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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:40:46 AM EDT
[#1]
In
 Now to save up enough money for a mill.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:42:15 AM EDT
[#2]
I wish shops up here would do that.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:44:40 AM EDT
[#3]
Awesome!
How long before possessing a CAD/CAM file is treated the same as "intent to manufacture"?  |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:47:27 AM EDT
[#4]
Why is it so fascinating that with a mill and a chunk of aluminum, you can wait 4 hours and make an AR lower....
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:49:55 AM EDT
[#5]
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL.
They'd be fine with 80% lowers. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:51:38 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:51:53 AM EDT
[#7]
Though not held as often build parties were all the rage back 8-10 years ago.
A few guys with 80% lowers or AK plates and some drill presses, jigs, and metal presses and you're good-to-go. "All" the work has to be done by the owner so I'm assuming that the CNC operation has the owner load the program and mouse click the run button. 
I bought and built 80% lowers back in the 1990's so it's been going on a long time. 
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:53:02 AM EDT
[#8]
In before all the neighborhood dogs get shot, Lee Paige is wounded in the process, and then all CAD/CAM machines have to be registered with the ATF.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:54:39 AM EDT
[#9]
Trying to get a MD build party together, except that...
1) MDHTF is a buncha bums. 2) Somebody still has my jigs.
You know who you are, ya punk. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:55:25 AM EDT
[#10]
Will not end well, Kristi Tool tried the same game and was fucked by ATF like a truck stop whore.
Kharn Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:56:19 AM EDT
[#11]
Cool. I like this "Build-a-bear workshop" concept.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:56:52 AM EDT
[#12]
I wish I had the equipment to do this.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:57:02 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: In Now to save up enough money for a mill. I sleep better at night knowing there is a milling machine and a bunch of tooling in the garage. I have one that looks exactly like that, except it has an A2 upper. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:57:56 AM EDT
[#14]
As long as it's the individual doing the work (pressing the start button) it doesn't matter who owns the tools. We need a shop like this in every mall....kind of like build a bear for adults
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:58:56 AM EDT
[#15]
Talk about one of those things for which you should not seek publicity...
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Posted: 11/19/2012 9:59:06 AM EDT
[#16]
Oh, a hit piece about guns? Color me surprised.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:03:07 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
Oh, a hit piece about guns? Color me surprised. It's amazing how many gun people will still happily talk to fucking journalists. They're not on our side, people. Knock it off. Local gun store apparently decided to invite Morgan fucking Spurlock to hang out with them at a gunshow. I'm holding off on a planned purchase until I see just how anti-gun the piece turns out to be. ETA: I think it might be a CNN thing too. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:03:41 AM EDT
[#18]
this is not good guys
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:04:47 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
Talk about one of those things for which you should not seek publicity... Agree, no op-sec. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:09:32 AM EDT
[#20]
Team 10... on the cutting edge of 10 years ago.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:10:11 AM EDT
[#21]
ATF soon to get some more mileage out of Obummer's "you didn't build that" line.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:15:58 AM EDT
[#22]
I love the video reference to the CNC machine as "being able to cut through metal like a hot knife through butter". That reminded me of Slick Willy with his "Teflon coated bullets" HOLLYWOOD BS. so I guess CNC ban/registration/destruction will commence Jan 1, 2013?
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:18:49 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I wouldn't want to poke the atf with a stick, but, I believe you're correct. If they signed a rental agreement, loaded the machine and pushed the start button, how could you legally say that they didn't make the part? |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:19:14 AM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:19:52 AM EDT
[#25]
Clip
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:25:56 AM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. You go into Ares Armor and buy an 80% lower (or bring your own), and on the first three Sundays of each month, you drive to the machine shop, pay them cash, and press the button to start the machine. If you want, Ares then holds a build class so everyone can assemble the rifle (with a kit they sell). Pretty smart, actually, and I've been planning to go get one done. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:29:13 AM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I wouldn't want to poke the atf with a stick, but, I believe you're correct. If they signed a rental agreement, loaded the machine and pushed the start button, how could you legally say that they didn't make the part? Now think about investment casting. Molten aluminum in a crucible in a swivel with a lever attached to it. Five different guys take hold of the lever to pour the metal. Who made the receiver? Reality makes fools of all lawmakers. And how could it do otherwise? The people who write the law don't know shit about anything but writing laws. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:34:26 AM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
Ares Armor in Oceanside. Team 10 promised not to reveal the location of the actual machine shop. A 2 second Google search found their address.... Point being, why mention the name of the company to begin with, when the media KNOWS that people can find the info?? |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:36:41 AM EDT
[#29]
What makes this not illegal or legal? Is it like bathtub booze? I can make as much as I want for personal consumption or something?
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:43:13 AM EDT
[#30]
The Dems there will ban this.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:43:30 AM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
As long as it's the individual doing the work (pressing the start button) it doesn't matter who owns the tools. We need a shop like this in every mall....kind of like build a bear for adults I can picture it in my mind. You start building the receiver. Then you go to a bin of stocks, a bin of LPK's. Next comes a wall of uppers. They could have different colored stocks, grips, and handguards. When you are done building you get to name it and they hand you your gun and a balloon.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:45:45 AM EDT
[#32]
They had a roll your own cigarette store in Brooklyn a while back. I like business that figure out creative ways to tell the govt to FO.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:46:06 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Awesome! How long before possessing a CAD/CAM file is treated the same as "intent to manufacture"?
