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Posted: 12/18/2011 1:18:15 PM EDT
Need to help get a safe out through a narrow doorway. Internal hinge pins. I've had an external hinge safe in the past (just lift the door off the hinges), but don't want to damage the safe when I help move it.

Thanks!

AFARR
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 1:25:27 PM EDT
Call the manufacturer, they would know how to do it.
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 1:27:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BeauBeaux:
Call the manufacturer, they would know how to do it.


I figured on trying that...but they may be down for the holiday (and it needs moved in the next week or two).

Since GD knows EVERYTHING, I figured I'd ask here and see what might work.

Of course, we could always cut the 1" or so off the doorway so the dial and handle fit through.......

AFARR
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 1:36:04 PM EDT
Does it not just lift right off the hinges? I would use a well padded car jack to lift it and move, then lower and walk it off onto a piece of 2x4 and then on to the carpet.
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 2:21:02 PM EDT
Depends on whether or not you care about getting it back on again!
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 2:55:58 PM EDT
From an ad in the sportsmans guide

One of the first things a burglar will attack is the hinge system, but Cannon® Safes have hidden hinges with internal locking system designed to prevent removal of the door
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 3:11:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/18/2011 3:16:39 PM EDT by WindKnot1-1]
^^^^^This. The whole idea is not to be able to remove the door.

I own a Canon safe with internal hinges and after some long thought I've come to the conclusion that when the door is closed and locked, the hinges mean nothing. There are bars on the hinge side of the door that protrude into the safe wall.

And crooks don't go for the hinges first, they go for the easiest, most efficient part to grind... the edges.
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 3:15:20 PM EDT
Just have one of our safe experts belittle it over the phone, it'll be in pieces in no time
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 3:17:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
^^^^^This. The whole idea is not to be able to remove the door.

You can cut the external hinges completely off a decent safe and the door's not going anywhere. The locking bolts hold the door on.
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 3:19:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MACD:
Just have one of our safe experts belittle it over the phone, it'll be in pieces in no time


Just put some towels down to dry up the tears...
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 3:28:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By UV830:

Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
^^^^^This. The whole idea is not to be able to remove the door.

You can cut the external hinges completely off a decent safe and the door's not going anywhere. The locking bolts hold the door on.


Exactly the point I'm tryint to make. Other than aesthetics, there is no advantage to internal hinges. At least with external hinges you can remove the door when transporting it. (Much lighter that way)
Link Posted: 12/18/2011 4:52:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
Originally Posted By UV830:

Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
^^^^^This. The whole idea is not to be able to remove the door.

You can cut the external hinges completely off a decent safe and the door's not going anywhere. The locking bolts hold the door on.


Exactly the point I'm tryint to make. Other than aesthetics, there is no advantage to internal hinges. At least with external hinges you can remove the door when transporting it. (Much lighter that way)


Agreed....the big difference (practicality wise) is that an external hinge door will open to 180+ degrees, the internal hinge won't go much past 90 degrees.

The door in the safe in question fits flush (not a problem)...but the dial and handle stick out far enough to block egress of the safe.

I'll try to call Cannon tomorrow, but...

The door sits into a 'frame' at the hinge points....the hinge pin sticks through a hole in the frame. My Brother (his safe) looked at it from the inside and thinks you can support the door, pull the pin UP out of the door and through the hole in the frame. The lower pin then would lift up with the door. However....we want to get better info before we try it.

AFARR
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 11:31:45 AM EDT
bump for the monday crew
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 11:42:39 AM EDT
A little over 2 years ago I moved into a new home, we decide to put the GS in a hall closet on the first floor, it was 25.5 inches and teh door 24 inches. We removed the door, the door jam, and the door frame down to the bare studs. Got it in there then put the door way back together and rehung the door.
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 12:42:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By scottlang:
A little over 2 years ago I moved into a new home, we decide to put the GS in a hall closet on the first floor, it was 25.5 inches and teh door 24 inches. We removed the door, the door jam, and the door frame down to the bare studs. Got it in there then put the door way back together and rehung the door.


Might have to do that in the end.

AFARR
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 1:21:42 PM EDT
Per Cannon..."Cannot remove the door, it's part of the frame".

Oh, well....next topic will be 'how to de-frame a doorway".

AFARR
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 1:26:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AFARR:
Per Cannon..."Cannot remove the door, it's part of the frame".

