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JohnSmith6073
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:01:11 PM
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?
BURN
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:02:09 PM
Originally Posted By JohnSmith6073:
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?


what on scene..I do not think so...there was still distance and travel involved
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:04:01 PM
[Last Edit: 12/22/2012 8:04:31 PM by Chaingun]
Where were they and were they the first responders?

I remember with Columbine the first responders set up entry teams. I don't recall an on-campus officer attempting anything, and it would be rather sad if they did nothing
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:06:43 PM
IIRC, One of the biggest parental criticisms of Columbine was that the LEOs stood around outside while carnage was being carried out inside.

CCW inside is part of the solution. IIRC CCW inside is shown to work anecdotally. It is just that the Managed State Media does not have orders to pick up those stories and forward to national attention.

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JohnSmith6073
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:07:41 PM
Columbine school resource officer was at lunch with security officer and engaged one of the murderers but missed. Allegedly put rounds into backstop (library).
DanTSX
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:07:48 PM
This is why we need to arm the teachers instead.

Cops get kept busy doing school cop stuff. Truancy, smoking, checking doors, etc, etc. No issue there, but the likelyhood they are nearby when the balloon goes up is low.
Private sercurity would be like the doofuses you see at the bank.
TSA would.....well, just NO!.


That poor teacher that hid her students and told Lanza that they were in the Gym, had a chance where she could had come up and popped the guy in the face with a Glock 29. Instead she took one for her students. Still a hero, but it's the guns you don't know about......
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:08:39 PM
I've seen that floating around, people seem to think I ran around FT Drum(or insert base here) with my M4,300 rounds and a frag all the time. We have MP's, they cant be everywhere at once. The MP's and DOD police rolled up to the building on Hood and shot him, but it was too late.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:09:26 PM
IIRC, VA Tech campus police was unarmed at the time.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:09:39 PM
Fort Hood; soldiers are not allowed to perform on base duties while armed. The FIRST armed responder stopped the incident. Shcools: It is not a mandatory thing to arm all teachers; but it should be an option when there are children present. Not one responder was armed when the shooting started; only unarmed people who did a MAJOR Ball-check and went in to do what they could. Which was not much.
It takes too friggin' long to respond when things get chaotic. A violence outbreak of any kind is quick as a gasoline fire: The explosion is over usually by the time the fire department shows up. And, so these shootings tend to be the same.
When police DO show up? Often they are a single unit, who WILL WAIT until more support officers show up. Costly seconds are lost, let alone minutes. I do not 'blame' police, they are doing what is prudent per their training. They have a whole host of other things to contend with beyond just stopping a shooter.

The ONLY way is to either meet the violence perpetrator immediately, and stop them by force.... or meet the perp and talk them out of continuing. Good luck with that.
EasTexan
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:10:09 PM
What about the off duty police officer at that church in Utah or Colorado that took out that asshole bent on massacring the congregation?
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:10:54 PM
Originally Posted By DanTSX:
This is why we need to arm the teachers instead.

Cops get kept busy doing school cop stuff. Truancy, smoking, checking doors, etc, etc. No issue there, but the likelyhood they are nearby when the balloon goes up is low.
Private sercurity would be like the doofuses you see at the bank.
TSA would.....well, just NO!.


That poor teacher that hid her students and told Lanza that they were in the Gym, had a chance where she could had come up and popped the guy in the face with a Glock 29. Instead she took one for her students. Still a hero, but it's the guns you don't know about......


Well said. You get it. Let's hope it rubs off on the rest of America.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:10:57 PM
i think only columbine had people in the bldg and they were rent a cops. va tech had campus security and they were nowhere near the shooter although they were on campus...they couldn't even locate cho for two hours until he offed himself. ft hood, they had base security cops but again, nowhere near the scene.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:12:03 PM
Sure. I wouldn't doubt that they had security guards. I seriously doubt that they were armed with anything more than pepper spray or a tazer.
ArmyInfantryVet
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:12:18 PM

Originally Posted By JohnSmith6073:
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?

From what I heard of all those scenes there were no police on the scene.

Unless they are talking about first responders.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:12:25 PM
Neither VT nor Ft had officers in the building. If you recall Hassan was actually confronted and shot by city police, not MPs. Military bases are quite soft in many parts.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:12:32 PM
Originally Posted By Chaingun:
Where were they and were they the first responders?

