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Posted: 1/15/2014 8:05:53 PM EST
So what is the deal with that round? Looks very interesting

Parent cartridge, ballistics, etc. Ad says it is the best subsonic round developed for the AR platform. How does it compare to the .300 Blackout?
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Posted: 1/15/2014 9:22:28 PM EST
Never heard of it, tag for info.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 9:24:17 PM EST
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Originally Posted By granther:
Never heard of it, tag for info.
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Almost looks like a .357 sig case with a massively long bullet.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 9:26:38 PM EST
Speculating here, AR10 based rifle using .400 caliber.bullet with tweeked 308win case?

Get the right slippery bullet and I bet it is wicked.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 9:36:52 PM EST
Looks like it fits in a standard 5.56 magazine. Unless the scale of the picture is off.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 9:36:53 PM EST
Here is a Shotshow pic from the ARF page. Supposed to use standard mags.

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Posted: 1/15/2014 9:51:15 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/15/2014 9:54:47 PM EST by Wirebrush]
Looks like a 50 Beowulf cut down and necked. I also wonder how you load that. The bullet looks like it's nearly as long as the loaded cartridge? Must be loaded with ball powder on a centrifuge.

Maybe you start seating the bullet, then flip the press upside down to finish seating it?

That has to be the only cartridge in the world in which the majority of the powder is between the base of the bullet and the case neck.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 11:37:12 PM EST
Good points! Guess we will have to wait and see.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 9:15:46 AM EST
Only way I can see it being successful is if you can use a .45 suppressor instead of one for the .416 Barrett

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Posted: 1/16/2014 9:17:01 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Texaspyro21:
Only way I can see it being successful is if you can use a .45 suppressor instead of one for the .416 Barrett

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
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Since its subsonic, a pistol can will work fine.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 9:21:16 AM EST
I don't see where this would beat a 458 Socom. There is a great selection of bullets in .458 already.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 9:31:09 AM EST
I think it has less recoil or something than the socom round. Its a funky round. Cool stuff.
I cut it twice, and it's still short.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 9:35:25 AM EST
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Originally Posted By bjgunner:
I don't see where this would beat a 458 Socom. There is a great selection of bullets in .458 already.
View Quote

+1 how long has .458 Socom been around?
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Posted: 1/16/2014 9:39:58 AM EST
Based on that info (at 1000fps) and a 100 yd zero you get...

50 yds: +3.7" (972.4 fps)
150 yds: -12.9" (959.7 fps)
200 yds: -35.2" (947.6 fps)
300 yds: -109.2" (924.9 fps)
400 yds: - 223.8" (904.0 fps)
500 yds: -381.0" (884.6 fps)
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Posted: 1/16/2014 10:08:56 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/16/2014 10:10:10 AM EST by theenforcer]
So it looks like a 357 sig case. I guess 416
round? Which means a new barrel? What else?
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Posted: 1/16/2014 10:12:07 AM EST
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Originally Posted By ajm1911:

+1 how long has .458 Socom been around?
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Originally Posted By ajm1911:
Originally Posted By bjgunner:
I don't see where this would beat a 458 Socom. There is a great selection of bullets in .458 already.

+1 how long has .458 Socom been around?
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With bullets that, you know, do more than poke a hole, even at subsonic speeds.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 11:12:29 AM EST
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Originally Posted By DarkNite:
Based on that info (at 1000fps) and a 100 yd zero you get...

50 yds: +3.7" (972.4 fps)
150 yds: -12.9" (959.7 fps)
200 yds: -35.2" (947.6 fps)
300 yds: -109.2" (924.9 fps)
400 yds: - 223.8" (904.0 fps)
500 yds: -381.0" (884.6 fps)
View Quote



Thanks for that. Do you have the same factors for the heaviest or most common .300 blackout round. Is there a subsonic .458 socom round?
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Posted: 1/16/2014 11:54:15 AM EST
The bullet shown appears to be a Hornady Match 450gr BTHP Match round (http://www.hornady.com/store/416-Cal-.416-450-GR-Match/), which are $54.00 for a box of 50 at Midway, when available. A full up round will probably be $2.00 each even if you hand load.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 12:21:07 PM EST
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Originally Posted By DarkNite:
The bullet shown appears to be a Hornady Match 450gr BTHP Match round (http://www.hornady.com/store/416-Cal-.416-450-GR-Match/), which are $54.00 for a box of 50 at Midway, when available. A full up round will probably be $2.00 each even if you hand load.
View Quote