Oh, well....next topic will be 'how to de-frame a doorway".

AFARR


That doesn't take long. A pry bar and 30min and you can deframe any doorway.
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 1:31:13 PM EDT
I was going to point out they have shotguns for that!
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 1:33:11 PM EDT
You are trying to get the safe out.... just reverse how you got it in previously!
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 1:37:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dyezak:
Originally Posted By AFARR:
Per Cannon..."Cannot remove the door, it's part of the frame".

Oh, well....next topic will be 'how to de-frame a doorway".

AFARR


That doesn't take long. A pry bar and 30min and you can deframe any doorway.


I can do it in 2 minutes with a sawzall
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 3:03:58 PM EDT
Can't you just take the handle and dial off?
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 3:07:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/19/2011 3:08:10 PM EDT by delemorte]
nm. beat by alot.
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 3:26:52 PM EDT
Can't you move the safe through the doorway with the safe door open?
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 3:37:24 PM EDT
so how did they get the safe into the room?
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 5:21:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By deadelk:
Can't you move the safe through the doorway with the safe door open?


Can't the door opens only about 90 degrees, and it's tight enough you cannot 'angle' it through the doorway.

Link Posted: 12/19/2011 5:35:25 PM EDT
We have a Champion Safe (a great buy for us) with internal hinges. Had to remove the door and frame (of the structure) to get it in place (could not remove the safe door). This might not work for you but ............ moving ours was a bitch given the weight - the things are built heavy for a reason. Good luck and don't break your back or knuckles.
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 5:35:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Plasteredtex:
so how did they get the safe into the room?


Not sure. My brother's arranging this and the safe is a co-worker's (their deceased relative's)...empty (other relatives got the guns, but probably didn't want to hassle with the safe due to the weight and doorway), and they are selling the house. Brother wants the safe, can get it for a few $$ but it has to be out in the next couple of weeks or it goes with the house. Some kind of narrow closet on the first floor (which is nice...no real stairs to get it out). I'm guessing the relative (dead one) must have pulled the frame themselves.

The problem with de-framing the door is that my Brother (and I) can't 'damage' anything getting it out. Which will happen if we don't know what we're doing. Well....it was a free safe anyway, so if it has to stay, the new home-owner will have to deal with it. If we can figure it out, we'll get it, if not.....

(((I've seen the pics of where it is and the measurements.....and my Brother's the one looking at getting it out, so I've tried to relay the info completely))).

Link Posted: 12/19/2011 5:44:10 PM EDT
Save all the hassle and call some piano movers. I think it cost me 150.00 to have my 1200 lb safe moved. It's what they do. If they can get a piano out of a house they damn sure can get that safe out ;)


If he's gettin a screamin deal on the safe he can afford to pay someone to move it and no family or friends end up with an f'ed up back or worse.
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 5:45:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bikertrash:
Save all the hassle and call some piano movers. I think it cost me 150.00 to have my 1200 lb safe moved. It's what they do. If they can get a piano out of a house they damn sure can get that safe out ;)


If he's gettin a screamin deal on the safe he can afford to pay someone to move it and no family or friends end up with an f'ed up back or worse.


Good point. Wonder if they'd do an 'estimate' to see if they can get it out. Not too worried about getting it out to his truck and slid into the back or into his basement...but if they can get it out of the closet...that would be worth the money..

AFARR
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 6:11:06 PM EDT
Get a price from a carpenter to R+R the door . That should keep the Family owning the house/safe happy


Price from carpenter+price from painter+price from mover is likely greater than price for new safe delivered.

if you had the time to do any of this work yourself you could make out but of course present owners of the house are afraid of screwing
up the sale by pissing off the buyers.

Possibly the best bet is to deal with the new owners if they don't want the thing taking up space?
Link Posted: 12/19/2011 6:13:16 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rod727:
From an ad in the sportsmans guide

One of the first things a burglar will attack is the hinge system, but Cannon® Safes have hidden hinges with internal locking system designed to prevent removal of the door

Any safe that relies on internal hinges is stupid.
Link Posted: 12/20/2011 4:27:36 AM EDT
Originally Posted By nhsport:
Snip....

Possibly the best bet is to deal with the new owners if they don't want the thing taking up space?


Interdasting.....

Hadn't thought of that.

Thanks.



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