I remember with Columbine the first responders set up entry teams. I don't recall an on-campus officer attempting anything, and it would be rather sad if they did nothing


There was an guard (retired police officer) on premises who was located at another spot on campus. He was called to the area reported as where the gunfire was at. On arriving he was shot at after exiting the vehicle. He returned fire.


DanTSX
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:12:42 PM
Originally Posted By Wrek:
Sure. I wouldn't doubt that they had security guards. I seriously doubt that they were armed with anything more than pepper spray or a tazer.


They were armed. They even exchanged fire, but beyond the practical reach of their sidearms.
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PogueMahone
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:13:00 PM
Originally Posted By EasTexan:
What about the off duty police officer at that church in Utah or Colorado that took out that asshole bent on massacring the congregation?


damn good counter!
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:14:39 PM
Originally Posted By JohnSmith6073:
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?


The only people who think those facts are important, are those who think all problems in life have black and white solutions. According to their logic, ALL PUBLIC SHOOTINGS play out the exact same way, with no differences. You really shouldn't spend any time trying to argue with those mindsets...they are functional retards. That time would be better spent writing letters to Congress or otherwise engaging in efforts to preserve our rights.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:15:38 PM
[Last Edit: 12/22/2012 8:16:08 PM by ArmyInfantryVet]

Originally Posted By retgarr:
Neither VT nor Ft had officers in the building. If you recall Hassan was actually confronted and shot by city police, not MPs. Military bases are quite soft in many parts.

I was watching MSNBC about the massacre at Newtown. Using the Fort Hood incident as being proof that armed citizens wouldn't have made a difference, saying that Fort Hood was one of the most heavily armed places in the Country.

These idiots have no idea, that the military is actually very very strict about personal weapons and aren't allowed to carry on the base.

They must think Soldiers openly carry M4s around on post during normal duty hours.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:17:04 PM
Originally Posted By DanTSX:
This is why we need to arm the teachers instead too.

Cops get kept busy doing school cop stuff. Truancy, smoking, checking doors, etc, etc. No issue there, but the likelyhood they are nearby when the balloon goes up is low.
Private sercurity would be like the doofuses you see at the bank.
TSA would.....well, just NO!.


That poor teacher that hid her students and told Lanza that they were in the Gym, had a chance where she could had come up and popped the guy in the face with a Glock 29. Instead she took one for her students. Still a hero, but it's the guns you don't know about......


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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:17:24 PM
[Last Edit: 12/22/2012 8:18:35 PM by PogueMahone]
Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet:

Originally Posted By retgarr:
Neither VT nor Ft had officers in the building. If you recall Hassan was actually confronted and shot by city police, not MPs. Military bases are quite soft in many parts.

I was watching MSNBC about the massacre at Newtown. Using the Fort Hood incident as being proof that armed citizens wouldn't have made a difference, saying that Fort Hood was one of the most heavily armed places in the Country.

These idiots have no idea, that the military is actually very very strict about personal weapons and aren't allowed to carry on the base.

They must think Soldiers openly carry M4s around on post during normal duty hours.


the press has no idea how the military works??? that's unpossible!!!

they can't even tell soldiers and marines apart for fucks sake...
DanTSX
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:17:55 PM
Originally Posted By PogueMahone:
Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet:

Originally Posted By retgarr:
Neither VT nor Ft had officers in the building. If you recall Hassan was actually confronted and shot by city police, not MPs. Military bases are quite soft in many parts.

I was watching MSNBC about the massacre at Newtown. Using the Fort Hood incident as being proof that armed citizens wouldn't have made a difference, saying that Fort Hood was one of the most heavily armed places in the Country.

These idiots have no idea, that the military is actually very very strict about personal weapons and aren't allowed to carry on the base.

They must think Soldiers openly carry M4s around on post during normal duty hours.


the press has no idea how the military works??? that's unpossible!!!


Another "gun-free zone".
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:17:55 PM
Some of the libs seem to think that everybody on military bases is armed (in re the ft hood shooting). We need to correct that when we see it.

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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:25:04 PM
Originally Posted By EasTexan:
What about the off duty police officer at that church in Utah or Colorado that took out that asshole bent on massacring the congregation?


IIRC, that was a "she" and she shot the hell out of the perp. I remember putting a congrats note on the "Women Shooters" section here. I think it was a few years back.
In Him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. John 1:4,5
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:46:33 PM
Originally Posted By JohnSmith6073:
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?


