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2/23/2017 5:55:53 PM
Posted: 3/22/2001 11:21:32 PM EST
Anyone have any experience with either of these 1911's? A friend is thinking about buying one (though he's still on the fence about a P220 as well). Which is manufactured better? I know that Kimber uses MIM parts, but does SA use them? I'm leary of MIM parts like hammers, sears, etc. Maybe I'm under estimating the durability of MIM parts, but I want my hammer and sear to be "wire EDM cut from S-7 tool steel bar stock" and then heat treated, like Wilson Combat #337/314, not like their MIM #455B/314C. Should he stay away from MIM parts? Also, what do you think about the reliability, worksmanship, and servicability of Kimber versus SA pistols? Is there anything about either company (i.e., not supporting RKBA) that would otherwise steer you away from their products? Who makes a better 1911? And I'm talking about an $850 gun, not the FBI-HRT pistol. TIA
Link Posted: 3/22/2001 11:28:42 PM EST
BTT Why isn't this showing up on the GD board? Hmmmm.
Link Posted: 3/22/2001 11:43:46 PM EST
I've got both a Springfield SuperTuned v10 Ultra Compact and a Kimber Ultra Compact CDP. While both are very nice, my favorite of the two is the Kimber. Fit and finish on both are great. The meltdown effect on the Kimber makes it nicer to carry. I have yet to have a failure in either one, but from what I've learned, the MIM parts really aren't as big an issue as first thought. I hope this helps a bit.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 12:08:50 AM EST
I own a Springfield, and have had it customized. I was told by my gunsmith who is fairly reputable that if you are planning on doing any custom work to your weapon Springfield is the way to go if you are just looking for an out of box weapon than Kimber would be the better of the 2. I know people who own Kimbers and I have shot them they shoot very nicely as does my Springfield . Hope that helps....
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 12:38:21 AM EST
General concensus I found was Kimber. American made vs brazilian, other details. check out the 1911 forums. [url]http://www.1911forum.com/cgi-bin/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro&BypassCookie=true[/url]
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 12:59:39 AM EST
i have a stock kimber and a modified springfield, and the kimber is the better gun
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 1:34:00 AM EST
I own both a Kimber Custom and a Springfield Loaded 1911A1. Both are excellent. The Kimber has the slightly better fit and finish, but both guns are totally reliable and accurate. I don't think you will go wrong with either one. You will pay more for the Kimber...kind of like you will pay more for an Armalite M15 as opposed to the Bushmaster XM15, due to slightly better appearance and finish of the Armalite. Don.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 2:34:28 AM EST
I have no experience with Springfield's Loaded Series, but every Kimber I have ever owned has been flawless. My carry gun is a Kimber stainless Gold Match and I have over 7,000 rounds through it with no jams and no parts breakage. It has also been the most accurate handgun I have ever fired. I can't reccommend it highly enough.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 3:01:54 AM EST
I bought a Kimber SLE (all stainless commander) last year and OMG I love this gun. It has been utterly reliable, shoots right to point of aim out of the box, and recoil is actually pleasurable. And no sharp edges like the Springfield. Can't recommend it highly enough. I was originally looking at a SIG 220 after getting a 229, but single action is sooooo much better than double. I am a true convert.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 3:25:14 AM EST
My friend (ex Marine) bought a Springfield NIB with Nomex sights. After about 1 box through it, the sights fell off. Send slide back to Sprinfield, new slide arrived in less than 3 weeks. Don't have experience with Kimber, but Springfield's got their customer service in great shape.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 3:36:20 PM EST
I'm the proverbial friend. Thank you JacRyan and other posters for the info. I am ideally looking for something the will work well out of the box. Does anybody have suggestions on specific options/packages from Kimber or SA? I thought I would go with full-size and night sights for sure, but am not sure what else I need.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 4:24:09 PM EST
I have a lightly customized Springfield, and I love that gun. No problems whatsoever. I don't have any experience with the Kimber. IMOP, I would get the Sig P220 (if the double action does not bother you - some people can deal with it, some can't). The P220 will likely be better than both in accuracy, and definitely fit & finish. SIG's customer service is outstanding. [;D] Tyler
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 5:12:00 PM EST
Thomas, I would advise the Kimber Classic Stainless if you want fixed sights, or the Stainless Target if you want adjustable.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 5:15:27 PM EST
BTT
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 8:09:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/24/2001 8:24:32 AM EST by FrankSquid]
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 9:32:33 PM EST
check out 1911forums.com Kimber's following, in my estimation is nearly as rabid as Glocks, and for good reason. However I would recommend that you go with Springfield, all things being equal, if for nothing else the lifetime warranty and service, which is like having your own gunsmith on retainer. Springfield loaded should be less tan $650. If you are going to pay $800 and change for a Kimber and then swap out parts that are not MIM, then I suggest saving a little more and again going with Springfield, but contacting Gunsite (www.gunsite.com) and buying the $995 Gunsite GSP 2000 service pistol. Again lifrtime warranty on everything INCLUDING FINISH, no MIM parts, 4 lb. trigger pull, hand tuned for relibility, Novak nite sites and 3 tuned mags, plus MOST of the features found on $1500-2000 Wilsons. Will do 3" @ 50 yds. [img]http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=637092&a=4646604&p=44647837&Sequence=0&res=high[/img]
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 10:51:30 PM EST
I have both and I don't think you could go wrong either way.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 11:02:43 PM EST
Kimber. Daddy owns 3. Loves them all better than Colt.