Don't worry man, constructive possession is bullshit, and the government can be trusted with unlimited power. ETA: Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I wouldn't want to poke the atf with a stick, but, I believe you're correct. If they signed a rental agreement, loaded the machine and pushed the start button, how could you legally say that they didn't make the part? It's trivial. Just scream "YOU BABY-COP-MURDERER!" Works every time in CA courts, and most of the time in non-ca courts. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:46:13 AM EDT
[#34]
I wonder if you have to be a CA resident to do this?
... and what their prices are? ... and if the local Maker shop with CNC mills and 3d scanners objects to this kind of thing?
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:49:02 AM EDT
[#35]
I have been thinking about doing this. I have a cnc mill that i can use anytime. Do i really need the jig if i am going to use a cnc mill? They appear to be for use with a drill press.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:49:24 AM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:
As long as it's the individual doing the work (pressing the start button) it doesn't matter who owns the tools. We need a shop like this in every mall....kind of like build a bear for adults I can picture it in my mind. You start building the receiver. Then you go to a bin of stocks, a bin of LPK's. Next comes a wall of uppers. They could have different colored stocks, grips, and handguards. When you are done building you get to name it and they hand you your gun and a balloon. You laugh, but if "Build A Gun" existed I would be there all the time. Then they would have an indoor shooting range to fire the gun after. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:51:06 AM EDT
[#37]
Quoted: This will not end well for Ares Armor.Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. You go into Ares Armor and buy an 80% lower (or bring your own), and on the first three Sundays of each month, you drive to the machine shop, pay them cash, and press the button to start the machine. If you want, Ares then holds a build class so everyone can assemble the rifle (with a kit they sell). Pretty smart, actually, and I've been planning to go get one done. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:51:11 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted: Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. You go into Ares Armor and buy an 80% lower (or bring your own), and on the first three Sundays of each month, you drive to the machine shop, pay them cash, and press the button to start the machine. If you want, Ares then holds a build class so everyone can assemble the rifle (with a kit they sell). Pretty smart, actually, and I've been planning to go get one done. Ahhhh... much better. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:54:42 AM EDT
[#39]
It's exactly the idea I had 10+ years ago. Program a CNC to make a receiver, hand customer a raw forging or whatever, they put it in the machine and hit the start button.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:56:06 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I believe the legal term would be facilitation, or party to a crime. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 10:58:44 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I believe the legal term would be facilitation, or party to a crime. So is Bridgeport part of the criminal conspiracy, too? |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:01:52 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I believe the legal term would be facilitation, or party to a crime. But...what crime? If the guy who puts the block in the jig, sets it up, and presses "start" is the owner of the (soon to be) gun, then no crime took place. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:01:55 AM EDT
[#43]
Sounds exactly like what Rick Celata of KTOrdnance.com was doing 10 yrs ago, shortly before ATF raided his shop and confiscated everything and charged him with a bunch of stuff. I think most of the charges have been dropped/resolved, but last I knew, he still hasn't gotten back everything they confiscated (personal firearms, tooling, computers email lists, stock and inventory). Hope Ares has better luck.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:02:08 AM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I believe the legal term would be facilitation, or party to a crime. So is Bridgeport part of the criminal conspiracy, too? Along with the electrical utility, the builder of the building and the aluminum supplier. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:06:00 AM EDT
[#45]
Quoted: this is not good guys Looks like freedom to me. It's the anti-freedom government response that may not be good. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:08:44 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted: That's exactly what appears to be going on. Time will tell how ATF/California DOJ goes about destroying that machine shop. Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:08:55 AM EDT
[#47]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I believe the legal term would be facilitation, or party to a crime. So is Bridgeport part of the criminal conspiracy, too? Along with the electrical utility, the builder of the building and the aluminum supplier. And the local city government. They issued the business license.  |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:11:15 AM EDT
[#48]
Quoted: You're not thinking like the our Government now does. This setup is bypassing all those restrictions the CA and Fed Government have put into place, you know for our protectionQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I think that machine shop is in trouble with the ATF if it's creating and selling 100% lowers without an FFL. They'd be fine with 80% lowers. Wouldn't the shop be able to sell the billet and then rent out the mill? As long as the customer pushes the start button, aren't they making the receiver? I believe the legal term would be facilitation, or party to a crime. But...what crime? If the guy who puts the block in the jig, sets it up, and presses "start" is the owner of the (soon to be) gun, then no crime took place.  . They must be made an example of (my guess is they will be). They're not breaking any law? Fuck it, raid their shop, tie them up in court for years, bankrupt them and make a big story out of it so no one dares do it again. Just to be clear I think it's pretty cool what they're doing but they better watch their corn holes. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:13:22 AM EDT
[#49]
There is a guy in Jackson, MI who does something similar. His setup, though, is a class on making the gun, and then he buys the gun from the students (I dunno if/what he charges for the class, but it's a way for him to teach people how to make them and then he does the paperwork to buy it from them as a dealer in the end).
Either way, fun field-trip! |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 11:18:30 AM EDT
[#50]
+1 to what Ripper said
There's very little difference between being found guilty of a crime and being charged of a crime (having inventory and assets held and then having to defend yourself)... financially speaking, either can ruin a business. |
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