 PM
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:48:58 PM
I have a Crosman 2100 that works well for that. I've taken out many chipmunks and squirrels with it as well. They aren't very expensive either. 725 fps pellet FPS.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:52:11 PM
I got a refurbished gamo whisper I picked up from cabelas for about $120. Thing is deadly on squirrels and birds and pretty fun to shoot.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 1:53:57 PM
[Last Edit: 2/16/2013 1:56:20 PM by WayneG]

Originally Posted By Colonel_Angus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzKZmaMCHKA

Just to make sure everyone knows, night vision is fine on a PCP gun, not on a springer! Spring guns will kill most night vision scopes in relative short order.

Rats can be tough to kill, but if you are shooting indoors you don't want too much power unless you want holes in the walls. BTW, pellets will ricochet, so be careful indoors. Frankly, you're probably better off with traps then with an air gun.

ETA the rifle used in the video is a PCP gun, an AA-S410 in .22, just about 600 fps.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:06:53 PM
Originally Posted By WayneG:

Originally Posted By Colonel_Angus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzKZmaMCHKA

Just to make sure everyone knows, night vision is fine on a PCP gun, not on a springer! Spring guns will kill most night vision scopes in relative short order.

Rats can be tough to kill, but if you are shooting indoors you don't want too much power unless you want holes in the walls. BTW, pellets will ricochet, so be careful indoors. Frankly, you're probably better off with traps then with an air gun.

ETA the rifle used in the video is a PCP gun, an AA-S410 in .22, just about 600 fps.


Springer will kill a night vision scope that uses a tube in short order. Thanks for mentioning that ! In this video the guy is using digital night vision with a IR illuminator. Digital night vision uses no tube at all. They are a good choice for a springer rifle. Very tough and can even be used in daylight. Digital night vision is just like a camera in night mode. They use small CCD chips that are very tough.

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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:15:28 PM

Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By IFBBjuicemonkey:
This is a great excuse to get a suppressed .22


Yea, except no surpressors in the commie state I live.

I have some .22 shot shell, I just thing the legal fees might be cheaper with a pellet gun.

they won't charge you any differently, pellet or 22 it is all the same
I will not Comply
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:19:06 PM
Originally Posted By broken_reticle:


22 Carbine, with pellets and stock. $87, its a sign! Used to be $67 at walmart.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Crosman-Doomsday-Bug-Out-Survival-Kit/21311833


The required pellet gun for this site is for sale at Walmart. My son has one and it's a fun gun. Good accuracy, but only shot at paper so far
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:20:13 PM
Crossman 1322 pistol or 760 pumpmaster I have bagged Rats with both.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:27:28 PM
One of these would be fun.

http://www.amazon.com/IZH-Drozd-Pistol-air-pistol/dp/B004BTNR06/ref=sr_1_3?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1361042790&sr=1-3&keywords=drozd+bb+gun

Not sure if it'd work worth a damn, but it'd be fun to go after rats with.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:29:03 PM
a single pump pellet pistol - sounds like an daisy/avanti target pistol that shoots about 325fps - yep, that would bounce off.

I suspect >500 is a good starting point. There are a few pistols that will do that in .177. I never questioned penetration with my .20 shooting 5-600 fps.

Issues to consider - garbage, I suspect you are in town and probably do not want to be heard (since pretty much every town has an ordnance against this). ok, advising illegal activity is a coc violation.

Pneumatics start with fairly cold compressed air at a relitively low pressure - so they compensate with more air. Louder pop.
Spring Air starts with very hot high pressure air - which uses less air, and it cools as it goes down barrel - less pop.
pcp is something in between as it does start with higher pressure air.
ssp are for target - so they are quiet, but slow.

some spring air's are rated supersonic - they probably lie, are relying on dieseling to pull it off (igniting lubricating oil). You don't want supersonic, not only for the noise, but it will go subsonic and the transition screws up accuracy.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:32:49 PM
fwiw, I have killed a lot of rats with a Rat Zapper. If you want to hunt them, I would use bait and a motion detector (get one that has a radio remote). It will tell you in the other room when there is a target rich environment.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:35:28 PM
Ive used a red ryder bb gun, it stuns them or knocks them out and then you can move in for the decapitation
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Posted: 2/16/2013 2:46:17 PM
Originally Posted By mousehunter:
fwiw, I have killed a lot of rats with a Rat Zapper. If you want to hunt them, I would use bait and a motion detector (get one that has a radio remote). It will tell you in the other room when there is a target rich environment.


this, ..ratzapper is awesome... let the trap do the work... why would one want to hang out in a garage all day waiting to spot one to shoot...
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Posted: 2/16/2013 3:19:47 PM
Originally Posted By WileyCoyote:
Originally Posted By mousehunter:
fwiw, I have killed a lot of rats with a Rat Zapper. If you want to hunt them, I would use bait and a motion detector (get one that has a radio remote). It will tell you in the other room when there is a target rich environment.


this, ..ratzapper is awesome... let the trap do the work... why would one want to hang out in a garage all day waiting to spot one to shoot...