I saw a news article, written with a liberal slant (quoted various gun control sources) that made blatantly false statements about Columbine.

Since the current goal seems to be to demonize "military style" rifles, the article claimed that the first officer on the scene at Columbine attempted to enter the building, but was driven back by one of the shooters firing at him with a rifle. For starters, their guns were two 12 gauge shotguns (a pump and a double barrel) that they had illegally shortened to make them easier to conceal, a Tec9 pistol, and a 9mm carbine. From what was reported shortly after the incident, the shotguns saw the most use, with the 9mm guns being used as 'backups' for their rampage. Then there's the issue of what that officer actually said happened. At an early press conference, he stated that he was already on the campus and attempted to enter the building, but the two nuts started throwing pipebombs at him, making it impossible to even hold his position, so he retreated and waited for backup.

The last time the news media mentioned the homemade bombs used at Columbine, was shortly after the incident, and it didn't take them long to start trying to sell the story that it was the Tec9 that killed those students. Now, they are trying to slip in a claim that a lone officer couldn't have stopped it, because the shooters had an evil rifle (what rifle?).


I've also recently seen people trying to claim that there are only a few hundred defensive uses of a gun by a private individual, each year. To make this claim, they find the government data and misinterpret (either intentionally or unintentionally) the total for police shootings as being the total for private indiivduals using a gun in self-defense.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 8:55:14 PM
Originally Posted By JohnSmith6073:
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?


Yes, but they were not wherever the shooter was whenever he was shooting, unarmed victims, who were following the no guns allowed policy, were though.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:02:17 PM
If they want to bring up Columbine, remind them that Harris fired 96 shots from 10 round magazines and a further 25 from a pump shotgun.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:02:44 PM
Columbine did, but that cop was there because he couldn't qualify with his service pistol. Or so I recall.

VTech probably did. But were they in the right building at the right time? Doubt it. I don't know.

Fort Hood did, and those cops engaged and neutralized the murderer/terrorist, thus limiting the damage to innocents. Not sure how this fits the libtard meme of which you speak.

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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:07:55 PM
[Last Edit: 12/22/2012 9:12:14 PM by Bama-Shooter]
Originally Posted By MisterBrux:
IIRC, VA Tech campus police was unarmed at the time.


Some of you may have already received this information but for those who haven’t seen it I felt it would be a great benefit to you. The attached review of the Virginia Tech Active Shooter incident has a lot of info and everyone in LE should review it.

Some of my thoughts on this report:

•From dispatch time to the shooter being reported as dead was only 10 minutes.
•Three ad hoc active shooter teams made entry. These teams consisted of patrol officers, ERT/SWAT members and administrative members of LE (i.e. Chief’s).
•VTPD and Blacksburg PD had trained for Active Shooter events together and had two combined AS training events in the past year before the massacre.

From a training, readiness and response time aspect it would be tough to beat the actions of VTPD and BPD on that day. Actual entry time to the team being on the second floor of Norris Hall to take out the AS was 28 seconds.

The delay was in the teams being able to make actual entry into the building, all doors had been chained shut from inside by the shooter. Two officers were able to get one door open partially and attempted to shoot the lock off the chain with 00 buckshot from a 12 gauge shotgun. Being unsuccessful they were able to make entry into another door by using slugs to breach the lock.

This is an area that needs to be looked at in our own departments and training programs. Some departments only allow the use of buckshot to be deployed with patrol shotguns. The use of buckshot is ineffective against locks. However the use of slugs/breaching rounds have been proven to be effective against padlocks, deadbolts, hinges and other impediments.

•Patrol officer who carry shotguns need to have access to slugs/breaching rounds in addition to the standard buckshot load out.
•Officers need training in conducting shotgun shell select loading to be able to effectively transition from buckshot to slugs in such events.
•Continuous training of patrol officers in the use of shotgun slug/breaching rounds needs to take place.
•Shotguns should be available to patrol officers in addition to rifle/carbines. Each one has their place and are valuable tools to the patrol officer.








A request for bolt cutters to be brought to the scene so the other padlocks could be removed to facilitate the evacuation of students and faculty took several minutes.

•Patrol cars should be equipped with a breaching kit. To include bolt cutters, small halligan tool and sledge hammer. These type kits could be placed in every other patrol car and small decal placed on the truck lid to denote the presence of a breaching kit in that vehicle.
•Training of patrol officers on regular basis in the use of these type tools should take place on continuing basis. Training should also be stressed based.

