 TexasRifleman1985
Member
Team Member
Joined: Mar 2007  TX, USA
 Posts: 14510 Feedback: 100% (10) |
Posted: 8/10/2012 9:43:17 PM
THE IMAGE ABOVE IS A PAID ADVERTISEMENT How hard would it be for them to identify operating nuclear reactors in their analysis of the images? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2012 1:53:29 PM
Any source of heat can be used to boil a liquid and run a turbine. Coal combustion, natural gas combustion, geothermal, bacterial decomposition, solar, etc.
Some combustion sources would be obvious, like coal. But natural gas would release water vapor and CO2, which from orbit would look like the water vapor that comes out of a nuclear cooling tower, or solar, or geothermal, or anything else that might use steam for heat rejection. If they image in the entire EM spectrum, and understand it well enough, it's possible they could rule out excess CO2 in the exhaust to eliminate hydrocarbon combustion as a heat source, and some wavelengths may be able to detect whether the geology would support geothermal energy (similar to our ground-penetrating radar). Our reactors are shielded well enough that they probably wouldn't detect any alpha, beta, or neutron radiation, but they may be able to detect gamma sources well enough to pick out reactors (and natural deposits of some radioactive sources). There is little to nothing about the external design that they would be able to pick out and say "this is definitely a nuclear reactor." |
|
|
|
sigp226
No_Limit_Cracka
Team Member
Joined: Jun 2006  LBY
Posts: 11275 Feedback: 100% (1) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 1:57:01 PM
The signals from the GPS satellites would make it clear that we understand relativity and therefore nuclear physics.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2012 2:02:01 PM
All they have to do is access the internet, log onto Google and type in "Nuclear Reactors"
|
|
|
|
StretchMaK
Cracker
Team Member
Joined: May 2009 OH, USA
Posts: 4392 Feedback: 100% (13) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 2:12:42 PM
If they could make it here from some other place way out in space they could figure us out pretty easy I would guess.
|
|
|
TexasRifleman1985
Member
Team Member
Joined: Mar 2007 TX, USA
Posts: 14515 Feedback: 100% (10) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 4:27:34 PM
Originally Posted By the_naked_prophet:
Any source of heat can be used to boil a liquid and run a turbine. Coal combustion, natural gas combustion, geothermal, bacterial decomposition, solar, etc. Some combustion sources would be obvious, like coal. But natural gas would release water vapor and CO2, which from orbit would look like the water vapor that comes out of a nuclear cooling tower, or solar, or geothermal, or anything else that might use steam for heat rejection. If they image in the entire EM spectrum, and understand it well enough, it's possible they could rule out excess CO2 in the exhaust to eliminate hydrocarbon combustion as a heat source, and some wavelengths may be able to detect whether the geology would support geothermal energy (similar to our ground-penetrating radar). Our reactors are shielded well enough that they probably wouldn't detect any alpha, beta, or neutron radiation, but they may be able to detect gamma sources well enough to pick out reactors (and natural deposits of some radioactive sources). There is little to nothing about the external design that they would be able to pick out and say "this is definitely a nuclear reactor." Don't a lot of reactors keep nuclear waste stored on site outside on the main containment facilities? Could this create identifying features/markers, such as gamma/neutrons or inexplicable thermal energy from decay? I'm think you're correct that the reactor itself is amazingly hard to identify without knowledge of human engineering. |
|
|
TexasRifleman1985
Member
Team Member
Joined: Mar 2007 TX, USA
Posts: 14516 Feedback: 100% (10) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 4:28:49 PM
Originally Posted By sigp226:
The signals from the GPS satellites would make it clear that we understand relativity and therefore nuclear physics. Assume they know we have nuclear knowledge, and are attempting to locate reactors by passive orbital imaging. |
|
|
TexasRifleman1985
Member
Team Member
Joined: Mar 2007 TX, USA
Posts: 14517 Feedback: 100% (10) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 4:32:44 PM
Antineutrinos! Duh!
Beta decay from nuclear waste products creates antineutrinos, which aren't stopped by shielding... The question is would it be high enough above background for an orbital detector to notice. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2012 4:44:39 PM
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Antineutrinos! Duh! Beta decay from nuclear waste products creates antineutrinos, which aren't stopped by shielding... The question is would it be high enough above background for an orbital detector to notice. They'd have to have a massive tank of something like carbon tetrachloride on board the passive detector. Neutrinos are hard to detect for the exact same reason they're hard to shield against: they pass through anything (shielding or detector) without interacting. |
|
|
|
Kharn
Mushroom Cloud Measurer
Team Member
Joined: Nov 2000 MD, USA
Posts: 24403 Feedback: 100% (9) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 5:11:22 PM
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
You actually need the particle to hit the detector, so probability comes into play. They would probably figure it out by other means, such as aircraft carriers just zipping along without a big plume of exhaust following them.
Antineutrinos! Duh! Beta decay from nuclear waste products creates antineutrinos, which aren't stopped by shielding... The question is would it be high enough above background for an orbital detector to notice. Kharn |
|
|
|
TexasRifleman1985
Member
Team Member
Joined: Mar 2007 TX, USA
Posts: 14518 Feedback: 100% (10) Link To This Post |
Posted: 8/11/2012 5:16:58 PM
Originally Posted By Kharn:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
You actually need the particle to hit the detector, so probability comes into play. They would probably figure it out by other means, such as aircraft carriers just zipping along without a big plume of exhaust following them.
Antineutrinos! Duh! Beta decay from nuclear waste products creates antineutrinos, which aren't stopped by shielding... The question is would it be high enough above background for an orbital detector to notice. Kharn Don't the Japanese have a neutrino detector that fits in a connex box? Still big though. And I question if the output from spent fuel would be detectable above background from orbit. |
|
ARCHIVED