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 11:16:54 PM EST
I own a springfield. Kimbers are nice but it is a parts gun. No flame intended but it uses S&W and other manufactured parts. Damn I wish I had one. [pistol] [sniper]
Link Posted: 3/23/2001 11:19:56 PM EST
Originally Posted By AR-SNIPER-15: I own a springfield. Kimbers are nice but it is a parts gun. No flame intended but it uses S&W and other manufactured parts. Damn I wish I had one. [pistol] [sniper]
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Damn AR-Sniper. Never heard that b4. Tell me more. I am interested.
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 12:39:05 AM EST
You never heard it before because it's BS. Kimber does not use anyone's parts. The thing about Smith is a total misstatement of what was published in Guns Magazine a while back. Kimber buys raw steel forgings from Smith and Wesson among other vendors, then machines them into frames and slides. This is hardly using Smith and Wesson parts, as most gun manufacturers don't make their own forgings. The Kimber is made in house and anyone who says it's a "parts gun" doesn't know what the hell they're talking about.
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 12:48:50 AM EST
Kimber buys forgings and some partially machine parts from S&W. Not arguing, just stating the facts. OSA
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 12:57:33 AM EST
Originally Posted By Old Spfld Armory: Kimber buys forgings and some partially machine parts from S&W. Not arguing, just stating the facts. OSA
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No, you stated one fact and one misstatement. Kimber buys raw steel forgings from Smith. Period. Nothing else.
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 1:37:13 AM EST
Originally Posted By glk31: I own a Springfield, and have had it customized. I was told by my gunsmith who is fairly reputable that if you are planning on doing any custom work to your weapon Springfield is the way to go if you are just looking for an out of box weapon than Kimber would be the better of the 2. I know people who own Kimbers and I have shot them they shoot very nicely as does my Springfield . Hope that helps....
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Absolulely right on (IMHO anyway). However, I will not buy any Kimber as long as they buy from S&W. Period.
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 1:51:19 AM EST
Originally Posted By Unreconstructed: However, I will not buy any Kimber as long as they buy from S&W. Period.
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Whatever will they do without your business? [:P]
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 2:39:29 AM EST
I know I'm going to get boo'd here but I have one of the Para-Ordnance Limited P-13 which is the equivalent to a commander 45 and I love it. With the exception of the bulky adjustable sights which are easily fixed with replacement Novak's it is an excellent shooting and functioning 45 with twice the capacity. This also helps with my big hands in having more of a grip to wrap around.
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 3:29:22 AM EST
Are the MIM parts really that big of a deal? My Wilson Combat 1996A2 has a slide stop, hammer, and sear that are cut from a solid block of steel. Which gives me the warm fuzzies about the strength of the parts. (This version of Wilson's .45 uses guaranteed for life BulletProof parts.) Kimber manufactures those same parts from MIM. In fact, the Wilson Protector line now also use MIM. (Kimber supplies Wilson with frames and slides, IIRC. And probably also the MIM parts.) Other manufacturers us castings for those same parts, per the Kimber literature that I and ThomasMagnum picked up today. Obviously, if you had a choice these parts would all be cut from the same steel block, but how many companies use castings for these parts? I'm assuming casting were used on the USGI .45, but could be wrong. How do castings compare with MIM? Is the MIM issue a non-issue? Thanks all.
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 5:04:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 3/24/2001 5:19:57 PM EST by JacRyan]
Last time back up top. Going once. Going twice. That saahweeeeet Kimber Custom 1911 with the night sights is SOLD to the gentleman with a very supporting wife. [;)]
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 8:37:37 AM EST
I own a KIMBER CUSTON TARGET in stainless steel and love its. buy the KIMBER support some yankee in Yonkers New York....buy american [;)]
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 2:43:13 PM EST
What does MIM mean?
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 7:44:51 PM EST
Kimber Pro-Carry
Link Posted: 3/24/2001 9:04:25 PM EST
I was in a gun shop yesterday, and a guy brought in his Kimber Custom Shop. It was a Gold Combat Stainless. He was complaining about pitting, the ambi safety working its was loose, the night sights being too far back and getting crudded, and worst of all the trigger was stagey and inconsistent. He let me dry fire it, and the trigger was pretty sad. The store manager let him hold a new Springfield. He got angry and wanted to throw his $1400 3 month old Kimber in the trash. We both told him to send it back to Kimber and they would make it right, but he was too chapped about it and just wanted to get rid of it. He headed for a consignment shop to sell it for $1000. He said he was going to take the cash and get a Springfield.
Link Posted: 3/25/2001 12:10:26 AM EST
Originally Posted By mejames: We both told him to send it back to Kimber and they would make it right, but he was too chapped about it and just wanted to get rid of it. He headed for a consignment shop to sell it for $1000. He said he was going to take the cash and get a Springfield.
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My God, what a moron. If he wanted a Springfield, he should have sent the gun back to Kimber FIRST and had the problems taken care of...as it is, he is going to lose a bundle on the gun AND he is pawning off a gun that has problems to some poor unsuspecting sucker.
Link Posted: 3/25/2001 5:32:47 AM EST
MY Kimber rocks. Everyone else I know who owns one personally, THEIR Kimbers rock. My MIM (metal injection molded) parts have yet to break.
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