The officers of VTPD and BPD were highly trained and prepared for an Active Shooter event yet the largest school massacre in US history still took place. The VTPD and BPD departments and officers were committed to AS shooter training. They had been conducting this type training for years. The departments also trained together so any blending of ad hoc AS teams could take place across departments. This training took place on a semi-annual basis.

As LE we have to be prepared for an AS event. We need to train and equip our patrol officers with the skills and tools to effectively deploy against an AS. It only took a few minutes for one shooter to inflict a massive amount of casualties.

•Training and equipment for Active Shooter events should be priority in all departments. Presentations of AS events to city council members should be made to stress the importance of fully funding AS training and equipment.
•Take advantage of summer breaks, spring breaks and other holidays to conduct training at your local schools.
•Invite members of other local LEA’s to attend AS training events.
•AS shooter training is for ALL in LE, patrol officers, ERT/SWAT, and sworn administrative officers.

The shooter, in this case did not all of the sudden decide to go on a murderous rampage. He thought it out, planned and trained for this day. This is something all officers need to keep in mind. The Active Shooter you go up against may have been planning and training for his event for a long time.

•The AS in this event procured weapons, magazines and ammunition for his event.
•He bought clothing, chains and padlocks for his event.
•Visited local shooting ranges to become proficient in the use of his firearms.
•Training for his event included shooting targets on the ground, i.e. Execution style.
•The shooter conducted tactical magazine changes during lulls in his shooting event.
•Extra magazines and ammunition were placed in a central location so the shooter could reequip himself after he expended the ammunition/magazines he carried on this body.

In closing, it is up to all of us who are involved in LE and LE training to prepare officers for the Active Shooter event. All officers from patrolman to chiefs need to be trained on a continuous basis. As this event showed even with highly trained and motivated officers it only takes minutes for a tragedy of massive proportions to take place.

Timeline
0941 Shooting starts
10 KIA
6 W
0942 Disptatch notified, LE dispatched
9 KIA
10 W
0945 LE arrives
11 KIA
11 W
0951 LE makes entry
2 shots are heard (person was already dead)
0952 Cho dead

Cho fired 113 9mm, 61 .22 and conducted 17 magazine changes.
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Any opinions expressed are my own and do not reflect upon any agency or organization with which I may be employed or affiliated.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:31:28 PM
There was a Jefferson County Sheriff’s Deputy who was a community resource officer at Columbine High School. Despite their injuries, two students were able to flee into the school library while Harris and Klebold were distracted by the Deputy. Harris turned his attention from shooting into the west doors of the high school to the deputy resource officer when he saw him. Harris fired about 10 shots at the deputy with his rifle before his weapon jams. The deputy fires four shots at Harris which obviously allows more students to leave the line of fire.

Basically at least two students and probably more were able to run away while Harris' attention was shifted to the deputy. Just because a school resource officer doesn't shoot and kill the active shooter doesn't mean that their presence there didn't save lives!

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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:51:26 PM
What the liberals on FB fail to understand are the laws and regulations on a DOD installation. Just because it is an Army Post, AF Base, Marine Camp or Navy Yard doesn't mean everyone is walking around armed. Unless you are an MP, AF SecFor, Master at Arms or DOD Police on duty you can't carry loaded weapon on post (there are special circumstances that only the base commander can dictate that additional non LE personnel be armed). The only variance to this if you are a city, county, state or federal LEO performing official duties on post and you are suppose to let the law enforcement operations why and when you arrive on the installation. Arms and ammunition for units assigned to these installations have specific guidelines and how they are stored and who has access to them.

The next time some liberal brings that horrible argument up ask them if they know and understand the arming policy for DOD installations; I'd bet a Buffalo Nickel they do not and think everyone just walks around all day with M-16s and all the ammo they can carry.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:54:54 PM
Columbine also had an AWB in place.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 9:56:50 PM
Originally Posted By Chaingun:
Where were they and were they the first responders?