That link says it is temporarily suspended.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 12:22:27 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Archtaan:


That link says it is temporarily suspended.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
Originally Posted By DarkNite:
The bullet shown appears to be a Hornady Match 450gr BTHP Match round (http://www.hornady.com/store/416-Cal-.416-450-GR-Match/), which are $54.00 for a box of 50 at Midway, when available. A full up round will probably be $2.00 each even if you hand load.


That link says it is temporarily suspended.


Strange, it works for me.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 2:12:10 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Archtaan:



Thanks for that. Do you have the same factors for the heaviest or most common .300 blackout round. Is there a subsonic .458 socom round?
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Originally Posted By Archtaan:
Originally Posted By DarkNite:
Based on that info (at 1000fps) and a 100 yd zero you get...

50 yds: +3.7" (972.4 fps)
150 yds: -12.9" (959.7 fps)
200 yds: -35.2" (947.6 fps)
300 yds: -109.2" (924.9 fps)
400 yds: - 223.8" (904.0 fps)
500 yds: -381.0" (884.6 fps)



Thanks for that. Do you have the same factors for the heaviest or most common .300 blackout round. Is there a subsonic .458 socom round?

300 BLK with 230gr Berger @ 1000FPS and 100 Yrd Zero.

50 yrds: +3.7 (988 FPS)
150 yrds: -12.8" (966 FPS)
200 yrds: -34.9" (955 FPS)
300 yrds: -107.8" (935 FPS)
400 yrds: -220.5" (916 FPS)
500 yrds: -374.6" (898 FPS)

300 BLK with 208gr Amax @ 1000FPS and 100 Yrd Zero.

50 yrds: +3.7 (984 FPS)
150 yrds: -13.0" (954 FPS)
200 yrds: -35.5" (941 FPS)
300 yrds: -110.2" (916 FPS)
400 yrds: -226.4" (893 FPS)
500 yrds: -386.1" (872 FPS)
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Posted: 1/16/2014 2:36:25 PM EST
I talked to the developer yesterday here at SHOT
It is based on the 50AE case
I like the shit out of this
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Posted: 1/16/2014 3:13:04 PM EST
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Originally Posted By DarkNite:
The bullet shown appears to be a Hornady Match 450gr BTHP Match round (http://www.hornady.com/store/416-Cal-.416-450-GR-Match/), which are $54.00 for a box of 50 at Midway, when available. A full up round will probably be $2.00 each even if you hand load.
View Quote

Cast bullets + powder coating = cheap, accurate shooters

You can push powder coated cast bullets up to 2000 FPS. Its the future.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 3:19:34 PM EST
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Originally Posted By cpermd:
I talked to the developer yesterday here at SHOT
It is based on the 50AE case
I like the shit out of this
View Quote


Anything that pushes the envelope further - even a little further - is welcome.

If you have the money for it & the ammo/brass, great. Would like to see a range report. Would probably buck the wind a little better than the 300 BLK.

For the reloaders & the "cash challenged" - it does not seem to offer a whole lot of improvement ballistically over the 300BLK heavy bullets.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 3:58:26 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/16/2014 4:00:26 PM EST by Scott_S]
That's slinging a whole bunch of lead with such a high BC pill. I'm really curious what the recoil is like with subsonic loads. Interesting the the parent cartridge is .50 AE. In the picture it looks more like a 458 SOCOM or 50 Beowulf like another poster suggested. That rim looks markedly more rebated than a .50 AE.

Compared to the Blackout, I bet this is horrifically expensive, but I bet it offers a tad better subsonic performance on game.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 4:01:36 PM EST
It does look a lot more like a BW rim, doesn't it?

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Posted: 1/16/2014 7:19:48 PM EST
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
So what is the deal with that round? Looks very interesting

Parent cartridge, ballistics, etc. Ad says it is the best subsonic round developed for the AR platform. How does it compare to the .300 Blackout?
View Quote


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?
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Posted: 1/16/2014 7:25:32 PM EST
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Originally Posted By CKxx:


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CKxx:
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
So what is the deal with that round? Looks very interesting

Parent cartridge, ballistics, etc. Ad says it is the best subsonic round developed for the AR platform. How does it compare to the .300 Blackout?