Poor man's sniping

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Posted: 2/16/2013 3:32:16 PM
Originally Posted By nchapa:
Ive used a red ryder bb gun, it stuns them or knocks them out and then you can move in for the decapitation


Nice
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Posted: 2/16/2013 3:32:40 PM
Originally Posted By Mach:
It comes diwn to the legalities.

I am going to get both just in case.

The primer only .22 and a crossman 760


The 760 will work good. I've killed rabbits and muskrats with them.

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Posted: 2/16/2013 3:34:23 PM
I used to kill wood rats with a .177 pump pistol with pellets.

Some of them took more than 1 shot but it got the job done.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 3:35:56 PM
I've used a Crossman single shot .20 pellet gun and the rats were all one shot, one kill.

Took a possum but that took two shots - one out of the tree and one to the noggin'.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 3:40:07 PM
Buy a nice, loud pellet gun, shoot the rats with the CBs, and show the pellet gun to anyone who asks.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 4:16:04 PM
[Last Edit: 2/16/2013 4:18:38 PM by Wingman26]
I can tell you from experience its almost impossible to hit a running rat, they run really fast, and usually from cover to cover, usually they are only out in the open for less than a second. The only people I've seen have success, on YouTube there are lots of videos of hunting rats with air rifles, usually on farms, at night, using night vision sights. The rats will sit still out in the open at night because they normally couldn't be seen, using the night vision they can blow them away.


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Posted: 2/16/2013 4:23:34 PM
[Last Edit: 2/16/2013 4:29:17 PM by Smashy]
Originally Posted By Wingman26:
I can tell you from experience its almost impossible to hit a running rat, they run really fast, and usually from cover to cover, usually they are only out in the open for less than a second. The only people I've seen have success, on YouTube there are lots of videos of hunting rats with air rifles, usually on farms, at night, using night vision sights. The rats will sit still out in the open at night because they normally couldn't be seen, using the night vision they can blow them away.


I use bait, and it works outside in broad daylight. A piece of toast with melted butter on one half and peanut butter on the other half. Along a wall, near one of their entry/exit points, with a rock on it so they can't grab it and run off with it (I learned that one the hard way). Then sit back and wait. The smell is too much to ignore. Usually gets one coming out to investigate within 5-10 minutes. Let them try to grab it the first time and fail and run back in. With that irresistible smell, they'll try again within a minute or two, and they'll take a little more time to try a little harder. That's when you pop 'em.

I eliminated a whole colony of them once that had taken up residence under my back deck with this method, using my scoped Daisy 880.





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Posted: 2/16/2013 4:25:03 PM
[Last Edit: 2/16/2013 4:35:47 PM by tesla120]
Originally Posted By Paul:
I've used a Crossman single shot .20 pellet gun and the rats were all one shot, one kill.

Took a possum but that took two shots - one out of the tree and one to the noggin'.


.20cal pellets are getting harder to find...

I love my Blue Streak pellet gun, it looks awesome, like a real rifle and at 700fps, has a lethal punch.

Downside, its pump, and if you need quick repeating shots, its not what you want.


http://www.midwayusa.com/product/476677/sheridan-blue-streak-air-rifle-20-caliber-wood-stock-blue-barrel

http://www.pyramydair.com/article/Sheridan_Blue_Streak_combo_May_2008/50

ETA: you can put a toilet paper wad in the breech on this, and drop a flechette down the bore, it shoots them like nails, haven't used them for hunting, but I used to shoot them into plywood in the cold months.
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Posted: 2/16/2013 8:23:59 PM
[Last Edit: 2/16/2013 8:24:25 PM by Mach]
I looked at some pellet rifles and decided I want a nice accurate high power one. Decided to buy it online, so I looked for a rat zapper and could not find one so I bought 4 rat traps instead. $8
Mach

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