I remember with Columbine the first responders set up entry teams. I don't recall an on-campus officer attempting anything, and it would be rather sad if they did nothing


There was an on campus officer at Columbine. Traded gunfire before backing off.
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Posted: 12/22/2012 10:10:18 PM
The Pearl, Mississippi school shooting was stopped by the vice principal Joel Myrick with a Colt .45 and he had to go to his car to retrieve it.

pearl shooting wiki

Appilachian Law School Shooting

According to Bridges: at the first sound of gunfire, he and fellow student Mikael Gross, unbeknownst to each other, ran to their vehicles to retrieve their personally-owned firearms[6] placed in their glove compartments. Mikael Gross, a police officer from Grifton, North Carolina retrieved a 9 mm pistol and body armor.[7] Bridges, a county sheriff's deputy from Asheville, North Carolina retrieved his .357 Magnum pistol from beneath the driver's seat of his Chevrolet Tahoe.[9] Bridges and Gross approached Odighizuwa from different angles, with Bridges yelling at Odighizuwa to drop his gun.[10] Odighizuwa then dropped his firearm and was subdued by several other unarmed students, including Ted Besen and Todd Ross.[11]

Applaw Wiki

New Life Church Shooting

California Gunshop Hostage shoots attacker and stop event

These should get you started.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 12:14:26 AM
Originally Posted By JohnSmith6073:
Going around liberal bastions Facebook and Twitter.... True? Effective arguments against?


The NIU shooting had the campus police on scene within a couple of minutes. It was pretty much a perfect response and over by the time they got there. (from what I was told by someone who was on campus that day)
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Posted: 12/23/2012 12:26:03 AM
[Last Edit: 12/23/2012 12:27:17 AM by ArmyInfantryVet]

Originally Posted By rara1141:
Columbine also had an AWB in place.

More importantly, the federal AWB was in place when the North Hollywood happened, and they were armed with FULL AUTO AK47s and AR15s.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 12:45:16 AM
Saw it too. With this header.

"They really didn't think this one through. But, if it sells more guns, they are all for it....."




Hell, if they didn't know it 'fore, they could tell right then that they weren't gonna beat him.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 12:53:54 AM
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Cho fired 113 9mm, 61 .22 and conducted 17 magazine changes.


That's an average of less than 10 rounds per mag... Interesting tidbit of info.

That is also a good argument that high-cap mag bans don't work.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 12:54:18 AM

Originally Posted By Boru:
Saw it too. With this header.

"They really didn't think this one through. But, if it sells more guns, they are all for it....."



So the response is:

The officer at Columbine was away at lunch, and wasn't there when the two shooters arrived.
Virginia Tech Police didn't arrive at the shooting location until 10 minutes after the shooting started.
Fort Hood soldiers are disarmed while on the base. Base Security wasn't at the shooting site when the shooting
started.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 12:58:03 AM
[Last Edit: 12/23/2012 1:03:39 AM by DmL5]
Yes, and the Fort Hood shooting was finally stopped when armed police officers arrived. If not for that, the outcome would have been even worse.

Call them on their idiotic lies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Hood_shooting
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Posted: 12/23/2012 1:01:48 AM
Originally Posted By HitmanMonkey:
Some of the libs seem to think that everybody on military bases is armed (in re the ft hood shooting). We need to correct that when we see it.

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been correcting them on that one all week...
J75player
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Posted: 12/23/2012 1:04:37 AM
Originally Posted By Lord_Grey_Boots:

Originally Posted By Boru:
Saw it too. With this header.

"They really didn't think this one through. But, if it sells more guns, they are all for it....."



So the response is:

The officer at Columbine was away at lunch, and wasn't there when the two shooters arrived.
Virginia Tech Police didn't arrive at the shooting location until 10 minutes after the shooting started.
Fort Hood soldiers are disarmed while on the base. Base Security wasn't at the shooting site when the shooting
started.


pretty much this.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 1:06:13 AM
From John Lott's website:


12/22/2012
Gun Control Advocates Misinformation by Guard in Columbine Attack

1) The guard at the Columbine High School attack did delay and that allowed many students to escape out of the building.
2) The guard was only able to delay the killers for a while because they had homemade grenades. The guard was hiding around a corner in a hallway, but when the two killers started lobbing their grenades down the hallway his position became untenable. Despite the claims to the contrary, it wasn't the "assault weapons" that were important in making it so that the guard had to back down. (Some information is available here.)
3) Finally, the officer at Columbine was there because he was such a bad shot. He was not given regular duty and was assigned to the school because it was deemed that his ability to properly shoot his gun wasn't thought to be an issue.

http://johnrlott.blogspot.com/2012/12/gun-control-advocates-misinformation-by.html

Also, President Clinton was sending officers to schools back in 2000. You can read that here: http://articles.latimes.com/2000/apr/16/news/mn-20323
No doubt, the same folks that criticize the NRA for the same idea today, supported it back then.
Since it was President Clinton's idea, all is good... NRA... bad idea.
s32
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Posted: 12/23/2012 1:10:13 AM
Columbine had a resource officer that was trained to "retreat and wait for backup". He went to the parking lot to help direct students away from the building and I think the killers did take shots at him from a window.