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?


How about some expanding 530gr .458? Might not shoot quite as flat, but it's gonna make a much bigger hole when it gets there.

http://outlawstatebullets.com/4.html
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Posted: 1/16/2014 7:32:33 PM EST
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Originally Posted By RDTCU:


How about some expanding 530gr .458? Might not shoot quite as flat, but it's gonna make a much bigger hole when it gets there.

http://outlawstatebullets.com/4.html
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Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By CKxx:
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
So what is the deal with that round? Looks very interesting

Parent cartridge, ballistics, etc. Ad says it is the best subsonic round developed for the AR platform. How does it compare to the .300 Blackout?


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?


How about some expanding 530gr .458? Might not shoot quite as flat, but it's gonna make a much bigger hole when it gets there.

http://outlawstatebullets.com/4.html


I'd like to see those bullets loaded in a 458 Win Mag at max velocities.
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Posted: 1/16/2014 7:34:14 PM EST
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Originally Posted By jhereg:


I'd like to see those bullets loaded in a 458 Win Mag at max velocities.
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Originally Posted By jhereg:
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By CKxx:
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
So what is the deal with that round? Looks very interesting

Parent cartridge, ballistics, etc. Ad says it is the best subsonic round developed for the AR platform. How does it compare to the .300 Blackout?


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?


How about some expanding 530gr .458? Might not shoot quite as flat, but it's gonna make a much bigger hole when it gets there.

http://outlawstatebullets.com/4.html


I'd like to see those bullets loaded in a 458 Win Mag at max velocities.


With the soft core, I would guess explosively fragtastic
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Posted: 1/16/2014 7:39:58 PM EST
Anyone have any reloading data or images or anything? Can't find anything on the net.
Originally Posted By HullBreach: Nah I bought a gun because stabbing people with bullets just doesn't carry the same message of "Get the fuck out of my house"
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Posted: 1/16/2014 7:43:55 PM EST
I think it looks like a baby .500 Phantom....

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Posted: 1/17/2014 12:31:52 PM EST
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Posted: 1/17/2014 3:48:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/17/2014 3:52:44 PM EST by Subsahnik]
reminds me of a necked down 50 American Eagle produced by SSK a while back?

http://i.imgur.com/fu5ZqdT.jpg
I've been doing pretty much the same thing on a Socom case for a couple years already for Bolt action and 308 based systems.
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Posted: 1/17/2014 5:59:12 PM EST
For a little more info guys, head to our website Am-tac.com and check out the specs and info there. We're wrapping up here at SHOT but we'll try and answer questions when we can.
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Posted: 1/17/2014 8:22:08 PM EST
The print in the photos is small to read but it looks like you based your PMBR on a 16" diameter circle?
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Posted: 1/24/2014 9:51:58 PM EST
Since it takes a 7.62x39 bolt I would imagine that the 416 hushpuppy is chopped and necked .50Beo case. The 458SOCOM was based on the 50AE too but lengthened and rebated rim. So there really isn't a parent case to make 458 from. It looks like you'd be able to run 50beo case through a 416hp die, Tim and call it a day.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 9:53:15 PM EST
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Originally Posted By CKxx:


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?
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Originally Posted By CKxx:
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
So what is the deal with that round? Looks very interesting

Parent cartridge, ballistics, etc. Ad says it is the best subsonic round developed for the AR platform. How does it compare to the .300 Blackout?


Pretty easy question to answer. Is it the heaviest sub-sonic round developed for the AR?


There are 600gr sub loads for the SOCOM what's the heaviest 416 bullet available?
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Posted: 1/30/2014 11:50:58 AM EST
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Originally Posted By AMTAC_Precision:
For a little more info guys, head to our website Am-tac.com and check out the specs and info there. We're wrapping up here at SHOT but we'll try and answer questions when we can.
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416 Hushpuppy

There, I fixed that for ya...
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Posted: 8/3/2014 9:57:41 PM EST
Any updates on this new round?
A gun, like any other source of power, is a force for either good or evil, being neither in itself, but dependent upon those who possess it.

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