We need police and security that are trained to engage active shooter.

Both VA tech and Ft Hood the actual shooting took place away from any armed security. You need to keep highlighting is that these mass-murderers are usually cowards and don't want to engage anyone that can fight back; they want easy targets. The second police showed up at VA tech and Sandy hook the murderer immediately committed suicide.
s1rGr1nG0
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Posted: 12/23/2012 2:09:59 AM
Originally Posted By PogueMahone:
Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet:

Originally Posted By retgarr:
Neither VT nor Ft had officers in the building. If you recall Hassan was actually confronted and shot by city police, not MPs. Military bases are quite soft in many parts.

I was watching MSNBC about the massacre at Newtown. Using the Fort Hood incident as being proof that armed citizens wouldn't have made a difference, saying that Fort Hood was one of the most heavily armed places in the Country.

These idiots have no idea, that the military is actually very very strict about personal weapons and aren't allowed to carry on the base.

They must think Soldiers openly carry M4s around on post during normal duty hours.


the press has no idea how the military works??? that's unpossible!!!

they can't even tell soldiers and marines apart for fucks sake...


They all look the same to me.

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Tim_the_enchanter
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Posted: 12/23/2012 2:11:31 AM
What they didn't have was armed citizens in the room.
FivespeedF150
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Posted: 12/23/2012 2:16:17 AM

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By MisterBrux:
IIRC, VA Tech campus police was unarmed at the time.


Some of you may have already received this information but for those who haven’t seen it I felt it would be a great benefit to you. The attached review of the Virginia Tech Active Shooter incident has a lot of info and everyone in LE should review it.


I need to read more about that. Most interesting. Is there an official report out yet online that you would recommend that goes into more detail?
THR-Thumper: One of the reasons I love arfcom is watching really brilliant guys thrown into discussions with some of the most stupid motherfuckers on the planet.
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Posted: 12/23/2012 2:18:43 AM
Originally Posted By Walther22lr:
Also, President Clinton was sending officers to schools back in 2000. You can read that here: http://articles.latimes.com/2000/apr/16/news/mn-20323
No doubt, the same folks that criticize the NRA for the same idea today, supported it back then.
Since it was President Clinton's idea, all is good... NRA... bad idea.


That's what I've been hitting.
BHO called SEALs they killed OBL
SEALS called BHO they were left 2 die.

Gun control requires so much faith in the face of statistics, data & history it should be an organized religion.
Bama-Shooter
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Posted: 12/23/2012 9:52:50 AM
Originally Posted By Lord_Grey_Boots:

Originally Posted By Boru:
Saw it too. With this header.

"They really didn't think this one through. But, if it sells more guns, they are all for it....."



So the response is:

The officer at Columbine was away at lunch, and wasn't there when the two shooters arrived.
Virginia Tech Police didn't arrive at the shooting location until 10 minutes after the shooting started.
Fort Hood soldiers are disarmed while on the base. Base Security wasn't at the shooting site when the shooting
started.


VT officers arrived within 3 minutes of being dispatched.
American by birth, Southern by the grace of God.

Constitutional carry is a right not a privilege.

Any opinions expressed are my own and do not reflect upon any agency or organization with which I may be employed or affiliated.
Bama-Shooter
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Posted: 12/23/2012 9:55:04 AM
Originally Posted By FivespeedF150:

Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By MisterBrux:
IIRC, VA Tech campus police was unarmed at the time.


Some of you may have already received this information but for those who haven’t seen it I felt it would be a great benefit to you. The attached review of the Virginia Tech Active Shooter incident has a lot of info and everyone in LE should review it.


I need to read more about that. Most interesting. Is there an official report out yet online that you would recommend that goes into more detail?


Archangel has a 300 page report. Not sure if it is out in the public.

American by birth, Southern by the grace of God.

Constitutional carry is a right not a privilege.

Any opinions expressed are my own and do not reflect upon any agency or organization with which I may be employed or affiliated.
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